Have you ever had to use what you've learned in self defense?

CosyAcorn

I'm just curious as to how many people have had to use what they've learned in training on the street and was it effective.

I've been doing kickboxing for a few years now and we do a good bit of self defense in the class but I've never had to use any of it, come close to a few times but never have.

paulmclaughlin

Nope, I find people with self defence training or a martial art are more civilized and more likely to keep a situation under control/walk away. At least, that's my experience since I started training.

Martin Walker

Never. Ive actually never been in a confrontation on the street. I have a keen ability to spy trouble before i get to it. I prefer to walk the other way.

arybvtcw0eolkf

CosyAcorn wrote: »

I'm just curious as to how many people have had to use what they've learned in training on the street and was it effective.

I think I'd be safe in saying that close to 99% of people using this forum have never had the need to use anything on the street tbh.

CosyAcorn wrote: »

I've been doing kickboxing for a few years now and we do a good bit of self defense in the class but I've never had to use any of it, come close to a few times but never have.

What kind of self defence techniques do you train in your class?.

CosyAcorn

Randall Echoing Squalor wrote: »

I think I'd be safe in saying that close to 99% of people using this forum have never had the need to use anything on the street tbh.

That's what I thought, and has been my experience from people I have met training

What kind of self defence techniques do you train in your class?.

We do the usual how to get out of a bear-hug/headlock/whatever, how to defend yourself when you're on the ground and your attacker is standing and general strikes that are useful on the street. One of my coaches also did a Personal Defense Readiness course so we do a good bit of that. It's different to the normal self defense stuff but is supposedly much more effective and more natural to learn. http://www.tonyblauer.com/4105/04_03_01_personal_defense_rationale.asp

arybvtcw0eolkf

CosyAcorn wrote: »

That's what I thought, and has been my experience from people I have met training

Not only from training but its a simple fact that most adults will never find themselves in a situation where they'll need any kind of martial arts skills.

Most of us here look at our styles as a sport, most of which happens to be very effective on the street if the situation arises.

CosyAcorn wrote: »

We do the usual how to get out of a bear-hug/headlock/whatever, how to defend yourself when you're on the ground and your attacker is standing and general strikes that are useful on the street.

Ok at the risk of opening up the discussion too far, but here goes my opinion - and its only an opinion.

If you want to learn how to get out of chokes, holds or attacks from your back (on the ground) train in a style which makes these at least a little realistic - ie against fully resisting oponents.. You'd have the likes of Judo, BJJ (Brazilian Jiu Jitsu) or MMA.. I say this with the benefit of a little experience in a kickboxing club with a self defence element in the grading syllabus (I found it next to useless when I started training in the above styles) and also I've almost 20 years experience working on the doors of bars & clubs.

Some might argue that Judo, BJJ etc are just sports - thats true to an extent, but if you want to train eye gouging and nutsack grabs/kicking etc well these are all presented to you should you find yourself in a street fight anyway - you really don't have to train them.

CosyAcorn wrote: »

One of my coaches also did a Personal Defense Readiness course so we do a good bit of that. It's different to the normal self defense stuff but is supposedly much more effective and more natural to learn. http://www.tonyblauer.com/4105/04_03_01_personal_defense_rationale.asp

I've no idea what that is, but again only speaking from my own personal experience "effective and more natural to learn" are just marketing tools to generate an interest.

But I'll go back to your first question re. using what you have on the street, in a self defence situation..

My example.. Working the door of a club in Dublin city center with a Judoka (Gary Bergin, many here will know Gary) and when the fur would fly Gary had nice, tidy grappling & take downs from his Judo - and I had Kickboxing and some useless self defence stuff..

Gary would often tell me "Martin, that sh*t is gonna put you in court" and I avoided Judo for awhile.. However one day he got me up to the club, first lad to take grips I thought 'Ha, I've been shown how to deal with this' - I had my ass handed to me - by a blind Judoka too!.

I very quickly learned why on the door I used kickboxing and not the self defence element of the syllabus - it simply does not work!.

Kickboxing is great, I love it.. But as I said, IMO if you want to learn about chokes, fighting off your back, joint locks etc then train in a style which makes them realistic.

Sorry for the long reply.

Doug Cartel

There's an episode of Penn & Teller where they talk about martial arts. They claim that you're more likely to be injured training in martial arts than you are from being attacked on the street.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Doug Cartel wrote: »

There's an episode of Penn & Teller where they talk about martial arts. They claim that you're more likely to be injured training in martial arts than you are from being attacked on the street.

lol, must remember that one

themandan6611

peteclarke wrote: »

If makikomi is half the bully/trouble maker in real life as he is on boards, he would be using his training a few times a day

lol, :eek: what are you basing this on ?? the guys in my opinion, (along with cowzer), are some of the better mods on this site - Self Defence & MA, & MMA forum are great places with some cracking banter.

so, nothing to see here, trot on old chap :rolleyes:

CosyAcorn

Randall Echoing Squalor wrote: »

I've no idea what that is, but again only speaking from my own personal experience "effective and more natural to learn" are just marketing tools to generate an interest.

But I'll go back to your first question re. using what you have on the street, in a self defence situation..

My example.. Working the door of a club in Dublin city center with a Judoka (Gary Bergin, many here will know Gary) and when the fur would fly Gary had nice, tidy grappling & take downs from his Judo - and I had Kickboxing and some useless self defence stuff..

Gary would often tell me "Martin, that sh*t is gonna put you in court" and I avoided Judo for awhile.. However one day he got me up to the club, first lad to take grips I thought 'Ha, I've been shown how to deal with this' - I had my ass handed to me - by a blind Judoka too!.

I very quickly learned why on the door I used kickboxing and not the self defence element of the syllabus - it simply does not work!.

Kickboxing is great, I love it.. But as I said, IMO if you want to learn about chokes, fighting off your back, joint locks etc then train in a style which makes them realistic.

Sorry for the long reply.

I agree with all of what you said, especially that a martial art like Judo, or any other grappling art, would be much more useful if you're working on the door. Striking someone when you're bouncing can land you in a whole pile of trouble. But my main reason for starting the thread was to see if people had used their training on the street, I didn't intend on starting a 'this martial art is more effective than that one' debate.

To answer your query about what PDR is, it's a self defense method that capitalises on your flinch. Check this out if you have a few mins

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shr2pYs6d2I

paulmclaughlin

There's a story behind this .gif. A TV show in Belgium set up a fake robbery to see if anyone would react. So the actor/robber grabbed an actress'/woman's purse and started running. She started shouting for help and then WHAM. Watch closely to see the purse go flying.

Khannie

Never had to use mine. I think I'm confident enough in myself from doing it that I'd be much happier to walk away from someone trying to wind me up. I'm also fit enough to run away better.

SDTimeout

Yes I have.

I have a brother who out weighs me who can't accept the fact I can now hand it to him when ever he tries to act the big d!ck.

I love Martial Arts.

da-bres

best defence is not to be involved at all, next best is leg it!

Sid_Justice

ah lads where are the stories about black belts giving fat guys a few digs over a bag of chips?

Barry.Oglesby

This one time right...

themandan6611

Sid_Justice wrote: »

ah lads where are the stories about black belts giving fat guys a few digs over a bag of chips?

they'll be here soon, they were at the match today

TrollHammaren

I've had to use TKD quite a few times growing up in Ballyfermot, but I never really got good at until I was 17 or 18.

Like Makikomi, I do the doors in Dublin City Centre and Judo has helped me out of a few nasty situations. I'm 5'7 and weigh about 70kg, so I have needed to defend myself on quite a few occasions. I'm glad I leanred Judo and Jujutsu (not BJJ), because if I was to continue using TKD I'd end up in prison.

I've been attacked a few times on the way home from work, and have had to defend myself, but most of the time it was a case of disabling them for a few seconds and running away.

antybots

Thankfully I've never had to use it. I haven't been in a fight on the street since I was 12 (and I didn't know martial arts then).

pearsquasher

Yep...
Back in 06 I managed to disable a sudden blade attack to my kidney area from a highly distrought/emotional aquaintance who lashed out in anger after they realised that they couldn't hit me sucessfully. (I held a classic fence positon, keeping them at arms reach, as I was verbally talking them down from a right angry state.. I sort of suspect it was coke-fueled). They seemed to be calm but had pulled a blade just when I was about to exit stage left. I managed to gain distance, hit their arm, and drop the weapon and got out of there as they realised what they'd just tried to do. I put my whole reaction down to training and can tell you that it was fairly blurry and subconsious, wrapped up as it was in high emotion and adrenilin as it escalated over 10 minutes from a simple argument. Technically the distance, angling and timing all worked out very well but what I was most pleased about was that I didn't have to cause injury as this person was essentially in a heightened state of vunerability despite the aggression involved.

Besides that, in 22 years training only 2 minor scuffles involving drunk people trying to start something for which I easily misdirected them and escaped without any physicality. One had tried to pull me down by the hoody but I simply went with the flow off-angle away from their free hand and when they let go I walked.

PS. Things like the animated gif showing the back-kick to the head of the handbag robber. While it looks "cool" and may be a technically excellent technique.. you have to ask yourself, is it an appropriate level of force to smash someone into the face such that they land hard on concrete... when they haven't even showed any physical threat? Even to trip the guy up may cause potential injury.

A few years ago in Dublin I was in a position to trip up a guy who was chased out of a shop by a security guard. I instantly decided not to realising he'd fly into the concrete. I left it to cctv to grab the guy if whatever he did was serious to warrant it.

Peetrik

pearsquasher wrote: »

Yep...
Back in 06 I managed to disable a sudden blade attack to my kidney area from a highly distrought/emotional aquaintance who lashed out in anger after they realised that they couldn't hit me sucessfully. (I held a classic fence positon, keeping them at arms reach, as I was verbally talking them down from a right angry state.. I sort of suspect it was coke-fueled). They seemed to be calm but had pulled a blade just when I was about to exit stage left. I managed to gain distance, hit their arm, and drop the weapon and got out of there as they realised what they'd just tried to do. I put my whole reaction down to training and can tell you that it was fairly blurry and subconsious, wrapped up as it was in high emotion and adrenilin as it escalated over 10 minutes from a simple argument. Technically the distance, angling and timing all worked out very well but what I was most pleased about was that I didn't have to cause injury as this person was essentially in a heightened state of vunerability despite the aggression involved.

http://youtu.be/jJvTDmvrDQI

Dathai

Had a bunch of eejits try bottle me and hit me a few digs a while ago. Not going to go into it, but from BJJ and having lads absolutely maul you for close to 2 hours in training, I was actually relatively pain free and damage free considering there was a group of lads after getting a good few digs in on me. My hands hurt though

Personally I'd say most people who do martial arts will avoid confrontation purely because they're (presumably) decent people. But if the situation came down to it, I'd say even if all the techniques and drills you've done over the years didn't kick in, you'd have the strength and stamina to mess them up a fair bit. If someone was waving a knife or syringe at me, I wouldn't risk it though.

yomchi

Remind me never to go to a boards meet up with any of you guys

paulmclaughlin

We're nice guys! Honest! :pac:

arybvtcw0eolkf

yomchi wrote: »

Remind me never to go to a boards meet up with any of you guys

Why?.

RoboRat

I've never really been confronted on the street but I think that is partly down to the fact that I am confident in my own abilities and people would think twice about starting a fight with me. I think a lot of people who do MA have that aura of 'Dont f*** with me' and its a great deterrent.

I did Bushido, Kempo and boxing when I was younger and I had to use some of my training when I did the door in a nightclub, but that was only ever a last resort when punters were attacking and couldn't be calmed down or talked to, 95% of the time you could change a volatile situation just by talking to the other party. I'm doing Judo & MMA/BJJ these days but I don't do the door any longer and don't go out as much either. I do find that the young lads on the road show me a lot of respect but that may be down to the fact that they see me coming home from MMA training in my gear!

CosyAcorn

RoboRat wrote: »

I've never really been confronted on the street but I think that is partly down to the fact that I am confident in my own abilities and people would think twice about starting a fight with me. I think a lot of people who do MA have that aura of 'Dont f*** with me' and its a great deterrent.

I see where you're coming from but from witnessing the occasional scrap in town on a Friday night I think that drunk/high people don't give a sh1t if you are a millionth degree black belt or a 6 foot 6 body builder - they just want to fight and don't care who with. Just my opinion though...

RoboRat

CosyAcorn wrote: »

I see where you're coming from but from witnessing the occasional scrap in town on a Friday night I think that drunk/high people don't give a sh1t if you are a millionth degree black belt or a 6 foot 6 body builder - they just want to fight and don't care who with. Just my opinion though...

I disagree but I respect that you don't agree. I honestly think that being able to hold yourself with confidence is a deterrent, it doesn't matter if you're a black belt or whether you have done any form of MA; but if you have that confidence I definitely think its a big deterrent.

I personally get that confidence from the fact that I know I am well able to look after myself due to my training. I know there are situations where people are drunk senseless and they are just spoiling for any kind of fight, but most of the time people will go for a weaker opponent who they feel they can dominate, and to be honest from my experience the people who get beaten up randomly are usually smaller or thinner guys, guys out with their missus or people who are not comfortable with fighting or lack confidence. I don't even think the attacker even thinks about the fact they are targeting someone they can dominate - its an animalistic instinct that is inherent in us...

SDTimeout

RoboRat wrote: »

I've never really been confronted on the street but I think that is partly down to the fact that I am confident in my own abilities and people would think twice about starting a fight with me. I think a lot of people who do MA have that aura of 'Dont f*** with me' and its a great deterrent.

This Aura is especially picked up on by Junkies who need a fix and have a used syringe in their hand

yomchi

Randall Echoing Squalor wrote: »

Why?.

That was my attempt at some boards.ie humour

SBG Ireland

pearsquasher wrote: »

I managed to disable a sudden blade attack to my kidney area from a highly distrought/emotional aquaintance

sounds like most of my break ups...