web design course

Smokiejam

haha not shouyting, just being a moan!! thanks for all your help...i do appreciate it!! madart was in my first post...if you read that you will know what i mean by i need to do a course before his course!!

anbrutog

Smokiejam wrote: »

haha not shouyting, just being a moan!! thanks for all your help...i do appreciate it!! madart was in my first post...if you read that you will know what i mean by i need to do a course before his course!!

No worries

Just read your original post just there.
Doing a course in Dreamweaver before learning basic HTML is madness, and Im sure most on here would agree. I wouldnt go near Dreamweaver until you know HTML /CSS inside out. Its really putting the cart before the horse. So I really dont know what that guy is talking about. I can only imagine that they use Dreamweaver to such a degree within their course that they regard it as a pre-requisite.
If thats the way they teach , dont bother with them.

Given that there seems no one in this city /country capable of running a proper web course and they all seem much of a muchness, your sole consideration should be price. The scd one is €350 , go with that one.

But please , from someone you knows, take this bit of advice. For that money you could get a course or two on Lynda and you'll learn far more. It'd be far better spent that way.

AB

rossc007

anbrutog wrote: »

No worries

Just read your original post just there.
Doing a course in Dreamweaver before learning basic HTML is madness, and Im sure most on here would agree. I wouldnt go near Dreamweaver until you know HTML /CSS inside out. Its really putting the cart before the horse. So I really dont know what that guy is talking about. I can only imagine that they use Dreamweaver to such a degree within their course that they regard it as a pre-requisite.
If thats the way they teach , dont bother with them.

Given that there seems no one in this city /country capable of running a proper web course and they all seem much of a muchness, your sole consideration should be price. The scd one is €350 , go with that one.

But please , from someone you knows, take this bit of advice. For that money you could get a course or two on Lynda and you'll learn far more. It'd be far better spent that way.

AB

What did you start off writing HTML in, notepad? Dreamweaver is just an editor, you'd do a lot worse then to start off using it, I started with Frontpage, shudder. I really cant see how using Dreamweaver would have any negative effects on someone trying to learn web design and you certainly dont need to know HTML and CSS inside out before you use it.

Your never going to find a course that ticks all the boxes, so pick one to get you started then continue on yourself.

Webmonkey

rossc007 wrote:

What did you start off writing HTML in, notepad? Dreamweaver is just an editor, you'd do a lot worse then to start off using it, I started with Frontpage, shudder. I really cant see how using Dreamweaver would have any negative effects on someone trying to learn web design and you certainly dont need to know HTML and CSS inside out before you use it.

Your never going to find a course that ticks all the boxes, so pick one to get you started then continue on yourself.

I disagree. The whole point doing a web design course is to learn HTML. Not have it done for you.

If you mean use Dreamweaver codeview as a tool, then yes that's useful. But doing it with WYSIWYG is non sense if you are serious about learning how to do things properly.

rossc007

Webmonkey wrote: »

I disagree if your talking about using it as a WYSIWYG..

FYP, thanks for agreeing with me

Dave!

Are there no designers on here or elsewhere that could get together and start running some sort of decent class on design? There really is a shít selection available.

99Luftballons

Hi guys,
I am looking at doing a webdesign course too, but not sure where to go. I know self-thaught would be better and cheaper but not sure if that works for me...I already did some basic HTML/CSS courses, worked with dreamweaver once for a bit.
did anyone ever heard anything good or bad about the courses in web design in:
- Dublin Insitut of Design
- IBAT college
- Dorset college offers a double course in web design and E-Commerce Strategies and Practices

also I am confused regarding accreditation: for example the griffith college course in web design is accredited by The Institute of Commercial Management (ICM), not FETAC. is there any difference working in the Irish labour market?
Also I read that the Diploma offered in web design in the Dublin Business school costs 1200EUR (!!!!!) why all the mad price differences?

Thanks for any advice, seems like a school jungle out there, really dont want to waste my money if I decide to to a course as it is expensive enough!

###########sorry just only now saw all the posts abouth the DBS course, please disregard, (still amazed about the prize though!)
my problem with MadArt is that they dont seem to have any accreditation and I also do this for my CV so some kind of somness of accreditation would be good if money is paid###########

99Luftballons

Dave! wrote: »

Are there no designers on here or elsewhere that could get together and start running some sort of decent class on design? There really is a shít selection available.

would be interested if somebody is putting stuff together!

Trojan

Dave! wrote: »

Are there no designers on here or elsewhere that could get together and start running some sort of decent class on design? There really is a shít selection available.

The main issues are 1) the scope is absolutely enormous and 2) the content changes frequently.

Very difficult for institutions to keep up. You see that in traditional software too, where languages like Pascal are taught despite their lack of usage (for the most part) in the commercial world, but to teach students easy to understand best-practices.

There's another thread on here asking about using HTML5 on live sites. Never mind the live sites for a moment, should a web design course teach HTML5? Should it teach it exclusively? Where's the line?

BarackPyjama

99Luftballons wrote: »

my problem with MadArt is that they dont seem to have any accreditation and I also do this for my CV so some kind of somness of accreditation would be good if money is paid

This is the catch 22. You either do an outdated course in an established institute, learning deprecated technologies that are of no use in the real world and get yourself a nice piece of paper at the end of it all. Or you potentially pay to learn from industry experts, gain excellent real world experience with contemporary technologies but forgo the accreditation.

From an employers perspective, I'd rather hire someone who can do the job than someone who uses WYSIWYG tools and Fireworks and has a diploma. Most of the people who you'll learn good web design from are too busy developing websites to become an official, accredited educational body. Most educational bodies are clueless and out of date.

Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach.

p

Or, learn the fundamentals of visual and interaction design on a course, and learn the bit of technology separately. The technology might change quickly, but the principles broadly stay the same.

BarackPyjama

p wrote: »

Or, learn the fundamentals of visual and interaction design on a course, and learn the bit of technology separately. The technology might change quickly, but the principles broadly stay the same.

+1. Web designers who are proficient technically but without any aesthetic ability aren't much use to anyone on a professional level.

VivGrise

Hey everyone, I am in the same boat as a few people here, I really want to learn how to design websites and was looking at doing a course in Web Design, but after ssing some of the comments here it has turned me towards the teach yourself direction.

I'm not a complete beginner, I am fairly proficient in Photoshop CS5 and I have being designing posters and logos for around 8 months now, and I'd love to take a step towards webdesign.

What i'm aking here really is;

• What are the necessary tools i will need? ( I have Dreamweaver CS5.5, InDesign, Photoshop, and Illulstrator)
• What are the main things i need to learn, like the topics, eg HTML...
• What tutorials should I use, W3Schools and Alison?

Also, do you need to know HTML to be a good webdesigner? I mean if I built a website using Dreamweaver, would it ever become a brilliant website without being able to write HTML?

Thanks a million, your help is really appreciated!

Webmonkey

There's no such thing as a good web designer if they don't know HTML. I strongly discourage using any WYSIWYG editor. Dreamweaver is great if you stay in code view. The design view is great for people that need to throw together a quick small brochure type website. But if you actually want to become a "web designer" then you will need to know HTML.

You've got all the tools neccessary, if not more than you need.
You will need to learn XHTML/CSS.
W3 Schools is great.

Once you know HTML, then it's time to start bringing your photoshop skills into play by using images with CSS to create a design.

VivGrise

Thanks, thats exactly what I needed to hear!

I'm going to start on the W3Schools website from scratch and do them all!

rossc007

Don't really recommend this for someone trying to learn HTML but it might be useful for someone who is already proficient in Photoshop.

Photoshop has a Slice function that lets you cut sections of an image into HTML. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVfxe4pqvo8

tricky D

BarackPyjama wrote: »

+1. Web designers who are proficient technically but without any aesthetic ability aren't much use to anyone on a professional level.

While there is a large element of truth to your point, I do like this quote.

"Most people make the mistake of thinking design is what it looks like. People think it's this veneer – that the designers are handed this box and told, 'Make it look good!' That's not what we think design is. It's not just what it looks like and feels like. Design is how it works."
Steve Jobs

How it works includes the aesthetics, but also much more than that.

sedantez

Hi,

I did the Madart course - overall I learned a huge amount and enjoyed the course. The instructor is a sound fella and a good teacher.

The only cons I found;
-it's very unstructured and informal e.g. no theory or notes
-the course goes at an incredibly fast pace if you're a beginner in photoshop and dreamweaver
-much of the course if copying his code without really understanding the theory behind it.

The biggest problem I found
-the course did not have a final project to refresh everything you have learned and test your skills.

On the flipside, if you are like me and enjoy skipping the theory and getting stuck-in, the course will suit you.

zofia300

I know they teach 'responsive design' in HTML5 and CSS3 at madart now. Also 'mobile first approach'. Comparing to other courses in town that looks pretty relevant. Guy is a professional and teaches whatever he does on a daily basis.

all best