Why is Ireland so dog un-friendly?

OldNotWIse

Kash wrote: »

I can totaly understand someone not wanting to share a restaurant with a dog - but I don't understand why they can't sit under my feet in a beer garden. As has been said many times before on this thread, the rest of Europe manages quite well.

We have two, and they are relatively big dogs, albeit fairly well trained (they will do what they are told 90% of the time) so finding a place that is happy to see us is a godsend. We found one in near the Burren - Linnanes Pub - they even brought us out a big bowl of water for the dogs! So, we go there regularly with our two hounds.

It would be cool if there was a sticky listing dog-friendly pubs/cafe's/B&Bs and things around Ireland! I'd definitely be interested in knowing a few more...


Still laughing at that comment about the type of people who give human names to dogs!

Agree. I have a little four legged angel and she's far more sociable than a lot of snotty nosed brats running around restaurants flinging food at each other

And to those who are being so precious about hygiene - I've caught far more diseases from people than I have from animals

Aru

I would imagine it has to do with Health and Safety more than anything. Cafe's that allow dogs probably belong to dog owners or have a few staff members who like dogs and are willing to bend the rules.

That said if I had a cafe I would not be allowing dogs inside. Ever dog on the continent I came across while travelling were well behaved and well socialised and had owners who appeared to be in control. I have not found the same to be true in Ireland.

Go into any Vet in the country and you will observe the idiocy of some people in the waiting room. No leads or those flexi leads loose on their dogs. Letting dogs intermingle with no attempt to stop them check the other dogs owners.. great idea when the animals are SICK! or not dog friendly...one of whom I remember is snarling at them from behind a muzzle and an uncomfortable looking owner who was trying so hard to control his dog aggressive pet.Who had been wonderful and so brave up until the other dog invaded his space.
Letting their dogs wee on the furniture with no attempt to stop them or apologies, same with poo... Letting their loose dogs jump up on everyone who enters..thats great fun when other people are coming in with cats!leting said dogs sniff around the cat carriers. Getting offended when the receptionist reprimanded the pet (asked owners to put him on a lead) who had entered behing the desk and was attempting to destroy all around him...... Because dont you know Vets are ment to be dog friendly....regardless of what the little darling is doing.

Granted there are also wonderful owners who have their pets siting quietly and calmly and they are much loved and appreciated by everyone involved!....but I wouldn't take the risk of having the others in a cafe I was in charge of.

Plus having been in a dog friendly cafe in west Cork with loads of lovely dogs in the beer garden I unfortunately I did not enjoy it thanks to a wandering Cocker who launched himself at every other dog aggressively....with no sign of his owners even noticing or anyone from the place intervening.
I wouldn't go back. Even though I love dogs I do not enjoy having dog fights breaking out around me while I am having food or a pint.I definitely would not feel happy to bring family there as they do not enjoy meeting strange dogs running loose in general let alone somewhere they want to eat/drink.

Why would any food place want to encourage those sort of situations and lose custom over it?

OldNotWIse

Aru wrote: »

I would imagine it has to do with Health and Safety more than anything. Cafe's that allow dogs probably belong to dog owners or have a few staff members who like dogs and are willing to bend the rules.

That said if I had a cafe I would not be allowing dogs inside. Ever dog on the continent I came across while travelling were well behaved and well socialised and had owners who appeared to be in control. I have not found the same to be true in Ireland.

Go into any Vet in the country and you will observe the idiocy of some people in the waiting room. No leads or those flexi leads loose on their dogs. Letting dogs intermingle with no attempt to stop them check the other dogs owners.. great idea when the animals are SICK! or not dog friendly...one of whom I remember is snarling at them from behind a muzzle and an uncomfortable looking owner who was trying so hard to control his dog aggressive pet.Who had been wonderful and so brave up until the other dog invaded his space.
Letting their dogs wee on the furniture with no attempt to stop them or apologies, same with poo... Letting their loose dogs jump up on everyone who enters..thats great fun when other people are coming in with cats!leting said dogs sniff around the cat carriers. Getting offended when the receptionist reprimanded the pet (asked owners to put him on a lead) who had entered behing the desk and was attempting to destroy all around him...... Because dont you know Vets are ment to be dog friendly....regardless of what the little darling is doing.

Granted there are also wonderful owners who have their pets siting quietly and calmly and they are much loved and appreciated by everyone involved!....but I wouldn't take the risk of having the others in a cafe I was in charge of.

Plus having been in a dog friendly cafe in west Cork with loads of lovely dogs in the beer garden I unfortunately I did not enjoy it thanks to a wandering Cocker who launched himself at every other dog aggressively....with no sign of his owners even noticing or anyone from the place intervening.
I wouldn't go back. Even though I love dogs I do not enjoy having dog fights breaking out around me while I am having food or a pint.I definitely would not feel happy to bring family there as they do not enjoy meeting strange dogs running loose in general let alone somewhere they want to eat/drink.

Why would any food place want to encourage those sort of situations and lose custom over it?

I imagine they are also thinking about the custom they would lose from dog owners who continue on elsewhere?

ekevosu

For the people in Cork, blackrock castle allow dogs to sit outside with their owners on a lead at the cafe there. They even provide water bowls. Food is a bit overpriced though but a lovely spot. There were two dogs there while I was there and one (retriever) who had just arrived starting misbehaving, getting aggressive and the owners were asked to leave with him. the other which I think was a boxer, sat quietly beside its owner and entertained several children.

A pet friendly sticky minus the debates would be useful.

Diddler1977

OldNotWIse wrote: »

Agree, in general we are not very forward when it comes to our pets. Thankfully I haven't really had too many bad experiences with my little one. Irish rail specify on their website that they allow dogs to travel (with certain conditions) so they cannot say anything really when you are in the stations etc. Buses are a little different. It's essentially at the driver's discretion. All I can say, from experience, Irish drivers have never had a problem. Foreign drivers, more often than not, have refused me. I dont know the reason for this.

As for hotels, they are few and far between.

I hate this part, I can't stand having to beg the driver

Léan

ekevosu wrote: »

For the people in Cork, blackrock castle allow dogs to sit outside with their owners on a lead at the cafe there. They even provide water bowls. Food is a bit overpriced though but a lovely spot. There were two dogs there while I was there and one (retriever) who had just arrived starting misbehaving, getting aggressive and the owners were asked to leave with him. the other which I think was a boxer, sat quietly beside its owner and entertained several children.

A pet friendly sticky minus the debates would be useful.

Not wanting to go off topic too much but, Gulpd cafe in town allow dogs outside and will also provide water.

Fionnbarras on Douglas st also allow dogs .

In general I find Ireland a really difficult place to own a pet. I walk most places as I don't drive and i'd love to be able to pop into a shop with Cato to get a loaf of bread or whatever. The most simple things are made really difficult.

My sister lives in France and every time i'm over I can't believe how dog friendly they are, being able to run into a shop or have a coffee with your dog would be amazing .

OldNotWIse

Diddler1977 wrote: »

I hate this part, I can't stand having to beg the driver

And of course you're made to feel like a second class citizen too. I've had "stand there at the luggage" or "keep him (its a girl, notice the absence of a penis?) on the floor" or "if he bites anyone he's gone!" or "if anyone complains he's gone!" barked (no pun intended) at me from bus drivers. One day a driver actually made a hitting gesture towards me (the "intelligent" idea being that if she was a reactionary type of dog, she would bite him, but like...eh no need to pretend you're going to hit me or the 6 kilo dog like :rolleyes: In any case, nobody would ever get to hit her, they'd have to come through mommy 1 first :mad: lol

The other day we took a bus and got the usual, "leave the dog in the luggage" so I stayed with her (horrible fear of her jumping off at stops!). Then this drunken god freak got on at the next stop and spent the entire hour shouting abuse at people, farting, belching, screaming about god and trying to rouse my dog (shouting at her and waving hands at her) - and you know what my little one did? She completley ignored him. She stayed put, looking out the window and there wasn't a peep out of her the whole time, she was a dream passenger - my partner wanted to have a go at the bus driver for allowing this male passenger to verbally abuse everyone on the bus and I just said, "no, leave it. Between his bad behaviour and her good behaviour, my point has been made. Sometimes it's wrong to be so prejudiced about animals - look at some of the scum we have to travel with just because they are human"

Thank God I've just got my licence! She can ride shotgun to her hearts content now, though less drinking for me

OldNotWIse

Anyone want to start a thread on pet friendly places? Shops, bars, hotels, B&Bs etc? We could compile a list by county or something?

Shenshen

I'm from Germany, and I have to say I can to some extend understand Irish pub/cafe/restaurant owners.
If you wanted to try and compare the two countries, you have to start at the basics. I've never seen anyone in Germany walking a dog on a public road without a leash on the dog.
I've never seen a dog in Germany just wandering around all by itself.
I've never spent a sleepless night in Germany because a dog somewhere decided to start barking, only for the owners to chuck it out of the house into the street/back garden, where it continued to bark.

And before you all start shouting at me : I'm sure none of you would be guilty of any of the above. The simple fact that you post on here is indication enough.
But you are all aware that people do behave in that way, and that their dogs in consequence are a little more unpredictable than necessary.
And the pub owners know that, too.

So, what are the pub.restaurant owners choices? Allow all dogs on the premisses? Even if you can tell just by looking at the owners that the dogs will probably cause trouble?

Allow just those dogs whose owners you like the look of? And put up with the complaints from all the other owners as to why their little pooch isn't allowed when someone else's is? And what will they do if someone else complains about the dog being there? I know a lot of people don't notice, but some dogs can smell rather strongly. And as was said earlier, people have allergies and phobias.

Or simply not allow any dogs, for the sake of having a quiet life, with no complaining dog owners and no complaining dog-dislikers?

Diddler1977

OldNotWIse wrote: »

And of course you're made to feel like a second class citizen too. I've had "stand there at the luggage" or "keep him (its a girl, notice the absence of a penis?) on the floor" or "if he bites anyone he's gone!" or "if anyone complains he's gone!" barked (no pun intended) at me from bus drivers. One day a driver actually made a hitting gesture towards me (the "intelligent" idea being that if she was a reactionary type of dog, she would bite him, but like...eh no need to pretend you're going to hit me or the 6 kilo dog like :rolleyes: In any case, nobody would ever get to hit her, they'd have to come through mommy 1 first :mad: lol

the lack of consistency is very frustrating. I've had "Don't let him down" when I put him on the ground in order to pay the fare into the machine.

Diddler1977

OldNotWIse wrote: »

Anyone want to start a thread on pet friendly places? Shops, bars, hotels, B&Bs etc? We could compile a list by county or something?

Door 51 in Ranelagh - very dog friendly.

They allow your dog under the canopy out the front and will offer water. And their breakfasts are great - Porridge with Baileys, anyone?!!!!

Zulu

Diddler1977 wrote: »

Door 51 in Ranelagh - very dog friendly.

They allow your dog under the canopy out the front and will offer water. And their breakfasts are great - Porridge with Baileys, anyone?!!!!

Bloody Stream in Howth is great. Outdoor covered & heated area. Nice food. Good pints. Table service (if eating). Waitress LOVES dogs - we always get a great welcome. Water for the dog.

...and the clientele tend to be dog friendly also.

ABajaninCork

I've asked the question a couple of times before..
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=77340759
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=78842665

I know there are a fair number of dog-friendly hotels in Ireland, and there are a few dog-friendly places around in Cork and Kerry. But there is no cohesive list and pretty well depends on the whim of the owners. Back home, there's a really good dog friendly guide, and a lot more place where you can bring the dog.

I've tried asking the Irish Tourist Board, but all they did was send me a list of places to visit in Munster, most of whom I KNOW do not allow dogs!! (I called them first before setting off)

What we need to do is to keep asking the question of the Tourist Board. I'm sure there's a lot of dog owners in the UK and beyond that would love to bring their dogs over (I have at least two friends that want to do this), and they would get a lot of business.

Meanwhile - composing a sticky would be a great idea.

borderlinemeath

ABajaninCork wrote: »

I've asked the question a couple of times before..
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=77340759
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=78842665

I know there are a fair number of dog-friendly hotels in Ireland, and there are a few dog-friendly places around in Cork and Kerry. But there is no cohesive list and pretty well depends on the whim of the owners. Back home, there's a really good dog friendly guide, and a lot more place where you can bring the dog.

I've tried asking the Irish Tourist Board, but all they did was send me a list of places to visit in Munster, most of whom I KNOW do not allow dogs!! (I called them first before setting off)

What we need to do is to keep asking the question of the Tourist Board. I'm sure there's a lot of dog owners in the UK and beyond that would love to bring their dogs over (I have at least two friends that want to do this), and they would get a lot of business.

Meanwhile - composing a sticky would be a great idea.

OldNotWIse Anyone want to start a thread on pet friendly places? Shops, bars, hotels, B&Bs etc? We could compile a list by county or something?

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=74190784

Thread from last year, following on from this actual thread when it started.

mitosis

Because people won't control and manage their dogs responsibly.

OldNotWIse

mitosis wrote: »

Because people won't control and manage their dogs responsibly.

generalise much?

OldNotWIse

Diddler1977 wrote: »

Door 51 in Ranelagh - very dog friendly.

They allow your dog under the canopy out the front and will offer water. And their breakfasts are great - Porridge with Baileys, anyone?!!!!

Porridge with baileys??? omg, sounds so wrong but could be amazing! thats my next stop

Diddler1977

mitosis wrote: »

Because people won't control and manage their dogs responsibly.

Some people don't control and manage their dogs.......and because of this we all suffer.

OldNotWIse

ABajaninCork wrote: »

I've asked the question a couple of times before..
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=77340759
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=78842665

I know there are a fair number of dog-friendly hotels in Ireland, and there are a few dog-friendly places around in Cork and Kerry. But there is no cohesive list and pretty well depends on the whim of the owners. Back home, there's a really good dog friendly guide, and a lot more place where you can bring the dog.

I've tried asking the Irish Tourist Board, but all they did was send me a list of places to visit in Munster, most of whom I KNOW do not allow dogs!! (I called them first before setting off)

What we need to do is to keep asking the question of the Tourist Board. I'm sure there's a lot of dog owners in the UK and beyond that would love to bring their dogs over (I have at least two friends that want to do this), and they would get a lot of business.

Meanwhile - composing a sticky would be a great idea.

Agree. I was recently researching somewhere to take my partner and our little furry one for the weekend (as it will be mine and the dog's bday - we dont know her age as she is a stray so we decided it will be the same as mine lol) and a lot of the hotels that claim to be "dog friendly" simply have boarding kennels attached. Just a way to make an extra buck One B&B in Tipperary advertised itself as "dog friendly" and this is a rough account of the conversation:

Me: Can I bring my dog to your B&B?
Man: Ah sure no problem, is it a small one?
Me: Yes
Man: Ok great...she can stay in the stable
Me: Oh...is the stable converted into kennels?
Man: Well...it's just a stable like, with a horse ya know?
Me: Oh, it has a horse?
Man: Ah sure of course, it's a stable woman but the horse wont touch your little dog
Me: Ok if you say so. I'll think about it and call you back....
(runs)

With repsect, if I want to go away without my dog, as I sometimes do, I have one specific kennel that I completely trust and that I will always leave her in. I'm not going to drag her halfway across the country to throw her into some kind of cowboy job kennels. Sure she'd be better off at home

OldNotWIse

Diddler1977 wrote: »

Some people don't control and manage their dogs.......and because of this we all suffer.

But why not just ban these? I have no problem removing my dog from a situation where she is misbehaving (hypothetical of course lol) so why not allow them on the condition that they are well behaved and when they misbehave...out. In my dream world they would apply this rule to unruly kids in pubs at the weekends too

Binka

OldNotWIse wrote: »

In my dream world they would apply this rule to unruly kids in pubs at the weekends too

...and unruly adults too!

ABajaninCork

borderlinemeath wrote: »

[/B]




http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=74190784

Thread from last year, following on from this actual thread when it started.

Yes, I am aware of the thread. However, I did say that asking the Tourist Board to compile a list of dog friendly places would be the way forward. Meanwhile, composing a sticky would be a start. So I did agree with that.

Apanachi

Shenshen wrote: »

I'm from Germany, and I have to say I can to some extend understand Irish pub/cafe/restaurant owners.
If you wanted to try and compare the two countries, you have to start at the basics. I've never seen anyone in Germany walking a dog on a public road without a leash on the dog.
I've never seen a dog in Germany just wandering around all by itself.
I've never spent a sleepless night in Germany because a dog somewhere decided to start barking, only for the owners to chuck it out of the house into the street/back garden, where it continued to bark.

Can't really comment on how dog un-friendly Ireland is, because growing up in the countryside, we never had any problems with our dogs, I can comment on the comparisons with Germany though

I for one (as a dog owner, I'm glad dogs aren't allowed in restaurants for various reasons, I've seen dogs p*ss and sh*t in restaurans and shoppping centres here in Germany (not very often but still on a few occasions) and cases of people being absolutely too terrified to finish their meals because they have a huge fear of dogs (something I've noticed a lot here)

Most of my Summer nights are sleepless because my neighbours dog is forever barking outside (Winters are only better because then I sleep with the window closed)

A lot of dogs around where I live don't be on a leash, but because it's a rural enough suburb just outside of the city no one really minds and I think it's good for the dogs to be able to run freely - this is obviously not a good idea in towns or cities. In Berlin however, I do see a lot of people letting their dogs run loose with a leash (OK to be fair, it's mostly punks and beggars who do this)

Now, I have come across a few people in Ireland (mostly famers, but don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to tar all farmers with one brush) who don't seem to care about their dogs, it's not that they necessarily mis-treat them, more of they just couldn't give a damn. We got our dog from a farmer who couldn't have been bothered neutering his dog, she runs around all the time and regularily has pups, which he doesn't give a damn about, it he can't find a home for them, he drowns them, lucky for our dog that we decided to get a dog when she did, she was the last of the litter and had we decided a day later, it would have been too late for her (lucky for us too, she has been a loving, faithfull companion to us for the last 14 1/2 years, we couldn't have wished for a better dog)

OldNotWIse

Apanachi wrote: »

Can't really comment on how dog un-friendly Ireland is, because growing up in the countryside, we never had any problems with our dogs, I can comment on the comparisons with Germany though

I for one (as a dog owner, I'm glad dogs aren't allowed in restaurants for various reasons, I've seen dogs p*ss and sh*t in restaurans and shoppping centres here in Germany (not very often but still on a few occasions) and cases of people being absolutely too terrified to finish their meals because they have a huge fear of dogs (something I've noticed a lot here)

Most of my Summer nights are sleepless because my neighbours dog is forever barking outside (Winters are only better because then I sleep with the window closed)

A lot of dogs around where I live don't be on a leash, but because it's a rural enough suburb just outside of the city no one really minds and I think it's good for the dogs to be able to run freely - this is obviously not a good idea in towns or cities. In Berlin however, I do see a lot of people letting their dogs run loose with a leash (OK to be fair, it's mostly punks and beggars who do this)

Now, I have come across a few people in Ireland (mostly famers, but don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to tar all farmers with one brush) who don't seem to care about their dogs, it's not that they necessarily mis-treat them, more of they just couldn't give a damn. We got our dog from a farmer who couldn't have been bothered neutering his dog, she runs around all the time and regularily has pups, which he doesn't give a damn about, it he can't find a home for them, he drowns them, lucky for our dog that we decided to get a dog when she did, she was the last of the litter and had we decided a day later, it would have been too late for her (lucky for us too, she has been a loving, faithfull companion to us for the last 14 1/2 years, we couldn't have wished for a better dog)

what a pr1ck, he should be reported.

Apanachi

OldNotWIse wrote: »

what a pr1ck, he should be reported.

As far as I know he has been, I don't know the guy personally, but my brother does (did??) he's the reason all the pups were saved, heand a friend of his found out that the dog had had pups and made sure he got homes for all of them and they said they were going to report him - to be honest I never followed up on it, so I don't know what happened, this was 14 years ago, so I hope things have changed, but there are still enough people like him around (unfortunately)

FoxyVixen

Just to point out drowning pups was a common practise 14 yrs ago and not limited to Ireland.

In my experience this has changed drastically and I know plenty of farmers who do neuter. Some don't as they see an affect in the bitch working in previous animals after spaying. Most farmers who don't spay take measures in ensuring the bitch doesn't get pregnant as again it will affect the animal working.

Apanachi

FoxyVixen wrote: »

Just to point out drowning pups was a common practise 14 yrs ago and not limited to Ireland.

Yes, definitely not limited to Ireland, we had a cat in Germany about 17 years ago, (OK I know this thread is about dogs, but the point is relevant)

We ended up with her because we had just moved into the house the cat had previously lived in, she was pregnant and kept coming back "home", the owner was constantly coming over to bring the cat back to her new home, but I could tell she didn't really care to much for the cat, so I told her the cat didn't bother me at all, in fact, I was quite fond of her, she asked me if I wanted to keep her so I said yes, she said when the cat had the kittens we should call her and she would "sort it out" (drown them), we obviously never called her and found homes for all but one kitten which I had already decided I wanted to keep. One of the first things we did when she had her kittens was take her to the vet to get her neutered.

Glad to hear things have changed for the better

OldNotWIse

Apanachi wrote: »

As far as I know he has been, I don't know the guy personally, but my brother does (did??) he's the reason all the pups were saved, heand a friend of his found out that the dog had had pups and made sure he got homes for all of them and they said they were going to report him - to be honest I never followed up on it, so I don't know what happened, this was 14 years ago, so I hope things have changed, but there are still enough people like him around (unfortunately)

Ah fair play to him. Yeah sadly it still happens a lot and animal welfare is a joke in this country. You can horribly abuse and kill a beautiful animal and you might just get a slap on the wrist

OldNotWIse

Apanachi wrote: »

Yes, definitely not limited to Ireland, we had a cat in Germany about 17 years ago, (OK I know this thread is about dogs, but the point is relevant)

We ended up with her because we had just moved into the house the cat had previously lived in, she was pregnant and kept coming back "home", the owner was constantly coming over to bring the cat back to her new home, but I could tell she didn't really care to much for the cat, so I told her the cat didn't bother me at all, in fact, I was quite fond of her, she asked me if I wanted to keep her so I said yes, she said when the cat had the kittens we should call her and she would "sort it out" (drown them), we obviously never called her and found homes for all but one kitten which I had already decided I wanted to keep. One of the first things we did when she had her kittens was take her to the vet to get her neutered.

Glad to hear things have changed for the better

I'm so happy there are people like you, helps to kind of counter the bad in a way

The spaying issue is unbelieveable in this country. How we still have so many unwanted dogs in this country is beyond me. Neutering/spaying is at an all time low (dogs trust for example have a flat fee of twenty euro for spaying, and believe it or not they do cats too lol). Most of the people who complain about the cost of neutering had no problem coughing up a couple of hundred quid for an inbred pedigree pup Then there are the ones who think its ok to leave the male intact because they wont have the burden of unwanted pups anyway. Sighs...

Apanachi

OldNotWIse wrote: »

I'm so happy there are people like you, helps to kind of counter the bad in a way

Well, to be fair, I think the praise goes to my parents (God rest their souls), they were the ones who taught us to care for all creatures great and small, they taught us tolerance and acceptance, which I, in turn, pass on to my children.

But thank you