New Cattle Chute and Crush

millertime78

The time as come to bulldoze the old crush ( too narrow & too short) and install a new one. Anyway I'm running the chute along side a cattle shed with entrance and exit points to and from holding pens in the shed.

The platform is now levelled and we're ready to get the iron works.

Has anyone here bought posts/piping/gates etc recently? Any recommendations on skulling gates or other tips & tricks eg width.

thanks all

vanderbadger

millertime78 wrote: »

The time as come to bulldoze the old crush ( too narrow & too short) and install a new one. Anyway I'm running the chute along side a cattle shed with entrance and exit points to and from holding pens in the shed.

The platform is now levelled and we're ready to get the iron works.

Has anyone here bought posts/piping/gates etc recently? Any recommendations on skulling gates or other tips & tricks eg width.

thanks all

i think its a nice job if the concrete or platform outside the crush is a bit higher than the crush itself, that way you are kinda higher up than the cattle, might not be possible for you, maybe go for a head scoop as well, I was thinking of getting one but they seem fairly pricey, would be handy for dosing cows though

49801

have you considered temple grandin principals in your design?
worth spending a bit of time on youtube

this article is good
http://www.fwi.co.uk/landing-page/livestock/cattle-handling/

flatout11

put in a decent headgate, its worth spending the money on a good one
we installed a morris gate last year but there are other options out there
also i wouldnt go for a solid rail gates give you the option of opening a section at a time if a animal goes down,
it might also be worth your while extending the roof of the shed by a sheet so even if its only over the front of the race as you have a bit of comfort on wet days (or for the snow in october )

pakalasa

Article in this weeks journal too.

Has anyone been in AIBP factory in Nenagh recently. They installed a circular forcing pen where you off-load the cattle. Two high rotating gates that ratchet as they swing. All sides & gates sheeted full. Great job!
They also have rubber mats in all the pens and the comfort rubber on the slats.

flatout11

pakalasa wrote: »

They also have rubber mats in all the pens and the comfort rubber on the slats.

your kidding..... how long are they going to be in the lairage for?
there must be a few pennys left in beef processing after all

Muckit

49801 wrote: »

have you considered temple grandin principals in your design?
worth spending a bit of time on youtube

this article is good
http://www.fwi.co.uk/landing-page/livestock/cattle-handling/

Totall agree. I've looked at all her videos on youtube. Very informative. She seems like a nutjob at first, but she's a genius when it comes to animal handling. They call her 'the woman that thinks like a cow' in the US . I'm sorry I didn't see her videos BEFORE I upgraded our handling facilities a few years ago. Still I'I tweek a few things to improve what I've got already based on her principles.

Basically you should bring the cattle to go up the crush at the furthest point from the shed or holding pens. Cattle want to go back the way from where they came. So they should run up the chute, thinking they are going back from where they came.

I like the 'Daniels bud box' idea too. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dq4DbjIzxMw&feature=related. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OP7aNhKCZwQ&feature=related It's a good compromise if your wallet or space doesn't allow for a 'tub' (semi circular forcing pen).

I think we all need to develop handling facilites where you don't need to be inside in the pen with cattle to load the chute if at all possible.

As stated here by some posters, the meat factories are leading the way here in Ireland with their handling facilities. Why? Because it's low stress. Low stress gives better quality meat and is easier on man and beast. Finished cattle are over 10 times the weight of a human, your not going to best them with brut force.

Kepak in Athleague is our nearest abbatoir. They've installed a curved chute with soild sides to read tags. You should see how cattle just want to run up it once the gate is opened. No need to enter pen. Staff have got rid of the sticks and electric probs. Instead they've swopped them for what look like large plastic fly swatters. They don't touch the cattle unless they really have to. Again it's to cut stress on man and beast and above all, protect the meat quality.

Muckit

pakalasa wrote: »

They also have rubber mats in all the pens and the comfort rubber on the slats.

The mats are probably to stop cattle slipping etc and give them a sure footing

pakalasa

Muckit wrote: »

The mats are probably to stop cattle slipping etc and give them a sure footing

Yep, especially with all the young bulls being killed now.

Muckit

I'm only putting up these pics so lads might get a few ideas. I'm not claiming I've the ideal setup - far from it. But if a lad could get ideas from it or suggest how i could improve on it, how bad? This was put up in 2006;)



Pic 1
I've a 14' passageway. The gate in front of it is 16'. Pillars for these are about 18" outside the agitation slats, giving a ~7' passagway to run cattle to the crush to the right of the picture.




Pic 2
This is the view down the 'runway' towards the end of the chute. Cattle run along the top of the agitation slat. Ideally I'd like to change this around at a later date so that the cattle are loaded from the opposite end - some day;). Also I'd like to put something down to give a bit of grip on the smooth agitation slat:rolleyes:




Pic 3
Here you can see the gate in front of the agitation point. It can be swung out of the way for agitating. Note also the two bars on the wall. The door slides back behind it and stops cattle warping it as they pass by. It also offers support to the inside small gate pillar which is just hilti-bolted to the concrete underneath (too near the tank to sink it in ground)



Pic 4
Self explanatory. Just shows the small backing gates I've used. Also you can see I've just used heavy duty gates and pillars with adjustable hinges. Great to level gates and adjust them in and out if they ever got warped.




Pic 5

Here you can see how the gate can be swung to bring cattle back after they exit the chute. It's great to be able to bring out a pen of cattle and be able to put them back into the same pen again. As I said before I'd reckon it'd be a better job if cattle were drove down to the right here first,then exit the chute nearest the shed.

If I was doing things again, it'd be great to have some gates opening on both sides or at least have small escape openings to save jumping gates and cut down on the walking.

Good loser

For man stand outside crush 9 inch cavity blocks side by side - not concreted in. But be careful.

Leave 11 -12 inch space(s) to access pen without opening gate.

pakalasa

The raised walk along the outside of the chute should not be solid concrete. If an animal goes down in the chute, you're in right trouble. Better to have a removable walkway and also chute side gates, that can be opened in an emergency.

49801

that bud box idea looks really neat!

Muckit

pakalasa wrote: »

The raised walk along the outside of the chute should not be solid concrete. If an animal goes down in the chute, you're in right trouble. Better to have a removable walkway and also chute side gates, that can be opened in an emergency.

Yes you are right. Opening sections would be preferable. Thank God never had a problem. Chute is very short though and bars can be pulled out from the back if needs be. Still not ideal

If an animal goes down in the middle, let say, could the one or two in front or the one or two behind not be let out? Animal should hop up. Yes/no? Anyone any bad personal experiences? Not just hear say

49801

just thinking about the catwalk...
how long is a panel roughly?
would it be better to have brackets on the uprights to hold scaffold planks at the required height?
I know the planks are 8ft.
easy to remove if necessary and should not be too expensive

John_F

saw this sexy job at the birmingham dairy event the start of the week

http://www.iae.co.uk/agricultural/fixedcattle/default.htm

note the ratchet on the back gate and slide chute gate

pakalasa

Muckit wrote: »

.....If an animal goes down in the middle, let say, could the one or two in front or the one or two behind not be let out? Animal should hop up. Yes/no? Anyone any bad personal experiences? Not just hear say

What happens is an animal mounts up on the one in front. The front cattle back up. It then falls back completely on its back , with 4 legs sticking up in the air. I saw it happen one day in Ennis mart. Animal then gets wedged in between the concrete. It took them over half an hour to free him. They couldn't get in with anything to lift him.
In the journal recently, the mart manager of listowel, I think, was asked his opinions on chutes, pens etc. He mentioned this aswell.
BTW, I have the side bars free to slide back too. Just as good as having opening sides, I think.

Lizard_Moon

49801 wrote: »

just thinking about the catwalk...
how long is a panel roughly?
would it be better to have brackets on the uprights to hold scaffold planks at the required height?
I know the planks are 8ft.
easy to remove if necessary and should not be too expensive

Wooden planks can get very slippy either from rain, slime, dirt not to mention frost and ice.
Once had to test a herd in a chute at the back of a shed on a hill in winter- big drop at end- just managed to escape with my ankles intact!
LM

flatout11

Muckit wrote: »

Yes you are right. Opening sections would be preferable. Thank God never had a problem. Chute is very short though and bars can be pulled out from the back if needs be. Still not ideal

If an animal goes down in the middle, let say, could the one or two in front or the one or two behind not be let out? Animal should hop up. Yes/no? Anyone any bad personal experiences? Not just hear say

i wouldnt put in walkways i thing they are a waste of concrete
if the animal is big they generallu wont be able to get ip right again,
i seen it happen 2 year old heifewrs one fliped over on to her back, the race in question had gates but the walkway was 12 inches heig and she couldnt wriggle out ended up having to put ropes on her feet and lift her hind quater out so as she could get up, not recommended

49801

Lizard_Moon wrote: »

Wooden planks can get very slippy either from rain, slime, dirt not to mention frost and ice.
Once had to test a herd in a chute at the back of a shed on a hill in winter- big drop at end- just managed to escape with my ankles intact!
LM

treated?
turn them before using your facilities?

just thinking out load.
gantry type platform would of course be nicer. maybe on a slip off bracket per panel... you'd know i'd put up scaffolding this morning:pac::pac::pac:

there was a previous point about not having a concrete curb in case an animal goes down and its a valid one. there is a row of concrete blocks on our ancient race inline with the pillars/panels for some reason. only ever seen an animal get stuck in it once. not pleasant but managed to pull animal back the race to were it was wider and all was well. far from pleasant though:o.

Bodacious

pakalasa wrote: »

The raised walk along the outside of the chute should not be solid concrete. If an animal goes down in the chute, you're in right trouble. Better to have a removable walkway and also chute side gates, that can be opened in an emergency.

+1

Pak is bang on here... When I was young saw a very large char cow of mine nearly lost on her back stuck in between wall and solid concrete walkway and pulling her out on her back with a tractor... Dehorning gone wrong

As a result now our whole crush now can be taken apart in 30 seconds. Block wall one side ... middle two stakes were set in a 5mm spacer/ sleeve... Head gate and end stake are fixed, 3 quick release bolts hold 3 tubes/ rails to head gate.

very handy also to pull back bottom rail if putting a calf sucking or if milking out a cow

Muckit

pakalasa wrote: »

What happens is an animal mounts up on the one in front. The front cattle back up. It then falls back completely on its back , with 4 legs sticking up in the air.
BTW, I have the side bars free to slide back too. Just as good as having opening sides, I think.

I understand now what your saying. Yes the concrete stand would not help in this instance. Not trying to get out of it, but twas actually the oul lad that put it in! The crush was in before I did the penning around it.

I went out today deliberately and tried the bars in the crush. TBH I didn't think they would slide out as easy, but they did. If you look at the pics again you'I see that there is an extra pillar in ours than what would usually be in a 20' crush. In other words, pillars are closer together. This has stopped the bars from warping allowing them to slide. They are not bolted to the pillars, just slide through the eyes. If bars did get warped in a crush like this, then there would be a problem :rolleyes:

Bodacious

Muckit wrote: »

pakalasa wrote: »

What happens is an animal mounts up on the one in front. The front cattle back up. It then falls back completely on its back , with 4 legs sticking up in the air.
BTW, I have the side bars free to slide back too. Just as good as having opening sides, I think.

I understand now what your saying. Yes the concrete stand would not help in this instance. Not trying to get out of it, but twas actually the oul lad that put it in! The crush was in before I did the penning around it.

I went out today deliberately and tried the bars in the crush. TBH I didn't think they would slide out as easy, but they did. If you look at the pics again you'I see that there is an extra pillar in ours than what would usually be in a 20' crush. In other words, pillars are closer together. This has stopped the bars from warping allowing them to slide. They are not bolted to the pillars, just slide through the eyes. If bars did get warped in a crush like this, then there would be a problem :rolleyes:

when I'm dehorning I always throw a rope around the kidney and tie them to the top rail ... Takes the power out of the jump and won't allow them to go over on their backs... My own crush is probably a bit over the top safety wise but I was building it from scratch

Muckit

sick of reading threads......a pic speaks a thousand words.... I'm dying to see a few good setups..... Thanks

pakalasa

BTW, this is the type of backing gate I saw in the chute at the Nenagh plant. Temple Grandin design, I think. The chain is adjused for the height of the cattle. Seems to work well. Simple too. Cattle go under it no problem.

Muckit

Those anti backing gates are grand in a factory or farm setup where cattle are the same size. How would they work with cows and calves :rolleyes:

I think sliding backing gates are a great job form what I've seen at shows. love to get one

Pappa J

Defo take on board what Muckit and 49801 are saying about curved crushes. We put one in last year. It takes about 28 cattle. Mighty job. If it were straight you'd be at the other side of the field. We put in a 12" concrete step. A good idea is a constant run top rail at waist height when you are standing on the step. If you are following a moving animal you don't get the stomach ripped off you with the upright posts. Do the uprights in round pipe so you can cup each side and the top rail sits nicely on top.
We did the rails in 90mm OD pipe and got Pat Rynn eng in Galway to roll the pipe to the curve we wanted.

Only thing i'd change is add a lower bar to keep calves and weanlings in. There are only two rails. The other thing i'd do is sheet off the side you are standing at for the last 6ft. It helps the animal focus on charging through the locking gate.

AND above all put in some sort of anti-reversing device. In a long crush its vital.

49801

Pappa J wrote: »

Defo take on board what Muckit and 49801 are saying about curved crushes. We put one in last year. It takes about 28 cattle. Mighty job.

i'd love a curved race with a tub but we just dont handle enough animals often enough to justify the expense. but i have been watching different facilities on youtube for ideas for our system
when i do get around to making improvements i will use as many of the principals used in curved chutes i cannon slip footing

• no distractions with some selective side sheeting with stokboard
• no dramatic light changes or sun blinding (not a problem in cloudy Ireland with outside races but has been a problem in the past with parlours)
• reduced noise like metal on metal banging
• animals tendency to return where they've come from with a tub or bud box.
• only half fill or less your forcing space

it would not be usefull to put up pic's of our system as its comes from the old thinking of push-pushing animals.

I would like a sliding gate behind our crate so that personnel can access the rear of an animal in the crate and be protected from the animal behind.

can you locate your system so you can take advantage of the penning system you already have in your sheds like in the pictures above?

Muckit

I'd love to sheet some of the gates i have on the penning with light rubber. Was talking to some lad at Tullamore show last year that do cubicle mats. He did a lighter rubber matting product also (about 10mm I think) in a 6' roll. Would be a great job. Less distractions for cattle

bazza6195

make the middle bar re-movable at the head gate, very handy for doing a caesarean section on a cow.

moy83

Is there anyone around galway with a curved chute that would be kind enough to let me look at ? There are great ideas on here but i would love to see one in the flesh so to speak .

lakill Farm

i am thinking of building a crush with a curved wall and backing gate. Im going to build the curved wall with blocks with a few piers i the back . (Iwill put up plans next week) .

Any more photos of crushes.

Charlie Charolais

moy83 wrote: »

Is there anyone around galway with a curved chute that would be kind enough to let me look at ? There are great ideas on here but i would love to see one in the flesh so to speak .

Don’t know any farm local, but Balla Mart, (not too far way, ½ hour from Tuam), are putting new chutes, walkways etc, the chutes are serious & curved;
Rynn Eng., the Docks, Galway are fitting them - 091 562568

moy83

Charlie Charolais wrote: »

Don’t know any farm local, but Balla Mart, (not too far way, ½ hour from Tuam), are putting new chutes, walkways etc, the chutes are serious & curved;
Rynn Eng., the Docks, Galway are fitting them - 091 562568

Thanks for that charlie , my dad is buddies with pat rynn so i might even get him to ask a bit about them and maybe get a bit of info on what he is charging for that kind of work .