Low end but decent hardtails?

Lumen

I know almost nothing about MTBs.

I want something cheapish and mechically simple, for hacking around on trails (Ticknock, Ballinastoe, Djouce) with the kids.

I'm quite tempted to get a 26" rigid steel singlespeed, but they don't seem as cheap as they ought to be and I think it might kill me.

So sanity is pushing me in the direction of a cheap-but-decent hardtail with susp. fork and gears.

The obvious choice (to me) is the Grand Canyon, but in size M (I'm 182cm) the only one available is the 9.0, which is €1600. Not cheap.

There is a 2009 version in the outlet for €1100, but I'm wondering whether that's still overkill for my needs.

There is a Yellowstone 4.0 Ltd, in a delightfully metrosexual colour scheme, for €799. It has mostly Deore stuff and a RockShox Recon Silver TK Solo Air fork.

Would I notice a big difference between the Yellowstone and the Grand Canyon?

Is there a better option around €600-€1000? e.g. Be One Karma.

I've seen a few other cheapy MTBs with RockShox Dart forks, but I've read that they're crap.

Or I could wait for the 2012 Canyons.

I just really want something fun and challenging at lowish speeds.

Veering back towards madness, there's the On-One Carbon Whippet Alfine 8 Speed - the ground clearance with that small ring looks great but I suspect the hub would explode and I'm not sure the geometry is right for the sort of singletrack I'll be on.

Morgan

There are a couple of older-model hardtails in the Outlet section. They're quite well specced for the money and the frame is the newer design (internal cables).

The Yellowstone would be fine for the kind of riding you describe. However, if you're used to riding nice high-spec bikes you might be left with a lingering feeling of dissatisfaction.

Morgan

Now that I read your post in full - you already spotted the outlet! I wouldn't consider it overkill - decent parts should last longer, so think of it as an investment. Who knows, you might even like it and decide to go ... fast!

brian2me

Whatever you do stay away from Halfords even for kids bikes

Tenzor07

Lumen wrote: »

II want something cheapish and mechically simple, for hacking around on trails (Ticknock, Ballinastoe, Djouce) with the kids.

I'm quite tempted to get a 26" rigid steel singlespeed, but they don't seem as cheap as they ought to be and I think it might kill me

In general I'd only use a Rigid steel singlespeed for cycling on relatively flat forestry road or parks, otherwise you'll feel like you've done a round of boxing with Mike Tyson after cycling on that!

Having a look around the Canyon site, this one seems perfect for some decent trail riding... www.canyon.com/_en/outlet/article.html?o=A1023952

Lumen

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Having a look around the Canyon site, this one seems perfect for some decent trail riding... www.canyon.com/_en/outlet/article.html?o=A1023952

OK, so to clarify one of my main questions: the Yellowstone looks fine for a bit of non-competitive singletrack?

That one is large. The Canyon size calculator has me on a medium for the Grand Canyon (I ride 56-58cm road bikes).

Smaller is funner with mountain bikes...?

Lemag

I'm 171/2 cm and I have the Grand Canyon AL in small. If anything, it feels slightly too large for me. However, there wasn't a smaller size. redmaxi is very slightly taller than me. Has has a small sized Nerve XC. I'd say that the medium would be right for you.

Diarmuid

I wouldn't even consider a SS. My knees are worth more. How about one of the Scott hardtails in Slane cycles

Lumen

Diarmuid wrote: »

I wouldn't even consider a SS. My knees are worth more. How about one of the Scott hardtails in Slane cycles

The low end Scott hardtails have Rock Shox Dart forks, which I read were crap.

julio_iglayzis

Lumen wrote: »

The Canyon size calculator has me on a medium for the Grand Canyon (I ride 56-58cm road bikes).

Smaller is funner with mountain bikes...?

I'm the same, I think their calculator is spot on - I'm 6ft1 and I ride a 58cm Felt Z85 and a 19.5" Trek Fuel Ex 6.

I had a go on a large-sized Nerve XC last weekend and it was waaayyy too big for me. There was zero clearance between my crown jewels and the top tube. That's not something I'd be comfortable with having in the back of my mind when hammering down a sketchy descent.

Smaller is definitely funner when it comes to mountain bikes - and safer.

Biopace

brian2me wrote: »

Whatever you do stay away from Halfords even for kids bikes

Halfords may have a bad reputation but the Boardman range consistently get very, very good reviews, and with the kit you get on the bike for the price you pay, I'd find it very hard to ignore them.

Lumen

Lemag wrote: »

I'm 171/2 cm and I have the Grand Canyon AL in small. If anything, it feels slightly too large for me. However, there wasn't a smaller size. redmaxi is very slightly taller than me. Has has a small sized Nerve XC. I'd say that the medium would be right for you.

I played with the Canyon sizing widget, and it's a pile of arse.

The only factor which affects recommended size is inseam.

C3PO

Biopace wrote: »

Halfords may have a bad reputation but the Boardman range consistently get very, very good reviews, and with the kit you get on the bike for the price you pay, I'd find it very hard to ignore them.

No fan of Halfords either but a Boardman is certainly worth a look too!

julio_iglayzis

Lumen wrote: »

There is a Yellowstone 4.0 Ltd, in a delightfully metrosexual colour scheme, for €799. It has mostly Deore stuff and a RockShox Recon Silver TK Solo Air fork.

I think that's absolutely perfect for what you've described. I don't think it's worth the extra outlay on the Grand Canyon.

Lemag

Lumen wrote: »

I played with the Canyon sizing widget, and it's a pile of arse.

The only factor which affects recommended size is inseam.

I think when I put in my measurements back when I was buying my bike it didn't even make a recommendation. Was I too short

You've probably seen this already and it might seem like diving into the deep end but you've already mentioned other options in the same price bracket. Weight makes a fair bit of difference regarding maneuverability. However, you do want the kids to be able to keep up, right? Also, if you're sufficiently crap and brave it'd probably get subjected to a fair amount of bashing.

Tenzor07

Lumen wrote: »

The low end Scott hardtails have Rock Shox Dart forks, which I read were crap.

They are, but sure unless your racing then they "do the job".... I'd always go with Fox forks over the Sram R/s...

Lumen

Focus Black Raider 4.0 SLX 2011, €589.87
http://www.wiggle.co.uk/focus-black-raider-40-slx-2011/

Icyseanfitz

whats the max budget? views on whats low end can differ greatly sorry just read up to a 1000 yeah, halfords boardmans are good bikes, the grand canyon al 6.0 is a good bike, id say ask around some lbs but you probably wont get better than the canyon unless you go second hand

Lemag

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

you probably wont get better than the canyon unless you go second hand

Sometimes secondhand can work out very expensive :pac: and sure one could be opening themselves up for a whole world of hurt, right Icyseanfitz:p

Icyseanfitz

Lemag wrote: »

Sometimes secondhand can work out very expensive :pac: and sure one could be opening themselves up for a whole world of hurt, right Icyseanfitz:p

haha caught dont even think i am going to sell it tbh as i cant see someone giving me the asking for it but who knows, either way the only reason i was selling it was so i could buy another bike of the same brand from an actual dealer over in the uk as i really like the bikes and their suspension system,

but yeah full suspension second hand bikes can bite you in the ass if you dont know what to look for, although i dont mind as ive learned a whole lot about bike mechanics in a very short amount of time

Lemag

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

haha caught dont even think i am going to sell it tbh as i cant see someone giving me the asking for it but who knows,

I'd bite the hand off that guy offering €800. Not too sure how well I'd sleep afterwards though.

Icyseanfitz

was thinking the same myself actually but then i started thinking of all those great times i had on the bike and all the money ive put into it and 800 euro just doesnt cut it, but as i said i aint exactly dying to get rid of it

Tenzor07

That Wonky-Con bike is the most Infamous MTB in Ireland at this stage ICFizz! Your better off keeping it....

@Lumen, Eurocycles have a load of Focus MTB's around with around €100 off the marked price... Can't go wrong really... And at least you get to try them out for size in person rather than fluting around with some Internet bike size app!

Icyseanfitz

Tenzor07 wrote: »

That Wonky-Con bike is the most Infamous MTB in Ireland at this stage ICFizz! Your better off keeping it....

@Lumen, Eurocycles have a load of Focus MTB's around with around €100 off the marked price... Can't go wrong really... And at least you get to try them out for size in person rather than fluting around with some Internet bike size app!

some people can be so mean my poor bike is in a corner leaking hydraulic fluid because of you

studiorat

Lumen wrote: »

I played with the Canyon sizing widget, and it's a pile of arse.

Great for making weird shaped people and seeing what size bike they'd use.
Hours of fun.

Cycle Surgery were selling Marin and Orange bikes a while back with excellent discounts. I find the shop is quite expensive usually but the discounts are usually very good.

Tenzor07

studiorat wrote: »

Cycle Surgery were selling Marin and Orange bikes a while back with excellent discounts. I find the shop is quite expensive usually but the discounts are usually very good.

Ah Marin and Orange, once THE bike to have, legend!

I believe they are making a comeback for 2012....

Tenzor07

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

my poor bike is in a corner leaking hydraulic fluid because of you

That not part of the problem? DIY repairs = Leaky shox etc?

But seriously... stick it up on an ebay auction, see what you get for it..

Icyseanfitz

Tenzor07 wrote: »

That not part of the problem? DIY repairs = Leaky shox etc?

But seriously... stick it up on an ebay auction, see what you get for it..

ah feck sake it doesnt have a leaky shock or a leaky anything, you work for a bike shop i take it, down with diy and what not not really pushed to sell it tbh as i quite like it

Tenzor07

Nah but for any suspension related issues I would take the bike to James@OC Tuning certainly would not trust the servicing of expensive suspension parts to an amateur, bike shop employee or not...


OP sorry for the OT chat..

Lemag

Lumen, I'm sure that you'd already be aware of this but for the benefit of those who may stumble across this thread the users of the following forums would probably tend to be better informed regarding Lumen's query -

epicmtb.com

mtbireland.com

madmtb.com

Icyseanfitz

yeah op this has gone way off topic mostly my bad as for suspension servicing yeah i think oc tuning is about the only place in the country who can actually service bionicon's suspension setup, at least i got a message from them saying they did, pity i live in kerry will have to try and learn how to do that at some point as well though

cunavalos

how about the giant xtc 1 from paulscycles in uk. there are loads of heavily discounted hardtails there including an giant xtc2 at £770 GBP specced similarly to the yellowstone from canyon

C3PO

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

......either way the only reason i was selling it was so i could buy another bike of the same brand from an actual dealer over in the uk as i really like the bikes and their suspension system

You are joking ....... aren't you?

Icyseanfitz

RPL1 wrote: »

You are joking ....... aren't you?

nope sure am not, as the saying goes dont bash it til you try it, the only problem with the bikes is that you dont get a good resale on them as they arnt all that widely known,

all the problems i had with the bike where brake, chainset, rear hub and getting some new pivot bearings and shock bushings, no suspension or frame problems at all

Lemag

Perhaps you've already found what you're looking for. If not though, this might take your fancy.