Matt Williams Pundit

MaryKing

Deleted User wrote: »

Regardless of whether or not he'd be eligible to play for Ireland, he's been involved in Irish Rugby for a far longer time than most.

He's done an awful lot for the game here, good and bad sometimes, but I think its fair to say that he has a lot of love for Irish Rugby.

He has a fairly poor record as a coach although he seems to have been fairly popular with the Leinster player when he was coach. After that, his record is dismal with Scotland & Ulster (both didn't continue with his services). I'd say the love of Irish rugby is more about him not being wanted anywhere else much, particularly in his homeland than anything else.

astonaidan

Yes I have and total agree with You, Have always had a disliking to him and his smugness

hsbc

Really like the Williams & Francis combo - Williams knows his rugby inside out and is really interesting, best rugby anchor/pundit on tv.

mrboswell

MaryKing wrote: »

I'd say the love of Irish rugby is more about him not being wanted anywhere else much, particularly in his homeland than anything else.

Load of rubbish there as we have come to expect.

He is a fantastic analyst and could be considered as being a steering influence on some of Australia's past greats. He was assistant coach and coach at the Warathas during their successful period before he came to Leinster.

Ever since he moved here the first time he has considered himself as Irish and has always referred to the Irish team as "us" or "we".

Even if people don't like him, he clearly knows a lot more about rugby than you.

phog

I dont particularly like Williams as an anchor man but there's no denying his knowledge of the game. Franno, has he ever really disagreed with Williams, he reminds on the toy dog you'd sometimes see on the rear window of a car, always nodding in agreement.

As for Setanta, it'll be a long day before this company ever get a cent from me again.

fryup

MaryKing wrote: »

I think his grandfather was from Limerick.

his granddad ya that really makes him irish alright

he's an aussie out and out

Another way he trys to appeal to irish viewers is the obligatory swipe at England, himself and Franno are always at it..after this mornings game he highlights the cynical side of the english never once mentioning what the argentinians got up to. It was the same the last world cup when England got to the final always commenting on the negative.

Someone needs to tell him we've moved on from that.

Bearcat

I like matt and Frano even though frano impersonates a nodding dog at times......both fellas tell it from the hip. I'm waning on hookie, popie, blank one and blank two. Sorry but that's the way i see it. Honest opinions as against bluff and bluster on rte.:rolleyes:

bob11

I'm loving Matt ...

Liked the bit showing the French dressing room at half time , with nobody listening to their coach and all their lineout plays on the whiteboard for all to see ...

Get your BNZ cups going !!

thomond2006

Love the BNZ cups, I wonder does Franno actually pay the fines?

Aidric

fryup wrote: »

his granddad ya that really makes him irish alright

he's an aussie out and out

Another way he trys to appeal to irish viewers is the obligatory swipe at England, himself and Franno are always at it..after this mornings game he highlights the cynical side of the english never once mentioning what the argentinians got up to. It was the same the last world cup when England got to the final always commenting on the negative.

Someone needs to tell him we've moved on from that.

Get a grip and listen to some more Matt, it might do you some good.

He is hands down the best pundit in the country, just listen to any of his input on various media outlets over the years. Balanced, insightful and fair. You can't ask for much more than that in a pundit.

fryup

Aidric wrote: »

Get a grip and listen to some more Matt, it might do you some good.

i'm not denying he's a good pundit...but i just wish he'd drop the plastic paddy routine of "us" and "we" i find it cheesey

Aidric wrote: »

He is hands down the best pundit in the country, just listen to any of his input on various media outlets over the years. Balanced, insightful and fair. You can't ask for much more than that in a pundit.

well not when it comes to England he always gets a dig in...

thats just the way i see it, ok

Stev_o

phog wrote: »

I dont particularly like Williams as an anchor man but there's no denying his knowledge of the game. Franno, has he ever really disagreed with Williams, he reminds on the toy dog you'd sometimes see on the rear window of a car, always nodding in agreement.

As for Setanta, it'll be a long day before this company ever get a cent from me again.

Slightly off topic but whats wrong with Setanta?

mrboswell

Us and we - I believe that he feels that way so I'm happy for him to say it. As he always has.

He gets a few digs in with England but I thought it was classic after the NZ v Tonga match when he said "Lets go to Graham Henry; one of the all time greats of rugby - not".

With any anchor, you have to have a bit of fun. If it was an Irish player that did something embarrassing or funny he mentions that as well.

Pre-match, half time and post-match I wouldn't watch anyone else

phog

Stev_o wrote: »

Slightly off topic but whats wrong with Setanta?

Programe wise probably nothing, contract wise a shower of liars.

stockyboie

Williams enthusiam for the game is infectious. I think thats why people like him. Its such a change to see punditry from someone who doesn't take himself too seriously. I'm tired of watching RTE with hook & co's attention seeking negative rants and fake infighting.

When you see some of the people involved with the irish setup like kidney who has absolutely zero personality and talks in his dronesome monotoned way you begin to see why the irish team has no motivation and why some people would be turned off rugby altogether listening to him. I'm sure Williams never suffered from this trait regardless of his managerial success. I think he has that rare ability to be fair when making his points and actually listens to what his fellow pundit is saying rather then just reacting in a childish manner.

Its just nice to see the lighthearted banter between williams and francais.

chiefwiggum

i love listening to matt when he's on newstalk's off the ball..as some of the lads here have said his love and excitement for the game just oozes from him..he's right on the money a lot of the time too,would love to see him on rte

Reloc8

He's a genuine expert on the game and is a lot less up his own arse than most people who sit in a pundit's chair - what's not to like.

Pride Fighter

Anyone see Williams and Francis criticising the journalists at the Irish press conference after the game? I thought it was quality, I think it was Williams that said are there any journalists there with an IQ higher than their shoe size. I LOLed hard at that, they're a great pairing.

thomond2006

Pride Fighter wrote: »

Anyone see Williams and Francis criticising the journalists at the Irish press conference after the game? I thought it was quality, I think it was Williams that said are there any journalists there with an IQ higher than their shoe size. I LOLed hard at that, they're a great pairing.

I also appreciated that!

Leslie91

Pride Fighter wrote: »

Anyone see Williams and Francis criticising the journalists at the Irish press conference after the game? I thought it was quality, I think it was Williams that said are there any journalists there with an IQ higher than their shoe size. I LOLed hard at that, they're a great pairing.

Yeah and one of them was Simon Hick the Newstalk guy!!. I thought Setanta and Newstalk were bed buddys. Simon won't be too pleased with that slagging!!. But the questions were crap. Where was Gerry Thornley say?.

duckysauce

probably getting drunk after seeing that perfromance

wixfjord

Leslie91 wrote: »

Yeah and one of them was Simon Hick the Newstalk guy!!. I thought Setanta and Newstalk were bed buddys. Simon won't be too pleased with that slagging!!. But the questions were crap. Where was Gerry Thornley say?.

Under the table servicing Kidney I'd wager.


On the press confrence, one of the questions was, literally,
"So Declan, what did you think of the performance?" followed by silence.

That guy is earning his corn.

RoryMc23

Francis and Williams are absolutely brilliant together.

The punditry on setanta is hands down the best on UK and Irish TV. I am shocked by how many people watch RTE's coverage (that have Setanta) I mean Donal Lenihan, George Hook, McGuirk and Sheehan are absolutely dreadful pundits. O'Shea does nothing but state the obvious (despite his near messiah status here) and Pope seems more interested in trying to be funny than actually being a pundit.

catseye2

Just can't listen to hook and mcguirk anymore. Would love to know how much they are pulling in per game from us license payees.

The 2 page article on them in the times yesterday was completely self indulgent.

Matt is the rugby fans pundit and franno is getting better each season

MaryKing

mrboswell wrote: »

Load of rubbish there as we have come to expect.

He is a fantastic analyst and could be considered as being a steering influence on some of Australia's past greats. He was assistant coach and coach at the Warathas during their successful period before he came to Leinster.

Ever since he moved here the first time he has considered himself as Irish and has always referred to the Irish team as "us" or "we".

Even if people don't like him, he clearly knows a lot more about rugby than you.

Seems you are ignoring my main point about Williams - his abysmal coaching record. 3 wins out of 17 with Scotland for instance (Japan among those wins!). He was fired. He didn't last a season in Ulster as coach.

Even I could not mess up mentoring David Campese & Brian O'Driscoll!

With regard to his dislike of England - no love lost between the Aussies and the English in sport particularly.

irishbucsfan

MaryKing wrote: »

Seems you are ignoring my main point about Williams - his abysmal coaching record. 3 wins out of 17 with Scotland for instance (Japan among those wins!). He was fired. He didn't last a season in Ulster as coach.

Even I could not mess up mentoring David Campese & Brian O'Driscoll!

With regard to his dislike of England - no love lost between the Aussies and the English in sport particularly.

He was succesful with the Waratahs, he brought Leinster from 35th in Europe to being ranked 2nd.

He was doing very well at Ulster as well before he fell out with the board.

Funny how you omitted all that.

He's had more success in rugby than any other analyst, and although Conor O'Shea could well surpass his achievements, he has quitened up since joining Quins.

Paparazzo

So great having the option of Matt Williams at half time with a bit of positivity. Didn't watch RTE, but I can only imagine Hook going on a massive rant about how bad we are and Ireland might as well never play a rugby match again because we'll never beat new zealand.

mrboswell

MaryKing wrote: »

Seems you are ignoring my main point about Williams - his abysmal coaching record. 3 wins out of 17 with Scotland for instance (Japan among those wins!). He was fired. He didn't last a season in Ulster as coach.

Even I could not mess up mentoring David Campese & Brian O'Driscoll!

Considering some of the pearls of wisdom you come out with here I'm sure it could be a possibility.

Just so you know - the title of the tread is Matt Williams Pundit not Matt Williams coach.

mossyc123

They are a nice antidote to the hyperbole and bluster coming out of RTE.

Williams is a quality pundit and a very professional anchor... does well to perform both roles at once!

Im no expert on Rugby and I understand some think he isn't the most knowledgeable but Francis is very entertaining... without the need for BS conflict with another panellist.

His article today in the Sindo was just about the only time I have laughed continously throughout a sports article... some absolutely crackin stuff :pac:


"It was a seminal moment in my fledgling career. Sanity and physical survival depended on it, and the man I had to thank was Colonel Harland Sanders and his 11 secret herbs and spices.
For our second World Cup pool match in 1987, Ireland were billeted in the two-star travel lodge in Dunedin. The food had been so bad that my ribs had begun to show -- not good at a time when bulk or ballast of any kind was considered advantageous. The restaurant in the hotel was a time capsule; I've never been to a 1960s civil service canteen but this is what it smelled like. Henry Ford came to mind -- you could have anything on the menu as long as it was lamb stew.
I'd vomited most of the previous night as Dolly's fat and intestines made acquaintance with Franzer's intestines. I took three mouthfuls and gagged, then ate nine or ten pieces of bread and butter and was just getting up to go when Syd Millar, who was so impressed with the quantity of bread and butter I'd eaten, insisted I had lamb spew seconds.
"What weight are you now son?"
"About 16 stone."
"You need to be heavier, get it into you."
He almost stood over me as I committed gastronomic hara-kiri. When Syd left, I went outside, ran up to the top of the car park and back, leaned over the wall, stuck my fingers down my throat and puked for Ireland. I'd become the nation's first bulimic second row. During my Technicolor yawn I sensed a movement between my knees. The porter's dog had seen me run up and down the car park and followed me. He couldn't believe his luck when gallons of lamb stew appeared from nowhere. The hound was too busy hoovering up to notice that I'd drowned him with my second splash. World Cup glamour or wot?
Physically weak I went for a walk to try and get myself together. Four blocks down the road and a chorus of Handel's Messiah hit me -- hallelujah, there he was, the specky chuckmeister in all his neon glory. One family bucket later and the world was good again.
The squad was made up of the bones of the 1985 Triple Crown-winning team and I was newish. It mightn't have been such a good idea to stray off when the team were eating together, but rule number one in the self-preservation manual says 'when you are Lee Marvin, forget everything and get to the trough'. For three consecutive nights I sneaked out to gorge myself, vampire-like, in the Dunedin darkness.
On the third night, I had just given my order when the girl at the counter said, "ah youse guize a basketball tyme?" "Sorry," I replied and turned around to see half the squad sitting down tucking into the colonel's finest.
It would be nine years before a nutritionist would come knocking on my door as the move from semi-professionalism took its final course. It was symptomatic of the cack-handed, half-baked preparation which was engendered by this virginal World Cup.
As I look back, naivety supersedes nostalgia. It was great fun but we hadn't a notion of what was required.
In 1987, there were still places up for grabs but the selectors went for an 'I'm-not-going-to-get-on-the-plane-but-I'll-make-sure-that-bollox-doesn't-either' blues versus whites extravaganza. Sinn Féin were still a banned organisation but Mé Féin was very much alive and kicking.
The difference between the two fairly evenly matched teams was that the side I played on was captained by Ciarán Fitzgerald, who was in the process of being royally shafted, yet he still did the Fitzy magic that night and the whites trounced the blewz. It was my only really big game in Ravenhill and while Gerry Holland and Mike Gibson were still in the equation, if the movie Jerry Maguire had been out ten years earlier, I'd have been shouting "show me the ticket" down the phone.
The flight told you everything you needed to know about the state of the game. Everybody turned right when they got on board. We spent 32 hours in steerage, no hydration, no stretching and just a few beers to relax us and make us sleep. By the time we reached Auckland, I had had two hours' kip and felt as wooden as Hugh Grant. Never mind, I'd get a good rub-down from Joe Doran. Sorry, left him behind in Dublin. Perhaps a plyometric stretching session with the squad's physical trainer. Unlikely when one didn't exist. Perhaps a pool session to loosen up the aching limbs and gently get the elasticity back into those muscles. Nope. What about a three-hour session of murder ball and scrummaging 30 minutes after we got out of the airport! Good thinking, Batman.
Half the squad picked up injuries but none as severe as the one picked up by our aspiring centre three-quarter. Mick Doyle had spent the session chasing Keith Crossan, Mick Kiernan and Brendan Mullin around the paddock. We had heard later that he had become ill. Sure enough, we were told that he had suffered a heart attack; it would affect him and the squad for the rest of the tournament. Doyle was seriously overweight and as he lay on his bed with his Ned Kelly hanging out, Donal Lenihan and Brendan Mullin popped in to the hospital to see him. "Well Doyler, is it a boy or a girl?" the lads asked. After the delivery Doyle suffered from a severe dose of the baby blues and was not the same man who had coached a side to a Triple Crown in 1985.
Things got worse for me as Uncle Syd took over the reins. Nothing that five trillion press-ups and three hours of scrummaging wouldn't put right -- and that was just the backs. New Zealand just wasn't doing it for me. The training was ****. The hotels were ****. The food was ****. The weather was ****. The training facilities were ****. The piss-ups . . .
Did I mention the piss-ups? They were legendary. We were a bunch of international class players but sometimes behaved like a club side on a tour of Canada.
The enormity of the event didn't really dawn on us. A small inkling of truth permeated at the inaugural dinner in Auckland. The Paddies were first into the hall. While we were waiting for the rest of the teams to arrive, I went over to the main table and picked the Webb Ellis trophy up off its plinth and promptly knocked the lid off the top. It would be the closest I'd ever get to it. Philip Matthews came over and lifted it back just as the All Blacks walked in. Silence descended. Wayne Shelford came over to us. We both felt like 12-year-old kids who had just been caught playing with his 22-year-old brother's Fender Stratocaster. The look we got was 'that's our property mate'.
I still think the gradual Welsh descent to south sea island standard had its genesis in the Ballymore bashing that the Kiwis inflicted on the Taffies in the semi-final. Back then a 49-6 thrashing would constitute a 90-point drubbing in today's terms. It wasn't the scoreline it was the way they literally dismantled the Welsh. One of the Welsh second rows that day was a guy called Huw Richards and he had a fair idea about the forthcoming All Black scorched earth policy. So he did the only thing you can do when the situation is hopeless -- start a fight.
He went a little heavy in his loafers at ruck time, threw a few fresh air Pradas and then walked into a vicious Shelford short arm, cocked at the waist. When he woke up there was red everywhere, blood on his face, but most dispiritingly a red card from referee Kerry Fitzgerald. He could barely stagger off the park.
Just watching the All Blacks play that day sent a very clear message to me. We were all sure we were playing rugby union but they were playing a radically different version of the game, a version that nobody was able to live with. Prior to that Wales had managed to dispatch Ireland in the first match in our pool. It was without parallel in the history of the game -- universally chosen as the worst game of rugby union ever seen. Anybody who took part in it would pay a high price at the Webb Ellis pearly gates.
When the match was over the subs and dirt trackers were thrown out of the dressing room and Doyle launched an amazing attack on his players. Some of the squad were bitter about it but never mind that wasn't going to last too long and there was a huge piss-up to be had and I met Mr Bengazzi that night as players from both sides got rollocking drunk.
As the bus went through the centre of Wellington on the way back to our hotel, it stopped at a set of traffic lights. Some ladies of the night put on a show, two of them removing their boob-tubes and letting it all hang out. Naturally, there was wild excitement and the driver was ordered to go around the block again and the Bobbies put on an even better show until one of them overdid it and the awful realisation that we were looking at an early version of The Crying Game. Hard to explain the graphic quietude on the bus but if Stephen Rea had been in the team he would have understood.
There would be no hangovers at training in the morning, all of us sobered up immediately in the silence. The team was made to go around the block again about 100 times on the training paddock over the next couple of days. If we failed to perform against Canada in the next match, we were out.
Dunedin was the next stop. They call Carisbrook 'The House of Pain' and if that be so then it extended all the way to the city limits. I thought Dunedin was a frightful kip. We really struggled, trailing for most of the match but coming good in the last 10 minutes or so. The Canadians took their beating and without a hint of malice or sour grapes announced that they only played 70 minutes-a-match back home in Canada and they weren't used to 40 minutes a side. Our side was in need of radical surgery in terms of attitude, direction and strategy but it never came and the squad never had the cojones to take the initiative.
The team moved to Brisbane, a change from -3 degrees to +33 degrees. I missed the KFC in Dunedin but there was food -- edible food in Brizzy and sunshine too. The team to play Tonga was announced in the morning, it was my only chance of a game. Lenihan, Anderson . . . "****e I'm not getting a game" . . . Matthews, McGrath . . . Francis.
Number 8! I hadn't played there since under 14s. What did I know about the position? I'd have responsibilities. I'd have to remember back-row moves, but worse still I had to make things called tackles and I'd have to learn quickly. Mercifully, I was extremely fit, I don't know how, but as a young bloke I was suffering from a terrible affliction called enthusiasm -- first cap I'd give it all.
I sponged Brads (Michael Bradley) for the four days before the match, but I needed more. I asked the great Doyler about my defensive alignment off scrums only to be told "if the Pope comes round the side of the scrum on a Honda 50 you just tackle him." Inspirational! All my problems solved. I played well despite the advice but had a 'mare in the dressing room beforehand. The heat was stifling in Ballymore and most of the players had cut their sleeves for ventilation purposes. My first Irish jersey, it was a shame to defile it in such a way but needs must.
I put it on the ground and started to cut, threw the sleeves away and put on the sacred garment. Syd came into the dressing room and was overcome with paroxysms of rage. How could I desecrate the national jersey? Worse still one sleeve was shorter than the other. No worries mate, snip, snip and the job is oxo. Syd went ballistic as the opposite sleeve was now much shorter. No worries mate, snip, snip . . . snip, snip. I played my first Test in an Aussie Rules shirt which looked like a vest and I was christened 'The Dipper' after the Aussie Rules guy who played for Hawthorn.
The Tongans spent the match bag-snatching, clothes-lining and gouging which suggested that we might have been caught a little bit out of rhythm but we physically were too strong and too aggressive for them and we managed to overcome them with a bit to spare which gave us hope that Australia in Sydney might not be insurmountable.
We were beginning to act like the pros of today. I had an early morning pool session which ended when I pocketed the eight ball in the best of nine frames with an Irish supporter in a speakeasy in the Brizzy suburbs. I retained my place but there was mounting disillusionment at the lack of focus as we considered how we would go about trying to upset a good Australian side.
In an intensely physical game, the Aussies blitzkrieged us in the space of 20 minutes, it was nearly as crushing a defeat as the 1991 spectacular. Doyler was happy though, we won the second half apparently. Were we a bad side? Definitely not. If we'd been prepared in today's professional conditions we would have given the current lot a good match. Overall, the tournament was amateur with a capital A yet there was a real aesthetic about the quality of the two finalists. The match was poor but New Zealand were unforgiving and Michael Jones' performance in the tournament and in the final remains unmatched to this day. Franck Mesnel got his pink bow-tie Eden Park label going and David Kirk got his political ambitions kickstarted. Apart from the glorious Australia-France semi-final, the only other classic I can remember was the Colonel's chicken burger with fries and a large Pepsi for 2.99.
I suppose it had to start somehow and obviously the competitive has changed out of all recognition. They will look back in 50 years at the prototype and wistfully shake their heads."
- Neil Francis

ktulu123

This is a class piss take of the lads on setanta!!

wixfjord

ktulu123 wrote: »

This is a class piss take of the lads on setanta!!

The Franno impersonation is bloody brilliant!

ktulu123

Absolutely spot on!!

LostPassword

I absolutely can't stand Williams and Franno. I think they're both basically bull****ters - in fairness to Williams he hides it well but his insights are generally piss-poor and his track record speaks for itself in terms of coaching and his current employability as a coach. Franno doesn't even try to hide it, he's about as insightful as your average pub bore. Not the first clue about modern rugby.

The BBC kicks arses in terms of punditry - Johathon Davies is head and shoulders above anybody else as a pundit in my book - real understanding of rugby, balanced and a smart bloke to boot.

bamboozle

LostPassword wrote: »

I absolutely can't stand Williams and Franno. I think they're both basically bull****ters - in fairness to Williams he hides it well but his insights are generally piss-poor and his track record speaks for itself in terms of coaching and his current employability as a coach. Franno doesn't even try to hide it, he's about as insightful as your average pub bore. Not the first clue about modern rugby.

The BBC kicks arses in terms of punditry - Johathon Davies is head and shoulders above anybody else as a pundit in my book - real understanding of rugby, balanced and a smart bloke to boot.

Davies balanced? not when it envolves wales, i like the BBC coverage though, ITV is nearly as poor as sky sports.

molloyjh

irishbucsfan wrote: »

MaryKing wrote: »

Seems you are ignoring my main point about Williams - his abysmal coaching record. 3 wins out of 17 with Scotland for instance (Japan among those wins!). He was fired. He didn't last a season in Ulster as coach.

Even I could not mess up mentoring David Campese & Brian O'Driscoll!

With regard to his dislike of England - no love lost between the Aussies and the English in sport particularly.

He was succesful with the Waratahs, he brought Leinster from 35th in Europe to being ranked 2nd.

He was doing very well at Ulster as well before he fell out with the board.

Funny how you omitted all that.

He's had more success in rugby than any other analyst, and although Conor O'Shea could well surpass his achievements, he has quitened up since joining Quins.

Obviously off-topic here but he had awful trouble with internal politics in Scotland. He's not very complimentary of the set-up there after his time in charge. That he did well with Leinster and, to a degree, Ulster is enough for me. Not sure if anyone can be successful with Scotland these days!

As for his punditry I think the guy is great. He does have that enthusiasm for the game that is a delight to see and is always good for a laugh or two. Bloody New Zealanders! Love it.

Conor O'Shea is ok buy I don't know if he's looking at the Irish job at the same time. Or maybe he's trying to counter Hooks negativity, but I find him ovely positive. He won't just come out and say we're s***e. He'll point to all the good things and won't linger at all on the bad. We watch him to get an honest appraisal of the game and I don't think we get it.

thomond2006

Apres Match lads brilliant as always, they nailed Franno!

irishbucsfan

LostPassword wrote: »

I absolutely can't stand Williams and Franno. I think they're both basically bull****ters - in fairness to Williams he hides it well but his insights are generally piss-poor and his track record speaks for itself in terms of coaching and his current employability as a coach.

Hahaha rubbish!

His track record is very good. Even now he's coaching Narbonne and they're joint top of the Pro D2 after finishing just above the relegation zone last year. As mentioned above, he brought Leinster from being ranked 35th in Europe to 2nd and had Ulster playing brilliant rugby before he fell out with the board.

He has been more successful as a coach than anyone else in punditry in the UK and Ireland.

You obviously haven't been watching Irish rugby for long if you don't think Williams has been a successful coach, after what he did with Leinster before Scotland nicked him.

Not to mention the fact he actually has experience with professional rugby. Something very few other pundits have. Even Jonathan Davies only has real experience with professional rugby league. Don't know if he even played union professionally.

footie_fanatic

LostPassword wrote: »

I I think they're both basically bull****ters - in fairness to Williams he hides it well

The BBC kicks arses in terms of punditry - Johathon Davies is head and shoulders above anybody else as a pundit in my book - real understanding of rugby, balanced and a smart bloke to boot.

How do you hide being a bull****ter, thats like hiding the fact your a vegetarian by eating meat. Its a contradiction IMO.

the BBC are unbelievably biased, Its actually ridiculous.

LostPassword

footie_fanatic wrote: »

How do you hide being a bull****ter, thats like hiding the fact your a vegetarian by eating meat. Its a contradiction IMO.

A plausible manner, affability and telling people what they want to think is very effective at convincing people that a skillful bull****ter is, in fact, an expert. C.f. Bernie Madoff, Sean Quinn, Seanie Fitz, the Dail, most of the Irish Business class, 99% of journalists and 99.9% of media pundits.

LostPassword

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Hahaha rubbish!

His track record is very good. Even now he's coaching Narbonne and they're joint top of the Pro D2 after finishing just above the relegation zone last year. As mentioned above, he brought Leinster from being ranked 35th in Europe to 2nd and had Ulster playing brilliant rugby before he fell out with the board.

This is total nonsense. He isn't coaching Narbonne - he is a director and he had to buy the freaking club to get the role.

The wikipedia snippet about moving Leinster from 35th to 2nd in Europe must have been written by some bull****ter or other since the ERC rankings weren't established until 2007. What's more, the idea that Leinster were the 2nd best team in Europe during the early 2000s is obvious nonsense (Toulouse, Leicester, Munster, Wasps, Stade Francais were all streets ahead of them).

The most salient point by which to judge his coaching record is the state in which he left the teams once he moved on (which was not quite as voluntary as that wikipedia article would have you believe in all cases). In every case he left the teams in a terrible state that took several years to recover from.

Now, don't get me wrong, I sort of like Matt, I don't mind an affable chancer at all - but that's what he is rather than being an actual expert.

.ak

Ugghhhh... Matt Williams is okay, if a little condescending, but Neil Francis shouldn't be allowed infront of a TV camera, never mind speak infront of one.. I can't hear a word he says, and he's always smirking as if he knows something you don't, but he doesn't, he just likes to think that you think he thinks he does. And the worst part about it is he just points out the obvious!! In Football terms it's like saying 'Oh the midfield just kicked the ball around' OH REALLY?! THANKS I CAN'T USE MY OWN EYES! Let's hear something insightful that I, Joe Public, might not know and something only you, a person that was somewhat involved, might know...

Actually, I wish I didn't write the above paragraph to sumarize my disdain for 'Franno' instead I'll take leaf out of Mr. Ronan Keating's song book...

You say it best, when you say FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU-!!!!!!!!!11

CatFromHue

LostPassword wrote: »

In every case he left the teams in a terrible state that took several years to recover from.

This doesn't apply to Leinster. He left the club in much better position than when he took charge.

While the 35th to 2nd may be an over estimation we did go from not getting out of our pool to quarter and then semi finalists.

In fairness to his time in Scotland he didn't set the world alight but Scotland had and still have an awful lot of problems (I can't remember where I read it but seemingly one of the Scottish directors/heads doesn't believe in "marketing").

irishbucsfan

LostPassword wrote: »

This is total nonsense. He isn't coaching Narbonne - he is a director and he had to buy the freaking club to get the role.

He's not "a director," he's the Director of Rugby. Like Dean Richards, Phillipe Saint-Andre, Ian McGeechan. You can say those guys aren't coaches all you like, but they are still hugely essential to the management oand instruction of the first teams they have been involved with. Also, he didn't buy the club on his own, he was brought into a consortium based off of his experience in rugby. Probably bull****ted his way into that right?

LostPassword wrote: »

The wikipedia snippet about moving Leinster from 35th to 2nd in Europe must have been written by some bull****ter or other since the ERC rankings weren't established until 2007. What's more, the idea that Leinster were the 2nd best team in Europe during the early 2000s is obvious nonsense (Toulouse, Leicester, Munster, Wasps, Stade Francais were all streets ahead of them).

Whether or not the rankings were official, after Williams took charge Leinster won the Celtic league (beating Munster in the final, who you say were better than them) and made the quarters of the heineken cup. The next season the team became the first team to win all their group games and then reached the semis of the Heineken Cup. Williams didn't complete the next season because Scotland appointed him half way through. It's quite clear he was doing an excellent job with Leinster. Very good for such a bull****ter.

LostPassword wrote: »

The most salient point by which to judge his coaching record is the state in which he left the teams once he moved on (which was not quite as voluntary as that wikipedia article would have you believe in all cases). In every case he left the teams in a terrible state that took several years to recover from.

Completely untrue. The only team he was sacked from was Scotland. I know what happened at Ulster, and he certainly was not sacked.

He left Leinster far better than when he joined them and is credited with introducing professionalism to the club properly by plenty who were there. He completely rejuvenated Ulster as well before he left.

LostPassword wrote: »

Now, don't get me wrong, I sort of like Matt, I don't mind an affable chancer at all - but that's what he is rather than being an actual expert.

He's obviously been very lucky to have had the success he has so. :pac:

The point is that he is the most successful coach in punditry on European English-speaking television. Conor O'Shea might well be a better coach than him, but he's stuck beside the two clowns and rarely gets to make decent points any more.

Qwertyup64

Is Michael Lynagh doing analysis for any of the stations? I know he used to be with Sky, but not sure if he is still in action. For my money he was the best analyst I've seen, keeping it fairly impartial (even when it covering tri-nations matches) and level-headed.

ktulu123

He's still with sky!

GerM

LostPassword wrote: »

I absolutely can't stand Williams and Franno. I think they're both basically bull****ters - in fairness to Williams he hides it well but his insights are generally piss-poor and his track record speaks for itself in terms of coaching and his current employability as a coach. Franno doesn't even try to hide it, he's about as insightful as your average pub bore. Not the first clue about modern rugby.

I don't think I've ever disagreed with anything posted on here as much as your opinion on Williams as a pundit. Williams' insights are streets ahead of others in terms of tactical analysis and reading of the game. The vast majority of other pundits are just cliché spouting former players that speak whatever endears them to the public. The comments on the coaching are totally incorrect. He failed in his role at Scotland, nowhere else. Leinster, Waratahs, Ulster, Ireland A and now Narbonne have all been successful stints. Whilst the results achieved at Ulster aren't eye catching, if you look at the dross he got rid of and the reshaping of the team that he was carrying out, he did a fantastic job. The likes of Cave, Whitten, Henry etc. all came through because of him as well as the acquirement of Botha, Diack, Nagusa, Court being made into a loosehead.

irishh_bob

Qwertyup64 wrote: »

Is Michael Lynagh doing analysis for any of the stations? I know he used to be with Sky, but not sure if he is still in action. For my money he was the best analyst I've seen, keeping it fairly impartial (even when it covering tri-nations matches) and level-headed.

loved lynagh as a player but he,s the nearest thing to a posh australian public school boy thier is , far too dull and prim and propper as an anylist

francior pienier is the best , very charismatic guy , inspirational leader of men

chupacabra

Williams sounding very hoarse/hungover on setanta right now :pac:
Must have celebrated/drowned his sorrows hard last night

No, you're a...

yeah, it is very funny to watch!

SCRUB

The lads are class, quit your whinging and go back and watch your crappy soccer with the lovely Giles and Dunphy ..... urgh.