Five arrests in 'slavery' raid at UK [travellers] site

alastair · 13-09-2011 1:43pm

Billy86 wrote: »

Do you mind if I ask where? Just that I have not heard/read it. He is ass't director of Pavee Point, right?

Yep. He was on the radio yesterday. Shouldn'tbe a surprise to anyone. Pavee have been very vocal on slavery/exploitation issues for years.

Billy86 · 13-09-2011 1:47pm

alastair wrote: »

Yep. He was on the radio yesterday. Shouldn'tbe a surprise to anyone. Pavee have been very vocal on slavery/exploitation issues for years.

Well that is interesting. I mean as the ass't director and spokesperson of Pavee Point, if he came out an condemned it, how can it then be said that Pavee Point are being silent on the issue?

Also, and this is a genuine question to Zohan... how do the travelling community come out and denounce it as a group? Would they have to all sign a collective petition, or have a spokesperson for every site/community manage to get on air/in print to do likewise? Or is there some other body apart from Pavee Point that I am ignorant of?

thebigbiffo · 13-09-2011 1:56pm

double post

thebigbiffo · 13-09-2011 1:56pm

I've no great love for the 'travelling community' - too many bad experiences down through the decades - but I'm not buying this whole thing. Something's not right. 'Slavery' should mean being forced to work for nothing - this does not seem to be the case. Exploitation maybe, not slavery. The whole camp wasn't exactly surrounded by barbed wire - those 'slaves' could have fecked off at any time but obviously chose not too.

Morally, it is wrong by the looks of things but calling this slavery reeks of media/pinko opportunism.

tfitzgerald · 13-09-2011 2:01pm

MCMLXXV wrote: »

Don't we have a lengthy thread on this already?

Sarcasm or troll?

mikom wrote: »

King Billy86, right?

Mikom you hit that nail on the head wonder did he know the travellers were from "Norn iron":pac:

TheZohanS · 13-09-2011 2:11pm

alastair wrote: »

Given that Collins is Pavee's spokesperson, and that there's probably no meeting scheduled at Pavee for 'official' statements, it sounds like you're just selectively deaf. Saddo.

If you have to resort to insults such as calling posters "Saddo" then I don't think there's much point in engaging with you because name calling infers that you might not have the intellectual capacity to carry out a reasoned debate. Jog on, you're not worth getting banned over..

Billy86 wrote: »

Also, and this is a genuine question to Zohan... how do the travelling community come out and denounce it as a group? Would they have to all sign a collective petition, or have a spokesperson for every site/community manage to get on air/in print to do likewise? Or is there some other body apart from Pavee Point that I am ignorant of?

That's a fair question. I suppose the local community on the site that the police raided would be best placed to come out and condemn the actions of those that were arrested. They have access to the media and you can be sure that the media would accommodate them. Likewise a soundbite from Pavee Point on a radio station is not enough in this case, they should, at the very least, issue a statement. They're well able to do it when they believe the travelling community have been wronged.

mikom · 13-09-2011 2:17pm

http://paveepoint.ie/
Last update, Sept 7th.
Title: Birth Cohort Follow Up Report to All Ireland Traveller Health Study released

Well done.

alastair · 13-09-2011 2:20pm

TheZohan wrote: »

If you have to resort to insults such as calling posters "Saddo" then I don't think there's much point in engaging with you because name calling infers that you might not have the intellectual capacity to carry out a reasoned debate. Jog on, you're not worth getting banned over..

I think we all have the measure of you. How's that 'deafening silence' working out for you in the face of cold facts to the contrary?

Dublindude69 · 13-09-2011 2:50pm

Maybe now we can get something done about Travellers. Maybe we can ship them all to Lambay Island and they can live together there is they don't want to live by the laws.

suicide_circus · 13-09-2011 2:55pm

Someone called Connors involved in criminality?

K-9 · 13-09-2011 3:18pm

TheZohan wrote: »

Pavee Point and the entire travelling community have been very silent over all of this. I've yet to hear anyone from either group condemn what happened.

As has been pointed out their spokesman was on the radio condemning it. I'm not sure what you mean by the entire travelling community?

Kasabian · 13-09-2011 4:07pm

Shocking stuff

Dublindude69 · 13-09-2011 4:36pm

A report just came out stating that there where more arrests made earlier this year over this. How come we're only hearing about it now?
The report also said it seems to be only travellers with the surname Connors that are involved.

ebixa82 · 13-09-2011 5:20pm

Dublindude69 wrote: »

A report just came out stating that there where more arrests made earlier this year over this. How come we're only hearing about it now?
The report also said it seems to be only travellers with the surname Connors that are involved.

Blacky from Glenroe was one of the ringleaders according to sky news..

wild_cat · 13-09-2011 5:24pm

Connors is a very wexford Traveller name. Is there any pictures of the lads that have been charged?

Amber Lamps · 13-09-2011 5:27pm

wild_cat wrote: »

Is there any pictures of the lads that have been charged?

Yeah here. Super charged

wild_cat · 13-09-2011 5:37pm

Amber Lamps wrote: »

Yeah here. Super charged

:rolleyes::rolleyes:

TheZohanS · 13-09-2011 5:37pm

K-9 wrote: »

As has been pointed out their spokesman was on the radio condemning it. I'm not sure what you mean by the entire travelling community?

Few posts up, their local community, where the arrests were made.

A report just came out stating that there where more arrests made earlier this year over this. How come we're only hearing about it now?

Racist.

Billy86 · 13-09-2011 5:45pm

That's a fair question. I suppose the local community on the site that the police raided would be best placed to come out and condemn the actions of those that were arrested. They have access to the media and you can be sure that the media would accommodate them. Likewise a soundbite from Pavee Point on a radio station is not enough in this case, they should, at the very least, issue a statement. They're well able to do it when they believe the travelling community have been wronged.

True enough on PP, though the soundbite may be a sign of something on the way, as they are obviously in a very delicate situation themselves on this. However I could not agree more about the local site, and I think their silence (coupled with the boobatic on Sky News yesterday) comes over as very, very damning indeed. It's one of those situations where (in my opinion) 'the better you know them, the quicker you have to act' which buys PP a bit of time to themselves try to get to the bottom of it somewhat before making a full statement, but where the people living in the same houses as those arrested need to make their point very, very soon. It's only been a day and a half, but that window is almost closed already, with regards to them (the neighbours).

lynski · 13-09-2011 6:06pm

Billy86 wrote: »

True enough on PP, though the soundbite may be a sign of something on the way, as they are obviously in a very delicate situation themselves on this. However I could not agree more about the local site, and I think their silence (coupled with the boobatic on Sky News yesterday) comes over as very, very damning indeed. It's one of those situations where (in my opinion) 'the better you know them, the quicker you have to act' which buys PP a bit of time to themselves try to get to the bottom of it somewhat before making a full statement, but where the people living in the same houses as those arrested need to make their point very, very soon. It's only been a day and a half, but that window is almost closed already, with regards to them (the neighbours).

You can't think of a traveller site like a street. the people living in the house next door are brothers/sisters/aunts/uncles/cousins/or a combination. They live together and work together. They not only knew about these guys, they were part of the reason those guys were there. Even if they did not use them themselves they knew about them. this is not a fritzel or jacee case, they were not hidden. the cleaned the site when not out working.
This is a widespread practice of travellers, in my experience, and is happening everywhere there are travellers who travel.

Andy-Pandy · 13-09-2011 6:17pm

lynski wrote: »

You can't think of a traveller site like a street. the people living in the house next door are brothers/sisters/aunts/uncles/cousins/or a combination. They live together and rob together. They not only knew about these guys, they were part of the reason those guys were there. Even if they did not use them themselves they knew about them. this is not a fritzel or jacee case, they were not hidden. the cleaned the site when not out working.
This is a widespread practice of travellers, in my experience, and is happening everywhere there are travellers who travel.

FYP

Billy86 · 13-09-2011 6:21pm

Lynski... did you read my post you just responded to?

And all travellers who travel? I thought others on here were saying it was all travellers who don't travel? Or all travellers full stop? I'm not even responding to that stuff after this point, because I have known a few different groups of travellers and can tell you that last sentence of your post is simply untrue. It's a poor and untrue generalisation that does nothing but further the divide between both communities, which in no way helps anything.

AudreyHepburn · 13-09-2011 6:34pm

This is an unbelievable story. It's hard to believe there's still slavery in this day and age.

But would it be asking too much to leave the all-out traveller bashing out of it? There are decent honest people among them who are persistantly blackened by criminals like these and by a lot of the settled community who seemed to feel we are are some-how above them.

Lets leave it out for once.

Dudess · 13-09-2011 6:36pm

Some people can't tell the difference between defending travellers who are good people, and defending this kind of exploitative operation.

AudreyHepburn · 13-09-2011 6:38pm

Dudess wrote: »

Some people can't tell the difference between defending travellers who are good people, and defending this kind of exploitative operation.

Who here is defending anything?

Dudess · 13-09-2011 6:40pm

Sigh... I'm agreeing with you.

AudreyHepburn · 13-09-2011 6:41pm

Dudess wrote: »

Sigh...

Elaborate please?

I wasn't getting at you....just wondering if I'd missed something?

Just saw your edit....to be fair it's hard to know on AH sometimes!

Logical Fallacy · 13-09-2011 6:42pm

Dublindude69 wrote: »

A report just came out stating that there where more arrests made earlier this year over this. How come we're only hearing about it now?

Because sometimes indignation is a slow burning thing.

Alternatively, some arrests were made and the cops got some names and some co-operation...rather than instantly put it out there they protected the investigation and increased it's scale and scope.

lynski · 13-09-2011 6:49pm

Billy86 wrote: »

Lynski... did you read my post you just responded to?

And all travellers who travel? I thought others on here were saying it was all travellers who don't travel? Or all travellers full stop? I'm not even responding to that stuff after this point, because I have known a few different groups of travellers and can tell you that last sentence of your post is simply untrue. It's a poor and untrue generalisation that does nothing but further the divide between both communities, which in no way helps anything.

i read your post i was saying that you cant expect a response or excuses from the others because they were involved.
Did you read my post? i did not say all I said where there are travellers who travel. there is a difference between those who travel and those who don't and In My Experience those who travel engage in these practices.

tayto lover · 13-09-2011 7:02pm

A petition signed by the travellers in the Greenacre site has been released

"We the travellers at the Greenacres Camp totally abhor slavery"

Signed -

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
x

Billy86 · 13-09-2011 7:05pm

lynski wrote: »

i read your post i was saying that you cant expect a response or excuses from the others because they were involved.
Did you read my post? i did not say all I said where there are travellers who travel. there is a difference between those who travel and those who don't and In My Experience those who travel engage in these practices.

I did read your post; I was pointing out that others have been having a go at settled travellers in this thread, as well as travellers in general. Interestingly, the ones in this instance appear to be living in houses, suggesting they do not travel.

Billy86 · 13-09-2011 7:12pm

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

Because sometimes indignation is a slow burning thing.

Alternatively, some arrests were made and the cops got some names and some co-operation...rather than instantly put it out there they protected the investigation and increased it's scale and scope.

Which is perhaps the right way to go about it. It's a tricky one since you need to make those potentially at risk aware of the dangers (especially foreign nationals who may not be as aware of who-or-what to be cautious of here & in the UK), but at the same time it is potentially dangerous to make something like this so public. Somebody made a post yesterday that there could be a lot of 'slaves' getting buried in the next few days, the possible truth of which is quite chilling, to be honest.

end a eknny · 13-09-2011 9:05pm

tayto lover wrote: »

A petition signed by the travellers in the Greenacre site has been released

"We the travellers at the Greenacres Camp totally abhor slavery"

Signed -

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
x

and yet more comic genius from you. how do you think this stuff up

SEPT 23 1989 · 13-09-2011 9:06pm

Have the breasts made a statement yet?

westendgirlie · 13-09-2011 9:08pm

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

Have the breasts made a statement yet?

I think they're milking this story for all its worth

gozunda · 13-09-2011 9:11pm

mikemac wrote: »

Any sign of Vanessa Redgrave?

I hear she feels strongly about issues and is willing to jump in if she feels human rights are breached

She is mentioned here LINK

gozunda · 13-09-2011 9:20pm

Dublindude69 wrote: »

I find it odd how the oldest person arrested is only 34, these people have been slaves for about 20 years so that means the oldest person started doing it at the age of 14?

Surely you not know that slaves can be left to your nearest and dearest in your will?

Fcs travellers work on a clan basis with families claiming rights on even large council provided halting site and refusing to share with other "traveller" families...dicrimination how are ya...

You honestly think that if grandaddy or the local king of that traveller family was involved in the abduction and threatening of slaves that the son / grandson is going to say " ah yer grand lads - twas all just a misunderstanding"!

We are not dealing with a noramlised society here. Travellers chose to live by their own laws and more often than not ignore the laws of whatever country they happen to live in - eg taxes, driving licences, planning permission, using other peoples land for the ponies, "borrowing" metal or the basis that this is their "culture" and to say otherwise is discriminastion .....yada yada yada

end a eknny · 13-09-2011 9:25pm

anybody ask paddy doherty what he thought

holyfish · 14-09-2011 12:50am

westendgirlie wrote: »

Latchy wrote: »

And in the back garden of merry ol England to ... I wonder what other horror mysterious are out there waiting to be liberated .

The Garden of England is Kent not Hertfordshire. But that doesn't take away from this awful story.

Leighton buzzard is in Bedfordshire not Hertfordshire , I lived there for a few years

bernardo mac · 14-09-2011 5:06am

Used to visit Rathkeale area ,"Ancestral" home of the Travellers decades ago.Not any more;major deterioration,now quite unattractive and not an area where I'd park and go fishing.There also has been a marked increase in the numbers of settled and unsettled members of that community.Of course anti-social behaviour is not necessarily connected to that change in numbers as many small towns and once quiet areas near Limerick City have contracted the contagion of criminal activity, due mainly ,I believe, to the relocation policies of Local Authorities and the HSE

MagicSean · 14-09-2011 7:11am

What really annoyed me was the police apologising for disturbing the other residents and thanking them for their understanding. Like we're supposed to believe they didn't notice 28 strangers being enslaved. In such a closed community they had to have noticed. Everyone in that site should have been arrested.

chris2008x · 14-09-2011 7:56am

1. It was 5 Travellers not the whole community.

2. They have being charged and not found GUILTY, This forum is sounding like a kangaroo court who knows maybe they could be found not guilty so you cant assume they are just in prison serving a sentence.

3. If the other residents of this camp were not arrested then don't make them out to be involved in it, who knows who knew what until the courts sort it out.

4. Alot of Irish people have done much worst crimes. Does that paint yourself with the same brush as them? No and all travellers shouldn't be painted this way either. I hope these people get what they deserve for what they did if they are FOUND GUILTY but as above it wasn't every traveller and best to wait until after the trial then express your opinion.

tfitzgerald · 14-09-2011 8:45am

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

Have the breasts made a statement yet?

How long before we see her on her own reality show "how to treat your slaves"

Dublindude69 · 14-09-2011 12:12pm

Now other travellers are intimadating the witnesses and they are becoming to scared to testify.

JP Liz V1 · 14-09-2011 12:33pm

end a eknny wrote: »

anybody ask paddy doherty what he thought

Sausages

bernardo mac · 14-09-2011 12:39pm

Dublindude69 wrote: »

Now other travellers are intimadating the witnesses and they are becoming to scared to testify.

I've a fair idea about what I'll say to travellers when they call around on their almost aggressive sales/business pitch visit:mad:

thegreengoblin · 14-09-2011 4:15pm

Still waiting to hear Pavee Point's reaction to this story. They're usually quick off the mark when it comes to travellers being 'victimised' yet not a peep out of them when it comes to a horrific story like this. Strange eh?

goat2 · 14-09-2011 7:44pm

i have been looking at the pictures of said campsite, it seems to beautifully kept. i cannot see how people could have been held against their will in that place.

Dublindude69 · 14-09-2011 7:47pm

goat2 wrote: »

i have been looking at the pictures of said campsite, it seems to beautifully kept. i cannot see how people could have been held against their will in that place.

Have you looked at the pictures of their living conditions? Four people living in one tiny caravan.

goat2 · 14-09-2011 7:49pm

Dublindude69 wrote: »

Have you looked at the pictures of their living conditions? Four people living in one tiny caravan.

i did not see those, i wonder how they survived the freezing cold winters we had in the past two years.

Five arrests in 'slavery' raid at UK [travellers] site

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