Your irish 22 for the 2015 rugby world cup

SD Sportsman

1. Healy
2. Best
3. Moore
4. Henderson
5. O Connell
6. Ferris
7. O Brien
8. Heaslip
9. Murray
10. Sexton
11. Fitzgerald
12. Marshall
13. Payne
14. Bowe
15. Kearney

16. Strauss/Cronin
17. McGrath
18. Ross
19. Ryan
20. O Mahony
21. Marmion
22. Jackson
23. Olding

Glass Prison 1214

What I would go for:

15. Payne
14. Bowe
13. Fitzgerald
12. Marshall
11. Zebo
10. Sexton
9. Murray
8. Heaslip
7. SOB
6. Ferris
5. Henderson
4. POC
3. Moore
2. Best
1. Healy

16. Strauss, 17. J Cronin, 18. Fitzpatrick, 19. Toner, 20. POM, 21. Marmion, 22. Hanrahan, 23. Gilroy

Ulster 8
Leinster 7
Munster 6
Connacht 1
Racing Metro 1

I'm surprised that my selection is so balanced between the Ulster Leinster Munster. To me that looks like a seriously talented and balanced 23, no chance they will all be fit(especially Ferris) but on paper it looks like a brilliant squad.

case885

Looking at the players available to ireland we have a serious bunch of talent, i dont think theres ever been an irish squad of 30 or so players good enough to play the top teams in international rugby.

Harry FM

Surprised to see so many people selecting Luke Fitzgerald, yes he's an outstanding player and is in form at the moment but if you look at guys such as Zebo, Gilroy and D.Kearney, they will surely be better in 2 years time.

SD Sportsman

Harry FM wrote: »

Surprised to see so many people selecting Luke Fitzgerald, yes he's an outstanding player and is in form at the moment but if you look at guys such as Zebo, Gilroy and D.Kearney, they will surely be better in 2 years time.

Whys that? Fitzgerald will only be 28 at the World Cup.
What have the others shown that he hasn't?

Harry FM

SD Sportsman wrote: »

Whys that? Fitzgerald will only be 28 at the World Cup.
What have the others shown that he hasn't?

He looked like he would be a brilliant player when he was younger but I don't think he quite reached the level we all expected him to. Zebo, Gilroy and D.Kearney all have very good try scoring records at international level. I just think that they will be better in 2 years.

SD Sportsman

He looked like he would be a brilliant player when he was younger but I don't think he quite reached the level we all expected him to. Zebo, Gilroy and D.Kearney all have very good try scoring records at international level. I just think that they will be better in 2 years.[/QUOTE]

That's because Fitzgerald has been injured for two or more years. He was a lions test player at 24 and has been excellent in between injuries.
The others only have 13 caps between (Zebo 6, Gilroy 5, Kearney 2) and scored two tries each both of kearneys against an awful, depleted, tired Samoa and Gilroy and Zebo both scored one against an equally awful Argentina last autumn. These are hardly very good try scoring records as they've barely played so I don't know what you're basing that on.
There's also a lot more than just tries required and Fitzgerald is easily the best defender.
In a Leinster sense I don't think even when returning from injuries, Kearney was ever rated ahead of him.

Grimebox

A fit Fitzgerald is easily ahead of those 3 imo

jamiedav2011

Grimebox wrote: »

A fit Fitzgerald is easily ahead of those 3 imo

Ah he's not 'easily' ahead of an in form Zebo.

Chabals Beard

jamiedav2011 wrote: »

Ah he's not 'easily' ahead of an in form Zebo.

The thing is we haven't seen the best of Zebo, on top form, he will be special.

hype101

1. Healy
2. Best
3. Moore
4. Henderson
5. POC
6. Ferris
7. SOB
8. Heaslip
9. Murray
10. Sexton
11. Gilroy
12. Marshall
13. Fitzgerald
14. Bowe
15. Zebo

16. J. McGrath, 17. S. Cronin, 18. Ross, 19. Toner, 20, O'Mahoney, 21. L. McGrath, 22. Hanrahan, 23. Henshaw/Olding

former legend

Sure I'll give it a lash so.

Healy, Strauss, Moore
Henderson, Toner
POM, SOB, Heaslip
Murray, Sexton
Fitzgerald, Marshall, Payne, Gilroy
R Kearney

Best, McGrath, Fitzpatrick, Ryan, Marmion, Madigan, Earls

If POC and Ferris are fit, they'll slot in and Henderson may not even up in the second row.

phog

Grimebox wrote: »

A fit Fitzgerald is easily ahead of those 3 imo

Fitz easily ahead of Zebo, not a chance of it.

Buer

phog wrote: »

Fitz easily ahead of Zebo, not a chance of it.

Both of them playing to the best of their ability as to what we have seen thus far in their careers? Fitzgerald would be ahead of Zebo for many.

People have very short memories in relation to Fitzgerald as to how good he has shown himself to be capable of.

Grimebox

Perhaps using the word "easily" overstepped the mark. How about: A fit Fitzgerald is ahead of those 3 imo.

Given how Schmidt puts a huge emphasis on squad building, hopefully all of them will heavily feature especially Zebo

former legend

PERSONALLY speaking, I don't think Zebo will be in the shake up. He's the second best winger in Munster IMO. That's just based on what we've seen in the last couple of years of course, maybe he'll kick on massively.

phog

former legend wrote: »

PERSONALLY speaking, I don't think Zebo will be in the shake up. He's the second best winger in Munster IMO. That's just based on what we've seen in the last couple of years of course, maybe he'll kick on massively.

Isn't everyone's selection based on what we've seen.

halpin17

1. Healy
2. Best
3. Moore
4. Ryan
5. POC
6. Ferris/POM
7. SOB
8. Heaslip
9. Murray
10. Sexton
11. Zebo
12. Marshall
13. Payne
14. Bowe
15. R.Kearney

16.Strauss
17.Mcgrath
18.Fitspatrick
19.POM/Ferris
20.McCarthy
21.P.Marshall
22.Jackson
23.Fitzgerald

Rest of squad
Cronin
Kilcoyne/J.Cronin
Henderson
Toss up between
T. O'Donnell/R.Ruddock/C.Henry
Gilroy
Madigan
Toss up between
Cave/D.Kearney/McFadden

Close
JJ. Hanrahan
Archer
Marmion
Earls
Trimble
Toner

phog

Buer wrote: »

Both of them playing to the best of their ability as to what we have seen thus far in their careers? Fitzgerald would be ahead of Zebo for many.

People have very short memories in relation to Fitzgerald as to how good he has shown himself to be capable of.

I'm not dissing Fitz and at this moment in time Fitz certainly offers more if either were to be a bench option. My point as a winger both would be closer than suggested.

former legend

phog wrote: »

Isn't everyone's selection based on what we've seen.

Not really.

jm08

Buer wrote: »

Both of them playing to the best of their ability as to what we have seen thus far in their careers? Fitzgerald would be ahead of Zebo for many.

People have very short memories in relation to Fitzgerald as to how good he has shown himself to be capable of.

It would all depend on the make-up of the team - defensively Fitz would be ahead but for strike power, getting over the line, it would be (an inform) Zebo.

Zebo's left boot is very handy as well.

Anyone else think that Tommy Bowe's form hasn't been great/a bit inconsistent over the last year or so. Injuries maybe catching up with him now. Maybe all that game time with the Ospreys is beginning to tell.

Hype710

Assuming an extra place for am additional prop, my 31 man squad:

Healy, McGrath, Cronin
Best, Strauss, Cronin
Moore, White, Ross
Henderson, POC, Ryan, Toner
POM, Ruddock, SOB, TOD, Heaslip
Murray, Marmion, McGrath
Sexton, Jackson
Marshall, Olding, Payne, Fitzgerald
Bowe, Zebo, Gilroy, Kearney

Huge amount of exciting permutations in the back line. I've left out the likes of Madigan, Hanrahan, McFadden, Dave Kearney, Cave, Griffin, Henshaw and Earls.

One thing is pretty clear: a need to blood Marmion. I included McGrath but not sure he'll be ready. Hart could be an interesting option due to his goal kicking and versatility.

Fireball07

Barring injury...

I would be shocked if Healy, POC, SOB, Heaslip, Murray, Sexton, Bowe aren't starting in 2 years time. You would think Kearney will be aswell.

If Ferris is fit, he'll start, but there has to be major doubts over that atm considering how long ago it is since he played. POM is likely to start in his absence, I can't see anything but him growing in stature until then.

2 years is plenty time for the likes of Marshall, Henderson, Marmion, etc. to get in around the squad, maybe nail down a place. Hanrahan could have a season as first-choice to challenge Madigan and Jackson for the sub out-half spot. The battle for hooker, the battle at 13 and the wing spot are likely to be huge.


I'll go for:

1. Healy
2. Best
3. Moore
4. Henderson
5. POC
6. POM
7. SOB
8. Heaslip
9. Murray
10. Sexton
11. Zebo
12. Marshall
13. Payne
14. Bowe
15. Fitzgerald

16. Cronin
17. Cronin
18. White
19. Ryan
20. TOD
21. Marmion
22. Jackson
23. Earls

bilston

SD Sportsman wrote: »

He looked like he would be a brilliant player when he was younger but I don't think he quite reached the level we all expected him to. Zebo, Gilroy and D.Kearney all have very good try scoring records at international level. I just think that they will be better in 2 years.

That's because Fitzgerald has been injured for two or more years. He was a lions test player at 24 and has been excellent in between injuries.
The others only have 13 caps between (Zebo 6, Gilroy 5, Kearney 2) and scored two tries each both of kearneys against an awful, depleted, tired Samoa and Gilroy and Zebo both scored one against an equally awful Argentina last autumn. These are hardly very good try scoring records as they've barely played so I don't know what you're basing that on.[/QUOTE]

There are a lot of reasons why Fitzgerald may be ahead of Gilroy or Zebo (both excellent wingers and I'm not certain he is or isn't) however one thing is for sure, try scoring record for Ireland is definitely NOT one of them!

Tox56

bilston wrote: »

There are a lot of reasons why Fitzgerald may be ahead of Gilroy or Zebo (both excellent wingers and I'm not certain he is or isn't) however one thing is for sure, try scoring record for Ireland is definitely NOT one of them!

I've no idea if this is what the poster meant but if Gilroy/Zebo have poor try scoring records it takes away one of the biggest (if not the biggest) reasons for not picking Fitzgerald. Then again Gilroy/Zebo don't exactly have the worst conversion rate so far, so I don't really know what he was trying to say.

SD Sportsman

Sorry I should have clarified. I never said Fitzgerald had a great try record but my point was it's not like the others do, yet anyway. As Fitzgerald is a better player in most other areas that's why I would have him ahead if them.

Superbus

SD Sportsman wrote: »

Sorry I should have clarified. I never said Fitzgerald had a great try record but my point was it's not like the others do, yet anyway. As Fitzgerald is a better player in most other areas that's why I would have him ahead if them.

Well after the Wallabies match Dave Kearney had as many tries in one cap as Fitzgerald does in 27.

gaius c

chupacabra wrote: »

I know threads like this are utterly pointless but its fun to put our opinions up based on what we THINK we know now and then look back in years to come and see how right or how terribly wrong we were.

Here's mine assuming that by 2015 we have 23 man squads:

15. Felix Jones
14. Andrew Conway
13. Nevin Spence
12. Fergus McFadden
11. Keith Earls
10. Jonathan Sexton
9. Luke McGrath
8. Jamie Heaslip (c)
7. Dominic Ryan
6. Sean O'Brien
5. Dan Tuohy
4. Ian Nagle
3. Jamie Hagan
2. Richard Strauss
1. Cian Healy

16. Sean Cronin
17. Jack O'Connell
18. Stewart Maguire
19. Dave O'Callaghan
20. Rhys Ruddock
21. Conor Murray
22. JJ Hanrahan
23. Eoin Griffin

Honorable mentions or shouts for squad players: Tiernan O'Halloran, Paddy Butler, Peter O'Mahony, Paddy McAllister, Brendan Macken, Mike Sherry and too many more to name

Brave attempt but only two members of that backline are likely to feature as first teamers. Three of the pack as well.

SD Sportsman

Superbus wrote: »

Well after the Wallabies match Dave Kearney had as many tries in one cap as Fitzgerald does in 27.

As I said earlier I never said Fitzgerald had a great try record.
There is more to wing play than tries.
Fitzgerald is better in every single facet of the game to Dave Kearney who I'm not saying is a bad player but is comfortably behind the other three in the debate.
My point on the try records was not trying to use it to enhance the argument for Fitzgerald, it was in retaliation to the point made by somebody else that the other three somehow had very good try records at international level which is impossible with 13 combined caps. I don't believe therefore if can be part of the discussion as to who should be included.
They may go on to have very good records but for now no so based on what we know of the players at international level it is Fitzgerald I feel should be included AS OF NOW. That can change over 20 months.

And before you reply Dave Kearney does have a very good try record for Ireland see how many he has after 20 caps if he gets that many, not after two against the worst team to play international rugby in the Aviva with huge injury problems.

Harry FM

CJ Stander will be eligible...

PlayerTrader13

Harry FM wrote: »

CJ Stander will be eligible...

and not playing for ireland

gaius c

PlayerTrader13 wrote: »

and not playing for ireland

Aye. Would like to see him in the Munster team first.

former legend

PlayerTrader13 wrote: »

and not playing for in ireland

FYP, just based on how things are looking at the moment.

jacothelad

Superbus wrote: »

Well after the Wallabies match Dave Kearney had as many tries in one cap as Fitzgerald does in 27.

SD Sportsman wrote: »

As I said earlier I never said Fitzgerald had a great try record.
There is more to wing play than tries.
Fitzgerald is better in every single facet of the game to Dave Kearney who I'm not saying is a bad player but is comfortably behind the other three in the debate.
My point on the try records was not trying to use it to enhance the argument for Fitzgerald, it was in retaliation to the point made by somebody else that the other three somehow had very good try records at international level which is impossible with 13 combined caps. I don't believe therefore if can be part of the discussion as to who should be included.
They may go on to have very good records but for now no so based on what we know of the players at international level it is Fitzgerald I feel should be included AS OF NOW. That can change over 20 months.

And before you reply Dave Kearney does have a very good try record for Ireland see how many he has after 20 caps if he gets that many, not after two against the worst team to play international rugby in the Aviva with huge injury problems.

So Fitz's two tries against an absolutely awful Italian side should be discounted then. So in effect he has scored no worthwhile tries for Ireland in that thesis. A winger with then, 26 meaningful caps has scored no tries is actually better than those who have? What about the awful international teams he has played against. If he's a s good as you think why hasn't he scored hatfuls of tries against them?

Hagz

jacothelad wrote: »

So Fitz's two tries against an absolutely awful Italian side should be discounted then. So in effect he has scored no worthwhile tries for Ireland in that thesis. A winger with then, 26 meaningful caps has scored no tries is actually better than those who have? What about the awful international teams he has played against. If he's a s good as you think why hasn't he scored hatfuls of tries against them?

Strike rate is a pretty useless source of information Jaco. The simple number of caps and tries doesn't provide any context. For instance, the cap doesn't say how many minutes the players played (with many of Fitzgerald and others being under 10 minutes). The cap doesn't say how much possession Ireland had, thus how many opportunities said player had to score. The cap doesn't say what position the player was in. It doesn't describe the quality of opposition.

For example, Fitzgerald has 27 caps. About 14 of them have come with him on the wing (I can't say for certain as there is no feasible way to guarantee). 22 of them have come against 6nations sides and SANZAR teams. The remaining 5 coming against a combination of lower tiered teams and Argentina. Again, those 27 caps don't detail the minutes he was on the field etc. He has 2 tries, and as has been pointed out those two tries came against a weak team in Italy.

Now lets look at some other players.

Simon Zebo has 6 caps with 2 tries. two of those caps he was at full-back, where he scored 1 of his tries. So he has scored 1 try whilst playing on the wing in his 4 caps on the wing. But again, those caps don't detail that he played against New Zealand in his first cap, or that he went down injured early against England. One of his tries came against a truly woeful Argentina team, so do we discount it?

Andrew Trimble has 50 caps with 12 tries. But again those caps don't show that for a few of the games he was in the centre. And 7 of his 12 tries came against Canada, Russia, Namibia, Romania and Italy. Do we discount them?

Dave Kearney has only played 2 games, with two tries, so its impossible to give his strike-rate any credence. And those two tries came against an awful Samoan team, so do we discount those?

Keith Earls has 39 caps with 12 tries. But 4 of those 12 tries came when he was in the centre/full-back, do we discount those? 8 of them came against Canada, Fiji, Russia, and Italy. Do we discount those?

See what I mean?

Grimebox

Statistics have always been misleading in Rugby. Trying to refer to number of tackles / missed tackles as a way to compare players has proved fruitless in the past too.

jacothelad

Hagz wrote: »

Strike rate is a pretty useless source of information Jaco. The simple number of caps and tries doesn't provide any context. For instance, the cap doesn't say how many minutes the players played (with many of Fitzgerald and others being under 10 minutes). The cap doesn't say how much possession Ireland had, thus how many opportunities said player had to score. The cap doesn't say what position the player was in. It doesn't describe the quality of opposition.

For example, Fitzgerald has 27 caps. About 14 of them have come with him on the wing (I can't say for certain as there is no feasible way to guarantee). 22 of them have come against 6nations sides and SANZAR teams. The remaining 5 coming against a combination of lower tiered teams and Argentina. Again, those 27 caps don't detail the minutes he was on the field etc. He has 2 tries, and as has been pointed out those two tries came against a weak team in Italy.

Now lets look at some other players.

Simon Zebo has 6 caps with 2 tries. two of those caps he was at full-back, where he scored 1 of his tries. So he has scored 1 try whilst playing on the wing in his 4 caps on the wing. But again, those caps don't detail that he played against New Zealand in his first cap, or that he went down injured early against England. One of his tries came against a truly woeful Argentina team, so do we discount it?

Andrew Trimble has 50 caps with 12 tries. But again those caps don't show that for a few of the games he was in the centre. And 7 of his 12 tries came against Canada, Russia, Namibia, Romania and Italy. Do we discount them?

Dave Kearney has only played 2 games, with two tries, so its impossible to give his strike-rate any credence. And those two tries came against an awful Samoan team, so do we discount those?

Keith Earls has 39 caps with 12 tries. But 4 of those 12 tries came when he was in the centre/full-back, do we discount those? 8 of them came against Canada, Fiji, Russia, and Italy. Do we discount those?

See what I mean?

I know. I was being a bit naughty.....ironic. If someone dismisses a player's tries against weak opposition in order to bum up a player who has only scored tries against weak opposition it's a bit...I don't know....childlike perhaps.

SD Sportsman

jacothelad wrote: »

I know. I was being a bit naughty.....ironic. If someone dismisses a player's tries against weak opposition in order to bum up a player who has only scored tries against weak opposition it's a bit...I don't know....childlike perhaps.

Yet again... I never said Fitzgerald had a good try record. Can you read?
My point is that the other threes try scoring for Ireland cannot be considered when picking your Ireland team as they don't have record, they've played 13 games combined.
I'm saying the try records for all of them are irrelevant and you're picking based on what else they can do. This is where in my opinion Fitzgerald is superior to the other 3.
Until the others play tonight games and keep scoring the try stats are pointless.
You can absoloutley discount Fitzgerald tries against Italy but it really doesn't change anything.

DeDoc

I don't think that you can discount try scoring record. However as with all statistics - beware using them as a drunk uses a lamp-post - for support rather than illumination.

Good wingers generally score more tries than bad ones. Also those who score more tries are more likely to be good wingers than those who don't.

I could however, give you plenty of examples of wingers who had good strike rates based on a few early games but weren't really up to much.

Luke Fitz' try scoring record is pretty poor for an international wing - there is no disguising that. But that doesn't make him a bad player. He has 29 tries in 118 (100 starts) appearances for Leinster. By comparison, DK has 13 in 62 (50+12). KE has 25 tries in 88 (81+7). Doug Howlett has 35 in 114(111+3). Denis Hickie had 55 in 125 (117+8). Andrew Trimble has 30 tries in 103 and Tommy Bowe has 40 in 104. Last two are from wiki, as the Ulster site is down right now.

Strictly on try scoring rate, Fitz and DK would be down near the bottom of the list, and in fact I'd say that is probably fair enough in terms of their fundamental nose for the line. Earls is a little ahead of them (and Trimble), but behind the others. Again a fair reflection - if all I wanted from my winger was to touch the ball down, then I'd take Earls in a heartbeat over any of those three.

If you want a really good example of massive try scoring rate then look at Alex Cuthbert - 26 tries in 37 games for Cardiff and 9 tries in 17 games for Wales. There is no doubt he knows his way to the line, probably as well as anyone in world rugby. Total donkey in every other respect though.

SD Sportsman

DeDoc wrote: »

I don't think that you can discount try scoring record. However as with all statistics - beware using them as a drunk uses a lamp-post - for support rather than illumination.

Good wingers generally score more tries than bad ones. Also those who score more tries are more likely to be good wingers than those who don't.

I could however, give you plenty of examples of wingers who had good strike rates based on a few early games but weren't really up to much.

Luke Fitz' try scoring record is pretty poor for an international wing - there is no disguising that. But that doesn't make him a bad player. He has 29 tries in 118 (100 starts) appearances for Leinster. By comparison, DK has 13 in 62 (50+12). KE has 25 tries in 88 (81+7). Doug Howlett has 35 in 114(111+3). Denis Hickie had 55 in 125 (117+8). Andrew Trimble has 30 tries in 103 and Tommy Bowe has 40 in 104. Last two are from wiki, as the Ulster site is down right now.

Strictly on try scoring rate, Fitz and DK would be down near the bottom of the list, and in fact I'd say that is probably fair enough in terms of their fundamental nose for the line. Earls is a little ahead of them (and Trimble), but behind the others. Again a fair reflection - if all I wanted from my winger was to touch the ball down, then I'd take Earls in a heartbeat over any of those three.

If you want a really good example of massive try scoring rate then look at Alex Cuthbert - 26 tries in 37 games for Cardiff and 9 tries in 17 games for Wales. There is no doubt he knows his way to the line, probably as well as anyone in world rugby. Total donkey in every other respect though.

Yeah these are all over 37-118 games when you can properly assess their records. You can't do this over 2,5 or 6 games.

Mahatma Geansai

DeDoc wrote: »

I don't think that you can discount try scoring record. However as with all statistics - beware using them as a drunk uses a lamp-post - for support rather than illumination.

Good wingers generally score more tries than bad ones. Also those who score more tries are more likely to be good wingers than those who don't.

I could however, give you plenty of examples of wingers who had good strike rates based on a few early games but weren't really up to much.

Luke Fitz' try scoring record is pretty poor for an international wing - there is no disguising that. But that doesn't make him a bad player. He has 29 tries in 118 (100 starts) appearances for Leinster. By comparison, DK has 13 in 62 (50+12). KE has 25 tries in 88 (81+7). Doug Howlett has 35 in 114(111+3). Denis Hickie had 55 in 125 (117+8). Andrew Trimble has 30 tries in 103 and Tommy Bowe has 40 in 104. Last two are from wiki, as the Ulster site is down right now.

Strictly on try scoring rate, Fitz and DK would be down near the bottom of the list, and in fact I'd say that is probably fair enough in terms of their fundamental nose for the line. Earls is a little ahead of them (and Trimble), but behind the others. Again a fair reflection - if all I wanted from my winger was to touch the ball down, then I'd take Earls in a heartbeat over any of those three.

If you want a really good example of massive try scoring rate then look at Alex Cuthbert - 26 tries in 37 games for Cardiff and 9 tries in 17 games for Wales. There is no doubt he knows his way to the line, probably as well as anyone in world rugby. Total donkey in every other respect though.

Most of Earls' club rugby has been in the centre. Fitz has an awful try scoring record at international level. That doesn't make him a poor player, but I'd imagine that it may be one of the reasons why he is being looked at as a centre.

tolosenc

I'm posting this here mostly as a means for me to look back on it in 18 months...

15. Kearney
14. Bowe
13. Fitzgerald
12. D'arcy
11. Gilroy
10. Sexton
9. Murray

1. Healy
2. Strauss
3. Moore
4. O'Connell
5. Ryan
6. O'Mahony
7. O'Brien
8. Heaslip

16. Best
17. McGrath
18. Ross
19. Toner
20. Ruddock
21. Marmion
22. Madigan
23. Zebo

Rounding out the rest of the 30 man squad: Cronin, Hagan, McCarthy, McLoughlin, McGrath, Jackson, Marshall.

shaka

Harry FM wrote: »

CJ Stander will be eligible...

And? Has generally been v poor for munster playing 6 or 7 and only looks ok at 8 . He came with a big rep but unless he gets the finger out he will be going home sooner rather than later

Fireball07

tolosenc wrote: »

I'm posting this here mostly as a means for me to look back on it in 18 months...

15. Kearney
14. Bowe
13. Fitzgerald
12. D'arcy
11. Gilroy
10. Sexton
9. Murray

1. Healy
2. Strauss
3. Moore
4. O'Connell
5. Ryan
6. O'Mahony
7. O'Brien
8. Heaslip

16. Best
17. McGrath
18. Ross
19. Toner
20. Ruddock
21. Marmion
22. Madigan
23. Zebo

Rounding out the rest of the 30 man squad: Cronin, Hagan, McCarthy, McLoughlin, McGrath, Jackson, Marshall.

No Henderson, even in the squad?

shaka wrote: »

And? Has generally been v poor for munster playing 6 or 7 and only looks ok at 8 . He came with a big rep but unless he gets the finger out he will be going home sooner rather than later

He may go home, but he has not been very poor. In fact, he's been quite good.

jacothelad

SD Sportsman wrote: »

Yet again... I never said Fitzgerald had a good try record. Can you read?
My point is that the other threes try scoring for Ireland cannot be considered when picking your Ireland team as they don't have record, they've played 13 games combined.
I'm saying the try records for all of them are irrelevant and you're picking based on what else they can do. This is where in my opinion Fitzgerald is superior to the other 3.
Until the others play tonight games and keep scoring the try stats are pointless.
You can absoloutley discount Fitzgerald tries against Italy but it really doesn't change anything.

Now, now. No need to be offensive. I would have thought you would have been able to work the answer to that out for yourself. Sadly, reading nonsense is still reading nonsense.

SD Sportsman

jacothelad wrote: »

Now, now. No need to be offensive. I would have thought you would have been able to work the answer to that out for yourself. Sadly, reading nonsense is still reading nonsense.

Sorry I forgot calling someone's opinion childish wasn't offensive.
It's great how you have a go at other people nonsense without pointing out why or giving your own opinion.
But you know what I couldn't care less what you have to say so I'm going to leave it here before Mods start intervening interpret my points whatever way tickles your little self.

shaka

He may go home, but he has not been very poor. In fact, he's been quite good.[/QUOTE]

Thats funny ive seen every home game he has played and He clearly can't play flanker , gives soft penaltys ( how can a pro not understand offside) while been lazy . In attack he is useful ball in hand but doesn't understand how to support his own team going into a ruck. They have been spending ages working with him one on one to get him up to speed but there hasn't been any improvement IMO

jamiedav2011

Fireball07 wrote: »

No Henderson, even in the squad?




He may go home, but he has not been very poor. In fact, he's been quite good.

Has he?!

jacothelad

SD Sportsman wrote: »

Sorry I forgot calling someone's opinion childish wasn't offensive.
It's great how you have a go at other people nonsense without pointing out why or giving your own opinion.
But you know what I couldn't care less what you have to say so I'm going to leave it here before Mods start intervening interpret my points whatever way tickles your little self.

I most certainly didn't call your post childish. I called the process of discounting player A's accomplishments because you're enamoured with player B, childlike. You're opinions of Fitz are not that uncommon but they are just that. Opinion...... and not one actually shared by everyone. Get it yet? Saying a player is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY ahead of others with absolutely no evidence or history of such stellar performances is -as I said - not really capable of standing up to scrutiny.

Bridge93

jacothelad wrote: »

I most certainly didn't call your post childish. I called the process of discounting player A's accomplishments because you're enamoured with player B, childlike. You're opinions of Fitz are not that uncommon but they are just that. Opinion...... and not one actually shared by everyone. Get it yet? Saying a player is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY ahead of others with absolutely no evidence or history of such stellar performances is -as I said - not really capable of standing up to scrutiny.

I think you've misunderstood what his point was. Go read where it first spawned from. I don't think he said he's miles better than Gilroy or Zebo only Kearney which at their best I must say I agree with. Kearney is nothing more than solid. Think it was somebody else said he was miles better.

for me the team would be:
1. Healy
2. Best
3. Moore
4. O Connell
5. Henderson
6. Ferris (But realistically POM)
7. O' Brien
8. Heaslip
9. Murray
10. Sexton
11. Gilroy/Fitzgerald/Zebo
12. Marshall
13. Payne/Fitzgerald
14. Bowe
15. Kearney

16. Strauss 17. McGrath 18. Ross 19. Ryan 20. POM (Assuming he starts Henry), 21. Marmion 22. Jackson 23. Fitzgerald/Olding

Others I'd expect to be knocking around would be Cronin x2, Toner, Fitzpatrick, Ruddock, O Donnell, Murphy, McGrath, Hanrahan, Madigan, Earls.
Obviously cannot all go and there will be somebody not on our radar now who will make a push. Autumn 2015 is ages away.