First time at mart, need a few things ironed out

NewBeefFarmer

Hi all,

Was at the mart resently,

Thoughts:
As i expected, nothing out of the blue, 75-125 farmers, yet most of the action were by the (what i can only call the gay farmers) arms around each other, stuck to the ringside wall. . . . (dealers no doubt), yes some serious love between those farmers. Id rather stand back in the next row.

dont like the way the auctioneers gets a head of himself or the boy in the ring lets the animal in or out too late. . . more than a few occasions im asking are we selling the animal thats in the ring now, or the previous one:rolleyes:


I have a few quick things i need ironed out.

the board with the animals detials, owner/DOB DOT etc. . . why doesnt it have the breed of the animal, like AAX or LMX etc . .

and if its an AAX, crossed with what breed? does it matter to know this?

I assume i stay well clear of the selling of an animal when the board is blank for him. . . . yes, have seen it.

oh yes, good one here. when u have 2 bullocks in the ring, and the auction starts, the bidding price is on one animal, and u just pay double at the office, is this assumption correct? that or double animals are way cheaper:p

is it better to have the same weight bullocks within say 50-70 Kgs. so they wont be fighting when u bring them home?. .

I know there is importance of the DOB and DOT, can someone tell me the importance of this and what i should be looking out for, im going again to the mart this weekend and im going to pay a lot of attention. . two charolias with the same weight could go for €150 in the difference, i think its due to the DOB. . . id appreciate someones knowledge on this.

dam, didnt mean for the post to be so long. . .
can never ask a simple short question can i. .

Cheers
NBF

jay gatsby

farmer love goes on too - not just dealers - I regularly see lads even in their sixties literally sprawled across one another at the ringside. Can't abide it either.

when you have 2 animals in the ring you are bidding a price for each animal - therefore no matter how different the 2 are they are effectively going for the same price. This is done normally to drag up the price of the weakest animal. (At least that's the idea)

Breed doesn't come up - sometimes the farmer will tell the auctioneer to announce it . It's basically down to your own eye to judge the quality. If your being breed specific for some reason e.g. for breeding the mart may not be the best place for it.
DOB is important because if both are the same weight the older one may be done growing, may not have the same potential. Alternatively it could be said that this animal might be easier to finish - also an animal close to 30 months may not be as desirable if your talking about the heavier lads.

Buying the stock - obviously you don't want to have huge disparity betweent he weights for the reason you outlined.

MfMan

Two (or three) cattle sold together have the advantage that they will settle quicker when brought home, but perhaps the disadvantage that a plain one will be 'carried' by the better one(s). As a rule, cattle brought home and left in a shed together don't tend to fight too much - probably too tired.

2 charolais cattle (CHX) can be quite different depending on what they're crossed with. e.g one may be crossed with a simmental and be tall, leggy and narrow, another could be out of a limousin and be beefier and broader. Experience and a keener eye over time will tell you the difference.

DOT - date of test? Cattle must be in test, i.e. tested within the previous 12 months to be sold at marts. (Also at factories, but this can be stretched to 18 months if the majority of your herd is 'in test' I think. Anyone?) If you're buying a bullock with the intention of selling him on in the near future, this may be significant.

NewBeefFarmer

krikey 321 views and two replies. . in the farm forum.

thanks Jay and MFman, , ,

KatyMac

NewBeefFarmer wrote: »

krikey 321 views and two replies. . in the farm forum.

thanks Jay and MFman, , ,

I'm just going to say 'hello' as I don't want to be yet another silent viewer! Afraid I can't sensibly answer any of your questions as I've never actually bought cattle in a mart only sell them. When I took over the selling from my father I hadn't a clue, wasn't even 100% sure about where the seller went when their animals were in the ring!! May your learning curve be steep;)

caseman

It would help if you brought a neighbour along to explain how it works.
And keep a eye an those gay farmers, they could leave cattle expensive.

Cran

NewBeefFarmer wrote: »

krikey 321 views and two replies. . in the farm forum.

thanks Jay and MFman, , ,

funny you posted this was just thinking today how much I enjoy your posts.

only advice I can give is used to buy good few stores in spring, best is to have picked cattle before hand and ignore the dudes around the ring

Bizzum

NewBeefFarmer wrote: »

krikey 321 views and two replies. . in the farm forum.

thanks Jay and MFman, , ,

413 views now and rising:)

Bizzum

NewBeefFarmer wrote: »

I have a few quick things i need ironed out.

the board with the animals detials, owner/DOB DOT etc. . . why doesnt it have the breed of the animal, like AAX or LMX etc . .

and if its an AAX, crossed with what breed? does it matter to know this?
Cheers
NBF

I love the innocence of your posts!
I'll answer your first question, or at least I'll give you my opinion.
Don't be getting to hung up on breed. Buy conformation and potential instead. But with experience it will be obvious to you what breed your looking at!
The breed of any animal is generally the breed of the sire as entered on the card by the breeder. Breed of dam is no longer on the cards. It used to be once upon a time! but not anymore.
Re: Buying cattle, the best bit of advice I can give you is to have a good look outside at the lots that interest you, note their lot no. and wait for them to come into the ring. In the interm you can look up their details in the office and even check their cards for breed if you like.
There are so many things at play at ringside your best bet would be to have someone experienced with you for a while.

Tipp Man

NewBeefFarmer wrote: »

Hi all,

Was at the mart resently,

Thoughts:
As i expected, nothing out of the blue, 75-125 farmers, yet most of the action were by the (what i can only call the gay farmers) arms around each other, stuck to the ringside wall. . . . (dealers no doubt), yes some serious love between those farmers. Id rather stand back in the next row.

dont like the way the auctioneers gets a head of himself or the boy in the ring lets the animal in or out too late. . . more than a few occasions im asking are we selling the animal thats in the ring now, or the previous one:rolleyes:


I have a few quick things i need ironed out.

the board with the animals detials, owner/DOB DOT etc. . . why doesnt it have the breed of the animal, like AAX or LMX etc . .

and if its an AAX, crossed with what breed? does it matter to know this?

I assume i stay well clear of the selling of an animal when the board is blank for him. . . . yes, have seen it.

oh yes, good one here. when u have 2 bullocks in the ring, and the auction starts, the bidding price is on one animal, and u just pay double at the office, is this assumption correct? that or double animals are way cheaper:p

is it better to have the same weight bullocks within say 50-70 Kgs. so they wont be fighting when u bring them home?. .

I know there is importance of the DOB and DOT, can someone tell me the importance of this and what i should be looking out for, im going again to the mart this weekend and im going to pay a lot of attention. . two charolias with the same weight could go for €150 in the difference, i think its due to the DOB. . . id appreciate someones knowledge on this.

dam, didnt mean for the post to be so long. . .
can never ask a simple short question can i. .

Cheers
NBF

a rushed reply as i'm in a hurry but some quick answers are:

1) a mart isn't a place for mugs so don't underestimate the "gay dealers" or it will cost you money. The budy budy act is exactly that, an act. These guys are razor sharp - especially when it comes to money

2) pay attention to the auctioneer and study him. they all take phantom bids so make sure your not being taken for a ride and learn how he operates. this is vital as it could cost you money

3) breed doesn't really matter hence why not on the board. Not sure about the blank board - the details must be displayed at some point while the animal is on sale. It goes blank though when it is changing lots

4) you should buy on quality, price and potential - not on breed

5) you don't need all your cattle the same weight at all - we have big variations in ours (several hundred kilos), but it can be easier to manage if they are of similar weights - however when housing you should have the similar weight cattle grouped together, at grass it doesn't matter

6) DOB date of birth is important for cattle going to factory so buyers want to know how long before the cattle reach 30 months. There can be penalites at factories for killling cattle over 30 months (a harp back to the BSE Days)

7) DOT date of test - you can't sell an animal out of test so buyers who intend on selling the animal again need to know how long the animal will be in test

8) Arrive at the mart early and view the cattle in the pens where you can judge them properly and at your own leisure. For a beginner it is nearly impossible to judge cattle in the ring. When viewing in the pens take a pen an paper with you and write down what you think the animals will weigh and what they will make. This is the fastest way to improve your judgement of an animal (and it will make it less boring!!). It will also get you in tune with the market

9) It can take years to become a good judge of a bullock and some people are doing it all their lives and are still crap at it so don't panic, you don't need to know everything right now. Just be careful but not afraid

NewBeefFarmer

now we're talkin! . . .

gerico

Hi New Beef Farmer.

you don't have to buy in a mart as you can buy private from the yard. you get to see the dams and possibly the sire. Cattle are generally less stressed & you avoid fees and time spent moping around the mart.

bring someone experienced with you to set you right. you can buy or walk and if things go right you could have a good contact for repeat business.

Ringside is a good place to drop money if your not fully tuned in !!

Kovu

Right, from what I read, you are inexperienced in a mart, The dealers (who are used of faces) could rip you into high prices at the ring. Have you any friends who buy cattle? Or know cattle even?
I've seen buyers pay €100 more for similar cattle in marts when they arrive in new, it really is a bit of a sham when the new buyers can be intimidated/provoked so much into paying these prices. Can you PM me with the mart you go to? How many bullocks are you looking for?

Kovu

Bizzum wrote: »

413 views now and rising:)

The one that left the ring now, not the one in it!

bob charles

Karen112 wrote: »

Right, from what I read, you are inexperienced in a mart, The dealers (who are used of faces) could rip you into high prices at the ring. Have you any friends who buy cattle? Or know cattle even?
I've seen buyers pay €100 more for similar cattle in marts when they arrive in new, it really is a bit of a sham when the new buyers can be intimidated/provoked so much into paying these prices. Can you PM me with the mart you go to? How many bullocks are you looking for?

And you reckon this wouldnt happen in any other industry? An inexperienced person is a sitting duck anywhere there is money changing hands.

Kovu

bob charles wrote: »

And you reckon this wouldnt happen in any other industry? An inexperienced person is a sitting duck anywhere there is money changing hands.

Of course it would. I'm just trying to help someone out to give them a chance in the industry.

pakalasa

Tipp Man wrote: »

8) Arrive at the mart early and view the cattle in the pens where you can judge them properly and at your own leisure. For a beginner it is nearly impossible to judge cattle in the ring. When viewing in the pens take a pen an paper with you and write down what you think the animals will weigh and what they will make. This is the fastest way to improve your judgement of an animal (and it will make it less boring!!). It will also get you in tune with the market

That's probably the best advice of all. See if you can estimate what the cattle will make. Then ask yerself why some seem cheap and others seem dear. Spend a few days doing this, if you have the spare time. It will be time well spent.
Another thing to remember is expect to drop out of the bidding without buying. If you're one of these guys that keep going till you have bought, the dealers will sit up and take note of you very quick.;)