kitty litter tray advice?

Aishae

hi all, this is my third cat but the eldest is 15. and never had a problem toilet training the 4 year old... but they're female. i have a male kitten that's 20 weeks at this stage.

at first when i tried to litter train him, it was hit and miss but he was getting the idea for poos. but not pee.... behind the door in one room got into such a state that we had to replace the carpet (and we used lino)

ive tried vinegar to deter him - and various antibacterials as well as an apple scented dettol one. but he's still peeing there. he's so very stubborn. he will not pee in the tray.
he hasn't got a urinary infection or that as he was he was checked by the vet.

im guessing that the problem is the smell. being stronger with males its harder to get rid of.
has anyone any experience with toilet training male cats?
suggestions as to what may get rid of the smell ?
if you have any advice on getting him to use the tray, that'd be welcome. he's a stubborn so and so

artieanna

Here's something to try.... Clean the area well with bleach and dettol then could you get another litter tray and put it where he's peeing behind the door. he should start using the tray as its in his pee area, then gradually move it a little every day until it arrives at the position of the permanent litter tray..

Hopefully this should work...

Good luck

MsQuinn

I have 2 cats who are mostly indoors. Boy will use the litter tray no matter what.

Girl will only use it if it is clean (ish). She might tolerate some pee.

If I don't clean it regularly, and i mean after he has used it for no. 2's - she will poo behind the tray by the back door. At least she is consistent. She doesn't go anywhere else in the house.

They get out most days for a while and prefer to do their business elsewhere so tray has been fresh recently. In wintertime, I check it morning, noon and night.

If you have 3 cats, you might need to get more litter trays or make sure that the're cleaned out as soon as they are used.

Themadhouse

How many trays do you have? The general rule is one for each cat plus one.

What age was he when you got him?

Urine off is a product every cat house should have. It takes away the urine smell.

I would put a covered tray in the area that he is using and hopefully he will begin to use it and then you can move it.

Themadhouse

Is there a possibilty that he is being prevented from using the tray at times or a bit of bullying going on?

lorebringer

Cats can be fussy, really fussy, when it comes to using litter trays. Smells can put them off or attract them to areas, or trays, and you need to work with the cat to get some success.

Firstly, if he isn't using the tray you have you may need to get another one. Some cats like to have their own personal tray () or are more comfortable using their own one. Try to have at least one tray per cat in the house (if not one or two more for good luck). Keep they tray clean, but not so clean that he cannot smell himself in it. Washing it out with washing up liquid and a drop of Dettol (not the one that goes cloudy in water) or Milton will do the job. Don't go mad with bleach or anything, it'll put the cat off. A nice big, deep tray is best (gives them room to turn around and lots of digging space) so get a bigger one if you are buying it new. Changing the litter regularly (the whole lot, not just scooping poo or clumps) will also stop any smells putting him off. Sprinkling a bit of Bicarb of Soda (get it in the cooking isle in the super market - really cheap!) at the bottom of the tray, under the clean litter, every time you change it will help stop any nasty smells too.

Second, the area that he keeps going to the toilet in needs to be super cleaned to stop him from smelling himself and thinking it's a good place to pee. You can buy special enzyme cleaner in pet stores which work well or you could use biological washing powder/liquid. Dilute it in warm (not boiling hot, but pretty hot) water (or follow the instructions on the bottle if you buy the stuff in the pet shop), clean down the area (and around it - skirting etc.) and give it a good rinse. Then go in with Dettol or Milton (or something similar) and rinse again. This should get rid of any smells hanging around. If he is still attracted to the area it's either a situation of he likes the particular spot or you will need to clean it down again. If he like discrete places, it may be an idea to buy him a covered litter tray so that he feels more secure.

Lastly, if he is still preferring certain areas to pee, put a litter tray in these areas so that he may be encouraged to pee in them. Make sure he has access to a clean litter tray at all times, the more he goes in the tray the more likely he is to go in one the next time! Large, covered trays make the cat most comfortable and he will be more inclined to go somewhere he feels "safe" (for want of a better word).

Just to note - if you are using bleach, use chlorine as opposed to ammonia. Ammonia bleach will attract him to the area where as chlorine will not. Really, there is no real need to use bleach for this but just to be aware if you are.

Good luck!

planetX

another litter tray where he's peeing. Incidentally I've never found any difference between males and females using litter. I was having accidents with 3 cats, which resolved when I went up to using 4 trays.

MaryK666

Themadhouse wrote: »

How many trays do you have? The general rule is one for each cat plus one.

What age was he when you got him?

Urine off is a product every cat house should have. It takes away the urine smell.

I would put a covered tray in the area that he is using and hopefully he will begin to use it and then you can move it.

Totally agree - you need to have more trays than you have cats. Some cats like to use a tray in complete privacy and will only use covered trays while others are scared of the swing doors on covered trays and of the confined spaces. Then you have the cats (like Ms Quinn's) who prefer to use a clean tray and don't like using one that another cat has already been in.

The Urine Off is a godsend to get rid of the smells, especially male cat urine as it's a very strong smell that cats can still pick up after we clean with ordinary products.

Using bleach and products with a strong smell or those containing amonia will only make the problem worse as your male cat will assume that these are someone trying to muscle in on his patch and will mark the area more frequently to assert his dominance as head honcho. Putting a litter tray in the area where he sprays or wees is also an option as he could well chose to use this instead. But remember that the litter needs to be quite deep in all of your litter trays. Cats like to dig deep and cover their toilet with lots of litter and will often shy away from trays that don't have sufficient litter to allow them to do this comfortably.

The type of litter could also be a contributing factor. Some cats seem to tolerate anything you put down for them but some have quite soft pads on their paws that can be hurt by sharp pieces of litter which acts as a deterrant to them using the tray.

There's also a product you can buy called Feliway. It comes in a spray or as a plug-in and is said to mimic a cats natural pheremones, promoting a happy atmosphere in the home. The spray is particularly good for cases like this or where cats are scratching something they shouldn't. You just spray it in the affected area or on the item in question and it works to stop unacceptable behaviour while making the cat feel good. We use it when we introduce a new cat or kitten to the tribe to prevent fighting between them and to stop the new arrival from doing anything he/she shouldnt.

Some people assume that having a cat or indeed several cats is a simple, uncomplicated process but the reality is that they can be quite complex little creatures with their own individual quirks, personalities and foibles. You'll find that what works for one will not necessarily work for another and it's the same with their toilet habits, their behaviour and their diet.
Get to know your cats very well, find out what they like, what they dont, and find what makes each of them tick. It makes it easier to tell if any one of them is feeling just a little off colour before an illness becomes serious and makes it easier to prevent other problems - especially in a multi-cat household.

Zapperzy

I have a cat with litter tray/inappropriate peeing issues so have done a good bit of reading up on that sort of thing. My problem still isin't fully sorted but were getting there.

Clean the area well as other people have suggested with something like urine off or biological washing powder. From what I gather the area is now lino? If it was carpet it would be much harder and you may need to rip it up and change it if it was well soaked in underneath.

Up the number of litter trays, 1 per cat plus 1 extra. Some cats are bullies and like to guard the litter tray to prevent any others using it but with all their might they cannot guard 4 trays at once provided they are in different locations. Also some cats don't like dirty trays and demand that each time they go it must be in a clean tray.

What litter are you using? Woodchips, grainy sort of stuff, scented? Some don't like the rough edges of woodchips, some might not like the scent added to them. Then you've got the ones who prefer covered trays and those that prefer uncovered trays. I'v just switched over to a covered tray and started off by taking the swinging door off, putting her original tray inside the covered one and opening up the whole front of it so she doesn't have a little door to walk through (mine has a really handy hinged top bit for easy cleaning so you can lift up half the lid). I'v now poured her litter straight into the base and closed down the lid but still not added the flap as I think she may have issues with it so I'l introduce it to her later really slowly. Mine didn't like being watched on her tray so seems to much prefer the covered one.

Could you close the door to that room so he hasn't the option of peeing in it until he is fully litter trained? Also +1 on whoever suggested feliway.

Litter training kittens is usually straightforward, the mother teaches them the scraping action so it's usually just a matter of lifting them onto the litter tray after meals and manic play sessions and manipulating their front paws to make scraping motions. Cat's like to be very clean so they naturally want to toilet somewhere they can cover it up. So I would think this could be moreso a case of somethings not quite right which is causing him to pee somewhere else rather than just being a difficult kitten to train.

Aishae

Thank you all for the advice.

Tinky was found by a neighbour who couldn't keep him so I took him. Thought he was 7 weeks old but going by what the vet said when we took him for vax, he was only 5 weeks when we got him. He gets on absolutely great with the dogs. Loves them. The cats all ignore each other really.

They all have their own tray and won't go near each others. Tinky has a deep covered tray. But I took the door off when I got it. I'm going to try him by taking the top off. Also the cleaning stuff mentioned.

He does have constipation trouble - so he's on a laxative. But the peeing started before the constipation.

mymo

I would also recommend biological washing powder as a cleaner, something to do with enzymes, does work better than any product I tried (and cheaper).
Bleach and other cleaners can actually make things worse due to the way they smell to the cat.
Can you try a shallow tray with some paper in it behind the door?
Maybe if he uses that add some litter (keep the wet paper the scent may help), and see how that goes. Increase the amount of litter and get rid of the paper. after he is using it often move the tray a little at a time until its where you want it.

Aishae

I took the lid off the tray. He doesnt seem as nervous in it now. I didn't notice the nervousness till the other day. I also cleaned the spot where he pees with an industrial strength odour and pee cleaner from the pet shop. Didn't have urine off.

He did a pee in his tray this morning. Progress! I started litter tray training from scratch. Put him in it when he wakes or eats.

He has to see the vet again though. He's not pooing at all now and leaves (pardon the graphic imagery) skidmarks all over as the laxative the vet gave us doesn't help him poo but makes his butt runny. That'll be more toilet training he'll need. Poor thing. I have to wash his bottom.

Themadhouse

Aishae wrote: »

I took the lid off the tray. He doesnt seem as nervous in it now. I didn't notice the nervousness till the other day. I also cleaned the spot where he pees with an industrial strength odour and pee cleaner from the pet shop. Didn't have urine off.

He did a pee in his tray this morning. Progress! I started litter tray training from scratch. Put him in it when he wakes or eats.

He has to see the vet again though. He's not pooing at all now and leaves (pardon the graphic imagery) skidmarks all over as the laxative the vet gave us doesn't help him poo but makes his butt runny. That'll be more toilet training he'll need. Poor thing. I have to wash his bottom.

Try feeding sunflower oil in his food, extra fibre too for the constipation. Also some milk in water, not too much. I know cats or kittens should not be fed milk but in this case it might loosen up his bowel movements. You will probably find if you get the constipation undercontrol that his litter tray habits will improve. It is possible he is thinking litter tray equals pain.

MaryK666

Aishae wrote: »

I took the lid off the tray. He doesnt seem as nervous in it now. I didn't notice the nervousness till the other day. I also cleaned the spot where he pees with an industrial strength odour and pee cleaner from the pet shop. Didn't have urine off.

He did a pee in his tray this morning. Progress! I started litter tray training from scratch. Put him in it when he wakes or eats.

He has to see the vet again though. He's not pooing at all now and leaves (pardon the graphic imagery) skidmarks all over as the laxative the vet gave us doesn't help him poo but makes his butt runny. That'll be more toilet training he'll need. Poor thing. I have to wash his bottom.

Hi Aishae - that's great news that he's starting to use the tray again. It's a big step forward so make sure you praise him lots every time he goes in it or after you've put him in it and hes done his business. I've always found that praise and rubs get much better results than treats - although they work too. Just try not to touch him once hes in the tray as he may get skittish again. Cats in the wild are vulnerable when they go to the toilet and that nervousness has come with them even though they now live in nice comfortable houses. Some cats don't even like you looking at them when they're doing their business.

Can I ask what you're feeding him at the minute? When we took on our kittens, Suzi was only about 5 weeks old and we had a nightmare trying to get a diet that suited her. Some things would make her constipated and others would give her galloping runs so we had a few scary weeks before we found something that she liked that actually suited her while being good for her. She's currently on a mix of Orijen and Applaws dry food along with fresh fish, chicken and occasional prawns and smoked salmon which she loves. Mind you, this is a cat who likes stilton cheese, butternut squash and mild curry so she's quite the little gourmet.

You have to be careful with the risk of dehydration, especially in kittens and young cats, if they have diarrhea as it happens quite quickly.
I wouldn't be in favour of giving him milk and water as this might just exacerbate the problem since cats are lactose intolerant. It will push the food through his digestive system but not in a way that's good for him.
Some people will advise you to feed dry food only while some will suggest a mix but the best advice I can give you is to feed the best quality food you can afford whether its wet or dry or a mix of both. Some own brand and bargain food can have very little real nutritional value to your cat and some tinned brands can make them behave like crack addicts over their food to the point where they will refuse to eat anything else.

Let us know how you get on at the vets and how your boy is getting on.

Aishae

He's staying in for x rays particularly of the colon. His poo is soft enough etc. But just not coming out. Vet doesn't feel it's his diet as the poo is soft and we tried diff foods too nor did the laxative work.

He's on science plan vet essentials kitten (with water) pricey... But he likes it

MaryK666

Ah the poor little fella. I hope that everything comes back ok and that it's just something simple and easy to sort.

There may be some kind of a twist in the gut or a blockage caused by something he ate that he shouldn't have done. But fingers crossed that the x-rays will show up the problem and it's something the vet can sort out easily.

The Science Plan food seems to be ok - as pet foods go - but mine wont even look at it. We tried the dry kitten food on the babies last year and they just sniffed it and walked away. The pouches seemed to be faring better but they just licked the gravy off and left the food behind. They're fierce fussy and very, very spoiled so we kept trying until we got something that they liked and was also going to be good for them.

Suzi had horrendous runs at one stage and she was only about 6 weeks old so we ended up having to throw out a lot of mats/rugs as she kept getting caught short. Then she got all bunged up and couldn't go at all and she'd be in the tray straining and crying. It was a stressful time as she was rescued at about 4 weeks when someone threw her out in a plastic bag so her poor little digestive system was all over the place. Luckily that has all passed now and we have a happy, health, very fussy little girl who'll be a year old soon.

Looking forward to hearing some good news tomorrow once the x-rays come back.

Aishae

Little update - he was in the vet for 4 days. Xray was clear. They think it was an infection from a worm in the gut. So he's on a special hills Prescriptive diet for a week and more steroid/ anti biotics. He's not constipated but it's not diarea (spell?!) either. So that will take time to sort. His nickname is skidmark (I'm terrible!)

He's very happy to be home. The dogs were wandering around like spare beds wondering where their playmate went. Cats didn't care! Gas....

He's making progress on peeing in the tray since I took the top off

Aishae

unfortunately this story has no happy ending tinky had to be pts this morning as they discovered a rare congential disease of the bowel/colon that they couldnt help and he was in extreme pain - he was such a sweet baby.

thank you all for the tray advice

MaryK666

I'm so sorry Aishae, you tried so hard to help him but it just wasn't meant to be. RIP Tinky, run free on Rainbow Bridge.






Just this side of heaven is a place called Rainbow Bridge.
When an animal dies that has been especially close to someone here, that pet goes to Rainbow Bridge.
There are meadows and hills for all of our special friends so they can run and play together.
There is plenty of food, water and sunshine, and our friends are warm and comfortable.

All the animals who had been ill or old are restored to health and vigor; those who were hurt or maimed are made whole and strong again, just as we remember them in our dreams of days and times gone by.
The animals are happy and content, except for one small thing; they each miss someone very special to them, who had to be left behind.

They all run and play together, but the day comes when one suddenly stops and looks into the distance.
His bright eyes are intent; His eager body quivers.
Suddenly he begins to run from the group, flying over the green grass, his legs carrying him faster and faster.

You have been spotted, and when you and your special friend finally meet, you cling together in joyous reunion, never to be parted again.
The happy kisses rain upon your face; your hands again caress the beloved head, and you look once more into the trusting eyes of your pet, so long gone from your life but never absent from your heart.

Then you cross Rainbow Bridge together....

Aishae

Thats a lovely piece, I knew of rainbow bridge but hadn't seen that. And i was hit by image of me being mugged for kisses by each special animal I've had: tinky, Brandon, Aran, lucky, patches and her brother tigger (who wasn't ours but hung at ours)