Guillemot Lightship cut-up!

Judgement Day

Anybody see this in today's Guardian? I heard nothing about it and I'm raging. Some muck savage councillor says it was private property and that's that - what if the Book of Kells was private property and the owner used it as loo paper? FFS!!! :mad:

vicwatson

It's gone months

Last time I was down there it was a big gaping hole in the quay - WILL THE OWNERS OF THE VESSEL BE PAYING TO HAVE IT FILLED IN I WONDER?

No respect for anything of possible historical significance in this country.

http://www.msmrecycling.com/projects/lightship-guillemot/

Guillemot
Built 1921/23 by Cran & Somerville, Leith; length 102 feet, breadth 24 feet, depth 12½ feet; construction all steel; five watertight bulkheads; steel mast and fixed lantern; mizzen mast carrying day mark; masts for wireless; cost £17,700; sold in 1968 to Wexford Maritime Museum Committee. Towed by ILT Atlanta to Rosslare. Taken in tow over Wexford Harbour Bar. Moored alongside quay at Wexford. Subsequently moved to Kilmore Quay and set in concrete.

Additional writing by me - and was then cut up for scrap metal in 2011 - 90 years later !

klong

Why was it of "historical significance"?

thedarkroom

I saw that article in the Guardian yesterday, fair play for getting it up here so quickly. Ireton must have had his head in the sand if he is only finding out now that this great display is no more!
This is a thread from a few months back about it-
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=71962499

It should never of happened. It was a popular attraction when it operated as a museum a few years ago and should have been invested in by the Heritage Council/Wexford Co Co/Bord Failte, etc to keep it as a central focal point for the harbour. There were a lot if interesting historical documents on display as well as various natural history displays, shame to see it gone.

Judgement Day

klong wrote: »

Why was it of "historical significance"?

No it obviously wasn't - Ireland is littered with preserved 90 year old lightships and maritime museums. :rolleyes:

RKQ

Its destruction was a terrible waste. Its sad to see the ship removed.
Surely the Wexford Maritime Museum Committee received public money in the past and therefore should have discussed its removal & destruction with the public.

I can understand the local fishermen being annoyed. Its a pity this wasn't discussed in public before its destruction - maybe funds could have been raised to save it.

Its removal may have been discussed locally but I don't recall any County or National debate about it. I wasn't aware of any problems with the ship.

Its such a terrible shame.

Niles

Basically in this country heritage falls into three categories:

1. "we were opressed by the Brits for 700 years"
2. "diddly eye, tis a magical stone so it is"
3. Really ancient stuff

If you can't fit an item under one of these headings no-one seems to care.

It's ridiculous that this kind of thing is allowed to happen. I take it that the Guillemot wasn't technically/legally a listed as a museum exhibit, otherwise my understanding is that the owner would have been obliged to offer it to similar museums before they could scrap it.

Judgement Day

Don't worry, in 50 years or so the OPW will build a multi-million Interpretative Centre for lightships - what they might have looked like etc.etc. with lots of storyboards and artist's impressions - supplied by some expensive English company operating out of the London Docklands. :rolleyes:

MungBean

It was dismantled because it was getting dangerous and as far as I'm aware everyone around knew well in advance. I have also spoken to many local fishermen and quite simply put the vast majority I spoke to dont give a shíte.

Wasnt just a matter of it was private and it was scrapped. I'd image the restoration involved to make it safe wouldnt have been worth it considering it was nothing more than a monument. Certainly wasnt worth much as an attraction. If it was a case of fork out a fortune or scrap it for the owner I know what I'd pick. The Quay is dying a slow death. I cant fathom why anyone would visit it to see a chipper (slowest chipper I've ever had the misfortune of being in), 2 shops and a "hotel". You know the place is a kip when it doesnt even have a pub for fcuk sake.

Sad to see it gone all the same.

vicwatson

Why was it of "historical significance"?

I said -

"possible historical significance"

I cant fathom why anyone would visit it to see a chipper (slowest chipper I've ever had the misfortune of being in), 2 shops and a "hotel". You know the place is a kip when it doesnt even have a pub for fcuk sake.

The "hotel" has a pub :rolleyes:

David900

Seems to me like everyone is jumping the gun here. It was privately owned bu something called the Wexford Maritime Museum Committee, sounds like some kind of not for profit trust rather than the greedy individual that is being portrayed by some here.

Drawing from that I'd say it wasn't making enough money to support it, look at the picture FFS, its rotten!!

From memory there was nothing overly spectacular about it apart from the light on top, it was a steel ship. They still make them like that today....
It was a quirky attraction but not a massive tourist attraction.
This place is worse than the tabloids sometimes....

MungBean

vicwatson wrote: »

The "hotel" has a pub :rolleyes:

Hotel has a bar I meant an actual pub. Two closed pubs in the centre of it doesnt exactly portray it as a vibrant place. Which is a pity because it could be a great spot.

thedarkroom

Skunkle wrote: »

Hotel has a bar I meant an actual pub. Two closed pubs in the centre of it doesnt exactly portray it as a vibrant place. Which is a pity because it could be a great spot.

I went to Kilmore Quay on a day trip with the family last Summer and when we got there we were very disappointed. There was nothing there. The pub (Kehoe's?) was busy with lunches but that was about it. Fine if all you want to do is take a walk and look at a few boats, unleash the kids in the playground over-run by a few thugs watched over by their parents drinking beside their Hiace, or take a walk across an oily dirty and smelly beach. There was a time when this place was nice to visit, but no more. A couple of nice restaurants on the outskirts but nothing else from what I could see. When we staying in Wexford town for a few days recently my kids even said "We're not going back to that other place again are we?" It certainly left a bad impression on them. The place needs a few 'attractions', whether the lightship constituted an attraction is a matter of opinion, I liked it, but the place needs to introduce stuff, not remove it.

Judgement Day

David900 wrote: »

Seems to me like everyone is jumping the gun here. It was privately owned bu something called the Wexford Maritime Museum Committee, sounds like some kind of not for profit trust rather than the greedy individual that is being portrayed by some here.

Drawing from that I'd say it wasn't making enough money to support it, look at the picture FFS, its rotten!!

From memory there was nothing overly spectacular about it apart from the light on top, it was a steel ship. They still make them like that today....
It was a quirky attraction but not a massive tourist attraction.
This place is worse than the tabloids sometimes....

Seems to me that you should know something about the topic before posting.

Niles

David900 wrote: »

Seems to me like everyone is jumping the gun here. It was privately owned bu something called the Wexford Maritime Museum Committee, sounds like some kind of not for profit trust rather than the greedy individual that is being portrayed by some here.

That actually makes it worse...

David900 wrote: »

Drawing from that I'd say it wasn't making enough money to support it, look at the picture FFS, its rotten!!

From memory there was nothing overly spectacular about it apart from the light on top, it was a steel ship. They still make them like that today....
It was a quirky attraction but not a massive tourist attraction.
This place is worse than the tabloids sometimes....

Heritage shouldn't necessarily be about making money. I understand things need money for their upkeep (trust me, I really do!), but at the same time that doesn't automatically mean it should be scrapped if it isn't. That's part of the problem. If it was a massive tourist attraction it would have survived, it's the smaller (but still worthy) ones that tend to fall through the cracks. Surely it should have been at least offered to similar museums?

Mahatma coat

Lads, I Saw it being taken apart, some of the Steel was like paper especially around the waterline, it Was dangerous and probably beyond repair.

From what I heard it cost more to dismantle than the Scrap Value was worth.

Judgement Day

Mahatma coat wrote: »

Lads, I Saw it being taken apart, some of the Steel was like paper especially around the waterline, it Was dangerous and probably beyond repair.

From what I heard it cost more to dismantle than the Scrap Value was worth.

I very much doubt that it cost more to cut up that its scrap value given the current high price of scrap. It was one of a very few tourist attractions in the South East - neglected and all as it was - and it should never have ended up dumped at Kilmore Quay. As for the idiotic comment by one poster that they still build similar ships........:rolleyes:

older i get better i was

twas an eyesore nd rustbucket no loss to town. tourist

Judgement Day

older i get better i was wrote: »

twas an eyesore nd rustbucket no loss to town. tourist

Yeah booming Kilmore is better off without it.

MungBean

Judgement Day wrote: »

I very much doubt that it cost more to cut up that its scrap value given the current high price of scrap. It was one of a very few tourist attractions in the South East - neglected and all as it was - and it should never have ended up dumped at Kilmore Quay. As for the idiotic comment by one poster that they still build similar ships........:rolleyes:

Your right in that it shouldnt have been neglected and it was kinda part of the identity of the place I suppose and its a bit like the quay has lost its centrepiece and lost whatever quaintness it had left. But if it was unsafe then it was unsafe and needed to be removed.

As for the high price of scrap, the cost to cut it up by professionals would easily match it I reckon. Your paying for time/gas/transport and all manner of other stuff. Whats scrap now 150 a tonne ? Less ? If it was a case of let a van load of travellers at it for the day you'd make a few quid but to have it done right and safe with all that goes with it I'd reckon it would be costly.

Its a pity its gone but I dont think it was wrong to take it down for safety reasons.

David900

Judgement Day wrote: »

Seems to me that you should know something about the topic before posting.

Must be both blissfully ignorant on the subject so.

Judgement Day

David900 wrote: »

Must be both blissfully ignorant on the subject so.

I have been involved in Transport Preservation since the late 1970s and have produced two guidebooks that included the Guillemot Lightship in them - what have you produced on the subject?

patff

thedarkroom wrote: »

The place needs a few 'attractions',

What would you like exactly.............a "Mackerel Fun Park" perhaps. Or maybe a themed fishing pub, with a few sullen fishermen giving you dirty looks. Oh wait, they used to have one of those, but it shut up shop.

Mahatma coat

Judgement Day wrote: »

I very much doubt that it cost more to cut up that its scrap value given the current high price of scrap. It was one of a very few tourist attractions in the South East - neglected and all as it was - and it should never have ended up dumped at Kilmore Quay. As for the idiotic comment by one poster that they still build similar ships........:rolleyes:

The way I heard it the guy who contracted to remove it F***ed up royally in his estimations, They had a crane there for Weeks, which they had budgeted for a few days, he also got scalded by the fact that the lower portion of it was filled with concrete, I think he had intended to remove it down to that and bury the rest, but he had to kango it all out.

David900

Judgement Day wrote: »

I have been involved in Transport Preservation since the late 1970s and have produced two guidebooks that included the Guillemot Lightship in them - what have you produced on the subject?

Right well that put me in my place

The idiotic comment part is quite harsh and unjust though.
I'm not an expert of transport by any means but I am a typical person that a tourist attraction should be targeting so my views on it should be the same as anyones.

In my eyes the ship was not an unique piece apart from the lighthouse on top. I would have liked to see that section preserved myself.
You might be able to point out points on how the ship was unique but I don't think it was a large enough attraction for a small village like Kilmore.

WexfordWarrior

i thought this was a real shame as well... one of my earliest memories in this life was my mam taking me down along the woodenworks years ago when i was about 3 or 4 and i stopped by that ship and was amazed by it...also met the ships "captain" and got on the boat for a bit...was always fascinated by the tower on it and used to think about the boat being on the high sea's and someone up there looking out from the "watch out tower" .... oh the innocence!

but i was also fairly upset it was taken out of wexford harbour in the first place... it was a real iconic part of the quay at one time but i guess with the new work they did there it didnt fit into the moderisation of some peoples plans!

klong

Judgement Day wrote: »

No it obviously wasn't - Ireland is littered with preserved 90 year old lightships and maritime museums. :rolleyes:

Thanks for that useful comment.

Now care to enlighten us as to why it was of historical significance and should have been preserved?

Judgement Day

klong wrote: »

Thanks for that useful comment.

Now care to enlighten us as to why it was of historical significance and should have been preserved?

I don't why I'm bothering to answer this as you being a 'professional' museum employee obviously know far more than me about preservation.

The Guillemot was the only lightship accessible to the general public on the island of Ireland.

It was one of only three maritime museums in the country.

It was an historic item of maritime interest.


Link here to an interesting lightship website: http://feuerschiffseite.de/startgb.htm#back

As far as I've been able to establish, aside from the 'Petrel' lightship which is now the club house for the Down Cruising Club, the Guillemot was the only intact lightship in the country. The 'Albatross' currently dumped near the East Link Bridge had its light removed -now on display in Arklow.


The 'Albatross' light on display in Arklow. Photo: Peter Goulding

Another former Irish lightship 'Osprey' is a floating restaurant in Paris dispensing 'British' pub grub - the mind boggles.



The 'Osprey' now moored on the Seine in Paris.

Anyway, the demise of the 'Guillemot' underlines yet again the woeful state of transport preservation in the Republic of Ireland and it shouldn't be left to a handful of individuals to run themselves ragged trying to do what the State are incapable of doing.