for all the deise 2 wheeled community this sunday

seanybiker

Cabaal wrote: »

and you've noted that already alright, my point being if its not about lights and most bikes can't turn off lights anyway then why include it as something not wanted on posters etc?

Why not use poster and campaign space for the stuff that actually matters and you have an actual real issue with such as say roadside diags?

I totally agree with you. Can't understand the light thing being on the poster.
Having lights on isn't really the "man" sticking two fingers up at us Bikers. The roadside diag should have taking up most of the posters.imo

daenerysstormborn3

Potential-Monke wrote: »

I'm with Cabaal on this one, always on headlights should be mandatory for every single driver out there, and not just motorcyclists. Partially agree to the high visibility part too, in fairness most bike accidents are caused by motorists who didn't see the biker, so more visibility would be a good thing... Now if only herself would let me get one!

So you admit that most bike accidents are caused by motorists who didn't see the biker, yet the onus should be put on the biker not the blind idiot who somehow managed to get a driving licence?

two wheels good wrote: »

I read comments about this but have searched relevant documents and websites and found no such proposal. I only found info on On-Board Diagnostics
There is NO proposal to fit ride history recording devices to motorcycles.

On-Board Diagnostics (OBD)amounts to warning lights to tell the rider a failure of equipment has occurred. e.g. ABS failure, brake light failure



There is NO proposal to mandate retro-fitment of ABS.
As I understand the proposal is for ABS to be fitted on all new bikes over 125cc

Of course ABS and ODB is going to push up prices

OBD will take note of everything including speeds and emissions, these may be used down the line to prosecute people for something they're not actually caught doing and to bring in a system for taxing bikes on scale depending on the engine size.

two wheels good wrote: »

Type approval , and any ban on modification is an outrageous proposal. That's why I'll be protesting tomorrow.

The ban on 7 (or 8) year old bikes in urban is not an EU proposal. It's a domestic French initiative . Utterly ridiculous.
I find it hard to imagine it could get EU-wide support, but who knows with the eurocrats.

The ban on bikes over 7 years is a domestic French proposal but if it gets passed there it's only a matter of time before other countries see the example and follow suit.

Cabaal wrote: »

Insanely stupid thing for anyone to do if this is true, not to mention very much illegal. Not exactly something that will make anyone want to support you either.

Yes, that's why there was hundreds of arrests today :rolleyes:

daenerysstormborn3

Cabaal wrote: »

No to always on headlights???......yeah smart.
All motorist traffic incl cars, trucks should have headlights on when moving, it makes them much more visible.

Either this riders right protest is the biggest troll ever on the Waterford forum or you people appear have no common sense,

The reason why we are against the always on dipped headlights for all vehicles is because bikes will once again just blend in with all other road users. People constantly complain about not being able to see us (because apparently blind people are allowed obtain a driving licence) yet the one thing that makes us more visible than other road users is always on dipped headlights (which is not optional on most bikes, I can't turn the lights off on my bike).

You people?? You are some piece of work.

chelloveks

Why do we all just support banning all bikes over 70ccs and bring back them red Honda scooters everyone had in the 60's. Could get some traction especially since nobody can afford a real bike in this fookin economy!

seanybiker

chelloveks wrote: »

Why do we all just support banning all bikes over 70ccs and bring back them red Honda scooters everyone had in the 60's. Could get some traction especially since nobody can afford a real bike in this fookin economy!

Quiet you.

Saying that, honda 50's are some laugh.

daenerysstormborn3

We should all get Honda Zoomers. Get some mileage out of a tank of petrol on them!

seanybiker

pixiebean22 wrote: »

We should all get Honda Zoomers. Get some mileage out of a tank of petrol on them!

haha Hilton used to have one of them badboys out there. always wanted a go of it for the laugh.

chelloveks

When the first gas crisis hit us in NYC in '75 I bought a 500 cc Yamaha thumper single cylinder street bike to commut to work n school. Filled the tank for about 3 dollars and it would run for a week. And the little thing had balls too! Even back then it was the law for all bike to have lights on at all times. Ahh the good old days....little flask in the saddle bags...

seanybiker

chelloveks wrote: »

When the first gas crisis hit us in NYC in '75 I bought a 500 cc Yamaha thumper single cylinder street bike to commut to work n school. Filled the tank for about 3 dollars and it would run for a week. And the little thing had balls too! Even back then it was the law for all bike to have lights on at all times. Ahh the good old days....little flask in the saddle bags...

Deadly. Must have been some thumper alright. Single cylinder 500cc. Sounds fun.

200motels

pixiebean22 wrote: »

The reason why we are against the always on dipped headlights for all vehicles is because bikes will once again just blend in with all other road users. People constantly complain about not being able to see us (because apparently blind people are allowed obtain a driving licence) yet the one thing that makes us more visible than other road users is always on dipped headlights (which is not optional on most bikes, I can't turn the lights off on my bike).

You people?? You are some piece of work.

So according to your argument we the car drivers should leave our lights off even in the dark so we can see the bikes. Because in the dark lights blend in even more than in daylight. Your argument is foolish to the extreme.

giles lynchwood

Well first of all our proxy government will do as they are told by the people who control our purse string´s and second,looks like the Kraut´s want everybody riding BMW´S.
Paybacks are a Bitch:mad:

daenerysstormborn3

200motels wrote: »

So according to your argument we the car drivers should leave our lights off even in the dark so we can see the bikes. Because in the dark lights blend in even more than in daylight. Your argument is foolish to the extreme.

Yes, that's exactly what I said so that must be exactly what I meant, well done :rolleyes:

200motels

pixiebean22 wrote: »

Yes, that's exactly what I said so that must be exactly what I meant, well done :rolleyes:

Your argument is mute.

two wheels good

Cabaal wrote: »

This honestly makes no sense, so whilst you admit that there are perfectly legit and reasonable requests being made you lump them in with others and reject them all.

You're referring my earlier statement:
"Some of the proposals e.g. light-on , hi viz, may seem sensible and not very onerous to some riders but this is a time for the motorcycle community to show solidarity and to resist ALL this unnecessary meddling."

Solidarity is needed because quibbling over the relative importance of individual proposals will only dilute the effect of the protest.

I usually wear hi-viz and usually ride with my headlight on in the hope that it may have some benefit - but I certainly don't rely on it. Some riders agree with this policy and some don't.
I don't believe someone should be criminalised for forgetting or refusing to put on a hi-viz jacket.
I also object to the implication that the problem of drivers failing to see motorcyclists is somehow the bikers' fault.
I'd like Garda time to be spent on more serious infringements of the law - e.g use of hand held phones

My last close call was on bright day, long straight rural road. The driver pulled out from the left. We were the only two vehicles on the road. I was on a large yellow bike , headlight-on , wearing a hi-viz AND sounding my horn. No advantage was provided by hi-viz or headlight.

Any objection to headlights on is already probably futile. The manufacturers have already decided on that.

two wheels good

pixiebean22 wrote: »

OBD will take note of everything including speeds and emissions, these may be used down the line to prosecute people for something they're not actually caught doing and to bring in a system for taxing bikes on scale depending on the engine size.

That's what I thought too - initially. But I've searched and found no documents that state OBD will record previous riding history.

RighttoRide.eu website has been useful. For example:
http://www.righttoride.eu/regulationdocuments/WheatfromtheChaff100911.pdf

Potential-Monke

pixiebean22 wrote: »

So you admit that most bike accidents are caused by motorists who didn't see the biker, yet the onus should be put on the biker not the blind idiot who somehow managed to get a driving licence?

I do admit it, and it is a fact, but just because other motorists are the cause of the accidents does not mean that entire blame should be on the driver. The majority yes, but bikers have to work with them to make them more visible. And not all bikers are angels on the road, and i know, having a biker family. We need to work together, and if that means bikers have to wear higher visibility clothing then so be it.

Yes, that's why there was hundreds of arrests today :rolleyes:

Regardless if there were no arrests, it's still a stupid thing to do and puts a negative light on the protest. Ye get a hard enough time as it is from other motorists, doing things like blocking traffic on a dual carrigway is adding fuel to the fire.

Overall, i believe it was a success here in Waterford, a very good turnout and not too much disruption which is good for both sides.

And i have just one suggestion for bikes, how about a certain coloured DDL's? Having a strip or 2 of green DDL's on the front of the bike would let motorists know that it's a bike and not a car with one headlight?

chelloveks

seanybiker wrote: »

Deadly. Must have been some thumper alright. Single cylinder 500cc. Sounds fun.

Jaaaaysus that was my favorite bike of all time except your nuts were numb within an hour of riding! Loved that bike in Manhattan. Could go between the lanes with ease, was really lightweight. Might get another one of them with the price of gas, and yours is twice as high!

daenerysstormborn3

Potential-Monke wrote: »

I do admit it, and it is a fact, but just because other motorists are the cause of the accidents does not mean that entire blame should be on the driver. The majority yes, but bikers have to work with them to make them more visible. And not all bikers are angels on the road, and i know, having a biker family. We need to work together, and if that means bikers have to wear higher visibility clothing then so be it.

Regardless if there were no arrests, it's still a stupid thing to do and puts a negative light on the protest. Ye get a hard enough time as it is from other motorists, doing things like blocking traffic on a dual carrigway is adding fuel to the fire.

Overall, i believe it was a success here in Waterford, a very good turnout and not too much disruption which is good for both sides.

And i have just one suggestion for bikes, how about a certain coloured DDL's? Having a strip or 2 of green DDL's on the front of the bike would let motorists know that it's a bike and not a car with one headlight?

Where are your suggestions for all the other road users then? We can't really work together if it's just us that are being targeted.

It's very amusing how you are proposing we do something to our bikes so motorists know that it's a bike and not a car with one headlight :rolleyes: How about all road users maintain their vehicles properly?! I believe that lights are something that are supposed to be checked on a car before every time it goes out on the road?

Potential-Monke

pixiebean22 wrote: »

Where are your suggestions for all the other road users then? We can't really work together if it's just us that are being targeted.

It's very amusing how you are proposing we do something to our bikes so motorists know that it's a bike and not a car with one headlight :rolleyes: How about all road users maintain their vehicles properly?! I believe that lights are something that are supposed to be checked on a car before every time it goes out on the road?

Yes, it is, and it's up to the Gardai to enforce that, but it's something that i believe that rarely gets a conviction due to the excuse that it may have only happened 1 mile back the road.

If someone on a bike nearly gets taken out of it by another motorist, they should be willing to take the reg and make a complaint to the Gardai, but also willing to go to court with the complaint if necessary. Unless a Garda witnesses something themselves they can't go through with a prosecution without a witness.

I can't see what more can be done for to get motorists to help the situation, it's going to take complaints against them to get other motorists to be more aware. The driving test is a joke in fairness, anyone with an attention span of 15 minutes should be able to pass it. But it doesn't take into account other road users really. In a perfect world there would be a simulation test which would throw random "think-fast" moments, but that will never happen.

I'd just like to let it be known also that i'm not anti-biker. I love bikes, my father was a biker, i've 2 brothers who are members of an MCC, and another who used to be but got a different interest now. All 4 of them have been knocked off their bikes. One brother had a broken ankle, the other had his spine saved by the lead in the back of his jacket. I know all too well the dangers facing bikers on the road. But if there is any way to make it safer for them then i'm all for it, and if that includes suggestions to make them more visible then i'm all for that too.

daenerysstormborn3

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Yes, it is, and it's up to the Gardai to enforce that, but it's something that i believe that rarely gets a conviction due to the excuse that it may have only happened 1 mile back the road.

If someone on a bike nearly gets taken out of it by another motorist, they should be willing to take the reg and make a complaint to the Gardai, but also willing to go to court with the complaint if necessary. Unless a Garda witnesses something themselves they can't go through with a prosecution without a witness.

I can't see what more can be done for to get motorists to help the situation, it's going to take complaints against them to get other motorists to be more aware. The driving test is a joke in fairness, anyone with an attention span of 15 minutes should be able to pass it. But it doesn't take into account other road users really. In a perfect world there would be a simulation test which would throw random "think-fast" moments, but that will never happen.

If I was to take the reg of every motorist that I have a close call with everyday then I'd have a notebook full at the end of each day. I wish I was exaggerating and I wish I was being over the top but that is the reality of it. Aside from that, it's not exactly convenient to whip out your pen and jotter while driving a motorbike, particularly while trying to control your motorbike around some of the idiots on the road.

The test for your bike covers both car and bike questions, the same cannot be said of the car test.

wellboytoo

Monday 26th September, 2011. Dear ,You have probably noticed some references in the national media recently about new EU regulations, around vehicle maintenance, that are being proposed for motorcycles. In addition the RSA’s plan to introduce a requirement for motorcyclists to wear high visibility material, which is currently a requirement for leaner motorcyclists, has also been discussed.I would like to take this opportunity to brief you on the EU’s plans, which I must stress are not RSA proposals and separately the RSA’s plans re hi-vis jackets.EU Proposals
In summary the proposed Regulation presents a legal framework for the type approval and market surveillance of two and three wheel vehicles and quadricycles. It will replace the existing framework Directive (2002/24/EC) and it’s 13 associated directives with one Regulation supported by three delegated acts. The main emphasis of the proposal is to; · improve safety, · improve the environment, · provide easier access to repair and maintenance information· simplify the type approval process· Implement market surveillance (to support recalls etc) The draft Regulations include requirements for ABS and CBS (Combined Braking Systems) to improve safety in emergency braking situations. The anti-tampering of the vehicles engine and drive-train will help ensure that vehicle safety is not compromised by increasing the vehicle’s performance capabilities above their design limits and such measures will also protect the environment. Manufacturers will be obliged to provide repair and maintenance information to non-franchise operators in the repair business which will ensure fairer competition and which will ultimately benefit the vehicle owner through reduced servicing and repair costs. In addition access to such information will also benefit manufacturers who wish to make replacement parts for these vehicles. Motor cyclists should benefit from improvements in the time in getting new vehicles to the market through simplification of the type approval process and when the vehicles are in use owners will also benefit from having a market surveillance system which will promote recalls of dangerous or problematic vehicles. Overall the proposed Regulation is expected to benefit both the safety of the biker, other road users and the environment. RSA Proposal
It is currently the case that all learner motorcyclists must wear a high visibility ‘Tabard’ displaying an ‘L’ plate, rather than on the vehicle.In relation to the rest of the motorcycling population the RSA has provided tens of thousands of high visibility jackets free of charge to motorcyclists, over the last number of years. This has included the provision of jackets (zipped up variety rather than Velcro jackets) at motorcycle shows, through the An Garda Siochana Bike Safe scheme and through the Bike Buyers Guide.In addition the RSA has circulated close to one million high visibility jackets and arm bands to other vulnerable road users (pedestrians and cyclists) in the last five years.The RSA is very pleased with the large numbers of vulnerable road users who voluntarily wear such jackets in order to increase their visibility and safety when using the roads.The RSA also runs many other special campaigns to promote motorcycle safety. Chief among them is our current TV campaign ‘Underneath’, produced by the DOE in Northern Ireland, which is designed to educate other road users, particularly car drivers, to be on the look-out for motorcyclists when exiting minor roads, or at junctions, intersections and when turning right. A failure to see a motorcyclist when performing such manoeuvres is one of the main causes of fatal and serious injury among motorcyclists. While other drivers need to pay far greater attention to the presence of motorcyclists on the road, motorcyclists should do all they can to increase their visibility on the roads. This can be done by using daytime running lights and wearing reflective or high visibility material.As part of its Motorcycle Safety Strategy 2011 to 2014 the RSA intends to seek the introduction of mandatory wearing of hi-vis material by all motorcyclists, in 2014. This will be subject to consultation with motorcyclists and industry on the most appropriate type of hi-vis material and possible solutions.Should you require additional information on the proposed Regulation or indeed any other matter relating to motorcycle safety please do not hesitate in contacting the RSA on 1890 50 60 80 or by emailing info@rsa.ie.Kind regardsNoel BrettChief Executive Officer

wellboytoo

The previous message is posted for clarity. as the whole thread seems to be based on rumour ,Duirt Bean liom go duirt Bean lei!!!

cococoady

Would it be worth having a different colour headlight for each vehicle. 4 wheel motors have white and 2/3 wheels motors have yellow lights (or a colour that is distinguishable from white but that also lights up the road properly for the user)
Just a thought

seanybiker

cococoady wrote: »

Would it be worth having a different colour headlight for each vehicle. 4 wheel motors have white and 2/3 wheels motors have yellow lights (or a colour that is distinguishable from white but that also lights up the road properly for the user)
Just a thought

Yellow wont go with my bike though. Maybe blue

chelloveks

seanybiker wrote: »

Yellow wont go with my bike though. Maybe blue

Blue would clash with my hivis thong though.....perhaps fuscia....yea, up the fuscia....

daenerysstormborn3

chelloveks wrote: »

Blue would clash with my hivis thong though.....perhaps fuscia....yea, up the fuscia....

fuschia will clash with my red bike though

two wheels good

Cabaal wrote: »

I'm sorry but I honestly can't support a campaign that puts choice into such things as having lights on when the engine is running, its as foolish as the campaigns years ago to have seatbelts as optional for people.

No it's not. There was very reliable and convincing evidence that use of seat belts would reduce injuries and save lives.