Centre fire pistols?

dax121

yes so u cant sub a CF pistol hence all the ****.
some just made a cock up and issued it. pity u didnt find the one in the country first instead of import

Cass

Well technically i wasn't refused, but it was strongly suggested to me to NOT apply for the sub again. If successful it would be deemed as a new license and come the new legislation i would loose it.

Bananaman

Ironically, ezri, yours is one of the good news stories, with a happy ending - they are a rare fish - most were not and have had to go the legal route to try to get theirs back

I have a Glock 34 and I remember people telling me I should switch it as that is all I was allowed do - but I like shooting it and am ok with it and wanted to keep it so I applied and got my license

I also have two restricted rifles (a .38 and a buckmark - restricted by incompetence alone)

I also have a Browning Buckmark Pistol but alas coukd not get a restricted license and am liimited to 5 shots per mag, for.the greater good, mar ya

A 6th round in the buckmark 22 pistol wiuld have made me a menace to society but the 9mm pistol, the 22 rifle and the '38 are ok.

There are more fish tales ariund this subject than I care to count - 'I heard .....', etc. Its good to hear a good one which starts with 'I did .......'

on the jubject of what date and whether it was before or after the chief supers breakfast - I would, personally, not get into specifics in matters like that

There is a tendency, here on boards, for people to tear a piece of good news to bits to the degree where people are made to feel guilty for succeeding - its not right

An individuals license is a matter for them and their super and not for the rest of us.

An individuals refusal, on the other hand, generally seems to be a part of a policy which, in my opinion, makes it fair game.

B'Man

Cass

Bananaman wrote: »

Ironically, ezri, yours is one of the good news stories, with a happy ending - they are a rare fish - most were not and have had to go the legal route to try to get theirs back

While i understand that my situation had a happy ending with not as much fuss as others, it did not come easy either. Months upon months of arguing providing paperwork, meeting, chasing up Gardai that had retired to get a letter signed by them, etc.

on the jubject of what date and whether it was before or after the chief supers breakfast - I would, personally, not get into specifics in matters like that

There is a tendency, here on boards, for people to tear a piece of good news to bits to the degree where people are made to feel guilty for succeeding - its not right

I think too many people are picking me up wrong here, and even with me stating thats not my intention allow me to say it again to clarify.

I'm delighted for dax121. I wish there were more like him. However my curiosity, eagerness to find out the details of how, etc came across as an "inquisition". Also if a person can get a restricted license, even for a .22, then it opens up things slightly for others.

An individuals license is a matter for them and their super and not for the rest of us.

Then, with all due respect, if its a matter you'd rather keep private perhaps Boards is not to place to discuss it at all. I have noticed over the last two years that when questions, polls, etc come up about pistols, locations, amounts granted per county there is very little to no answers because people are hestitant to reveal whether they got theirs, got it easily, etc. And thats fair enough, but if you're willing to come on and say you got X or Y then realistically you need to be prepared for questions from others.

I have no issue with discussing my situation. Its not as easy as some nor as difficult as others, but it shows people another route that had to be taken to get a license. Also the Gardai are well aware of my situation as i dealt with them on the matter. It comes back to our attitude of "tell them nothing, its none of anyone's business".

An individuals refusal, on the other hand, generally seems to be a part of a policy which, in my opinion, makes it fair game.

B'Man

Thats a shame though. If people got a license they should be able to come on here and post about it. Half the problems we have are if we get good news we hide it for fear someone will see it and take away the license (exaggerating there, but you get the idea). This leaves us with nothing but a long list of trouble stories, and horror situations, and it makes for discvouraging reading from a newbie perspective.

Sometimes its nice to read or hear a good news story.

Anyway, i apologise to dax121 as it seems my questions have come across as inqusitionional (for want of a better word), but genunely that was not my intention.

Bananaman

Ezridax wrote: »

......
Thats a shame though. If people got a license they should be able to come on here and post about it. Half the problems we have are if we get good news we hide it for fear someone will see it and take away the license (exaggerating there, but you get the idea).
.....

Right on the money.

rowa

You say we don't hear about the good news , but from my experience there is very little good news concerning pistols about, all except two or three individuals i know have had their licences refused for centrefire or rimfire pistols and have either had to go down the district court route or appeal directly to the gardai.
Dealing with the gardai is a tedious and frustrating task , i rang the firearms policy unit today to ask for clarification about the legality of my revolver for which i am seeking a licence and was told it was restricted for too reasons, it is six shot where as it should be only five, and secondly the barrel is 170mm where as it should be a maximum of 100mm according to the si ! I'll get the hacksaw out.

Cass

rowa wrote: »

You say we don't hear about the good news , but from my experience there is very little good news concerning pistols about, all except two or three individuals i know have had their licences refused for centrefire or rimfire pistols and have either had to go down the district court route or appeal directly to the gardai.

I'm not defending the numbers, its terrible so many have lost their licenses, but there are currently 400 or so licensed pistols out there whether they are restricted or not. I'm just saying we only hear of the refusals, it'd be nice to hear about someone who got theirs or kept it.

Dealing with the gardai is a tedious and frustrating task , i rang the firearms policy unit today to ask for clarification about the legality of my revolver for which i am seeking a licence and was told it was restricted for too reasons, it is six shot where as it should be only five, and secondly the barrel is 170mm where as it should be a maximum of 100mm according to the si ! I'll get the hacksaw out.

This is were knowing the law is handy. I think they are wrong if they told you that. The law says a short firearm is a firearm that does not exceed 30cm or 60cm with any detachable componant. Also to be unrestricted it cannot be shorter than 10cm.
SI 337/2009

other firearms using 0.22 inch long rifle rim fire percussion
ammunition provided that the maximum magazine
capacity of such a firearm does not exceed five
rounds and that the barrel length of the firearm is
greater than 10 cm.”.

None of them say it has to be a maximum of 10cm. If that were the case then all Olympic, Hammerli, Xesse, Ruger, Buckmark, and pretty much every other .22 on the famous list would be restricted as most are over 10cm in length. Plus look at Sig Mosquitos. They are also licensed and have a 3.9 inch barrel.

rowa

I had the si in front of me ezridax and knew he was talking crap , but it is shocking you can ring a firearms policy unit and no one apparently knows the rules or anything about firearms , typical irish logic strikes again.
He also told me the s+w 617 is a restricted firearm no matter what is done to it so i don't know. I'd have been better off ringing the speaking clock.

Cass

Did you mention or quote the SI to them? Did they still argue the point after you done this?

I'm surprised at the FPU being like this. I've had dealings with them and they have always been helpful and the info given by them was on the money.

As to the S&W 617. The 10 round thing is an issue. I know of 2 lads, and heard of one other that was refused a license, and wouldn't even have their application accepted for similar pistols even when given documentation by the manufacturer to say the extra cylinders would be plugged permanently.

rowa

Ezridax wrote: »

Did you mention or quote the SI to them? Did they still argue the point after you done this?

I'm surprised at the FPU being like this. I've had dealings with them and they have always been helpful and the info given by them was on the money.

As to the S&W 617. The 10 round thing is an issue. I know of 2 lads, and heard of one other that was refused a license, and wouldn't even have their application accepted for similar pistols even when given documentation by the manufacturer to say the extra cylinders would be plugged permanently.

I asked them was it the new policy that handguns be as short as possible and he grudgingly accepted a mistake was made , they weren't helpful and i certainly won't bother with them again.

tac foley

rowa wrote: »

I'd have been better off ringing the speaking clock.

Don't know about that, every time I call them up I get a different answer...

tac

dax121

rowa wrote: »

He also told me the s+w 617 is a restricted firearm no matter what is done to it so i don't know. I'd have been better off ringing the speaking clock.

they make it up as they go along the 617 is on the list for suitable olympic standard pistols. as long as it hold only 5 rounds its non restricted. so if you have 1 chamber or 5 plugged its still un restricted. its in the new guidelines in black and white.
the sooner ireland gets a independant body over the firearms and take the decisions away from the gardi the better. once you tick all the box's you should get ur firearm. and its not up to ur super or CS personal opinions it will be the same all across the board.
but again i couldnt see a body set up like this anytime soon :mad:
forgot to say i have a unrestricted 617 5shot as do 2 others in the club.

rowa

The whole thing is a dogs breakfast and also a postcode lottery , in some areas a super/chief super will give you something that in an other area is a no no.
It should be the same as germany , the police do the background checks etc and after that its an office staffed by civilians who complete the licencing process.
Whatever idiot came up with this restricted/non restricted thing should be ashamed of themselves.

dax121

rowa wrote: »

It should be the same as germany , the police do the background checks etc and after that its an office staffed by civilians who complete the licencing process

same as what im on about in the above post. i couldnt see it happening tho :mad:
hopefully the minister will re do the firearms act at some stage soon and maybe take some ideas from the shooters. or maybe go to some other goverment to see how they go about firearms licenceing. ie civilans who complete the licencing process after back round checks

Bananaman

Depending on which 'civilians' are running it you could have the same problem

At the moment licensing is catered for by the justice dept under the 'Criminal' justice laws

That, IMHO, is the nub of the issue - its a sports matter (albeit with security concerns) not a criminal issue

B'Man

dax121

Bananaman wrote: »

Depending on which 'civilians' are running it you could have the same problem QUOTE]

yes but it would be the same for everyone right across the board. once you tick all the boxs and prove that you need the firearm you wouls get it. not like here where a guY in the club i know gets a .38 spl for his first rifle 1984c. and i have to wait and battle for 9 months before i get mine. and i did tick all the boxs. this panel of civilans lets say would be instructed its the same for everyone and it would led to a fairer and better licenceing system
just my opinion on it im sure alot will disagree

Bananaman

dax121 wrote: »

Bananaman wrote: »

Depending on which 'civilians' are running it you could have the same problem

yes but it would be the same for everyone right across the board. once you tick all the boxs and prove that you need the firearm you wouls get it. not like here where a guY in the club i know gets a .38 spl for his first rifle 1984c. and i have to wait and battle for 9 months before i get mine. and i did tick all the boxs. this panel of civilans lets say would be instructed its the same for everyone and it would led to a fairer and better licenceing system
just my opinion on it im sure alot will disagree

Oh - I agree - 100% - I am just cynical, old and cranky.

There are too many little hitlers (aswell as a few big ones) who would love the "power" of people having to come to them with cap in hand, kiss the ring and be beholding to them should they get what they want. (Irish Politics 101)

There was a tentative attempt at this (taking advice from the people that know that is) with the FCP but it was just another ring kissing exercise - with a cherry picked panel of well skilled ring kissers and whole swathes of the shooting community explicitly excluded. The whole thing only met twice as far as I know - both photo ops for the man with the ring.

Now - don't get me wrong, everyone was, of course, "represented" - and that is why things are going so well. (just cynical, old and cranky) and we have hundreds before the courts.

I would be wary of people who would want such a role (they tend to be a bit too fond of the boot polish)

B'Man

tac foley

rowa wrote: »

It should be the same as germany , the police do the background checks etc and after that its an office staffed by civilians who complete the licencing process.

Same here in UK. You fill out the form and send it to the county police HQ firearms and explosives licensing department. The police do their bit and then the civilian staff do theirs. If all is good, then the Chief Constable of the county signs your ticket, and off you go to the gun dealers...

The premise behind it all is simple - if you have good reason to own a firearm, then the Chief constable SHALL issue the relevant license to you.

BTW, in the county in which I live in rural eastern England, which has a population of just over half a million, there are 30,644 shotguns and 7576 Section 1 firearms.

tac

Sparks

Bananaman wrote: »

There are too many little hitlers (aswell as a few big ones) who would love the "power" of people having to come to them with cap in hand, kiss the ring and be beholding to them should they get what they want. (Irish Politics 101)
There was a tentative attempt at this (taking advice from the people that know that is) with the FCP but it was just another ring kissing exercise - with a cherry picked panel of well skilled ring kissers and whole swathes of the shooting community explicitly excluded. The whole thing only met twice as far as I know - both photo ops for the man with the ring.

Seriously?
You're going to post that?
With a straight face?
How short do you think our memories are, exactly?

Sparks

tac foley wrote: »

The premise behind it all is simple - if you have good reason to own a firearm, then the Chief constable SHALL issue the relevant license to you.

That's the main source of our difficulties in most of the cases where there are difficulties - our law says SHALL NOT UNLESS, rather than SHALL IF. And it's one of the few places where SHALL is used at all - most of the time it's MAY.

rowa

Sparks wrote: »

Seriously?
You're going to post that?
With a straight face?
How short do you think our memories are, exactly?

+1

tac foley

I like Oregon better.

1. Be over 21.

2. No felony convictions.

3. No outstanding warrants from any other state.

4. All you then need then are two pieces of plastic....

a. Your Oregon state driver's licence, and....

b. Your Visa card.

And that's it.

tac

rowa

Yes tac but thats a decently run country for people who demand decent public services, we're a country that thought voting for bertie ahern and fianna fail would be good for the economy and then dermot AHern got the ministry for justice position......

Bananaman

Sparks wrote: »

Bananaman wrote: »

There are too many little hitlers (aswell as a few big ones) who would love the "power" of people having to come to them with cap in hand, kiss the ring and be beholding to them should they get what they want. (Irish Politics 101)
There was a tentative attempt at this (taking advice from the people that know that is) with the FCP but it was just another ring kissing exercise - with a cherry picked panel of well skilled ring kissers and whole swathes of the shooting community explicitly excluded. The whole thing only met twice as far as I know - both photo ops for the man with the ring.

Seriously?
You're going to post that?
With a straight face?
How short do you think our memories are, exactly?

Why not?

rowa

Bananaman wrote: »

Why not?

The words brass and neck spring to mind.

Bananaman

rowa wrote: »

Bananaman wrote: »

Why not?

The words brass and neck spring to mind.

You have piqued my interest - as a centrefire pistol owner I am perfectly entitled to comment on this and give my opinion - I don't see why not

B'Man