The Official After Hours Presidential Election Thread **POLL RESET 23/10**

owainglyndwr

dasdog wrote: »

Its popular to bash at the moment but without Fianna Fail in the mix people are actually thinking democratically regardless of the candidates qualities.

The most intriguing thing about this Presidency is the nervous expectation that a few more Skeletons will fall out of the closet before the campaign really hits the road.. Davids Wagon has already lost one Wheel .. He must be bricking it !!

Sonnenblumen

owainglyndwr wrote: »

It appears to me that Senator David Norris will be elected come Hell or High Water ,, The good people of Ireland have no concern about his major indiscretion concerning the Clemency letters and considering more and more cases of Clerical abuse are being highlighted i think the immoral 60% would rather sweep those facts under the Carpet .. The lies he has told concerning the letters and his sheer arrogance during interviews where concerns have been raised has exposed a nasty side which is unbecoming of a Presidential hopeful.

A very low bar for being disappointment.

owainglyndwr

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Have been thinking long and hard about this and was seriously considering giving MMG a preference - not #1 as that's Mickey D's - but maybe # 3. Thought about the civil rights abuses in NI and lack of protection for Nationalists - OK understand that.

Lived through the bombing campaign in England - that was a ****e time to be Irish in England but while I often encountered good intentioned ignorance, I only once encountered anti-Irish racism in person - and that person was sacked immediately. So not comfortable with anti-British diatribes by MMG supporters and comments by him calling people in the republic of Ireland West Brits people born here who have contributed via their taxes to the state.

But over the last few days one thing about MMG has begun to bother me more and more and that's the fact that he never lived or worked in the state he now seeks to become head of. It's really bothering me that he will move here if we elect him our figurehead - otherwise he'll stay put in NI.

Sure it's grand he'll take the average wage as a salary - but he never paid a brass cent in taxes to contribute towards that salary or the lovely pension he'd get when his term ends.

My work colleague was from Shankill Rd Belfast .. We were contractors working in London and worthing He married a Catholic girl from Co Cork and when he told me he was unable to return home i initially didn't believe him (This was 1986) but after conversations with his wife Kath and their friends it turned out to be true He would've been killed. Now the Guns are silent i am hoping he can return. That is one aspect of the troubles which have been forgotten by the average observer.

Its that old adage We can't change the past but we must never forget for if we do forget History has a nasty habit of repeating itself or something on those lines. Whether Martin McGuinness lives in Derry or Timbuktu if he is a strong leader and is truly able to reconcile the past then would it be fair to say he IS a worthy candidate ?

Bannasidhe

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

I see your points, but do not think a better reason would his position about the murdering of Gardai and their killers?

Someone not living in the Republic, yeah not a good thing for a President, a President who supported men who murdered Gardai and then sought for their release? That might be a tad worse.

Yes - that is also an issue but I am sick of the republican rhetoric that muddies the waters every time this - and the fact that MMG has in the past refused to recognise the State and it's judicial system - is mentioned.

No-one can deny - he has never lived here.

Bannasidhe

owainglyndwr wrote: »

Its that old adage We can't change the past but we must never forget for if we do forget History has a nasty habit of repeating itself or something on those lines.

THOSE WHO DO NOT REMEMBER THE PAST ARE CONDEMNED TO REPEAT IT.

I have it on my office wall.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Bannasidhe wrote: »

THOSE WHO DO NOT REMEMBER THE PAST ARE CONDEMNED TO REPEAT IT.

I have it on my office wall.

The problem with that is that those who do remember it frequently repeat it regardless.

owainglyndwr

Bannasidhe wrote: »

THOSE WHO DO NOT REMEMBER THE PAST ARE CONDEMNED TO REPEAT IT.

I have it on my office wall.

Sadly the Human race is not blessed with a long attention span .. We are supposed to learn by our mistakes but we never do.

dasdog

Bannasidhe wrote: »

But over the last few days one thing about MMG has begun to bother me more and more and that's the fact that he never lived or worked in the state he now seeks to become head of. It's really bothering me that he will move here if we elect him our figurehead - otherwise he'll stay put in NI.

The problem may be the two states. Take nationalism out of Irish poltics and there may be something effectiveness, we're smart enough people but our energies aren't focussed.

Bannasidhe

dasdog wrote: »

The problem may be the two states. Take nationalism out of Irish poltics and there may be something effectiveness, we're smart enough people but our energies aren't focussed.

I agree - the Partition scuppered our chances - in NI the Presbyterian majority developed a siege mentality not dissimilar to that of the Afrikaners in South Africa while in the Free State and later Republic the RC church was allowed far too much influence over civil society (which could have been prevented if the vocal Presbyterian lobby had been involved).

So in North there was an undeclared civil war between Unionist and Nationalist while in the South we endlessly re fought the civil war in every election.

Tribalism (with extra added religious bigotry) at its worst became the focus North and South.

Still would prefer to have a president with a history of actual involvement in the social, economic and political life of our damaged little republic.

My name is URL

Anyone hear the Mitchell vs McGuinness debate on the Dunphy show earlier?

http://media.newstalk.ie/listenback/32893/sunday/1/popup

Mitchell sounds like a petulant child.. classic stuff

owainglyndwr

Gay Mitchell has started his campaign ! Now that he is aware that the Polls are being unkind to him he has concentrated his campaign on attacking Martin McGuinness. His accusations are bordering on slander.

Wolfe Tone

Mitchell has lost the plot, attacking MMG wont gain him votes it will simply knock him further down peoples preferences. He made himself look like a fool.

He even made stuff up about MMGs salary, everyone knows (except gay) that abstentionist MPs don't get paid!

Lord TSC

owainglyndwr wrote: »

Gay Mitchell has started his campaign ! Now that he is aware that the Polls are being unkind to him he has concentrated his campaign on attacking Martin McGuinness. His accusations are bordering on slander.

I'm not saying I agree with the tactic but I can see why someone may think using that style of a campaign could work well for someone who is doing less than well in the polls. There's a lot of people out there, whether some want to admit it or not, who detest MMG with a vengence, and basing a campaign around trying to court those votes could bump his numbers. I don't think it will win him the election, but he'll pick up votes on it.

The Waltzing Consumer

I would have to guess that FG know that Mitchell has not a chance of winning so what I think they are doing, is playing dirty, not to win votes, but to sway voters who were thinking McGuinness but who would most likely transfer to Michael D.. People will be put off voting Mitchell of course with this stuff, but what they are saying has truth in it and that will of course stick with people. They won't want to reward FG for this, so they will back Michael D. instead.

mikom

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

I would have to guess that FG know that Mitchell has not a chance of winning so what I think they are doing, is playing dirty, not to win votes, but to sway voters who were thinking McGuinness but who would most likely transfer to Michael D.

The attack dog tactic.

The Waltzing Consumer

mikom wrote: »

The attack dog tactic.

Yeah I think so, it makes sense.

I don't find it tasteful at all, but I think it is even more condescending for SF or others to be faux outraged at this stuff whilst not batting an eye lid at the very obvious Garda killing, robbing banks, not recognising our Army or State etc. etc.

owainglyndwr

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

I'm not saying I agree with the tactic but I can see why someone may think using that style of a campaign could work well for someone who is doing less than well in the polls. There's a lot of people out there, whether some want to admit it or not, who detest MMG with a vengence, and basing a campaign around trying to court those votes could bump his numbers. I don't think it will win him the election, but he'll pick up votes on it.

Sadly thats the nature of the Beast !

mikom

?
You quoted yourself?

The Waltzing Consumer

mikom wrote: »

?
You quoted yourself?

You gotta talk with someone :pac:

The Waltzing Consumer

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

You gotta talk with someone :pac:

I agree, good point.

owainglyndwr

mikom wrote: »

?
You quoted yourself?

Sorry i was just adding another comment .. Am i supposed to use re-edit instead ?

mikom

owainglyndwr wrote: »

Sorry i was just adding another comment .. Am i supposed to use re-edit instead ?

Go with what ever you find handiest.
Go with what ever you find handiest.

owainglyndwr

mikom wrote: »

Go with what ever you find handiest.
Go with what ever you find handy

I'll start again .. Back to the script !!

Back to the topic !! Please delete queries

McGuinness will appeal to younger voters who have this rebellious streak and sing Kevin Barry and Men behind the Wire badly on a Friday night after a few Fat Frogs and After Shocks .. He will will also appeal to the lower working class who feel like the World owes them a life and there are a lot of them if they haven't emmigrated already ! I don't they'll be too concerned about Mitchell's pettiness ... Its only a Presidency for J'sus sakes...

The Waltzing Consumer

owainglyndwr wrote: »

McGuinness will appeal to younger voters who have this rebellious streak and sing Kevin Barry and Men behind the Wire badly on a Friday night after a few Fat Frogs and After Shocks .. He will will also appeal to the lower working class who feel like the World owes them a life and there are a lot of them if they haven't emmigrated already ! I don't they'll be too concerned about Mitchell's pettiness ... Its only a Presidency for J'sus sakes...

I don't think these type of people vote

owainglyndwr

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

I don't think these type of people vote

If Northern Republicans and Nationalists were allowed to vote by God they would cast their vote .. Sadly a dual National status does not afford them the right to vote .. They can play soccer for the Republic of Ireland but they can't vote .. :mad:

stonetrower

owainglyndwr wrote: »

McGuinness will appeal to younger voters who have this rebellious streak and sing Kevin Barry and Men behind the Wire badly on a Friday night after a few Fat Frogs and After Shocks .. He will will also appeal to the lower working class who feel like the World owes them a life and there are a lot of them if they haven't emmigrated already !

Im 63 and I enjoy singing. I dont need a drink to sing Kevin Barry. I am well educated. I have not got a rebellious streak. I dont know what a fat frog is. I am not a member of any political party. I am not lower working class. I do not feel that the world owes me a life. I do not need to emigrate. However, having read your post I may just vote for Martin Mc Guinness. Thanks for helping me to decide.

I did not realise that there was an upper class, champaign skinny frog swilling, God save the Queen singing, fascist political party in the republic of Ireland.
I wondered what the term West Brit meant and now I know thanks to you. :P

The Waltzing Consumer

stonetrower wrote: »

Im 63 and I enjoy singing. I dont need a drink to sing Kevin Barry. I am well educated. I have not got a rebellious streak. I dont know what a fat frog is. I am not a member of any political party. I am not lower working class. I do not feel that the world owes me a life. I do not need to emigrate. However, having read your post I may just vote for Martin Mc Guinness. Thanks for helping me to decide.

I did not realise that there was an upper class, champaign skinny frog swilling, God save the Queen singing, fascist political party in the republic of Ireland.
I wondered what the term West Brit meant and now I know thanks to you. :P

You are well educated yet you would decide your vote based on the ramblings of some stranger on the internet?

You can still go back to school at 63 ya know

alastair

Bannasidhe wrote: »

But over the last few days one thing about MMG has begun to bother me more and more and that's the fact that he never lived or worked in the state he now seeks to become head of.

ah now, he was resident in Portlaoise for a time.

stonetrower

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

You are well educated yet you would decide your vote based on the ramblings of some stranger on the internet?

You can still go back to school at 63 ya know

And study what?? How not to take serious fascist ramblings on the internet.
I had already made my mind up on who to vote for. Thought you would have seen through that?
By the way ,I and many Brits like me, know that bad deeds were done by not just the IRA. 3,300 unfortunate people lost their lives in the troubles 1,500 by the IRA and 1,800 by us Brits. The world has moved on and its time to give the peace movement a chance so that it never happens again. Ireland has a great reputation and the world loves the Irish people and its culture. Lets forgive but not forget

gigino

stonetrower wrote: »

3,300 unfortunate people lost their lives in the troubles 1,500 by the IRA and 1,800 by us Brits.

Actually the PIRA killed 49% of those in the troubles, the RIRA and INLA and UVF and UDA etc accounted for more percentages. The British army killed "only" 9%. The " Brits" did not kill 1,800....even if you include those groups who saw themselves as being loyal to Britain. Interesting statistics on http://www.wesleyjohnston.com/users/ireland/past/troubles/troubles_stats.html