Building Muscles with Protein Shakes

roberb

Have read all the threads about Protein shake but am looking for a bit of specifics.

Am 6 ft, have a soccer build and want to gain muscle around pecs, backs and bisceps. Play soccer once a week and weight train for 50 minutes twice a week (focusing on pecs, backs and bisceps).

I bought High Protein Whey shakes for 'lean muscle growth' - did not buy the Creatine one. How often to take it? It says 2-4 times a day but with the above exercise i am doing is this too much/ too little. Do i take it every morning and again during the day. And then maybe a third time on the days that i exercise...

squod

Should really post up your routine. Protein shakes supplement your protein intake.

Gingko

roberb wrote: »

Have read all the threads about Protein shake but am looking for a bit of specifics.

Am 6 ft, have a soccer build and want to gain muscle around pecs, backs and bisceps. Play soccer once a week and weight train for 50 minutes twice a week (focusing on pecs, backs and bisceps).

I bought High Protein Whey shakes for 'lean muscle growth' - did not buy the Creatine one. How often to take it? It says 2-4 times a day but with the above exercise i am doing is this too much/ too little. Do i take it every morning and again during the day. And then maybe a third time on the days that i exercise...

Only take on days of training. Your weight can determine how much you take on these training days. For muscle gain I would take 4 x 30g mixed with 200ml water each time. Or double up 2 x 60g with 400ml water. I weigh 12.5st or 80kg and that is what is recommended for me.

However you are always better off getting extra protein the natural way. Chicken fillets, tuna steaks, quinoa, eggs, beans, pulses etc. Studies have shown that too much or too little protein can lead to osteoporosis in later life. You are right not to touch creatine, awful stuff! Aimed at insecure pumped up idiots.

Tigger

Gingko wrote: »

Only take on days of training.

why

Your weight can determine how much you take on these training days. For muscle gain I would take 4 x 30g mixed with 200ml water each time. Or double up 2 x 60g with 400ml water. I weigh 12.5st or 80kg and that is what is recommended for me.

reccopmended by who?

However you are always better off getting extra protein the natural way. Chicken fillets, tuna steaks, quinoa, eggs, beans, pulses etc. Studies have shown that too much or too little protein can lead to osteoporosis in later life.

what about dead cows?
what studies

You are right not to touch creatine, awful stuff! Aimed at insecure pumped up idiots.

oh i see
creatine is naturally occuring in meat btw

Gingko

Basically don't over do it!

Gummy Panda

Gingko wrote: »

However you are always better off getting extra protein the natural way. Chicken fillets, tuna steaks, quinoa, eggs, beans, pulses etc. Studies have shown that too much or too little protein can lead to osteoporosis in later life. You are right not to touch creatine, awful stuff! Aimed at insecure pumped up idiots.

This should be interesting...

*popcorn*

Gingko

Gummy Panda wrote: »

This should be interesting...

*popcorn*

Popcorn is brain food too? Or so they say!

Tigger

who are they
how do they know?

Mellor

roberb wrote: »

Have read all the threads about Protein shake but am looking for a bit of specifics.

If you read all the threads about protein shakes, then you would of seen the aprts where all this was repeatedly covered.

Nobody can answer for you without knowing

1. What size you are (weight, not height)
2. What your training is like,
3. And, most importantly, what the rest of your diet is like.

Gingko wrote: »

Only take on days of training. Your weight can determine how much you take on these training days. For muscle gain I would take 4 x 30g mixed with 200ml water each time. Or double up 2 x 60g with 400ml water. I weigh 12.5st or 80kg and that is what is recommended for me.

How much protein a person should take via shakes is totally dependant on the the rest of their diet.

However you are always better off getting extra protein the natural way. Chicken fillets, tuna steaks, quinoa, eggs, beans, pulses etc.

Whey is not unnatural. It from milk, and actualy is a better source of protein in terms of bioavailability than some of the sources you listed.

Studies have shown that too much or too little protein can lead to osteoporosis in later life.

Define too mcuh or too little, and quote your source.

You are right not to touch creatine, awful stuff! Aimed at insecure pumped up idiots.

why is it awful.
Yuo are starting to sound like you don't really know what you are talking about and just repeating what you've heard in the gym

roberb

Chers for the replies

I am 6ft, 11& 3/4 stone

I train in gym twice a week - usual routine is 3 x 8 pull ups, 3 x 8 Olympic ring dips, 3 x 20kg kettle bell one are rows, 3 x planks with 8kg kjacket on and 1.5kg ankle weights (front plank for 10 seconds, eachside for 10 - lifting legs up and down each time), 3 x 10 chin ups.
As regards diet - muesli in morning; green salad, broccoli with pasta and salami/ham for lunch; main dinner various from Chicken breast w/potatoes and greens, Beef stir fry, sushi, salmon w/potatoes and greens, pizza.
Fruit per day: orange, apple, banana, peach, plum usually.

So with all this i am lean and skinny and would prefer to gain more muscle quicker without having to go to gym more often. Play soccer once a week also. SO presume Protein shakes may help but not sure when or how often to take...

Cheers

Scuba Ste

Protein shakes will probably help less than just eating more food generally. More protein, more carbs, more fats, just more calories.

Use the shakes around training if you want with some oats or some other carb.

The Guvnor

I did not read the whole thread.

What exactly are your goals?

To me it does not look like you are eating much tbh.

+ve calories for weight gain and you will always gain some fat.

There are no quick fixes - I've looked!:)

Do you think you are eating a lot or a little?

The weights routine looks a little lacking as well.

Whey is great - but it is just a handy source of protein.

How much should you take? That depends somedays if I am really busy I might get near all of my protein from whey shakes but that is not that often thankfully.

I prefer to aim for a 60/40 food/whey ratio or thereabouts. I look to get anywhere from 300-400g of protein per day.

Scuba Ste

The Guvnor wrote: »

I prefer to aim for a 60/40 food/whey ratio or thereabouts. I look to get anywhere from 300-400g of protein per day.

Fair amount of protein. What do you weigh?

The Guvnor

18st give or take.

roberb

I only eat when i'm hungry, don't feel the need to eat that much so not sure i want to eat more than i do presently.

Not much of a nutritionalist and am happy to just eat what i can rather than diet and eat specific amounts of carbs, protein fats etc. T

The training i do is only 30 mins per workout and cant really do more per session as arms are done after the workout and time restricted also.

Maybe the general conclusion is that the workout i am doing is keeping me lean but not really providing big muscle growth and to do this i need to workout more to build muscle rather than the current workout and a few protein shales after??

Not really happy with that if that is the case. I thought the protein shake would help more

fearcruach

roberb wrote: »

I only eat when i'm hungry, don't feel the need to eat that much so not sure i want to eat more than i do presently.

Not much of a nutritionalist and am happy to just eat what i can rather than diet and eat specific amounts of carbs, protein fats etc. T

The training i do is only 30 mins per workout and cant really do more per session as arms are done after the workout and time restricted also.

Maybe the general conclusion is that the workout i am doing is keeping me lean but not really providing big muscle growth and to do this i need to workout more to build muscle rather than the current workout and a few protein shales after??

Not really happy with that if that is the case. I thought the protein shake would help more

If you want to see muscle growth in those areas (Pecs/Biceps/Backs), I would definitely add in the bench press and deadlift to your routine.

You don't really have anything in there hitting the pecs so the bench is a must. It's a great compound exercise as well.

Duck's hoop

roberb wrote: »

Not much of a nutritionalist and am happy to just eat what i can rather than diet and eat specific amounts of carbs, protein fats etc.

The training i do is only 30 mins per workout and cant really do more per session as arms are done after the workout and time restricted also.

i need to workout more to build muscle rather than the current workout and a few protein shales after??

I thought the protein shake would help more

I think a couple people pointed out already, there's no magic bullet / powder for this.

To gain muscle you need to work hard and eat right. Shakes not going to magically give you the muscle you haven't worked for. I wouldn't say 30 mins is that much really when you think of rest between sets etc.

Like you've to earn the results, it won't happen from 30 mins and a shake. We'd all be looking great if that was the case.

The Guvnor

Rob the workout is not keeping you lean imo it is the diet.

If you want to gain weight then you will have to eat more.

This does not mean counting cals or going extreme but a lot of people feel like they eat a lot but when they look at it - it is not as much as they think.

Keeping it simple

3 x 50g whey shakes per day or 2 x 75g adds about 500cals.

Have bigger portions elsewhere and you'll see some results.

It will take time though.

RMD

Gingko wrote: »

Only take on days of training. Your weight can determine how much you take on these training days. For muscle gain I would take 4 x 30g mixed with 200ml water each time. Or double up 2 x 60g with 400ml water. I weigh 12.5st or 80kg and that is what is recommended for me.

However you are always better off getting extra protein the natural way. Chicken fillets, tuna steaks, quinoa, eggs, beans, pulses etc. Studies have shown that too much or too little protein can lead to osteoporosis in later life. You are right not to touch creatine, awful stuff! Aimed at insecure pumped up idiots.

Either you're doing a bit of trolling or you're just completely ignorant.

You don't need to take in 120g of Protein through shakes each day, if you do you're diet is in awful order and you're using your supplement as a source instead of a supplement. You don't just take it on days of training, you take it every day in order to hit your macros, the only thing that changes is what time of day you'll be taking them.

You clearly know nothing about Creatine, it's effects and it's benefits. I forget the exact percentage, but at the 2008 Olympics game a figure close to 80% (+/- 5%) used Creatine. I'd hardly consider an international athlete an "insecure pumped up idiot".

Please, don't give advice on supplementation unless you know what you're talking about, it's not helpful, it's just spreading ignorance. No offense intended.

TimeToShine

Gingko wrote: »

However you are always better off getting extra protein the natural way. Chicken fillets, tuna steaks, quinoa, eggs, beans, pulses etc. Studies have shown that too much or too little protein can lead to osteoporosis in later life. You are right not to touch creatine, awful stuff! Aimed at insecure pumped up idiots.

Creatine, not even once. i took creatine once and became addicted, you can never go back.

Mellor

roberb wrote: »

I only eat when i'm hungry, don't feel the need to eat that much so not sure i want to eat more than i do presently.

That's the problem right there. Not your fault, you jsut haven't been made aware about how the body builds muscle.

Simply put, building muscle is a response to lifting weights but muscle growth itself also consumes energy, it also requires protein. So in order to be able to grow after a workout, your body needs excess calories. This means to have to eat more than your body needs. To eat when you aren't that hungry. It's not always easy. A very rough guess, you need to aim for 3000cals a day.

Maybe the general conclusion is that the workout i am doing is keeping me lean but not really providing big muscle growth and to do this i need to workout more to build muscle rather than the current workout and a few protein shales after??

Two 30 minute workouts aren't keeping you lean. This is prob at most an extra 300 calories a week. Maybe 2% of your weekly energy consumption.

As well as eating more, you need to improve your routine. If your arms are too tired after 30mins, then you need to start working in a way that isn't arm focused.

Some pointers o nthe workouts.

1. No leg work at all. Legs are hugely important.
2. No need to do pull-ups and chin ups and ignore other areas.
3. 10 second planks aren't much use.
4. Try increase the time per session. This should be easy if you structure it right.
5. Or try going more than twice a week. Aim for at least 2-3 hours total a week, more sessions or longer session whatever works.
6. Seriously, do some leg work. This alone will make longer sessions easy to achieve

Gingko

RMD wrote: »

Either you're doing a bit of trolling or you're just completely ignorant.

You don't need to take in 120g of Protein through shakes each day, if you do you're diet is in awful order and you're using your supplement as a source instead of a supplement. You don't just take it on days of training, you take it every day in order to hit your macros, the only thing that changes is what time of day you'll be taking them.

You clearly know nothing about Creatine, it's effects and it's benefits. I forget the exact percentage, but at the 2008 Olympics game a figure close to 80% (+/- 5%) used Creatine. I'd hardly consider an international athlete an "insecure pumped up idiot".

Please, don't give advice on supplementation unless you know what you're talking about, it's not helpful, it's just spreading ignorance. No offense intended.

Hi RMD, The "pumped up idiots" statement comes across strong I know. It's not aimed at everyone! But where I am living at the moment I am surrounded by just that. Guys going to the gym and taking copious amounts of Creatine supplement. And they are pumped up and they do look ridiculous as are their insecure attitudes. You know the type? Your obviously not one of them nor are others on this thread. So apologies to you and the other guys.

I used to take protein supplements in the past. Maximuscle "Promax" to be exact. Quite a good one as they go? These days I just take it the natural / food source way, and I carry more muscle now along with having more stamina. But I did learn a lot of new recipes along the way in Asia, Indonesia and S.America. I'm a surfer by the way.

Just because Olympic athletes take Creatine supplement it does not mean their right? One is always better off in the long term to stay away from these supplements. There really not necessary. Better off with a few more cook books! The jury is always out re this topic, both for and against? I have two friends that are GP'S and recommended the natural approach to me some years ago. They were worried about the longterm effects on the internal organs and bone density as are many in the medical profession. Also many in the complimentary / alternative medical community believe that it can simply alter the overall balance in the human body and mind just like too much Fluoride can stunt the Pineal Gland.

It's early days still when you consider just how long these supplements have been around for in relation to human evolution? Maybe moderation is the key? It's up to us individually the choices we make. Mine is the natural one. Best of luck.

roberb

Cheers for the replies...

No leg work at all. Legs are hugely important.

When I say 30 min work out i mean 50 minutes with all the breaks. SO my arms are donw after 50 mins. I dont do leg work as i play soccer once a week and have very strong legs from years of running and football (35 now)

10 second planks aren't much use.

I do 10 seconds x 4 sides per plank so 40 seconds per plank. I vary this also with the exercise ball.

Have bigger portions elsewhere and you'll see some results.

Would this mean i could potentially develop a pot belly???

So looks lkike the best thing to do to get results is:
1. Increase workouts to 3 per week (50 mins)
2. 3 x 50g whey shakes per day
3. Add in the bench press and deadlift to routine
4. Eat more

Gingko

roberb, Your really not going to get the ideal program to meet your individual needs online? Maybe best to see someone qualified in person? It's easy for everyone here to tell you what to or not to do? Always need to meet the person involved to get a real picture so to speak. Good that your so inquisitive though!

The Guvnor

roberb wrote: »

Would this mean i could potentially develop a pot belly???

So looks lkike the best thing to do to get results is:
1. Increase workouts to 3 per week (50 mins)
2. 3 x 50g whey shakes per day
3. Add in the bench press and deadlift to routine
4. Eat more

If gaining weight you will gain fat - this does not mean you will be fat or get fat it is possible however!:) The aim for most is to try and gain more muscle than fat. You will get heavier but bodyfat can go down.

1. 3 weight sessions per week is good.
2. 3 shakes per day as well - space them between meals with one after your workout.
3. Do add them in but do take them seriously as they are demanding exercises and my only advice here would be never do them if in a rush - last thing you need to do is be rushing these heavier exercises etc.
4. Eat more - healthy options etc.

Give yourself 3 months and see where you are then. I think it is feasible for you to add about 14lbs in 12 weeks and to do it in a more muscle than fat manner!

Take measurements now to assess progress along the way.

What do you eat for breakfast? Do you find weetabix ok?

roberb

Cheers Guiko. Will look into a trainer. i have meant to.

Guvnor, I eat a big bowl of Alpen everymorning, a bit boring but love it.

Will try and add eggs, nuts, carrots throughout the day as a means of eating more

Duck's hoop

Throw in a litre of milk for handy cals, protein and healthy goodness.

john_cappa

Gingko wrote: »

Hi RMD, The "pumped up idiots" statement comes across strong I know. It's not aimed at everyone! But where I am living at the moment I am surrounded by just that. Guys going to the gym and taking copious amounts of Creatine supplement. And they are pumped up and they do look ridiculous as are their insecure attitudes. You know the type? Your obviously not one of them nor are others on this thread. So apologies to you and the other guys.

hahahahahaha "copious amounts of Creatine supplement"!

Do you consider creatine to be a steroid? Serious question.

Gingko wrote: »

Just because Olympic athletes take Creatine supplement it does not mean their right? One is always better off in the long term to stay away from these supplements. There really not necessary. Better off with a few more cook books! The jury is always out re this topic, both for and against? I have two friends that are GP'S and recommended the natural approach to me some years ago. They were worried about the longterm effects on the internal organs and bone density as are many in the medical profession. Also many in the complimentary / alternative medical community believe that it can simply alter the overall balance in the human body and mind just like too much Fluoride can stunt the Pineal Gland.

No the jury is not out. Its just people like you, who "heard" this from some one who knew a doctor once who said this etc......and then you spread and believe it as fact.

There are 100s if not 1000's of published peer reviewed demonstrating both its use and safety.



In other news only eat one egg per month or you will must like die of a heart attack before 30.

john_cappa

Gingko wrote: »

roberb, Your really not going to get the ideal program to meet your individual needs online? Maybe best to see someone qualified in person? It's easy for everyone here to tell you what to or not to do? Always need to meet the person involved to get a real picture so to speak. Good that your so inquisitive though!

You do not need a trainer. You do not need a specially tailored program for you. You are no different to the millions of other people training.

You need to decide your goals and read and educate yourself a little.

Paying for advice does not make it better advice.

flynmo

Well if I was you, I wudnt just focas on biceps and chest, work ur legs and triceps aswel, by doin squats in ur routine u build your overall bodies muscles and you will find yourself been more hungry therefore eating more food and then getting bigger muscles, squats are also known to make your body produce more testosterone.

gymsoldier

Gingko wrote: »

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