LIVELINE Thread - (05/10/11 to 14/02/2012)

Sunnyisland

Stripey Cat wrote: »

"These awful people"- Joe's view of the surviving victims of the Dublin and Monaghan bombings.

Or as where known as the unforgotten http://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=dublin%20monahan&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CC0QFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dublinmonaghanbombings.org%2F&ei=XLYFT-25GoewhAfJvYyoAQ&usg=AFQjCNFdIMa_P6C0ElxffF7U83tEjeNVCw, oops wrong thread.

constitutionus

furiousox wrote: »

Ha, after all Duffy's righteous indignation for the last 75 mins, did that caller just say that he had the original quote from Dugdale wrong?

i would like to hear the next line of what she said after the one duffys been quoting all day.

by hilarious if its was "im glad they didnt shoot the man like they were ordered" or something like that.

joes been VERY conspicious in only using that one line of dialogue.

guess we'll find out

bloopy

Judgement Day wrote: »

He was rushing to finish the show and garbled the awful people statement and then corrected himself but that's not good enough for the blinkered 'hate Joe brigade'. :rolleyes:

In fairness, the only one today who didnt seem like they were full of hate was the Dutch guy.

Wertz

The only time I heard Liveline cover anything to do with the 1974 bombings in the south, he was all over a few of the relatives of Dubs who were killed in Talbot St., not much time for anyone from Monaghan and certainly no discussion about the possible perpetrators behind it... and the time some months back when the UK government decided not to release all it's info on the matter, there was nothing said by Duffy or much anyone else in RTÉ bar a piece on Pat Kenny that morning.
...and I certainly don't recall any interviews with people related to those shot by the security services or loyalists in the north on the show either, over the years.

Technocentral

Happyman42 wrote: »

TG4 are doing this state some service and should be heartily congratulated.

Their documentaries are head and shoulders above RTE's by and large, as they tend to let people tell their own story and hang themselves/come across as impressive, whatever the case may be, its so easy, hackneyed and boring to just shout "why did you do that, apologise" every 2 minutes at someone, I prefer the Errol Morris/Nick Broomfield style of minimal intervention.

Sunnyisland

Technocentral wrote: »

Their documentaries are head and shoulders above RTE's by and large, as they tend to let people tell their own story and hang themselves/come across as impressive, whatever the case may be, its so easy, hackneyed and boring to just shout "why did you do that, apologise" every 2 minutes at someone, I prefer the Errol Morris/Nick Broomfield style of minimal intervention.

Agree 100 %

steelcityblues

Technocentral wrote: »

Their documentaries are head and shoulders above RTE's by and large, as they tend to let people tell their own story and hang themselves/come across as impressive, whatever the case may be, its so easy, hackneyed and boring to just shout "why did you do that, apologise" every 2 minutes at someone, I prefer the Errol Morris/Nick Broomfield style of minimal intervention.

The Anglo Irish Treaty one from last month, was highly impressive.

No forced pro or anti Treaty narrative, just clever voice reconstructions of the main people involved.

Couldn't believe RTE by contrast, largely ignoring this highly significant moment in our history.

constitutionus

Technocentral wrote: »

Their documentaries are head and shoulders above RTE's by and large, as they tend to let people tell their own story and hang themselves/come across as impressive, whatever the case may be, its so easy, hackneyed and boring to just shout "why did you do that, apologise" every 2 minutes at someone, I prefer the Errol Morris/Nick Broomfield style of minimal intervention.

theyve got some incredible archive footage as well.

the stuff mustve been lying in the bowels of montrose for decades before they came along and rooted it out for their shows.

really is astounding what they do with so little money.

Judgement Day

Wertz wrote: »

The only time I heard Liveline cover anything to do with the 1974 bombings in the south, he was all over a few of the relatives of Dubs who were killed in Talbot St., not much time for anyone from Monaghan and certainly no discussion about the possible perpetrators behind it... and the time some months back when the UK government decided not to release all it's info on the matter, there was nothing said by Duffy or much anyone else in RTÉ bar a piece on Pat Kenny that morning.
...and I certainly don't recall any interviews with people related to those shot by the security services or loyalists in the north on the show either, over the years.

You must have selective deafness or be very young then as I have heard the Dublin/Monaghan bombings covered on Liveline a number of times.

Technocentral

constitutionus wrote: »

theyve got some incredible archive footage as well.

the stuff mustve been lying in the bowels of montrose for decades before they came along and rooted it out for their shows.

really is astounding what they do with so little money.

RTE have an amazing archive of audio and film/video but choose to hardly ever use it (I'm a video editor and have used it a few times), unlike the BBC who have made loads of great programmes (especially on BBC 4) out of theirs, a bit of imagination wouldn't go amiss in there.

IvyTheTerrible

What I don't really get about the item is that we don't even know yet what slant the TG4 producers are giving these events. I doubt very much that they are going to be all-out pro IRA!

constitutionus

IvyTheTerrible wrote: »

What I don't really get about the item is that we don't even know yet what slant the TG4 producers are giving these events. I doubt very much that they are going to be all-out pro IRA!

shure thats the fun of liveline !



if this turns out to be nothing itll make the last couple of hours comedy gold !

Sunnyisland

Judgement Day wrote: »

You must have selective deafness or be very young then as I have heard the Dublin/Monaghan bombings covered on Liveline a number of times.

A number of times,.... Considering that was the biggest loss of life in the troubles/conflict and that there is a huge question mark over British Government collusion and no one was ever charged in them, and considering the amount of airtime that other incidents (always republican violence) get on liveline it is a disgrace. Joe duffy would want to leave out his personal agenda when he is broadcasting his show, its showing through to many times.

Wertz

Judgement Day wrote: »

You must have selective deafness or be very young then as I have heard the Dublin/Monaghan bombings covered on Liveline a number of times.

Have you? Myself and my mother were nearly killed in the Monaghan bombing so I pay particular attention for it's mention anywhere.

The twice I heard it covered (which I referred to in the post you quoted), Duffy was all about the dubs angle and at least one of those occasions was due to it being an anniversary (35 yrs I think) and I think the other time it was something to do with a book on the events; there was one contribution from someone in the Monaghan one...and as I already said there was little if any discussion about who or what carried them out and certainly none of the blind republican bashing that Duffy's let's fly on a regular basis.

withless

Terrible/brilliant show today.

Who is Duffy's actual commanding officer? Somebody must be his boss. He seems to be operating without a mandate.

yosser hughes

Wertz wrote: »

Have you? Myself and my mother were nearly killed in the Monaghan bombing so I pay particular attention for it's mention anywhere.

The twice I heard it covered (which I referred to in the post you quoted), Duffy was all about the dubs angle and at least one of those occasions was due to it being an anniversary (35 yrs I think) and I think the other time it was something to do with a book on the events; there was one contribution from someone in the Monaghan one...and as I already said there was little if any discussion about who or what carried them out and certainly none of the blind republican bashing that Duffy's let's fly on a regular basis.

Whilst I agree with you Wertz that there is a serious deficit in the coverage of the Dublin/Monagahan bombings the show today was about Rose Dugdale and tonights TG4 documentary. I heard her interviewed by John Murray this morning and she came across as an unapologetic,deluded fool. That aside there were atrocities on both sides and to deny that would be stupid. I have heard and seen documentaries and discussions on the Dublin /Monaghan bombings on RTE and if you reckon it does not get the coverage it deserves I wouldn't argue with you. But we are in to the realms of whataboutery here.
I think we all know Joe Duffy is an unprofessionaland biased 'broadcaster' who does not have the will or ability to chair any serious discussion properly. But we knew that before today anyway.

Wertz

Granted yosser... it was the caller toward the end that accused Duffy of dwelling on one side and on a handful of events when it comes to commentary that I was in defence of... whataboutery is in no-one's interest.
RTÉ themselves have given good coverage to the 1974 bombings in passing, I couldn't see how they wouldn't given it's impact on the country.

As for Dugdale, what does anyone expect from these people? They don't deny doing these things, and years later they don't see that they did any wrong... expecting graciousness from them is swimming against the tide. Does anyone expect her to say that the prison guards were great fellas? Or to criticise people acting in her interest?

I don't listen to Murray and that he had something on of such substance is a surprise...he didn't seem to know how to handle it. Kenny was surely a better place for her to say her piece maybe?

That doesn't take away from Duffy jumping up and down in his usual "Not in my name" fashion and calling up the same poor woman who is blinded to objectivity by her grief (and who would deny her her sense of being greatly wronged?) when there are countless other victims of republicans and loyalists. Further to that, Ms Travers had absolutely nothing to do with Dugdale...at least Tida Herrema was relevant even if it didn't go as planned.

Like I said at the very start of today's show, hatchet job. Good radio, but infuriating to hear a host that can't sit on the sidelines and let the callers air their views... I mean we all know where Joe stands.

Harry Angstrom

Leaving aside the subject matter of today's programme (which admittedly is a very emotive subject) I found Joe Duffy showed absolutely no impartiality or neutrality in the topic being discussed. I'm no IRA supporter or sympathiser (far from it) but it was plain to see that Joe was not "chairing" the discussion as he would be expected to. It very obvious to see where his emotions and his sympathies lay. Somebody posted a section of the Broadcasting Act dealing with the impartiality of presenters, which to my ears was thrown out the window by Duffy in the first 10 seconds of the show.

I remember Marian Finucane and Dave Fanning getting into hot water a few years ago following a movie review about a film dealing with the Catholic Church and a subsequent broader discussion they had about the issues that the film dealt with. That was small potatoes compared with what went on today.

Judgement Day

Joe Duffy does tend to get involved on one side or the other in most programmes - no problem as far as I'm concerned - and it makes for better listening than some prat like Matt Cooper/Boucher Hayes etc who delight in playing Devil's Advocate.

For what it's worth I don't think there is nearly enough investigative reporting on the Dublin/Monaghan bombings, the Omagh massacre etc.etc. *Post severely toned down as we all know what nutters trawl the Boards - or we should do by now.

Wertz

Judgement Day wrote: »

and it makes for better listening than some prat like Matt Cooper/Boucher Hayes etc who delight in playing Devil's Advocate.

But playing devil's advocate shows a willingness and capability to put one's own views aside and is a desirable trait in any good presenter/interviewer. If you want Bill O'Reilly type commentary then why bother having a phone-in show at all? Just stick out the soapbox there and let everyone have a go. Did anyone phone in to that show today? Sounded to me that all but the last few callers with 5 min to go were contacted by producer/research team to further the theme of indignation at the subject of, and the contributors to, the TG4 programme.

The presenters you mention are possibly as devoid of republican sentiment as Duffy, but in any interviews on that or other subjects, they can usually put that aside for the sake of an objective piece on whatever news item they're covering, even if you can hear distaste in having to do so.
Bias is not something that should be welcomed on a programme proclaiming itself as a voice of the country... it is to be expected from "callers", but fro m the host? No thanks.

neris

Fridays show freaky unfunny washed up old comedian friday? Or is it the last friday of the month?

JonathanAnon

Wertz wrote: »

The only time I heard Liveline cover anything to do with the 1974 bombings in the south, he was all over a few of the relatives of Dubs who were killed in Talbot St.

Neither Joe, nor anybody within RTE, is ever as forceful calling for the British Army/ Secret Service collusion to be fully investigated... I read Joe Tiernan's book and he seems to think that it was safer for people down South "not to find out about the extent of the collusion lest it cause a civil war...

ThisRegard

It may be a painful show today with all the pension tax avoiders ringing in about how they're now going to have to pay tax that they should have always being paying, even though they are going to be let away without it being backdated.

IvyTheTerrible

ThisRegard wrote: »

It may be a painful show today with all the pension tax avoiders ringing in about how they're now going to have to pay tax that they should have always being paying, even though they are going to be let away without it being backdated.

But they are pensioners and have paid their taxes all their lives and they are entitled to....oh wait....

SEPT 23 1989

The blue rinse posse will definitely be up in arms today

europa11

If Joe needed a lesson in impartiality and how to conduct a proper discussion on aspects of the Northern troubles he could do worse than listen to Pat Kennys' handling of the release of State papers and subsequent debate surrounding the Hunger Strikes of 1981 with Danny Morrison and Eamon Maille this morning.

Proper, reasoned argument with an unbiased man in the chair keeping his personal opinion to himself and dealing with the subject objectively - yet in total contrast to this, the same broadcasting organisation allow Duffy to rant and rage at anyone who holds a different point of view or disagrees in any form with his (often cockeyed) agenda.

Gophur

Joe Duffy's history of his membership of Fianna Fail comes back to the surface time and time again.

yosser hughes

europa11 wrote: »

If Joe needed a lesson in impartiality and how to conduct a proper discussion on aspects of the Northern troubles he could do worse than listen to Pat Kennys' handling of the release of State papers and subsequent debate surrounding the Hunger Strikes of 1981 with Danny Morrison and Eamon Maille this morning.

Proper, reasoned argument with an unbiased man in the chair keeping his personal opinion to himself and dealing with the subject objectively - yet in total contrast to this, the same broadcasting organisation allow Duffy to rant and rage at anyone who holds a different point of view or disagrees in any form with his (often cockeyed) agenda.

I was about to post much the same thing europa11. Excellent discussion this morning. Duffy's 'style' if you could call it that is more suited to late night phone-in shows. It beggars belief that Duffy gets paid what he does for this sub-standard fare.
Pat Kenny is the best broadcaster on Irish radio by a country mile.
So if Joe or any of his researchers or indeed those that would choose to call someone like me a begrudger, I'm not. I will give praise where it is due and recognise when a job is done well. Joe Duffy is overpaid and does not deserve his elevated position in Irish life.

Stripey Cat

Does anyone think that the TG4 programme will be mentioned this afternoon?

I watched it last night and it was certainly nothing to get upset about. Will Joe apologise and say he was wrong to get his knickers in a twist?

HeidiHeidi

Damn, forgot all about it. Does TG4 have a playback bit on the internet?