Help - teens hanging around apartment building landing

Karede

Hi guys, first time poster! Apologies in advance for long post...

Im so frustrated, any help will be much appreciated...I rent an apartment with my husband on the top floor of a medium to large apartment complex. As its the top floor there is a large landing area (as there is no further staircase going up)

This area on the landing has now become a magnet for the local teens. Gangs of them arrive and they are loud, distructive, disrespectful and to be perfectly honest little scumbags. They started hanging around here a few months ago. Each time i seen them i moved them on. They would reluctantly leave with just some verbal abuse. I emailed the management agency who said they would alter the hours of the cleaners to evenings so they could move them on but this didnt actually happen. After pestering from me they left for about 2 months but now they are back!

They are around 15/16 years of age and are drinking and smoking hash outside my door. They are writing on the walls and burning holes into the carpets. Ive tried having a chat with them and asking them to just not leave anything behind and to keep the noise down...they agree to my face but as soon as i go indoors its another story! Im only in my 20's myself and am not just some old crank with nothing better to do. Its mortifying bringing friends or family to my home at this stage but i absolutely love my apartment and its location and dont want to move.

After tonight i want to explode. Had a friend over havnt seen in ages. When my husband came in from work he said teens were on the landing and he moved them on. My friend left just awhile ago (late night) and when we went outside we discovered they had been back! Outside my door is numerous cases of empty beer. glass bottle lying everywhere. cigarettes stubbed into the floor, rubbish AND plenty of urine. Its awful!

One if the teens does live in the complex and has given his mates the codes to get in. His family wouldnt be the friendliest and it would be too daunting to approuch them. Landlord is gona do nothing. I dont want to move. What can i safely do? please help!

Tea_Bag

get one of those high pitched noise producing horrible things that irritate young people.

while I hate them, I fully agree that it should be used in antisocial behavior circumstances.

I'm not sure if they're legal or where to buy them, but its an idea.

AstonMartin

Why have you not rang the guards?

Victor

Agreed. Go to the local Garda Station. Try to talk to the youth liaison / community liaison officer(s). Teenagers with drink and drugs is something they will act on. The space is sufficiently public for them to act.

Write to the landlord and/or management, reminding them that you are paying for and entitled to peaceful enjoyment of the property and that they have responsibilities to you for the behaviour of your neighbours.

Ask for the security system to be changed to card or apartment number + PIN instead of a common code.

ebixa82

It's a renters market. I would have moved out a long time ago. Crazy to have to put up with that!

Karede

Thanks for the replies guys! I really dont want to move as I love my apartment and its location.

I'm gona contact the managment agency on Monday morning. Im also gona pop down to the garda station for some advice. Hopefully it can be sorted!

Blackjack

Google "Mosquito alarm".
May cost a bit, but could resolve the problem.

marknine

I had the same issue a few years ago and it was a nightmare to say the least although in my case I was living in a housing estate. I reasoned with them and talked to them as civil as I could and at no time did I lose my temper with them or be abusive to them. I ended up with lots of vandalism to my car and house and I had to replace a few windows, two of which I still need to replace due to not having any money. The Guards did not do anything to stop the youths and a lot of times they never even bothered to check out my 999 calls. One evening, one of the youths (whose name I know) started throwing stones at my windows and teaching young kids to do the same. I phoned 999 and they asked me what they looked like and when I said I could do better than that as I knew his name and where he lived. Once they heard that I was told that I should go down to the Garda station to report it even though he was outside trying to break my windows at the time. What did they want me to do? Go out and challenge them? I ended up borrowing a video camera and made sure that they were caught in the act. Once they knew they were on video, it all stopped.
I would suggest that you keep a detailed diary off all events, with dates and times. Also take photos of vandalisms for evidence. Might be an idea to take video of them with a hidden camera so you can show Guards what is happening. Most cameras have video now. Good luck Karede, my thoughts are with you.

Karede

Thanks Marknine!

Isnt it awful that we have to live like this! I feel like im turning into my mother complaining about teenagers and so on but i guess she was right ...never thought id say that!

I just cant understand the level of disrespect they have especially the one that suposidly lives here...its his home too but he's the main instigator.

Im looking foward to hearing what the management agency have to say!


*Apologies for my spelling!

the groutch

I'd try find out who is letting them into the building, and report them to the management company

also the Gardai will take interest if there's drugs involved (you mentioned them smoking hash)

The_Conductor

Seriously- don't pop down to the Gardai for some advice. Ring them and advise them that you believe there is illegal drug usage along with underage drinking and antisocial behaviour occurring. I really don't understand why you haven't done this thus far.

rcdk1

I agree that a formal complaint to the Gardai is the way to go. You should make written complaints to the Management Agency and Landlord as well, making mention that the Gardai are now involved due to the drink and drug use.

marknine wrote: »

Might be an idea to take video of them with a hidden camera so you can show Guards what is happening.

Taking a video is a good idea but I wouldn't go down the hidden camera route for two reasons. First, is there not legality issues in using video of someone without their knowledge? Secondly, as a deterrent I would be inclined to plaster the place with "CCTV in operation" signs and patently obvious camera units. They don't necessaily need to be working units, dummy units can be bought for a few Euros on ebay. The guys on the home security forum might be able to advise you better.

Karede

Okay so I just heard back from the managment agency and there response was basically "Thank you for your feedback, although we will contact the guards to ask them to patrol the area more, we cannot help who other residents let into the building"

I think this is a b*llsh*t reply. One of the teenagers is a resident.

I am going to speak to my neighbours because if I am the only person complaining I guess its wont make much of a difference. I dont think the management agency care as long as the apartments are full.

I am def going to the guards but I am thinking I am going to get the same response from them too.

On another note I noticed last night the teens are sitting on the floor below...its too dirty for them to sit up on this floor until the cleaners are in! gggrrr

Laisurg

Forget about going to the management of the complex and just ring the guards, what they're doing is trespassing and vandalism and the guards should act on it especially since it sounds like it's been going on for a while.

Zamboni

I'd be gone.

The management agency won't stop it.
Your landlord won't stop it.
The gardaí won't stop it.

Sometimes it's worth fighting your corner and sometimes it's not.
Just be thankful you have the mobility of a renter.

bobbysands81

Karede wrote: »

Okay so I just heard back from the managment agency and there response was basically "Thank you for your feedback, although we will contact the guards to ask them to patrol the area more, we cannot help who other residents let into the building"

I think this is a b*llsh*t reply. One of the teenagers is a resident.

I am going to speak to my neighbours because if I am the only person complaining I guess its wont make much of a difference. I dont think the management agency care as long as the apartments are full.

I am def going to the guards but I am thinking I am going to get the same response from them too.

On another note I noticed last night the teens are sitting on the floor below...its too dirty for them to sit up on this floor until the cleaners are in! gggrrr

Internal common areas are NOT a playground. Do NOT accept this answer from the Managing Agents. It is not the job of the Gardai to patrol inside apartments.

If I got the line in bold above from a Managing Agent I would flip the lid. You have a right to peaceful enjoyment of your home, you are not getting it.

Often the best way to solve a problem is make it someone else's problem. The problem you're having is a problem that the landlord and Managing Agents should also be having... it's up to you to make it their problem or they won't sort it out. Ring every single day until they sort it. Do not accept the bullsh1t that they've given you so far.

swirlser

Make it your LLs fight too. Ofc nobody cares so long as the place is full of paying renters your going to have an uphill battle getting people to take it seriously. But guess what the LL will realise when you say your moving out and he's going to have an empty apartment due to most folks don't like walking thru urine smelling landings with bottles and graffiti etc!

It's inrecidble the response you got from the mc, they want their 2k pa but they do little to earn it and will dodge any type of responsibilities whenever they can!

Catch them on vid, go to guards, and tell your LL you will leave if nothing is done.

pinkypinky

As someone who is a director of an MC, I annoyed with your managing agent. I wonder do your directors know that they are not making any effort to remove the teens? Since one of them is a resident, it should be very easy to complain to their parents (MC, not you).

I have found the Gardaí to be not massively helpful in this scenario. A couple of years ago my building had a problem with a local boy sleeping rough in the building. He was not homeless, just didn't want to go home. We were unable to establish who was letting him into the building. 2 of our directors went to see the Gardaí about it and they said there was nothing they could do except remove him every time we called about it. This was because he was a minor. They used a lot of jargon like "you need to see the JLO" and then couldn't remember what that stood for (juvenile liaison officer, we later discovered) but we got nowhere with them. Eventually, he stopped sleeping in the building.

marknine

bobbysands81 wrote: »

Internal common areas are NOT a playground. Do NOT accept this answer from the Managing Agents. It is not the job of the Gardai to patrol inside apartments.

If I got the line in bold above from a Managing Agent I would flip the lid. You have a right to peaceful enjoyment of your home, you are not getting it.

Often the best way to solve a problem is make it someone else's problem. The problem you're having is a problem that the landlord and Managing Agents should also be having... it's up to you to make it their problem or they won't sort it out. Ring every single day until they sort it. Do not accept the bullsh1t that they've given you so far.

Brilliant advice. Wish I knew yoou when I was having problems. Fantastic

Marcusm

There should be a clause in the lease precluding the lessee from loitering or undertaking any activities in foyer except those consistent with proper use - travelling to flat, transporting goods to flat etc. Likewise there should be a covenant which facilitates you as lessee requiring the freeholder (which should be the management company - one not the agent) to enforce these covenants against other leaseholders. You can generally require the enforcement through serving a notice. Failure to enforce the covenants will be a breach of the lease which will cause useless re compensation and servic fees (although in effect is really a big stick, the only one you have to use). Another poster referred to peaceful enjoyment. In a lease this s usually referred to as "quiet enjoyment" but doesn't really have anything to do with noise or nuisance - it's actually a promise not to interfere with your use of the flat.

paddyandy

The Stink of Garlic and it's invisible if rubbed on the walls carefully.

TheReverend

Blast them with piss, seriously

keithm1

Tell your land lord if this isn't sorted by the end of the week your moving out

Victor

paddyandy wrote: »

The Stink of Garlic and it's invisible if rubbed on the walls carefully.

TheReverend wrote: »

Blast them with piss, seriously

Neither of which are acceptable - as posts or behaviours.

CP Kindleberger

What a crazy situation . The OP is confronting gangs of teenagers who are drunk and stoned on the hall outside of her apartment . But it gets better . They are then expecting 2 of the most useless organisations in Ireland to sort it out , The Cops and a Apartment block management agency ??

You are renting , just move out . That situation is only going to get worse . It could end up with them attacking you or your husband or having your apartment broken into ( hopefully when you are not there .)

Move out , seriously .

mikemac

They might be dismissing you, you are "just" a tenant
In our estate I've done more work with the local gardai and the councillor on issues in the estate then most owners but I'm still a tenant and so I don't get to go to any MC meetings

Tell your landlord you are considering moving out and why
The landlords wants good rent paying tenants so they'll call up the management agent to kick ass.

Maybe the landlord will even call over and start shifting the boyos himself

A landlord about to lose tenants and knows they will struggle to get new tenants will be very motivated to get it sorted

Ray Palmer

People fail to understand a LL has not got magical talents where they can make people do things you can't. THe management company will respond no quicker for a landlord.

Bare in mind you break a lease for this you are just as responsible as anybody who breaks a lease.

bobbysands81

Ray Palmer wrote: »

THe management company will respond no quicker for a landlord.

Ray, I know you work in this field so I'm a bit surprised about that comment.

The Management Company (of any complex) has legal responsibilities to the apartment owner (they are a shareholder in the Management Company after all). A Management Company has absolutely NO legal obligation to a tenant.

Basically, a management company is not obliged to deal with tenants, only the owners of a unit. This is very evident when it comes to AGM time of a Management Company as only unit owners are permitted to vote and attend.

Ray Palmer

bobbysands81 wrote: »

Ray, I know you work in this field so I'm a bit surprised about that comment.

The Management Company (of any complex) has legal responsibilities to the apartment owner (they are a shareholder in the Management Company after all). A Management Company has absolutely NO legal obligation to a tenant.

Basically, a management company is not obliged to deal with tenants, only the owners of a unit. This is very evident when it comes to AGM time of a Management Company as only unit owners are permitted to vote and attend.

Having dealt with them I can assure you it makes no difference when it comes to something they aren't bothered about. Management companies really don't care about the service they provide as they are quite difficult to change

Carawaystick

Might be worth checking with the office of tobacco control, if it's an inside area and cleaning staff clean there it's a workplace and smoking is illegal, 3 grand fine might light a fire under someone, 'scuse the pun

Victor

Carawaystick wrote: »

Might be worth checking with the office of tobacco control, if it's an inside area and cleaning staff clean there it's a workplace and smoking is illegal, 3 grand fine might light a fire under someone, 'scuse the pun

It need not have people working there. In any such area smoking is completely banned (it would be permitter within apartments, but even that has implications if tobacco smoke escapes into common areas).