Most evil person ever?

Yahew · 09-10-2011 12:51am

HavingCrack wrote: »

To be fair, does Castro really deserve to be lumped in with them all?
He supressed democracy and treated homosexuals and political dissidents abysmally but didn't preside over any actual massacures, unlike the others, as far as I am aware. If I'm wrong please correct me.

Castro and Tito were the best communist dictators for sure. Both practical men. Still dictators though.

ColeTrain · 09-10-2011 12:52am

Duke Leonal Felmet wrote: »

'Hello miner, is Thatcher worse than an individual responsible for millions of deaths'

Miner: 'No, dont be a ****ing idiot'

It's all in context though. Obviously she didn't commit the most evil acts ever or she wasn't the evilest person born. But she got away with some pretty immoral decisions. Can't argue with her getting a mention.

mikemac · 09-10-2011 12:53am

Sir Charles Edward Trevelyan

Leopald of Belgium
Irishmen going off to fight for poor little Catholic Belgium while their leaders had natives getting their arms hacked off on plantations in Africa. There's the power of propaganda

Brian? · 09-10-2011 12:55am

Yahew wrote: »

I dont trust a word Pilger says, and that was the article I was previously referring to. It proves very little, like most Pilger articles ( bombing cambodia may have helped Pol Pot, but bombing doesn't normally lead to Pol Potism. if it always did then the Nazi attack on london would led to a British Pol Pot).

Right, you don't trust the author. You could however trust the simple facts. Britain and the USA supported Pol Pot in exile and funnelled weapons and cash to him because they hated the Vietnamese. It's not really open for debate whether they did it or not, they did it. The British and Americans admit they did, so I don't see why you are trying to defend them

I am not saying Thatcher was in the same class of evil as Pol Pot or Hitler, just that she was an evil bitch.

The other points you made, I agree with. Doesn't change what the British and Americans did.

Mike 1972 · 09-10-2011 12:55am

HavingCrack wrote: »

The odd thing is that Stalin and Mao were both responsible for far more deaths than Nazi Germany ever managed. I suppose it was the 'industrialisation' of death by Hitler and co. that makes them seem more evil.

Stalin was in power a good bit longer than Hitler & Co so had more opportunity to commit evil

It could be argued that much of the Evil attributed to Mao was down to incompetence rather than Malice

Milošević/Karadžić (and some of their Croatian counterparts), Saddam, The leadership of the Taliban, Pinochet, etc would be pretty much second division.

Theres some bad $hit going down in the Congo at the moment. Only the fact that its perputrated in the main against dark skinned people stops people comparing it with the holocaust.

admiralofthefleet wrote: »

Karol Wojtyła
all the above pure evil

I said something like that when I was living with Polish housemates

It didnt go down too well......................................

electrobanana · 09-10-2011 12:58am

sick twisted cnut
Vlad III of Romania (also known as Vlad the Impaler) was Prince of Wallachia three times between 1448 and 1476. Vlad is best known for the legends of the exceedingly cruel punishments he imposed during his reign and for serving as the primary inspiration for the vampire main character in Bram Stoker’s popular Dracula novel. In Romania he is viewed by many as a prince with a deep sense of justice. His method of torture was a horse attached to each of the victim’s legs as a sharpened stake was gradually forced into the body. The end of the stake was usually oiled, and care was taken that the stake not be too sharp; else the victim might die too rapidly from shock. Wikipedia has an article that describes, in great details, the methods of Vlad’s cruelty. The list of tortures he is alleged to have employed is extensive: nails in heads, cutting off of limbs, blinding, strangulation, burning, cutting off of noses and ears, mutilation of sexual organs (especially in the case of women), scalping, skinning, exposure to the elements or to animals, and boiling alive. There are claims that on some occasions ten thousand people were impaled in 1460 alone.

abouttobebanned · 09-10-2011 12:58am

Shirley Jane Turner
Lenny Murphy

Brian? · 09-10-2011 12:58am

Yahew wrote: »

Castro and Tito were the best communist dictators for sure. Both practical men. Still dictators though.

Does that makes them evil?* Both liberated their countries from tyrants. In fact as being a dictator goes, Tito was a light weight. He sent hardly anyone to forced labour camps at all, he really needed to pull up his socks.

*I know you never said they were.

Brian? · 09-10-2011 12:59am

mikemac wrote: »

Sir Charles Edward Trevelyan

Leopald of Belgium
Irishmen going off to fight for poor little Catholic Belgium while their leaders had natives getting their arms hacked off on plantations in Africa. There's the power of propaganda

Leopald was some wagon alright.

Mammanabammana · 09-10-2011 1:00am

Hitler wasn't THAT evil. After all, he killed Hitler...

Yahew · 09-10-2011 1:01am

briankeating wrote: »

Right, you don't trust the author. You could however trust the simple facts. Britain and the USA supported Pol Pot in exile and funnelled weapons and cash to him because they hated the Vietnamese. It's not really open for debate whether they did it or not, they did it. The British and Americans admit they did, so I don't see why you are trying to defend them

I am not saying Thatcher was in the same class of evil as Pol Pot or Hitler, just that she was an evil bitch.

The other points you made, I agree with. Doesn't change what the British and Americans did.

Fair enough. Good points.

Yahew · 09-10-2011 1:03am

briankeating wrote: »

Does that makes them evil?* Both liberated their countries from tyrants. In fact as being a dictator goes, Tito was a light weight. He sent hardly anyone to forced labour camps at all, he really needed to pull up his socks.

*I know you never said they were.

No, I think that given their absolute power they were ( whisper it) almost good men. Tito in particular.Of course, proper stalinists hated Tito.

Its a pity Castro turned to communism, rather than a strong social democracy where he kicked American gangsters out, but ran a mixed economy and turned to democracy eventually, but communism was in vogue, and Che had his ear.

Nodin · 09-10-2011 1:03am

Chris P. Bacon wrote: »

Kim yong il.

Cunt.

Aye, I hear Cunt was a right bastard.

LondonIrish90 · 09-10-2011 1:06am

bayern282 wrote: »

Say that to a miner

The number of miners in Britain was in the low thousands.

The population of Britain was almost at 60 million.

I'm fairly glad she decided to revolutionise the UK's economy instead of bow down to the pressure of those who were not the future if Britain was ever to be prosperous.

And on topic, John Prescott.

Nodin · 09-10-2011 1:06am

4leto wrote: »

Margaret Thatcher wasn't evil, one hell of a leader who saved Britain from ruin.

...............

While not in the all time "greats" she did promulgate homophobic legislation, imposed needless hardship, helped extend the life of the Apartheid South African regime, gave respectability to Pinochet, moral support to Reagan. "not nice" certainly. Definitely not a force for good.

Duke Leonal Felmet · 09-10-2011 1:08am

ColeTrain wrote: »

Duke Leonal Felmet wrote: »

'Hello miner, is Thatcher worse than an individual responsible for millions of deaths'

Miner: 'No, dont be a ****ing idiot'

It's all in context though. Obviously she didn't commit the most evil acts ever or she wasn't the evilest person born. But she got away with some pretty immoral decisions. Can't argue with her getting a mention.

Next to Hitler, Stalin ,et al.

Seriously, put down the whisky.

billybudd · 09-10-2011 1:09am

Hitler witout doubt, estimated 15 million people died during his time.

ColeTrain · 09-10-2011 1:16am

Duke Leonal Felmet wrote: »

Next to Hitler, Stalin ,et al.

Seriously, put down the whisky.

Get new glasses pal, you didn't read a word I wrote..

Mike 1972 · 09-10-2011 1:16am

billybudd wrote: »

Hitler witout doubt, estimated 15 million people died during his time.

Ummmm 25 million in Russia alone ?

If youre referring to the Holocaust specifically IIRC its abour 11 million (just over half of whom were Jewish) suppose pogroms outside the camps would bring it up to about 15 though ?

Yahew wrote: »

Its a pity Castro turned to communism, rather than a strong social democracy where he kicked American gangsters out, but ran a mixed economy and turned to democracy eventually, but communism was in vogue, and Che had his ear.

It was probably the Americans who turned Castro to Communism. That and the need for outside support making him suck up to the USSR.

4leto wrote: »

Do gooders are pure evil they just piss me off.

So do badders are better in your book ?

I see !

billybudd · 09-10-2011 1:20am

Mike 1972 wrote: »

Ummmm 25 million in Russia alone ?

If youre referring to the Holocaust specifically IIRC its abour 11 million (just over half of whom were Jewish) suppose pogroms outside the camps would bring it up to about 15 though ?

sorry didnt read previous posts, is that 25 million under one person example ivan the terrible for instance? i didnt know there was an estimated figure for him? all in all hitler was responsible for an estimated 15 million deaths, from jews to what he deemed defective people.

Yahew · 09-10-2011 1:20am

LondonIrish90 wrote: »

And on topic, John Prescott.

lol. I am centre right and I love Prescott. Particularly since he took that guy out. Proper order.

HavingCrack · 09-10-2011 1:23am

Yahew wrote: »

Castro and Tito were the best communist dictators for sure. Both practical men. Still dictators though.

Dictator doesn't neccessarily equate to 'evil' though. In fact, life in Tito's Yugoslavia was probably superior to life in Ireland during the same time period.

mikemac wrote: »

Leopald of Belgium
Irishmen going off to fight for poor little Catholic Belgium while their leaders had natives getting their arms hacked off on plantations in Africa. There's the power of propaganda

Ah yes, poor old Belgium with it's massive colonial empire in the Congo...

billybudd wrote: »

Hitler witout doubt, estimated 15 million people died during his time.

As I said before though, Stalin and Mao were both responsible for far more deaths. Stalin was estimated to have been culpable for approximately 20-22 million while estimates of deaths under Mao range from 30-40 million.
Granted both of them ruled for far longer than Hitler did but still it's worth remembering that the Nazi's weren't the only butchers in history.

Hannibal · 09-10-2011 1:23am

briankeating wrote: »

Does that makes them evil?* Both liberated their countries from tyrants. In fact as being a dictator goes, Tito was a light weight. He sent hardly anyone to forced labour camps at all, he really needed to pull up his socks.

Agreed.

Tito was a popular leader and unified the countries of Yugoslavia which descended into war and a build up of ethnic tensions not long after his death. He received many awards and declarations from countries around the world.

Fidel Castro wasn't evil, he freed Cuba from being exploited by America and the American backed dictator Batista and put an end to it being used by the Mafia as a playground. The US propaganda machine gave unfavourable perceptions of Castro and they bullied countries the world over into alienating Cuba. Castro's crime was putting an end to US companies extracting Cuba's resources for their own profits and he returned these to the Cuban people only for their trade partners to be bullied out of trading with them thus economic meltdown. He got caught up in the middle of a game between Kennedy and Khrushchev, due to the US having missiles in Turkey aimed at Moscow and in turn the Soviets used Castro's bad relations to put weapons into Cuba aimed at America. From reading his speeches he strikes me as being one of the cleverest politicians of his time and an undoubted leader whether or not you agree with his ideaology.

Castro should never be placed into the same category as Himmler, Cromwell, Stalin, Amin, Pot, Thatcher, Bin Laden, Hussein or indeed Ben-Gurion who hasn't been mentioned once on this thread. Ben-Gurion is the main influence behind the anti-Arab thinking and feelings among generations of Israeli's and Jewish Americans who are the main power brokers and moneymen behind many US administrations. It could be argued that in a roundabout way he created the likes of Bin Laden.

AgileMyth · 09-10-2011 1:26am

4leto wrote: »

Newton for inventing gravity.

Agreed. It really gets me down.

HavingCrack · 09-10-2011 1:27am

billybudd wrote: »

sorry didnt read previous posts, is that 25 million under one person example ivan the terrible for instance? i didnt know there was an estimated figure for him? all in all hitler was responsible for an estimated 15 million deaths, from jews to what he deemed defective people.

Yes Stalin was effectviely personally responsible for at least 22 million deaths.
On another note, the focus on the Holocaust does distract attention from other vicitms of Hitler. Somehting like 2 million Soviet POWS died under German imprisionment while the Soviet Union lost 25 million people to war and starvation alone :eek::eek:.

HavingCrack · 09-10-2011 1:30am

Dotsey wrote: »

Fidel Castro wasn't evil, he freed Cuba from being exploited by America and the American backed dictator Batista and put an end to it being used by the Mafia as a playground. The US propaganda machine gave unfavourable perceptions of Castro and they bullied countries the world over into alienating Cuba. Castro's crime was putting an end to US companies extracting Cuba's resources for their own profits and he returned these to the Cuban people only for their trade partners to be bullied out of trading with them thus economic meltdown. He got caught up in the middle of a game between Kennedy and Khrushchev, due to the US having missiles in Turkey aimed at Moscow and in turn the Soviets used Castro's bad relations to put weapons into Cuba aimed at America. From reading his speeches he strikes me as being one of the cleverest politicians of his time and an undoubted leader whether or not you agree with his ideaology.

Still a dictator at the end of the day though. As I said previously he locked up an estimated 20,000 political dissidents and wasn't adverse to a spot of torture when it suited him by all accounts. He certainly wasn't evil but not exactly a fluffy bunny either.

Chuck Stone · 09-10-2011 1:30am

What about Henry Kissinger?

Must get that book Hitchens wrote about him.

billybudd · 09-10-2011 1:42am

HavingCrack wrote: »

Dictator doesn't neccessarily equate to 'evil' though. In fact, life in Tito's Yugoslavia was probably superior to life in Ireland during the same time period.

Ah yes, poor old Belgium with it's massive colonial empire in the Congo...

As I said before though, Stalin and Mao were both responsible for far more deaths. Stalin was estimated to have been culpable for approximately 20-22 million while estimates of deaths under Mao range from 30-40 million.
Granted both of them ruled for far longer than Hitler did but still it's worth remembering that the Nazi's weren't the only butchers in history.

wasnt aware of those numbers so thanks.

swabby · 09-10-2011 1:43am

Obama!!

ShadowHearth · 09-10-2011 1:45am

My misses.

she is pissed of beyond believe.

why? i have no ****ing clue.

i asked her, and she said she is alright...

omfg not this again...

yup, she is toping the list.

barakus · 09-10-2011 2:02am

twink

Lady Chatterton · 09-10-2011 2:08am

Brendan Patrick O'Donnell

Godsentme · 09-10-2011 2:11am

AgileMyth wrote: »

Agreed. It really gets me down.

Yaeh. Gravity sucks.

SandraManson · 09-10-2011 2:15am

"God" for inventing humans.

Full.Duck · 09-10-2011 2:19am

Mao by a long shot. Seriously he has killed more than double than any other person that has ever existed.

Lab_Mouse · 09-10-2011 2:25am

HavingCrack wrote: »

Somehting like 2 million Soviet POWS died under German imprisionment while the Soviet Union lost 25 million people to war and starvation alone :eek::eek:.

I highlighted war.Read up on how the russian commanders treated their soldiers.The only reason the russians lost so many(millions!)in the war was because the people in charge were callous bastards.Give out about the nazi's all you want,but if you keep sending unarmed men against a wehrmacht machine gun nest,the germans will keep mowing them down.

have a quick look at the soviet casualitys in finland for an example

It set the the stage for the bastard$ that ran the USSR and other communist states in europe

Chuck Stone · 09-10-2011 2:28am

SandraManson wrote: »

"God" for inventing humans.

Humans for inventing 'God'.

wandatowell · 09-10-2011 2:30am

Ed Gein has to be up there

al28283 · 09-10-2011 2:39am

Fr. Todd Unctious

flyswatter · 09-10-2011 2:45am

No mention yet of Shiro Ishii, a Japanese lietenant responsible for war crimes/ human experimentation. An evil man indeed, just google Unit 731. Pretty sickening.

mikemac · 09-10-2011 2:47am

flyswatter wrote: »

No mention yet of Shiro Ishii, a Japanese lietenant responsible for war crimes/ human experimentation. An evil man indeed, just google Unit 731. Pretty sickening.

I was wondering how a lowly lieutenant could do all that
Quick check shows he was a lieutenant general, sorry if I'm coming across as pedantic.

But you're right, some horrendous things done

Sergeant · 09-10-2011 2:52am

Gordon Gecko.

flyswatter · 09-10-2011 2:56am

mikemac wrote: »

flyswatter wrote: »

No mention yet of Shiro Ishii, a Japanese lietenant responsible for war crimes/ human experimentation. An evil man indeed, just google Unit 731. Pretty sickening.

I was wondering how a lowly lieutenant could do all that
Quick check shows he was a lieutenant general, sorry if I'm coming across as pedantic.

But you're right, some horrendous things done

Sorry, forgot the general part! There's a good documentary on the unit called Nightmare in Manchuria and a graphic film based on it called Man Behind the Sun, haven't seen the film and don't really want to either!

al28283 · 09-10-2011 2:57am

Dr. Robotnik

beks101 · 09-10-2011 3:03am

Sarah from work.

x in the city · 09-10-2011 3:05am

bertie would be in the top of the pile

Full.Duck · 09-10-2011 3:05am

The guy who invented MP3's, ruined the music industry.

EarlERizer · 09-10-2011 3:07am

Kneivel!!!!

The Internet Explorer · 09-10-2011 3:09am

A terrible bunch of lads.

CoolHat · 09-10-2011 3:22am

flyswatter wrote: »

No mention yet of Shiro Ishii, a Japanese lietenant responsible for war crimes/ human experimentation. An evil man indeed, just google Unit 731. Pretty sickening.

Just googled upon reading your post. A very evil man and unit indeed.

You know the messed up thing?
Take guys like Hitler, Stalin, this Shiro Ishii (etc) If you talk to them personally would they come off as evil people or regular blokes? As opposed to serial killers like Ted Bundy, Charles Manson and others were after talking to them for a few seconds you know they aint all there and have some fu*ked up mental need to kill people.

But the former were guys in power. Military men. Hitler didn't personally kill the 6 million Jews. Stalin didn't personally kill the the officially estimated 10-60 million people under his reign. They ordered other people to do it. And that's the fuc*ed up thing.

Like, 90% of people in this life are out for themselves, screw you over weather big or small, type of people. So the ultimate question is, were the likes of Hitler or Stalin naturally evil people? ... or Just regular wa*kers who rised to power?

Most evil person ever?

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