What Has Martin McGuinness Ever Done For The Republic of Ireland?

KELTICKNIGHTT

Ellis Dee wrote: »

I doubt whether you are even Irish, as your grasp of English grammar and idiom is deplorable.:eek::eek: Therefore it is unlikely that you can vote here.

be guess what,
i can see your english so good :rolleyes:

maccored

K-9 wrote: »

maybe all the PSNI, Garda, Minister for Justices, respected and impartial journalists and historians are wrong and he is telling the truth.

Well maybe the PSNI, Garda and Minister for Justices should do their jobs and produce the convincing evidence. Ive no idea when he left the IRA, but until someone can step up and backup the claim he's lying, why should I just assume he is lying?

My question is just why haven't the PSNI, Garda and Minister for Justices been able to directly dispute his claim of when he left the IRA with some substantial information to the contrary? Heresay and commercial novels dont cut it unfortunately.

Mr.Micro

Originally Posted by Ellis Dee
I doubt whether you are even Irish, as your grasp of English grammar and idiom is deplorable. Therefore it is unlikely that you can vote here

.

Originally Posted by KELTICKNIGHT
be guess what,
i can see your english so good

So what if he/she is not Irish and its commendable that the poster posts if English is a second language. So called English speakers that post on here can hardly string a sentence together.

Ellis Dee

Mr.Micro wrote: »

So what if he/she is not Irish and its commendable that the poster posts if English is a second language. So called English speakers that post on here can hardly string a sentence together.

I agree, but my point was that someone whose English is so obviously influenced by his/her original language can not have been in Ireland for long. Certainly not during the conflict in the North or nearly 20 years ago when that cop was killed in Adare. So therefore why is (s)he so opinionated?

KELTICKNIGHTT

Ellis Dee wrote: »

I agree, but my point was that someone whose English is so obviously influenced by his/her original language can not have been in Ireland for long. Certainly not during the conflict in the North or nearly 20 years ago when that cop was killed in Adare. So therefore why is (s)he so opinionated?

First ,im more Irish than you i think
I grew up with he troubles and all the PIRA propaganda, Irish people killed
and maybe you should check again when garda gerry mc cabe wa killed by PIRA murders,,
Here's a link that might help you :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_McCabe
maybe you can refrain for petty comments .if you can't don't answer my post please.
thank you.

Mr.Micro

Ellis Dee wrote: »

I agree, but my point was that someone whose English is so obviously influenced by his/her original language can not have been in Ireland for long. Certainly not during the conflict in the North or nearly 20 years ago when that cop was killed in Adare. So therefore why is (s)he so opinionated?

Why not say that originally instead of posting an insult then, and seek clarification as to the knowledge of the poster re the conflict? The whole idea I do believe is to debate?

Mr.Micro

KELTICKNIGHTT wrote: »

First ,im more Irish than you i think
I grew up with he troubles and all the PIRA propaganda, Irish people killed
and maybe you should check again when garda gerry mc cabe wa killed by PIRA murders,,
Here's a link that might help you :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_McCabe
maybe you can refrain for petty comments .if you can't don't answer my post please.
thank you.

Good for you KN....too many people make value judgments without the facts based on assumptions and little else.

Liam Byrne

jank wrote: »

Liam Byrne wrote: »

It will if people continue to excuse it; the Americans even made up a phrase for it - "collateral damage"

Are we not allowed to strive for better ?

Once upon a time an "unfortunate fact of life" was TB - that has now been as good as eradicated.

Once upon a time an "unfortunate fact of life" for black people or gays was that they got picked on and ridiculed - that, too, has been as good as eradicated.

But that's because very few people sat back and accepted those.

Ironically, with all due respect to those affected by the above, the murder of innocents - which is a far bigger issue - gets "accepted" ?

Not on my watch.

Frankly Liam are you a dreamer and an idealist. You dont live in the real world. You think the world should be perfect and if its not you give out about it. Nobody wanted what occured in the north to happen, but it did for reasons already explained countless times. One can chose to accept the facts or not but to dream up some alternative reality is facile tbh.

I live in the real world, and I don't accept that these things just "happen", because they are choices.

And there's nothing wrong with wanting people to make better choices.

KELTICKNIGHTT

Mr.Micro wrote: »

Good for you KN....too many people make value judgments without the facts based on assumptions and little else.

I have noticed if you don't agree or say something some don't like specially sf support ,they try to insult etc .
I know now what to expect from them but still in hope give them a chance
funny thing
My father was old IRA and big supporter but he was disgusted what happened with the remaining years after 1969 onwards,
I'll leave it at that..

blahfckingblah

KELTICKNIGHTT wrote: »

First ,im more Irish than you i think
I grew up with he troubles and all the PIRA propaganda, Irish people killed
and maybe you should check again when garda gerry mc cabe wa killed by PIRA murders,,
Here's a link that might help you :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_McCabe
maybe you can refrain for petty comments .if you can't don't answer my post please.
thank you.

that does not make you any more irish by the way, does nobody wonder why whole familys and in cases a very large proportion of people in towns and villages joined the IRA? If you ever get the opertunity i suggest you ask someone why they joined the answer is often interesting. Thats in no way glorifying it, its just interesting to hear why so many people turned to violence.

Its 15 years ago and its been discussed up down and across here before and tbh i really don't want to talk about it again so im just going to say, it was wrong and i don't agree with it.

KELTICKNIGHTT

blahfckingblah wrote: »

that does not make you any more irish by the way, does nobody wonder why whole familys and in cases a very large proportion of people in towns and villages joined the IRA? If you ever get the opertunity i suggest you ask someone why they joined the answer is often interesting. Thats in no way glorifying it, its just interesting to hear why so many people turned to violence.

Its 15 years ago and its been discussed up down and across here before and tbh i really don't want to talk about it again so im just going to say, it was wrong and i don't agree with it.

My father was old IRA ,so i know enough
He supported waht happened up to a point
But he was disgusted with what happened after a period with what PIRA did killing their own etc and in the republic,part of him sank when they did this.
Thats why i wonder by some when they talk about ira of old and PIRA
I'm sure sf supporters will say different.

blahfckingblah

KELTICKNIGHTT wrote: »

My father was old IRA ,so i know enough
He supported waht happened up to a point
But he was disgusted with what happened after a period with what PIRA did killing their own etc and in the republic,part of him sank when they did this.
Thats why i wonder by some when they talk about ira of old and PIRA
I'm sure sf supporters will say different.

The old ira and the pira have so many similarities including members, they all made mistakes, killed people, regardless of what our revised history leads you to believe. stop saying things like "I'm sure sf supporters will say different" and "I have noticed if you don't agree or say something some don't like specially sf support ,they try to insult etc ." its rediculous and niggling, like your looking down on SF supporters.

K-9

maccored wrote: »

Well maybe the PSNI, Garda and Minister for Justices should do their jobs and produce the convincing evidence. Ive no idea when he left the IRA, but until someone can step up and backup the claim he's lying, why should I just assume he is lying?

My question is just why haven't the PSNI, Garda and Minister for Justices been able to directly dispute his claim of when he left the IRA with some substantial information to the contrary? Heresay and commercial novels dont cut it unfortunately.

Don't think they normally publish intelligence reports. Suppose it might come out in as papers are released.

I'd trust independent, unbiased journalists on it, Republicans tend to believe them when it suits them.

KELTICKNIGHTT

blahfckingblah wrote: »

The old ira and the pira have so many similarities including members, they all made mistakes, killed people, regardless of what our revised history leads you to believe. stop saying things like "I'm sure sf supporters will say different" and "I have noticed if you don't agree or say something some don't like specially sf support ,they try to insult etc ." its rediculous and niggling, like your looking down on SF supporters.

sinn fein in south i have more respect for but not from north,
yes ,there was some similarities but not what PIRA after 1975 on-wards.
This should be interesting.
you tell me what you think i don't agree with and or agree with and I'll correct you if your wrong ?

added comment :
Do sinn fein support insult,niggling or look down on non sf supporters ?

blahfckingblah

KELTICKNIGHTT wrote: »

yes ,there was some similarities but not what PIRA after 1975 on-wards.
This should be interesting.
you tell me what you think i don't agree with and or agree with and I'll correct you if your wrong ?

added comment :
Do sinn fein support insult,niggling or look down on non sf supporters ?

Martin McGuinness was in the IRA until 1974

sorry can you explain the bold bit i don't understand the dialect

KELTICKNIGHTT

blahfckingblah wrote: »

Martin McGuinness was in the IRA until 1974

sorry can you explain the bold bit i don't understand the dialect

i don't believe m mcguinness left PIRA specially after 1974,wheres the proof ?

KELTICKNIGHTT

blahfckingblah wrote: »

Martin McGuinness was in the IRA until 1974

sorry can you explain the bold bit i don't understand the dialect

added comment :
Do sinn fein support insult,niggling or look down on non sf supporters ?

alex73

He has done NOTHING...

blahfckingblah

KELTICKNIGHTT wrote: »

added comment :
Do sinn fein support insult,niggling or look down on non sf supporters ?

Its not party policy, on a personal level i don't, and i don't think others should, hence me asking you to refrain from it

foggy_lad

dulpit wrote: »

Got my Martin McGuinness literature through the post yesterday. In it there's a small bit of text at bottom that says something like "Get involved in the campaign by texting the following". And they give 2 numbers, and it says before each either 26 counties: or 6 counties.

Now if this man wants to be the president of this country, maybe he should refer to it as such...

A more interesting question concerns him actually having an election presence in the north which is outside the jurisdiction. Is he canvassing in the north in the hope of getting all the dole cheats who sign on both sides of the border? That is the only way I could see how people normally resident outside the state would have an address here and possibly be registered to vote and be worth canvassing.

Happyman42

foggy_lad wrote: »

A more interesting question concerns him actually having an election presence in the north which is outside the jurisdiction. Is he canvassing in the north in the hope of getting all the dole cheats who sign on both sides of the border? That is the only way I could see how people normally resident outside the state would have an address here and possibly be registered to vote and be worth canvassing.

How many dole cheats would make it worth going to the trouble?

Mayo Exile

Liam Byrne wrote: »

It will if people continue to excuse it; the Americans even made up a phrase for it - "collateral damage"

Are we not allowed to strive for better ?

Once upon a time an "unfortunate fact of life" was TB - that has now been as good as eradicated.

Once upon a time an "unfortunate fact of life" for black people or gays was that they got picked on and ridiculed - that, too, has been as good as eradicated.

But that's because very few people sat back and accepted those.

Ironically, with all due respect to those affected by the above, the murder of innocents - which is a far bigger issue - gets "accepted" ?

Not on my watch.

"Collateral damage" in the strictest sense of the term when dealing the pursuance of warfare has nothing to do with the deliberate targeting of 'innocents' or civilians as you are seemingly inferring.

What has TB got to do with anything here? Your examples demonstrate people targeting people. TB is an exception as it is a bacterialogical infection incapable of reasoning intelligence.

anymore

foggy_lad wrote: »

Can anyone list things that Martin McGuinness has done for the people of the 26 county Republic of Ireland or anything which has made our lives and Country a better place?

Is he just a one trick pony or has he got something else up his sleeve after singlehandedly bringing peace to the 6 counties of Northern Ireland?

Without mention of Northern Ireland what do people see his contribution consisting of if he is elected president of the Republic of Ireland?

1. His organisation helped run a variety of summer /training camps in rural areas which were economically underveloped.,e.g Roscommon.
2. Helped keep diplomatic channels open with a varity of third world countries, e.g, Libya.
3. Ensured that Britain could not just ignore small countries like ireland
4. Helped ensure that ireland received extensive coverage in the international media.
5. Helped Bertie Ahern and Tony Blair look good.
6. Ensured that the DUP became the larges party in North, etc, etc

Happyman42

anymore wrote: »

1. His organisation helped run a variety of summer /training camps in rural areas which were economically underveloped.,e.g Roscommon.
2. Helped keep diplomatic channels open with a varity of third world countries, e.g, Libya.
3. Ensured that Britain could not just ignore small countries like ireland
4. Helped ensure that ireland received extensive coverage in the international media.
5. Helped Bertie Ahern and Tony Blair look good.
6. Ensured that the DUP became the larges party in North, etc, etc

The SF where alone theory again. :rolleyes:

anymore

I wont vote SF or for McGuinness, but it is high time that people like Miriam O Callaghan etc started to reminded themselves where the Provos first got money and arms from , i,e it was supplied by ' Republican Fianna Fail ' and maybe she and her kind might get someone to translate the words of Amhran na bFhiann.
And she and the rest might also remember that the Repubic, governed mainly by FF refused to extradite people for ' Political offences'.

The IRA war continued for so long because irish Governments and particularily FF allowed it to continue.

maccored

K-9 wrote: »

Don't think they normally publish intelligence reports. Suppose it might come out in as papers are released.

I'd trust independent, unbiased journalists on it, Republicans tend to believe them when it suits them.

they dont need to be published to be used in court. you can trust 'independent, unbiased journalists' if you want - doesnt get around the point that IF this information exists, mmg would have be taken in byt he authorities. He hasnt, so therefore such info doesnt exist. I find it amazing how people can claim to be democratic and but only 'tend to believe' in democracy when it suits them.

KELTICKNIGHTT

blahfckingblah wrote: »

Its not party policy, on a personal level i don't, and i don't think others should, hence me asking you to refrain from it

i don't agree
can be seen all over the forum by sinn fein with sf supporters taking cheap shots too when non sf supporters don't agree with them

Do you support mmg ?
and
do you support sinn fein ?

KELTICKNIGHTT

anymore wrote: »

I wont vote SF or for McGuinness, but it is high time that people like Miriam O Callaghan etc started to reminded themselves where the Provos first got money and arms from , i,e it was supplied by ' Republican Fianna Fail ' and maybe she and her kind might get someone to translate the words of Amhran na bFhiann.
And she and the rest might also remember that the Repubic, governed mainly by FF refused to extradite people for ' Political offences'.

The IRA war continued for so long because irish Governments and particularily FF allowed it to continue.

Irish government didn't allow it,show how irish goverment had control of PIRA in the north
Are you saying FF allowed it or certain members and if so,give names ?

blahfckingblah

KELTICKNIGHTT wrote: »

i don't agree
can be seen all over the forum by sinn fein with sf supporters taking cheap shots too when non sf supporters don't agree with them

Do you support mmg ?
and
do you support sinn fein ?

What are you even on about now?:eek: back on topic. please,for the sake of sanity.

K-9

maccored wrote: »

they dont need to be published to be used in court. you can trust 'independent, unbiased journalists' if you want - doesnt get around the point that IF this information exists, mmg would have be taken in byt he authorities. He hasnt, so therefore such info doesnt exist. I find it amazing how people can claim to be democratic and but only 'tend to believe' in democracy when it suits them.

Tbh, it probably would be politically sensitive and hardly helpful in NI, I understand that. Also it might have harmed the peace process considering the views some Republicans already have of the PSNI and then you have the Conspiracy theorists who think he's a British agent!

Personally, now that I think he has left NI politics and is running here, I don't see the need to keep up the pretence now. I suppose the IRA's history after 1974 isn't that great and it suits him to distance himself from it.

As for democracy, I've no problem with him running so no need for hysterics like that. I just reserve my democratic right to vote for a better candidate.