orf in sheep how best to treat

cattle man

hi everyone.

i had a out break of orf in my flock in the last week.
i now have 10 sheep a mixture of lambs, hoggets and a odd old ewe with fairly mild orf around the mouth.

i but j's fuild on the injected area today and removed the infected sheep from the rest of the flock.

they were in with another 50 sheep and i dont see any signs of orf yet on these but was wondering will them also get it or how am i fixed.


is there any other / better way to treat them. and what are the long term effects of this i am trying to get these sheep in lamb and all this handling isnt good for them any advice would be greatfully.

thanks in advance:)

X1R

There is a product on the market (your local CoOp should have it) called Orficide,as far as I can remember it comes in a 500m bottle with a spray cap for the top of it. It comes from a company in Galway called Coyle Veterinary. And before anyone asks, NO I don't work for Coyle's, I worked in an Agri Store that has closed. JC;).

cattle man

X1R wrote: »

There is a product on the market (your local CoOp should have it) called Orficide,as far as I can remember it comes in a 500m bottle with a spray cap for the top of it. It comes from a company in Galway called Coyle Veterinary. And before anyone asks, NO I don't work for Coyle's, I worked in an Agri Store that has closed. JC;).

thanks.

i went into connacht gold today and they mentioned that orficide.
and i asked did they have it and after a few minutes lookin they said they didnt have any

mikemac

WD-40

I'm not lying, we've used it at home

And to be sure I didn't imagine it as it does sound daft, here is a link
http://www.tvsp.org/sore-mouth.html

WD-40 can do everything

Highland

Orf is caused by a virus - so not cure there - scabs are usually infected with secondary bacterial infection - use antibiotic injection and/or spray for the infected area - avoid strong disinfectings or diesel, WD40 etc as it will only make the area more painful. You can vaccinate the remaining sheep with scabivax to prevent them from getting infected. Once you have had orf once on the farm you are likely to keep getting outbreaks, so vaccinating the lambs every year is a good idea to prevent a reoccurance in subsequent years. Field with lots of thistles seem to predispose animals to orf if it is in the land

LostCovey

Highland wrote: »

Orf is caused by a virus - so not cure there - scabs are usually infected with secondary bacterial infection - use antibiotic injection and/or spray for the infected area - avoid strong disinfectings or diesel, WD40 etc as it will only make the area more painful. You can vaccinate the remaining sheep with scabivax to prevent them from getting infected. Once you have had orf once on the farm you are likely to keep getting outbreaks, so vaccinating the lambs every year is a good idea to prevent a reoccurance in subsequent years. Field with lots of thistles seem to predispose animals to orf if it is in the land

The advice Highland gives here is 100% accurate state of the art sterling advice on the control of orf. Evidence based scientific and excellent.

I can't fault a word or a stroke of it. Brilliant, concise, on the money.

Fair play.

I am not replying to the other "advisory" posts because I am being good for Rovi and Reilig.

Till they settle in................

LostCovey

LostCovey

But I will say that there is NO TOPICAL TREATMENT that can be shown to treat orf in clinical trials.

If there ever is, the inventor will become a rich man.

In the meantime, topical treatments and tablets have only one role in Orf - to facilitate its spread to humans.

LostCovey

rancher

LostCovey wrote: »

But I will say that there is NO TOPICAL TREATMENT that can be shown to treat orf in clinical trials.

If there ever is, the inventor will become a rich man.

In the meantime, topical treatments and tablets have only one role in Orf - to facilitate its spread to humans.

LostCovey

We would have orf most years, there is no real treatment, we just ignore it, however we would try to control thistles and briars so that their mouths don't get tore and infected because thats only when you have to treat, otherwise it will take its course and be gone in a fortnight

Rovi

LostCovey wrote: »

I am not replying to the other "advisory" posts because I am being good for Rovi and Reilig.

Till they settle in................

LostCovey

Thanks

This sort of thing highlights the 'grey areas' of moderating a forum.

We (the mods) and the regular contributors don't want to have to try to create and abide by a long convoluted highly-detailed charter, one which gets expanded and amended every time a nit-picky issue comes up.

This COULD be such an issue. There's a general site-wide ban on seeking or giving medical advice, but does that extend to 'veterinary' advice???
I'm not sure that it does, and in any case, people exchange veterinary advice all the time in the real world.

Farmers and stockmen have been applying home-brewed remedies and treatments since livestock were domesticated, so it'd be unrealistic of us to try to ban discussion of the subject.

Provided something isn't illegal or likely to cause unnecessary suffering or cruelty, it's PROBABLY okay here.
We'll deal with the grey areas on a case by case basis; one person's 'traditional remedy' is another's 'cruelty', and the legal, ethical, and veterinary goalposts move constantly, but we'll do our best.

Take the WD-40 post above for example. The linked page isn't exactly a peer-reviewed scientific paper, so I'd be giving it the same weight as information imparted at the mart or down the pub.
The thing is, is it illegal or cruel?
To the best of my knowledge, it's not breaking any laws.
Is it cruel?
In my opinion, no.
I have strong doubts that it'll do any good, but I know I've doused my own skin in WD-40 plenty of times and it hasn't done any harm or caused pain in any way. Even in cuts.

So, if someone wants to squirt WD-40 on their orfy sheep, provided they're not getting it in the sheep's eyes or down their throat, let them belt away.
If someone can come up with a good argument that it causes suffering or inhibits normal healing, that's good information to get too.

snowman707

I can see the headlines

"Irish lamb exports banned due to traces of oil contamination found the in the meat"

LostCovey

Rovi wrote: »

Thanks

This sort of thing highlights the 'grey areas' of moderating a forum.

We (the mods) and the regular contributors don't want to have to try to create and abide by a long convoluted highly-detailed charter, one which gets expanded and amended every time a nit-picky issue comes up.

This COULD be such an issue. There's a general site-wide ban on seeking or giving medical advice, but does that extend to 'veterinary' advice???
I'm not sure that it does, and in any case, people exchange veterinary advice all the time in the real world.

Farmers and stockmen have been applying home-brewed remedies and treatments since livestock were domesticated, so it'd be unrealistic of us to try to ban discussion of the subject.

Provided something isn't illegal or likely to cause unnecessary suffering or cruelty, it's PROBABLY okay here.
We'll deal with the grey areas on a case by case basis; one person's 'traditional remedy' is another's 'cruelty', and the legal, ethical, and veterinary goalposts move constantly, but we'll do our best.

Take the WD-40 post above for example. The linked page isn't exactly a peer-reviewed scientific paper, so I'd be giving it the same weight as information imparted at the mart or down the pub.
The thing is, is it illegal or cruel?
To the best of my knowledge, it's not breaking any laws.
Is it cruel?
In my opinion, no.
I have strong doubts that it'll do any good, but I know I've doused my own skin in WD-40 plenty of times and it hasn't done any harm or caused pain in any way. Even in cuts.

So, if someone wants to squirt WD-40 on their orfy sheep, provided they're not getting it in the sheep's eyes or down their throat, let them belt away.
If someone can come up with a good argument that it causes suffering or inhibits normal healing, that's good information to get too.

Rovi,

Grey areas are where moderators come in alright!

I agree with virtually everything you said there.

In the spirit of your suggestion re WD40, this is from the Material Safety Data Sheet for the product, prepared and published by the manufacturer. The red text below is my emphasis, not theirs.

The Following Controls are Recommended for Normal Consumer Use of this Product
Engineering Controls: [FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]Use in a well-ventilated area.
[/FONT][/FONT]Personal Protection:
Eye Protection: [FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]Avoid eye contact. Always spray away from your face.
[/FONT][/FONT]Skin Protection: [FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]Avoid prolonged skin contact. Chemical resistant gloves recommended for operations where skin contact is likely.
[/FONT][/FONT]Respiratory Protection: [FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]None needed for normal use with adequate ventilation. [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]http://www.wd40.com/files/pdf/msds-wd494716385.pdf[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial][/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]I have also used it regularly without ill effect.......to loosen seized bolts! However it is quite different to suggest spraying it on something I will eat. I personally would rather not. [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial][/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]A major chemical hazard? Probably not.[/FONT][/FONT]

In keeping with what our customers think they are getting when they buy a leg of lamb from 'Ireland the green food island"? Definitely not.

A risk of some ill effects, or a major scandal because some bizarre residue gets found in Irish meat - yes, I think so.

I think there is a world of difference between folk remedies that may do some good, won't do any harm - for example poultices, and taking household chemicals to food animals.

We lose our fear through exposure to highly engineered chemicals like WD40, but they don't get safer just because we are more used to them and their rather pleasant smell in this case. Even highly dangerous carcinogens only affect a proportion of people/animals exposed to them - so a personal anecdote can be highly misleading.

If WD40 smelled like ammonia or sewage we might have more respect for it

A precautionary principle also needs to be applied.

We are making food, after all.

LostCovey
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]
[/FONT][/FONT]

Rovi

LostCovey wrote: »

Rovi,

Grey areas are where moderators come in alright!

I agree with virtually everything you said there.

In the spirit of your suggestion re WD40, this is from the Material Safety Data Sheet for the product, prepared and published by the manufacturer. The red text below is my emphasis, not theirs.

The Following Controls are Recommended for Normal Consumer Use of this Product
Engineering Controls: [FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]Use in a well-ventilated area.
[/FONT][/FONT]Personal Protection:
Eye Protection: [FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]Avoid eye contact. Always spray away from your face.
[/FONT][/FONT]Skin Protection: [FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]Avoid prolonged skin contact. Chemical resistant gloves recommended for operations where skin contact is likely.
[/FONT][/FONT]Respiratory Protection: [FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]None needed for normal use with adequate ventilation. [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]http://www.wd40.com/files/pdf/msds-wd494716385.pdf[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial][/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]I have also used it regularly without ill effect.......to loosen seized bolts! However it is quite different to suggest spraying it on something I will eat. I personally would rather not. [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial][/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]A major chemical hazard? Probably not.[/FONT][/FONT]

In keeping with what our customers think they are getting when they buy a leg of lamb from 'Ireland the green food island"? Definitely not.

A risk of some ill effects, or a major scandal because some bizarre residue gets found in Irish meat - yes, I think so.

I think there is a world of difference between folk remedies that may do some good, won't do any harm - for example poultices, and taking household chemicals to food animals.

We lose our fear through exposure to highly engineered chemicals like WD40, but they don't get safer just because we are more used to them and their rather pleasant smell in this case. Even highly dangerous carcinogens only affect a proportion of people/animals exposed to them - so a personal anecdote can be highly misleading.

If WD40 smelled like ammonia or sewage we might have more respect for it

A precautionary principle also needs to be applied.

We are making food, after all.

LostCovey
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]
[/FONT][/FONT]

^
|
|
And that's a reasoned argument against using it for this purpose.
Exactly what I was talking about in my previous post.


I'd better not tell you about my self-repair method involving insulating tape and superglue

LostCovey

Rovi wrote: »

^
|
|
And that's a reasoned argument against using it for this purpose.
Exactly what I was talking about in my previous post.


I'd better not tell you about my self-repair method involving insulating tape and superglue

I do that myself!

Consistency is over-rated..........

LC

greysides

I've heard Superglue was invented in Vietnam to quickly 'suture' cuts. There is a 'bona fide' medical version. However, make sure the cut is clean and don't seal in dirt/infection.

Orf and Ringworm are two topics that come up very frequently on agricultural forums.

Treatments suggested in many cases could be considered as dermotoxic (Did I just make that term up?).

Jeyes fluid, disinfectant, strong iodine etc.

Waste oil is a frequently suggested treatment for patches of Ringworm. It is high in sulphur and has high concentrations of toxic heavy metals. It probably works by poisoning what it contacts.
(Antibiotics are selective poisons too, BTW)

My opinion is that these may have some benefit as the pathogens concerned are in the outer layers of the skin and killing off those outer layers will kill the pathogens and stop the spread. They may not be the most humane way of doing so though, Jeyes Fluid comes to mind. In parts of rural Ireland it was the drug of choice for a variety of complaints.......of animals. A bit like 'Worm in the Tail' treatments.

There used to be an injection on the market known as 'The Orf Injection'. Curiously, it had the same active ingredient as 'The Ringworm Injection' and the markings were similar. Essentially it was an immune stimulant, containing a form of antimony, if memory serves.

Another forum has posts highly recommending a particular Mineral bucket for Orf. Proper mineral/trace element balance can only help the animals to contain the disease themselves.

As LC has said, the post by Highland is completely correct treatment.

razor8

scabivax is the only cure for orf. but thats no good to cattle man who already has it. im surprised you would get it at this time of year. theres 100's of cures for orf mainly due to the fact it usualy gets better itself especially during dry weather spells

reilig

razor8 wrote: »

im surprised you would get it at this time of year. theres 100's of cures for orf mainly due to the fact it usualy gets better itself especially during dry weather spells

Orf is a major problem in the last few weeks for a lot of sheep farmers that I have been talking to in my area. It must be due to the wet summer that we had. Its normally more common in early spring.

While orf usually gets better itself, I suspect that a lot of people like to treat it to try to prevent the associated infections that come with it. As carers of animals, I suspect that a lot of farmers like to try to treat it to reduce the amount of suffering on the animal because none of us want to see an animal suffer. Whether treatment works or not is a debate that should be left to those with a veterinary qualification.

I have my own remedy for orf which many people laugh at. It works for me and I haven't had orf on the farm since it was done. Chance or coincidence? Maybe. Each to their own, so long as it isn't cruel to the animal.

supersean1999

con orf was the best spray iv ever used, not sure is it around now, i had only one this year and just used the blue alamysin spray on it and gave an injection and it went away

flatout11

greysides wrote: »

I've heard Superglue was invented in Vietnam to quickly 'suture' cuts. There is a 'bona fide' medical version. QUOTE]
the superglue bit its in the movie dog soldiers - strange the things that go on in dem welsh woods!!!