'The Card' threads on the Rugby Forum

bamboozling

Yesterday morning during the Wales vs France world cup semi final, Sam Warburton, Wales captain, was sent off in the 17th minute for a dangerous and reckless tackle.

This tackle is a massive talking point throughout the rugby world, something that hasn't been seen since the Brian O'Driscoill spear incident during the Lions tour of 2005.

Yet the good moderators of the rugby forum have decided we can't discuss this rather important matter. Incredible! Why is this? No justification, no reasoning, no logic given simply a statement that any more threads will result in instant bannings.

Surely a bit of interaction is needed, what exactly is the point of having a rugby union forum if it won't facilitate the discussion of the most talked incident in world rugby for years?

pickarooney

It's been done to death and just keeps descending into a bitchfight. It wasn't even that big a deal in the first place, despite what everyone is trying to make out.

chupacabra

Both sides just keep regurgitating the same stuff over and over and over again. The argument has gone as far as it can go imo

jaykay74

If people want to waste their time arguing why not just let them. If posts are OTT and reported they can be dealt with then. Seems strange to block discussion of the incident when its very high profile all over the media today. People want to give their take on it I guess. Leave them at it

CouchSmart

There should be a thread to discuss it. If people want to that's their prerogative as far as I'm concerned. It was a big aspect of the game and the whole tournament, surely a discussion is valid?

On another note, the Match thread was locked for the same reason. This is more annoying to me. The thread doesn't even get 24 hours? There's so much to discuss - yes the card will come up (it was a major point of the game) but there's a whole lot else to talk about and closing the whole thing seems a bit over the top.

Sandwlch

Its a terrible case of heavy handed modding and a real mistake in their understanding of their role.

The correct decision was to create a card-only post and mod card discussion out of the general match thread,

Then if people feel they have read it all - then they can read match discussion in peace. If they feel they have heard it all on the card, then dont open the card discussion thread.

BUT let those who do want to discuss it do so.

How do you make a formal protest on this one ?

gearoidc

It's a bizarre state of affairs. Incredible really.

"I notice that one moderator "Justsomebloke" describes himself as "getting himself noticed when he shouldn't"

Tells you all you need to know in regard to his decision-making motives and capabilities.

bamboozling

gearoidc wrote: »

"I notice that one moderator "Justsomebloke" describes himself as "getting himself noticed when he shouldn't"

Tells you all you need to know in regard to his decision-making motives and capabilities.

Let's not forget the reprimand he got 2 weeks ago; he went from

As a point of reference this was in a Live match thread.

An Italian player was caught eye gauging an Irish Player (basically one of the the most shocking fouls a player can commit), people reacted immediately to it on the thread. I gave a warning to everyone going forward to watch what they say.

If a professional sports player commits a career threatening tackle on another player, I think people should be allowed a slight bit on grace in their immediate response to the actions of offending player in a live thread as the player is the one who has left himself open due to his actions. People will be warned to not to carry on past the time of the initial incident though which they were

to

It has been pointed out to me by Dav that they way I handled this matter was incorrect. I would like to apologise for my actions in not upholding the letter of the charter and the inconsistencies that this may cause for the other mods of both the rugby forum and other forums.
As it was my mistake no action will be taken against those involved, however in future no abuse will be tolerated

Very revealing I think. With such inconsistent moderation surely it is time to question the moderating abilities of this user.

thomond2006

CouchSmart wrote: »

On another note, the Match thread was locked for the same reason. This is more annoying to me. The thread doesn't even get 24 hours? There's so much to discuss - yes the card will come up (it was a major point of the game) but there's a whole lot else to talk about and closing the whole thing seems a bit over the top.

My 2c.

There was a bit of nonsense regarding the card issue, but considering it was a World Cup semi-final it should have been given more leeway. This was a very big game and merited more dissecting.

ambid

Agree with what's been said here. In the match thread the Mod didn't seem to issue warnings or isolate individuals who were being unreasonable, but just treated everybody the same. Locking the match thread was bizarre and the Mod said any further threads would also be locked - regardless of how the debate was conducted. That seemed excessive. The second thread seemed to be a respectful debate, but was locked anyway.

The mod chose to treat posters on here as if they are kids. He should be disappointed in how he handled the issue.

g'em

bamboozling wrote: »

Let's not forget the reprimand he got 2 weeks ago; he went from

to

Very revealing I think. With such inconsistent moderation surely it is time to question the moderating abilities of this user.

A Mod made a mistake, held their hands up to it, said they're more than willing to learn from it and you're calling for heads to roll? Come off it. The rugby Moda have been doing a sterling job keeping the forum discussions running smoothly and peacefully in the last few weeks given the volume of activity on the forum. They should be commended for their work.

yimrsg

The match day thread got ruined by people focusing discussion on the card and not looking at the match on the whole. Moving the card discussion outside the thread (even though it was a red!) would have at least given the match day thread it's full life, but knowing how most match day threads end up being locked for going off topic this one reached boiling point sooner.

There is a ridiculous amount of posts and threads being made and I've only seen Des, Ruggiebear and Justsomebloke posting so they might be overworked. That's not meant as a pop or a jibe at any of them; just my interpretation of the forum.

To me it just seems that someone has a bee in their bonnet about the rugby mods as the OP was complaining about them being too lenient previously now when a thread is a carcrash they're looking for clemency for a thread.

.ak

I concur with the above statement to the degree that taking the red card incident off thread was the best idea. Let people open up a thread and discuss it, so long as the rules are applied.

I probably wouldn't add anything to that thread, as I think everything that was said was said in the original thread.

I think the mod had the right idea, but should've worded it differently and warn people to open a new thread on the matter rather then closing a match-day thread were we usually go back and dissect a game for it's merit.

CIARAN_BOYLE

There was a couple of lads who degenerated to personal insults and crap around the red card. Mods should have banned those individuals and allowed discussion. They chose to ban the discussion.

Insect Overlord

bamboozling wrote: »

Let's not forget the reprimand he got 2 weeks ago; he went from

to

Very revealing I think. With such inconsistent moderation surely it is time to question the moderating abilities of this user.

That's a really scummy tactic to take in a feedback thread. Pathetic.

ambid

.ak wrote: »

...I think the mod had the right idea, but should've worded it differently and warn people to open a new thread on the matter rather then closing a match-day thread were we usually go back and dissect a game for it's merit.

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

There was a couple of lads who degenerated to personal insults and crap around the red card. Mods should have banned those individuals and allowed discussion. They chose to ban the discussion.

That's the key issue here IMO. The mod had every opportunity to tackle the individuals concerned, but chose to treat everybody as the problem. That's unfair and unnecessary.

Aidric

No surprise. Typical of the overbearing moderating that exists in the Rugby forum.

EmacB

One of the biggest talking points of the worldcup, and we're not allowed discuss it? I think mods have gone way too far banning all dicussion of it. I appreciate its difficult to moderate but its sill a ridiculous decision imho.

wixfjord

The guy is an over zealous OTT mod and this is a ridiculous way to stop talk of one of the biggest rugby issues of the whole WC. It's a discussion forum FFS.
Where are ruggie bear and crash?

wixfjord

Insect Overlord wrote: »

bamboozling wrote: »

Let's not forget the reprimand he got 2 weeks ago; he went from

to

Very revealing I think. With such inconsistent moderation surely it is time to question the moderating abilities of this user.

That's a really scummy tactic to take in a feedback thread. Pathetic.

Bull****. It's a fact and relevant to the discussion. I'd like to get the mods take on it himself.
Seems to lack judgement sense that is obviously needed for a forum as big as the rugby one.

bamboozling

Insect Overlord wrote: »

That's a really scummy tactic to take in a feedback thread. Pathetic.

I don't see how not, his moderating was deemed to be wrong only two weeks ago and here we have another scenario where the majority of the posters think that he was way out of line in this scenario.

It's relevant to this case and I think your objection should be overruled.

Ciaran-Irl

Ridiculous to prohibit discussion. Every paper is discussing it. Rugby people all around the world are talking about it. Why does someone feel they have to decide that every relevant thing has been said, so now everyone must shut up? It's a forum... For like, discussing things. Completely stupid.

MungBean

Ciaran-Irl wrote: »

Ridiculous to prohibit discussion. Every paper is discussing it. Rugby people all around the world are talking about it. Why does someone feel they have to decide that every relevant thing has been said, so now everyone must shut up? It's a forum... For like, discussing things. Completely stupid.

I pm'd Justsomebloke yesterday about the thread and he said he didnt have the time to pick through it. So maybe its not a case of why did he close down the discussion but why isnt there more mods available during the world cup to deal with the forum.

I the same as everyone else have issue with the way this was dealt with but I'm uncomfortable with the attacks on Justsomeblokes character when it looks to me likes its down to the fact that he just didnt have time to babysit a thread that had degenerated or any more that would probably go the same way.

Just out of curiosity did anyone pm him to ask for the second one to be left open based on the fact that it was more civil ? Or for the match day thread to be reopened for match day talk other than the red card ?

Insect Overlord

bamboozling wrote: »

I don't see how not, his moderating was deemed to be wrong only two weeks ago and here we have another scenario where the majority of the posters think that he was way out of line in this scenario.

It's relevant to this case and I think your objection should be overruled.

One solitary decision was deemed to be wrong, and not, as you're trying to suggest, his moderation in general. As MungBean has already said, you're attacking the guy's character. That's a heinous way of trying to get attention.

BoarHunter

Coming back on the fact, I think you can't accuse rolland of being inconsistent

http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2056125885?page=22#post_70253885

Being in a wc semi should't change the laws of the game.

Funny to hear the sky commentators adhering totally with the red card when it's a french man being sent off

thomond2006

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056422005

No offence to justsomebloke personally, but this is an appalling rule. "Instantly banned", seriously? Seems a reactionary rule more than anything else. As someone said why shouldn't there a thread on the card itself if it is derailing the match thread?

IMO it wasn't derailing the match thread in the first place because it was the key event of the match. I really think the moderating is OTT at times, some users have stopped posting on the forum because of it. I appreciate the mods are volunteering their time to help out but I think the mods need to adopt a laissez faire attitude sometimes.

The match day thread got ruined by people focusing discussion on the card and not looking at the match on the whole

But this happens all the time. It's rare that you get a general discussion/reaction to the whole game right after it. Normally the key issue of the game dominates for the first few hours (we see this in Ireland match threads after almost every game for example) and subsequently this filters out and more components of the game start getting mentioned.

MungBean

I think we just need another mod to be available. When a thread is let degenerate for 10-15 pages the thread is beyond manageable.

I've seen Justsomebloke handling certain things well when he caught them early. Delete offending posts, issue warning and the discussion proceeds in a civilised fashion. But it takes time and if the mods doesnt have it he only has one alternative, kill the discussion rather than allow a free for all.

I understand where people are coming from wanting to discuss it but from a mods point of view is it as easy as tell everyone to be nice after 10-15 pages of arguments or is closing the thread the best solution. I think the problem was that there was nobody there to moderate the actual discussion.

As for the next thread discussing the same point he did make it clear the thread would be closed, so I dont see why the OP couldnt have cleared it with him first or waited to get feedback from the cmods before starting it and putting Justsomebloke in an awkward position where the OP had clearly and openly argued with his decision.

Its all very nice in retrospect to say people want to discuss it but people did discuss it and it turned into a mess. So I dont think Justsomebloke was wrong to do what he did. I just think the Rugby forum needs more attention maybe. With another mod available if the other listed mods are not. Bar Justsomebloke, Ruggiebear and maybe 1-2 posts from Des I havent seen hide nor hair of the others since I've been posting there.

No doubt the forum will quieten down after the world cup anyway though. During the world cup though I think a regular poster should have been drafted to help out with spam and trolls and keep the discussion from becoming personal.

TL;DR - Problem is nobody moderating the discussions and that leads to whats seen as heavy handed decisions when things get out of control.

thomond2006

Why didn't we just re-open the old thread?

hellofromanon

Well I'm not much of a posting person but I absolutely love reading some of the opinions on the rugby forum. Over the years I have seen some brilliant posters simply stop posting because of the over zealous moderators. Another problem is that for whatever reason (maybe because so many of the actual regular posters are Munster fans) you can't even criticise a Munster player (or former coach for that matter) without being accused of trolling and being biased. Indeed a regular poster who I have watched for years, Phog, regularly calls for other users to report posters who criticise Munster players and not once have I ever seen the mods infract Phog. The forum has really taken a dive since justsomebloke has come in however. He is too eager to lock threads, he bans and infracts even quicker than Ruggiebear (who from what I can see is bad enough) and he bans discussion around contentious issues. A good mod should be able to handle these sorts of things, from what I can see both Ruggiebear and Justsomebloke cave to peer pressure from Munster posters to ban users who criticise their provinces players (much higher proportion of banned users over the years have been Leinster) and have the rugby forum running like a Nazi dictatorship. The Rugby Forum isn't even close to being in the top 30 busiest forums on this website yet it regularly features in feedback. Something has been needed to be done for years and I think the solution is a new mod team. I think GerM and Emmet02 should be installed as the new mods, both are the only 2 consistently reasonable and level headed people on the forum and they are actual regulars and contribute regularly. But then what do I know, I am just a reader. Slinking off into the shadows now, bye.

Chucky the tree

Any of the mods planning on explaing their decision?

tricky D

One of the biggest events is being debated everywhere else except here, on a discussion board of all places. That is just not right. Sure posters will cause problems but as CIARAN BOYLE noted, you deal with at the poster level, not the whole discussion level. The mods should rethink their level of banning discussions outright, it seems to be much more common than usual compared to the rest of boards, to the detriment of the Rugby forum. I'm a fan but don't bother with the forum.