Ireland u20 6 Nations & World Cup 2012

irishbucsfan

Former Coach wrote: »

Sherlock simply wasn't picked for World Cup. He played in 6 Nations but TOH was injured for most of it.

He was injured! Also TOH was left out of the 6 Nations team when fit on at least one occasion, definitely.

bilston

Former Coach wrote: »

Not sure what you mean by that comment! Are you saying that if Leinster win the Heineken Cup they're not the best team???

Well put it another way then, if Ulster win the Heineken Cup will they be the best team in Europe?

Former Coach

bilston wrote: »

Well put it another way then, if Ulster win the Heineken Cup will they be the best team in Europe?

I'd argue that any team winning a Heineken Cup/World Cup/Super 15/ 6 Nations etc etc could justifiably lay claim to being the best team in the competition.
And, yes, that includes Ulster if they win the final.... although I don't expect them to.

ScareGilly

profitius wrote: »

Qualter and Finn are not on that list. They could be injured ormaybe dropped.

Apparently there's a rumour going around that Qualter was smoking and drinking in the same pub as Mike Ruddock and that's why... I don't see why either would be dropped tbh, Qualter played well in the 6 nations and didn't Conor Finn start almost every game?

easyeas wrote: »

Qualter and finn dropped and rightly so. Both not good enough and Buckley wasn't picked for 6 nations but was very impressive in that game against Munster development side. Sherlock will start fullback IMO way better then Leyden or nelson just very unlucky with injuries. Just because Connacht won interpros doesn't guarantee there players a place to south africa

Both not good enough but played the majority of the 6 nations for Ireland... That makes sense?

easyeas wrote: »

From what I've heard
McCall out for world cup knee surgery
Leyden out for world cup with broken leg
Conneelly is injured in a freak accident holding a bag and might have to retire I heard

Where on earth did you hear all that? Leyden with a broken leg? And that ridiculous statement about Aaron Conneely?

its_phil

ScareGilly wrote: »

Apparently there's a rumour going around that Qualter was smoking and drinking in the same pub as Mike Ruddock and that's why... I don't see why either would be dropped tbh, Qualter played well in the 6 nations and didn't Conor Finn start almost every game?

Both not good enough but played the majority of the 6 nations for Ireland... That makes sense?

Where on earth did you hear all that? Leyden with a broken leg? And that ridiculous statement about Aaron Conneely?

it isn't the first time he's made up stuff about Connacht players.

Hagz

ScareGilly wrote: »

and didn't Conor Finn start almost every game?

After Barry Daly injured himself. Now that Sherlock is back, there's probably just no room for him.

irishbucsfan

George Ford was man of the match in the Premiership semi final. He was born in 1993!

I'd imagine he'll be in the English squad for the JWC unless he travels with the senior squad. Just makes an already strong team even stronger.

Tox56

irishbucsfan wrote: »

George Ford was man of the match in the Premiership semi final. He was born in 1993!

I'd imagine he'll be in the English squad for the JWC unless he travels with the senior squad. Just makes an already strong team even stronger.

Pretty sure he isnt going on either and is staying home to be conditioned, or something like that.

irishbucsfan

Tox56 wrote: »

Pretty sure he isnt going on either and is staying home to be conditioned, or something like that.

I suppose he's been playing for the 20s since he was 17 so they might leave it to someone else and fast track him for senior level.

ScareGilly

Hagz wrote: »

After Barry Daly injured himself. Now that Sherlock is back, there's probably just no room for him.

Ahh right, cheers...

ormond lad

IrishRugby TV videos with Conor Gilsenan here, Luke McGrath here and Jack Conan here

RuggaBugga

The boys seem confident.. Call me ambitious, but i think we can pull of an upset and make it to the finals..

KJY

I think the bulk of the English and presumably SA will be too much. They are talented but that English match was men against boys

Hagz

RuggaBugga wrote: »

The boys seem confident.. Call me ambitious, but i think we can pull of an upset and make it to the finals..

Your ambitious.

RuggaBugga

Haha, so i'm assuming that there's not even the smallest inkling of hope in you guys?

the perfect ten

What is happening with regard to Paddy Jackson? There was a story in the Irish Times on Wednesday that Ulster wanted to withdraw him from the squad. If so, who is Mike Ruddock likely to bring in? Is Cathal Marsh back to full fitness as he had to miss the trial match against the Munster Development XV a couple of weeks ago? I would not like to see Hanrahan moved from 12 to 10 as it would upset the balance of the backline.

bilston

the perfect ten wrote: »

What is happening with regard to Paddy Jackson? There was a story in the Irish Times on Wednesday that Ulster wanted to withdraw him from the squad. If so, who is Mike Ruddock likely to bring in? Is Cathal Marsh back to full fitness as he had to miss the trial match against the Munster Development XV a couple of weeks ago? I would not like to see Hanrahan moved from 12 to 10 as it would upset the balance of the backline.

I would imagine if fit Cathal Marsh would be 10 in that case with support from Olding and Hanrahan in whatever order.

its_phil

Layden out of the tournament

.ak

its_phil wrote: »

Layden out of the tournament

Bugger!

GerM

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I suppose he's been playing for the 20s since he was 17 so they might leave it to someone else and fast track him for senior level.

U20 since he was 17 and senior rugby since he was 16! Think it's the right call to keep him off the radar and working on his conditioning. He's still very lightweight despite his talent. Another summer in the spotlight will just increase the hype around him. As the current IRB young player of year, he'd be a marked man also.

Hype710

Jackson pulled from squad apparently.

http://thefrontrowunion.com/2012/05/jwc2012-jackson-pulled-from-ireland-u20-squad/

Marsh, Hanrahan and Olding all capable of playing 10 but losing Jackson is a big loss to the team's chances.

the perfect ten

If Jackson and Layden are both out then surely Ruddock will have to bring one or two more in - for backup if nothing else. They are bound to pick up some more injuries in the course of the tournament.

RoundBox11

Sucks for Jackson!

That seems a bit selfish to stop him from going because he'll miss some of pre season. I mean it's a world cup. I think our already slim chances are now non existent without Jackson.

Cheers Ulster. Way to take one for the team

bilston

RoundBox11 wrote: »

Sucks for Jackson!

That seems a bit selfish to stop him from going because he'll miss some of pre season. I mean it's a world cup. I think our already slim chances are now non existent without Jackson.

Cheers Ulster. Way to take one for the team

We had no chance whether Jackson was there or not. Most Leinster fans I spoke to at the final were happy to tell me that Marsh is better anyway!

Seriously though Jackson has played in a JWC and appears to be Ulsters first choice 10 and has played in a HEC final, would someone like Marsh not benefit more playing in a JWC? It also means Olding might get a game as well.

Having said that on an individual level I would argue the best thing for Jackson would be to get straight back on the horse after the HEC final but if he's going to be Ulster's first choice 10 then you can understand their thinking.

RuggaBugga

It's a big loss to lose Paddy, but I honestly think that Marsh can do as well a job if not better than what Paddy would have done. Besides, Paddy is rather inconsistent.

So England, Ireland and South Africa have all lost their first choice flyhalves for this tournament it shall be interesting..

bilston

RuggaBugga wrote: »

It's a big loss to lose Paddy, but I honestly think that Marsh can do as well a job if not better than what Paddy would have done. Besides, Paddy is rather inconsistent.

So England, Ireland and South Africa have all lost their first choice flyhalves for this tournament it shall be interesting..

There you go then, nothing to worry about...Ireland don't need Jackson...Marsh is the man

Hagz

RuggaBugga wrote: »

l lost their first choice flyhalves for this tournament it shall be interesting..

are you ruggerbugger 67

RuggaBugga

Hagz wrote: »

are you ruggerbugger 67

Nope.

Hagz

RuggaBugga wrote: »

Nope.

Oh, just a coincidence then.

.ak

I like Marsh n all. I think he's got something about him, he's a clever footballer and has that 'x factor' about him.. having said that, there's probably a good reason he doesn't even start on the Leinster A games. He likes to link up in the midfield and as I said can be clever in that regard, but the chap is tiny and looks suspiciously out of place on a rugby field. Not that he won't bulk up, it's just I think he'd be easily targeted by better conditioned teams.

ormond lad

.ak wrote: »

I like Marsh n all. I think he's got something about him, he's a clever footballer and has that 'x factor' about him.. having said that, there's probably a good reason he doesn't even start on the Leinster A games. He likes to link up in the midfield and as I said can be clever in that regard, but the chap is tiny and looks suspiciously out of place on a rugby field. Not that he won't bulk up, it's just I think he'd be easily targeted by better conditioned teams.

C Marsh always has been tiny. he was when playing minis rugby in bective rangers as a 7 and 8 year old and dont think size has ever been an issue for him when playing all through schools rugby or now at adult level. size will only really affect him oif he plays at the very top level

RuggaBugga

His size is a BIG problem, I can see opposition teams picking his channel to run through a lot. It shouldn't be much of a problem on attack if our forwards secure good ball for him to work with..

profitius

Marsh is 5'10" and almost 12st 8lb. The same size as George Ford! He was excellent against England last year even though Ireland took a hammering.

shuffol

Mathew Morgan is only 5'8" and less than 12 stone. Marsh is small but not prohibitively so. Hope he gets the nod, very gifted player but well down the ranks at Leinster so could do with the exposure.

Fishooks12

From a Munster point of view I'd like to see JJ at ten. Really think he has the attributes for the position and we're badly in need of an exciting young ten

irishbucsfan

shuffol wrote: »

Mathew Morgan is only 5'8" and less than 12 stone. Marsh is small but not prohibitively so. Hope he gets the nod, very gifted player but well down the ranks at Leinster so could do with the exposure.

Matthew Morgan is too small though!

Not that I think Marsh is too small for u20s. Morgan was brilliant at u20s

boynesider

How on earth is 5'10 too small for a back? Dan Carter, Wilkinson, BOD are all 5'10, as is Paddy Jackson by the way. Even Madigan is 5'9 and he is twice the defender than a 6 foot ROG. It would be crazy to write Marsh off for being that height. Defence is all about courage and technique and from what I've seen of him he has those qualities.

Anyway it is a poor move to remove PJ from the tour. The best thing for him after the H Cup final would have been to play rugby again.

Layden is a big loss but the return of Peter Nelson should make up for it.

I think the team could surprise a few people out there. Furlong is a massive addition to the front row and I can see us causing an upset against England or the Boks. This is a good group of players, although lacking the sort of top quality backs which we have been lucky enough to have in recent years.

Marsh isn't imposing. He has a slight build and struggled to bulk up from what I have heard.

It's so frustrating that the game may be heading in the direction of losing guys like Reid and Marsh to guys of superior size but far less ability.

Marsh reminds me of Paddy Wallace tbh. Tricky, incredibly smart, but just looks like he's going to get hurt out there. He's a serious talent though, but may need a year off to eat and lift weights

Hype710

10 Hanrahan
12 Farrell
13 Daly

is far less likely to get eaten alive than Marsh and Hanrahan in midfield.

15 Nelson
14 Sherlock
11 Coughlan Murray

would be how I would complete the backline.

Cpt_Blackbeard

Hype710 wrote: »

10 Hanrahan
12 Farrell
13 Daly

I'd really like to see a Hanrahan-Farrell 10-12 axis. With the way things are going, we are going to need a big b*astard at 12 going forward and Farrell fits the bill perfectly. I'm not too fussed if Hanrahan plays 10 or 12 as long as he plays, but from a Munster point of view I'd like to see him do well at 10 in the tournament.

Quint2010

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

I'd really like to see a Hanrahan-Farrell 10-12 axis. With the way things are going, we are going to need a big b*astard at 12 going forward and Farrell fits the bill perfectly. I'm not too fussed if Hanrahan plays 10 or 12 as long as he plays, but from a Munster point of view I'd like to see him do well at 10 in the tournament.

There is one or two on the way from this years U18 schools team..

jacothelad

boynesider wrote: »

How on earth is 5'10 too small for a back? Dan Carter, Wilkinson, BOD are all 5'10, as is Paddy Jackson by the way. Even Madigan is 5'9 and he is twice the defender than a 6 foot ROG.

ROG's measurements are 'beyond' normal.

boynesider

Actually I forgot that Sherlock is back. Pity Layden is injured because a back 3 of him, Sherlock and Nelson would have been very exciting, although they would all be more natural fullbacks than wingers.

I would also like to see Hanrahan at 10. He is the sort of player you want with the ball as much as possible. I think Farrell is better off at 12 as he has always looked very awkward positionally at 13 whenever I've seen him play.

Hagz

Hype710 wrote: »

10 Hanrahan
12 Farrell
13 Daly

is far less likely to get eaten alive than Marsh and Hanrahan in midfield.

15 Nelson
14 Sherlock
11 Coughlan Murray

would be how I would complete the backline.

That looks like the best possible line up.

RuggaBugga

Seeing that we start with South Africa and then England, who should we play our strongest team against? We have to rotate the team and rest some players, but against who?

thebaz

Hagz wrote: »

That looks like the best possible line up.

I thought Daly was a wing ?

RuggaBugga

thebaz wrote: »

I thought Daly was a wing ?

He plays centre and wing, his got the size for it too.. Played there for the u20s against Leinster Development in December

phog

Not sure if this was mentioned earlier in the thread - Ml Corcoran tweeted

TG4 to show @irfurugby games at Junior World Cup, 4/6 South Africa 545pm, 8/6 England 545pm and 12/6 Italy 145pm, Irish time

siltirocker

I don't care if I speak Gaelige at a pass level Junior Cert at best, I love TG4's dedication to show us Rugger-bay!

Tox56

It is on Sky Sports too right?