The Truth about Ireland's Puppy farms - tomoro @ 10pm TV3

ISDW

softmee wrote: »

This is not the way it is in Poland. If you buy pedigree dog there you can be sure its well treated.

_and why are all my donedeal links deleted???? Do you protect puppy farms boards????

So do the Polish kennel club do DNA tests on all pups and parents? Fantastic if they do.

Maybe you need to consider how many dogs have ended up in rescue here in Ireland because Polish people lived here, bought them, have now gone home and just dumped them. I am not saying anything against Poland or Polish people, but if, as you say, they treat dogs so well there, why have they not taking their dogs home with them when they go?

falabo wrote: »

well this is a politician response. they claim not to support puppy farms but yet they delete links to donedeal ads...

That logic is incredible. Puppy farmers aren't allowed to advertise on boards, so that means they are supporting them Even if you are putting a link up to complain about conditions etc, you are still giving a wider audience to their 'product', and it may actually help them to sell a dog - I imagine you don't want to do that:)

softmee

ISDW wrote: »

So do the Polish kennel club do DNA tests on all pups and parents? Fantastic if they do.

Maybe you need to consider how many dogs have ended up in rescue here in Ireland because Polish people lived here, bought them, have now gone home and just dumped them. I am not saying anything against Poland or Polish people, but if, as you say, they treat dogs so well there, why have they not taking their dogs home with them when they go?

-above has nothing to do with my post, I know there is many idiots treating dogs like toys for their kids.. I was only saying pedigree dogs are really under control in Poland -most of them and if you buy pedigree dog you can be like 95% sure it is coming from a good place. Also as far as I know most of pedigree breeders do all kind of tests.
Sure it is not ideal there and just as many bad things happen, but kennel clubs have more control it seems.

Zapperzy

caseyann wrote: »

I agree alot more animal lovers and dog lovers in Ireland than the latter of this show.And it is disgraceful they would say that for a minority.
They should have said there is alot of uneducated people who want a dog now and dont consider it could be puppy farmers who treat the dogs badly.As they themselves cant imagine people can do that.
I hate these shows they blame everyone,when the only people at fault are the ones who puppy farm and the law for not changing it so they can take the animals immediately and ban those people from ever having any kind of animal again.
To the show could not watch makes me sick and i cant do anything about it.:(

And those who continue to buy from puppy farms whether through sympathy, lack of education or just wanting a puppy now and not caring where it comes from. These people are to blame too!

How many people do you know with dogs who were bought from any old paddy-joe and mary down the road who just happened to have a purebred female yorkie/bichon/husky and bred them to a dog of the same breed without any consideration to health or temperment? Just thought it'd be a fun way to make an extra few bob and it'd be fun for the grand kids to have a few puppys around to play with. The majority of ads are from these types of people and are what I would describe as puppy farmers, hell I'v got one living 2 doors down from me who has a shih tzu who was bred with a shih tzu x at under a year old and who intends on breeding her again soon. You'd think she's the model dog owner, keeps her dogs in the house, walks them, feeds them pedigree/cesar muck, keeps them well groomed but at the end of the day there's no health tests done, the bitch is just an ordinary run of the mill pet bought from the likes of what I described above and there's no doubt the sire will just be a dog picked out from the likes of donedeal who just happened to be the cheapest shih tzu near her with a set of balls advertsied for stud. Now I'm sure she see's nothing wrong with this, she sees her happy, well groomed dog lying in front of the fire and thinks how lovely it would be to contribute more little happy puppys to the world, there's no way she'd throw herself into the same group as the likes of what was seen last night, urine soaked bitches in cages kept in cold sheds. But I see no difference.

These types of owners are absolutely everywhere and when you start digging down into that type of stuff you get a very pessimistic view of the dog world and see just how many irresponsible dog owners there are whether they mean to be irresponsible or not.

caseyann

Zapperzy wrote: »

And those who continue to buy from puppy farms whether through sympathy, lack of education or just wanting a puppy now and not caring where it comes from. These people are to blame too!

How many people do you know with dogs who were bought from any old paddy-joe and mary down the road who just happened to have a purebred female yorkie/bichon/husky and bred them to a dog of the same breed without any consideration to health or temperment? Just thought it'd be a fun way to make an extra few bob and it'd be fun for the grand kids to have a few puppys around to play with. The majority of ads are from these types of people and are what I would describe as puppy farmers, hell I'v got one living 2 doors down from me who has a shih tzu who was bred with a shih tzu x at under a year old and who intends on breeding her again soon. You'd think she's the model dog owner, keeps her dogs in the house, walks them, feeds them pedigree/cesar muck, keeps them well groomed but at the end of the day there's no health tests done, the bitch is just an ordinary run of the mill pet bought from the likes of what I described above and there's no doubt the sire will just be a dog picked out from the likes of donedeal who just happened to be the cheapest shih tzu near her with a set of balls advertsied for stud. Now I'm sure she see's nothing wrong with this, she sees her happy, well groomed dog lying in front of the fire and thinks how lovely it would be to contribute more little happy puppys to the world, there's no way she'd throw herself into the same group as the likes of what was seen last night, urine soaked bitches in cages kept in cold sheds. But I see no difference.

These types of owners are absolutely everywhere and when you start digging down into that type of stuff you get a very pessimistic view of the dog world and see just how many irresponsible dog owners there are whether they mean to be irresponsible or not.

Does not make them bad pet owners nor does it make them bad people like the puppy farmers.
And should not have been said in the show about Irish people as a whole.

star-pants

softmee - As I have already said if you have an issue with a donedeal ad take it up with them, do not circumvent our rules by copying a photo and description from a donedeal and reposting it here. This is the last warning I will give, anyone doing so will get a ban next time.

softmee

ISDW wrote: »

S


That logic is incredible. Puppy farmers aren't allowed to advertise on boards, so that means they are supporting them

-no, poster that you quoted never said anything like that (that they are not allow to advertise on boards!)

softmee

star-pants wrote: »

softmee - As I have already said if you have an issue with a donedeal ad take it up with them, do not circumvent our rules by copying a photo and description from a donedeal and reposting it here. This is the last warning I will give, anyone doing so will get a ban next time.

-I never said where that picture is coming from

andreac

caseyann wrote: »

Does not make them bad pet owners nor does it make them bad people like the puppy farmers.
And should not have been said in the show about Irish people as a whole.

Yes it does!! They are just as bad as the big time puppy farmers as they dont care about the dogs, they only care about making money and lots of it!!!

They see their lovely pets as money making machines, nothing more!!!

Caseyann, its this attitude that keeps these bloody puppy farmers in business and until your attitude changes, its the likes of yourself that will fund these back yard breeders and contribute to the huge problem of all the unwanted dogs in Ireland due to everyone and anyone breeding, just for the sake of it!!:mad:

andreac

softmee wrote: »

-I never said where that picture is coming from

Eh, you can see the name of the website on it....:rolleyes:

star-pants

softmee wrote: »

-I never said where that picture is coming from

The large Donedeal watermark gave it away...

caseyann

andreac wrote: »

Yes it does!! They are just as bad as the big time puppy farmers as they dont care about the dogs, they only care about making money and lots of it!!!

They see their lovely pets as money making machines, nothing more!!!

Caseyann, its this attitude that keeps these bloody puppy farmers in business and until your attitude changes, its the likes of yourself that will fund these back yard breeders and contribute to the huge problem of all the unwanted dogs in Ireland due to everyone and anyone breeding, just for the sake of it!!:mad:

Are you accusing me of buying from back yard breeders? :rolleyes:Funny i dont recall writing that.

softmee

star-pants wrote: »

The large Donedeal watermark gave it away...

-ok, sorry, so can I post pictures without watermarks?

softmee

andreac wrote: »

Eh, you can see the name of the website on it....:rolleyes:

So what? They should be ashamed of advertising anything like that, dont you think so?

star-pants

softmee wrote: »

-ok, sorry, so can I post pictures without watermarks?

No, I don't think you're understanding the rule here, you cannot link or quote such adverts, again if you have issue take it up with that website, do not bring it onto this forum.

Softmee - if you have issue with that site, take it up with them - please do not post anymore in this thread regarding that or other sites.

softmee

star-pants wrote: »

No, I don't think you're understanding the rule here, you cannot link or quote such adverts, again if you have issue take it up with that website, do not bring it onto this forum.

Softmee - if you have issue with that site, take it up with them - please do not post anymore in this thread regarding that or other sites.

Ok Ok Ok -I don't understand why, but fine

andreac

caseyann wrote: »

Are you accusing me of buying from back yard breeders? :rolleyes:Funny i dont recall writing that.

Where did i accuse you of anything? But having the attitude of thinking these back yard breeders are not like puppy farmers and saying its ok to buy one of their pups, is exactly the same as saying its ok to buy from a puppy farmer because they are both the same in my opinion!!

I said people like yourself who have this opinion that its ok to buy from a back yard breeder as they are not the same as a puppy farmer... when they are exatle the same!!

Zapperzy

caseyann wrote: »

Does not make them bad pet owners nor does it make them bad people like the puppy farmers.
And should not have been said in the show about Irish people as a whole.

Can't remember what exactly was said in the show about irish people as a whole but all I'l say is that there are bad apples in every culture and country, it's the percentage of bad apples that's being debated here. I wouldn't hold any country up as a shining example because I know whatever country I pick a quick google search will show up some horrific animal cruelty that has happened or is going on in that country. But it still stands that we have a much higher pts rate in our pounds than countries of a similar population, so something is going wrong with dog owners in this country.

No I'm sure these people are wonderful pet owners, as I said they have their dogs in the house, they're well groomed, well fed, vaccinated every year and wormed regularly, I'm sure the dogs are well looked after but it still stands that if they are breeding from their dog with no consideration to health (through health tests. Vaccinated and wormed regularly and a quick once over from a vet is not enough) or temperment (as my above example of my neighbour one of her dogs she bred from has other dog issues) then they are a puppy farmer just on a smaller scale. If someone buys from this type of breeder then they are contributing to puppy farming, it doesn't matter how well looked the pup will be, the harm is already done in that the money is handed over.

Yes there is a difference between the man in the show in that he had dogs living in filth and plain to see cruelty and neglect, and the type of breeder I described who is a bad breeder out of ignorance. Obviously it would be a brilliant start to rid the country of this first type of puppy farmer but the smaller scale ones should not be forgotten about, they can do as much damage.

ISDW

softmee wrote: »

-above has nothing to do with my post, I know there is many idiots treating dogs like toys for their kids.. I was only saying pedigree dogs are really under control in Poland -most of them and if you buy pedigree dog you can be like 95% sure it is coming from a good place. Also as far as I know most of pedigree breeders do all kind of tests.
Sure it is not ideal there and just as many bad things happen, but kennel clubs have more control it seems.

You didn't answer my question.

Do the Polish kennel club do DNA tests on the dogs to ensure that the parents named on the papers are actually the parents of the pups?

ISDW

I'm not sure if this is against the rules or not, I won't put the link up,but this is taken from a site in the UK, I can give anyone who wants it the link if they pm me:

There is an article in todays Sunday People 12/9/10
It warns people about buying puppies which are born in puppy
farms in Poland,Czech Republic, Hungary and Romania then transported to Ireland and to U K via Northern Ireland then sold for a quick profit

These would obviously be pedigree dogs

Shammy

There is a big difference between people who love dogs and people who know about dogs.

The majority of Irish people are uneduacted when it comes to buying a dog breeding a dog and bringing up a dog.

caseyann

andreac wrote: »

Where did i accuse you of anything? But having the attitude of thinking these back yard breeders are not like puppy farmers and saying its ok to buy one of their pups, is exactly the same as saying its ok to buy from a puppy farmer because they are both the same in my opinion!!

I said people like yourself who have this opinion that its ok to buy from a back yard breeder as they are not the same as a puppy farmer... when they are exatle the same!!

Where the hell did i say anything of the sort. Where did i even mention back yard breeders?Or say any of it right?
Jump on someone elses posts thanks.

andreac

caseyann wrote: »

Does not make them bad pet owners nor does it make them bad people like the puppy farmers.
And should not have been said in the show about Irish people as a whole.

Casey, this your post, see above. You were replying to Zapperzy posts about back yard breeders and saying they arent the same as puppy farmers, when they are....

caseyann

andreac wrote: »

Casey, this your post, see above. You were replying to Zapperzy posts about back yard breeders and saying they arent the same as puppy farmers, when they are....

Not one place in there does that say anything about backyard breeders or puppy farms.
It says pet owners

star-pants

Final warning, next person to go on about Donedeal in this thread is getting banned - I'm sick of saying it over and over. Do NOT respond to this message either.

andreac

caseyann wrote: »

Not one place in there does that say anything about backyard breeders or puppy farms.
It says pet owners

Casey, you replied to Zapperzy post who WAS talking about back yard breeders, and you said, it doesnt make them bad owners like the puppy farmers, which in fact it does, as these "pet owners" breeding are back yard breeders, exactly the same as puppy farmers!!!

DBB

caseyann wrote: »

And should not have been said in the show about Irish people as a whole.

It was not. The presenter specifically said at the start of the show that "most" dog owners in Ireland cared well for their dogs.
Personally, I don't agree, but I wanted to correct an untrue assertion you're making about the show.

borderlinemeath

Caseyann, while I see where you're coming from with thinking that loving pet owners aren't contributing to the problem - the truth is that while the back yard breeder may treat his dogs better than the puppy farmer - the end result is almost the same - an oversupply of puppies and dogs that haven't been health tested for genetic diseases that are contributing to the very large amount of dogs that end up in pounds and rescues.

It's just a pity it wasn't touched on in the programme, I think a lot of people would be "aware" of puppy farms and think that buying from a byb who has a litter from their family pet is the right thing to do.

caseyann

DBB wrote: »

It was not. The presenter specifically said at the start of the show that "most" dog owners in Ireland cared well for their dogs.
Personally, I don't agree, but I wanted to correct an untrue assertion you're making about the show.

I didnt make any assertion i read from the other poster.

lrushe

Was a bit disappointed that health testing wasn't mentioned once during the programme. The breeder of the Shelties seemed to have done most things right but she never mentioned any health testing she had done before breeding her dogs therefore I don't think she should have been held up as a model breeder.

caseyann

borderlinemeath wrote: »

Caseyann, while I see where you're coming from with thinking that loving pet owners aren't contributing to the problem - the truth is that while the back yard breeder may treat his dogs better than the puppy farmer - the end result is almost the same - an oversupply of puppies and dogs that haven't been health tested for genetic diseases that are contributing to the very large amount of dogs that end up in pounds and rescues.

It's just a pity it wasn't touched on in the programme, I think a lot of people would be "aware" of puppy farms and think that buying from a byb who has a litter from their family pet is the right thing to do.

Thank god someone can read here.Rather than accusing me of saying things i didnt.

I never said it was right i said simply people who buy them dogs are not bad people and do not love their dogs any less.It just means they are uneducated and dont realize who they are buying from.
People have been buying dogs and getting dogs for decades from people who arent legalized breeders.The mentality needs to change.