50% of Greece's Debt written off

Chuck Stone

Chuck Stone wrote: »

So can someone tell me who loses out with the 50% write down?

Is it bond holders? Tax payers?

Who?

Quite likely the pensioners who have their pension with a bank that invested in Greek bonds, followed by taxpayers who have to bail out the bank running that pension fund.

The Left Hand Of God

Chuck Stone wrote: »

So can someone tell me who loses out with the 50% write down?

Is it bond holders? Tax payers?

Who?

Everyone. Via Taxes.

Taxes used to pay for things. Now they are paying back money to banks etc

And not just us, the rest of Europe and the USA too.

It's a sham of the highest order

Bailout explained

Greeks getting really pissed off with Germany.
Image
Report
OK it's the Daily Mail, but they're only reporting what the greeks think!

The image looks like it came from an episode of "allo, allo"

Thrill

Greece debt crisis: referendum promised on EU deal


Greece will hold a referendum on a new European Union aid package intended to resolve the country's debt crisis, Prime Minister George Papandreou says.


Mr Papandreou said a vote of no-confidence would also be held on the deal - but no dates were set.


The package envisages losses of up to 50% for private holders of Greek debt and a new 100bn euro loan ($140bn).


There have been large-scale protests in Greece against the austerity measures introduced by the government.


Mr Papandreou said his government trusted the judgement of Greek voters.
"The command of the Greek people will bind us", he is quoted as saying by the AFP news agency.


An opinion poll published on Saturday by a newspaper, To Vima, suggested that the majority of people in Greece viewed the EU bailout package in a negative light.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-15526719

Freddie59

Annnnnd:

Europe tells everyone else to pi$$ off:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/1031/eueconomy.html

It just gets better. FFS what is going on?

parrai

Europe is sickened cause they are in trouble, that's what is happening...
What will be really interesting will be if China say 'no, we can't help you'.

The problem of runaway debt is getting so big now, it's only a matter of time before someone hits that little red "reset" button and changes the basis of money to something else.

Debt-based money appears to have reached its limits of expansion, total collapse is looking increasing likely without change!

The upcoming G20 meeting will be very interesting.

homerjay2005

I am pie wrote: »

Yeah, right, the EU, the IMF and the ECB all looked at a few thousands Greeks throwing rocks and decided they had better give them 50 % of their bank loans.

FFS.

Greece are being allowed to enter into a managed default. Nothing at all to do with protesting on the street and everything to do with the banks realising that 50% is better than 0%. This won't be a free lunch.

exactly. causing riots will hit the news and make things look worse from people looking in, like we have no food or money and we are in meltdown and all this.

the reality is, making a fuss wont do jack s*it. the damage was done 5 years ago and we will only get things softened in terms of debt if we are going to bring down the euro, which is what was potentially happening in greece.

Freddie59

homerjay2005 wrote: »

exactly. causing riots will hit the news and make things look worse from people looking in, like we have no food or money and we are in meltdown and all this.

the reality is, making a fuss wont do jack s*it. the damage was done 5 years ago and we will only get things softened in terms of debt if we are going to bring down the euro, which is what was potentially happening in greece.

The reality - and the point being missed - is that Greece as a country brought this upon itself. Ireland did not. Bankers and developers did. And the ordinary citizen foots the bill? A fcuking joke shop if ever there was one.

Crazy Horse 6

Just as well i'm broke because i would'nt want to have money in any European bank. The euro is going to be pretty much worthless in a few weeks. I predicted we would be back to crisis mode in a month after the can kicking exercise last week but it looks like it will be much much sooner than that.

Crazy Horse 6

Freddie59 wrote: »

The reality - and the point being missed - is that Greece as a country brought this upon itself. Ireland did not. Bankers and developers did. And the ordinary citizen foots the bill? A fcuking joke shop if ever there was one.

Whilst the banksters,developers and political elite had a huge hand in bringing our country down the ordinary citizen had a part to play also and that must not be overlooked.

Crazy Horse 6

Crazy Horse 6 wrote: »

Whilst the banksters,developers and political elite had a huge hand in bringing our country down some of the ordinary citizens had a part to play also and that must not be overlooked.

fyp, we didn't all max out out borrowings.

5live

Deleted User wrote: »

fyp, we didn't all max out out borrowings.

No but we do have collective responsibility.

The Greek debt even with the writedown will be 120% of GDP, with a declining economy and the possibility of even more hidden deficits being discovered. So in 6 months, there will have to be another writedown of greek debt. One of the economists writing in the Indo (Constatin Gurdayev(???) iirc) was saying a while back that 75% of a writedown was the level for Greece to aim at and at a minimum 60% with no more surprises.

So the euro is doomed because the Germans and Frence dont want to pay the bill for the prosperity they enjoyed the last few years and the Greeks dont want to work for the living standards they enjoyed the last few years

Collective responsibility, like sharing wealth needs to be practiced by all and not just now when losers are going to be hurt!

After all, I don't remember the financial sector sharing the spoils of their dealings during the boom times. (I don't count the splashing of cash in wine bars ete)

humanji

Freddie59 wrote: »

So are you. It is estimated that our debt will be 250 Bn by 2014. How do you believe that we can pay this off - EVER?

Well if each person pays €1k a year for 60 years that'll roughly wipe the debt. That's just an non-workable option off the top of my head. I'm not an economist and I certainly don't claim this is a proper way to deal with the debt. I'm simply pointing out that €250b isn't an impossibly huge number that can never be achieved.

Oh it's a different situation alright - their Government squandered the money. Over here the banks and developers did it - and we're expected to foot the bill for these pricks?

And we can foot the bill. It sucks that we have to, and it's not even slightly fair. But Greece can't foot the bill. Not even slightly. And that's the fundamental point that is being ignored.

humanji

humanji wrote: »

Well if each person pays €1k a year for 60 years that'll roughly wipe the debt. That's just an non-workable option off the top of my head. I'm not an economist and I certainly don't claim this is a proper way to deal with the debt. I'm simply pointing out that €250b isn't an impossibly huge number that can never be achieved.



And we can foot the bill. It sucks that we have to, and it's not even slightly fair. But Greece can't foot the bill. Not even slightly. And that's the fundamental point that is being ignored.

The only realistic way those debts will ever get repaid, would be to have a period of hyperinflation to devalue the debts.

Forget "growth" it simply isn't going to happen, well not unless you nuke China and India!