Occupy Waterford

dlofnep

daddydick wrote: »

I studied hard in school, got a really good university course, studied really hard, got a good degree, got a great job which requires me to wear a suit and walk down dame street every morning.

I have a degree too. I don't feel the need to flaunt it as if I'm above anyone else though. Those that you are looking down on could very well also be university educated. It's moot.

It's your attitude of labelling an entire collective of people that you don't even know as 'wasters' that annoys me. You haven't really responded to any of the points I've made. You've just engaged in a dick-swinging contest, while continued your tirade against a bunch of unknowns.

Let people protest - it's no skin of your back. Perhaps if you stopped looking down on them as if they were beneath you, you might get somewhere. People protest because they feel that their voice is not being listened to. And your attitude further cements that suspicion.

merlante

daddydick wrote: »

I studied hard in school, got a really good university course, studied really hard, got a good degree, got a great job which requires me to wear a suit and walk down dame street every morning. I don't deserve the heckling that I receive from these wasters every day. I don't know if the protesters in Waterford are at the same sort of intimidating tactics but what is happening on dame st is a disgrace.

It's not right that you are heckled just because you wear a suit. Pity you couldn't have a chat with them, or even consider joining the protest yourself, whenever you can. That way you'd add some (from your point of view at least) respectability to the whole thing. Dilute the wasters, etc. Don't let a good cause get ruined just because you don't get on with some of the protesters.

Unless of course you also disagree with the general thrust of the protest itself. In which case, why not play the ball rather than the man.

By the way your sense of entitlement for having a 'good degree', etc. is equally as sickening as that of serial dole hounds always with the hand out. You don't deserve any more out of life than anyone else.

O Riain

RufustheKing wrote: »

Whay is it really about? Dame street occupy the central bank, so what are the occupy waferford occpying? 10/10 for trying but a real waste of their time. Leaderless organisations will always fail.

I wondered why they occupied the clock tower area myself for a while and thought it to just a simple case of it being the best suited area for the protest. Then I noticed that the public toilet is next to the site and realised this was obviously the reason for choice of location. No point in camping up on Parnell street or railway square when at say 4am in the morning you need to use a bathroom and can't as theres no toilet in the area.

Big Lar

I'd say there fair perished there tonight, It'll easy talk to the few that will be left in the morning.

daddydick

merlante wrote: »

It's not right that you are heckled just because you wear a suit. Pity you couldn't have a chat with them, or even consider joining the protest yourself, whenever you can. That way you'd add some (from your point of view at least) respectability to the whole thing. Dilute the wasters, etc. Don't let a good cause get ruined just because you don't get on with some of the protesters.

Unless of course you also disagree with the general thrust of the protest itself. In which case, why not play the ball rather than the man.

By the way your sense of entitlement for having a 'good degree', etc. is equally as sickening as that of serial dole hounds always with the hand out. You don't deserve any more out of life than anyone else.

Where do you see a sense of entitlement from me? I work extremely hard in my job in order to provide for me and my family. I don't think that I am entitled to anything but I have worked extremely hard in school, college and eventually in the real world to ensure that I have as good a life as possible. And if by chance I earn some money(by no means substantial) as a result why should I have to be the subject to the heckling of a dreadlocked wooly jumper wearing man on my way to work each morning?

daddydick

dlofnep wrote: »

I have a degree too. I don't feel the need to flaunt it as if I'm above anyone else though. Those that you are looking down on could very well also be university educated. It's moot.

It's your attitude of labelling an entire collective of people that you don't even know as 'wasters' that annoys me. You haven't really responded to any of the points I've made. You've just engaged in a dick-swinging contest, while continued your tirade against a bunch of unknowns.

Let people protest - it's no skin of your back. Perhaps if you stopped looking down on them as if they were beneath you, you might get somewhere. People protest because they feel that their voice is not being listened to. And your attitude further cements that suspicion.

Of course their voice is bot being listened to. And instead of going drinking cans at a camp why don't they knock the door down at John Deasy, Paudie Coffey or Ciara Conways constituency office? These are the people who can help them. Do they think that Enda Kenny is going to stop paying the Anglo bond holders as a result of a few lads setting up a few tents outside The Tower hotel? They need a reality check.

daddydick

dayshah wrote: »

I seriously can't understand why people are more annoyed with the protesters than with the banks that cost about €17,500 per person; or about €30,000 per person in employment. No-one has to pay any attention to the protesters. We all have to foot the bill for the banking fvck up. Sure there are some strange types too with ideas about fluoride, but I'd take a fluoride oddball over Seany Fitzpatrick any day.

Daddydick, do you work in Bank of Ireland or the Central Bank by any chance?

No I don't work in the banking sector and I completely agree that what happened over the last ten years was a disgrace. But it the boards of these banks that should be targeted, the decision makers - not every suited person working in Dublin.

dayshah

daddydick wrote: »

No I don't work in the banking sector and I completely agree that what happened over the last ten years was a disgrace. But it the boards of these banks that should be targeted, the decision makers - not every suited person working in Dublin.

So some of the protesters are stereotyping those wearing a suit, and you are stereotyping the whole group of protesters. I don't see why you are so much better than those protesting. I'd bet plenty of them have a degree too.

If what happened over the past 10 years is a disgrace, why should people not protest?

RufustheKing

daddydick wrote: »

No I don't work in the banking sector and I completely agree that what happened over the last ten years was a disgrace. But it the boards of these banks that should be targeted, the decision makers - not every suited person working in Dublin.

dayshah wrote: »

So some of the protesters are stereotyping those wearing a suit, and you are stereotyping the whole group of protesters. I don't see why you are so much better than those protesting. I'd bet plenty of them have a degree too.

If what happened over the past 10 years is a disgrace, why should people not protest?

Both of you are wrong it's our political class that allowed this to happen. sitting around ain't going to F all and the guys on the boards in the banks will get away with it cause they are allowed to. FF/Lab/FG/SF need to be purged from the system and a second republic set up. Out biggest problem is the political class and they bloke any forward process of ireland at this moment in time.

dayshah

RufustheKing wrote: »

Both of you are wrong it's our political class that allowed this to happen. sitting around ain't going to F all and the guys on the boards in the banks will get away with it cause they are allowed to. FF/Lab/FG/SF need to be purged from the system and a second republic set up. Out biggest problem is the political class and they bloke any forward process of ireland at this moment in time.

The 'political class' are the only people with a mandate to run the country.

Personally, I would like a system like Switzerland where you have a referendum every few weeks (and their are some provisions for this in the constitution, they are a bit weak though). But its fairly easy to get on the ballot paper, and people were given a free choice on who to vote for. Or people could run for election at city council level, or even something direct like a local GAA club or Credit Union. Plenty of chances for people to help govern their local communities.

I'd have preferred a more left-wing government, but the people have spoken.

SteelyDanJalapeno

Passed there this morning round 8, didnt see anyone, do they stay there over night?

RufustheKing

dayshah wrote: »

The 'political class' are the only people with a mandate to run the country.

Personally, I would like a system like Switzerland where you have a referendum every few weeks (and their are some provisions for this in the constitution, they are a bit weak though). But its fairly easy to get on the ballot paper, and people were given a free choice on who to vote for. Or people could run for election at city council level, or even something direct like a local GAA club or Credit Union. Plenty of chances for people to help govern their local communities.

I'd have preferred a more left-wing government, but the people have spoken.

The political class have a mandate to work for the people of ireland not shaft them over and take as much pension as possible before they kicked out. I do want direct democacy like they have switzerland. In the good times a left wing government would be better but in times likes, left wing governments are as much needed as a hole in the head.

Hoffmans

theres seems to be more tents than people down there,that blue shanty by the bustop is a bit much pointless as no one is using it, may be time for the local freemen nutjobs to find a new cause and stay at home rather than goofing around on the quays under the occup flag looking for attention....

Proview

What a sad bunch, all these occupy this, that and the other are!!! They will look back in a few years when they get a job and think “would you look at me, i was an over the top activist”

They will achieve nothing and seem to have nothing to achieve. I was listening to the Late Show on 4fm last week when he had them on air and the reporter was down at the site with them. The presenter didn’t really agree with them and he asked a million times why they were there and their answers were all so undefined. He eventually got tired listening to them but at least gave them air-time that i felt they never deserved. Last night i heard him mention that many of the supporters had posted nasty personal remarks on the show facebook page because they felt they were not treated fairly. So it seems if you don’t agree with them you are unfair i suppose. I watched the facebook page when their comments one by one were being deleted from the page. I’m sure it was a huge inconvenience for the radio station. Is this really the way they protest, by making life difficult for hard working people. If i was him i would have cut them off sooner as they sounded boring and disorganised. For them then to attack the facebook of a radio show because they were not happy with the coverage they got beggars belief and if that’s their idea of democracy, i want none of it. :mad::mad:

He was right when he said they had no defined agenda. They said on the show they want “a better world” :D... Who doesn’t. Although I’m happy with my world and my job right now so they don’t represent me. If i have a reason to protest i will but i will have a reason.

I think he was right when he suggested to them that it almost seemed like the start of a political party but a much disorganised one at that. They said they had no leaders and it was going to stay that way, let’s see how long that lasts.




Maybe they should have a little respect for people who don’t want to join the circus that is “ occupy “ because not everybody supports their protest and many people believe they are just a bunch of over educated anti-capitalists that have nothing better to do with their time .


Just my two pence worth

RufustheKing

Proview wrote: »

What a sad bunch, all these occupy this, that and the other are!!! They will look back in a few years when they get a job and think “would you look at me, i was an over the top activist”

They will achieve nothing and seem to have nothing to achieve. I was listening to the Late Show on 4fm last week when he had them on air and the reporter was down at the site with them. The presenter didn’t really agree with them and he asked a million times why they were there and their answers were all so undefined. He eventually got tired listening to them but at least gave them air-time that i felt they never deserved. Last night i heard him mention that many of the supporters had posted nasty personal remarks on the show facebook page because they felt they were not treated fairly. So it seems if you don’t agree with them you are unfair i suppose. I watched the facebook page when their comments one by one were being deleted from the page. I’m sure it was a huge inconvenience for the radio station. Is this really the way they protest, by making life difficult for hard working people. If i was him i would have cut them off sooner as they sounded boring and disorganised. For them then to attack the facebook of a radio show because they were not happy with the coverage they got beggars belief and if that’s their idea of democracy, i want none of it. :mad::mad:

He was right when he said they had no defined agenda. They said on the show they want “a better world” :D... Who doesn’t. Although I’m happy with my world and my job right now so they don’t represent me. If i have a reason to protest i will but i will have a reason.

I think he was right when he suggested to them that it almost seemed like the start of a political party but a much disorganised one at that. They said they had no leaders and it was going to stay that way, let’s see how long that lasts.




Maybe they should have a little respect for people who don’t want to join the circus that is “ occupy “ because not everybody supports their protest and many people believe they are just a bunch of over educated anti-capitalists that have nothing better to do with their time .


Just my two pence worth

too many left nuts that want to bring down capitalism without showing what to replace it with. There needs to be change in how politics in ireland works and saddly this occupy movement is using that up and when real change comes people will be tired of it and wont support it.

dayshah

Hoffmans wrote: »

theres seems to be more tents than people down there,that blue shanty by the bustop is a bit much pointless as no one is using it, may be time for the local freemen nutjobs to find a new cause and stay at home rather than goofing around on the quays under the occup flag looking for attention....

Are they all this 'Freeman' group. I checked out the freeman website and I consider their view fairly warped. Certainly views more of 1% than 99%.

I don't think the Dublin protest has the same type of conspiracy theorists.

dayshah

Proview wrote: »

He was right when he said they had no defined agenda. They said on the show they want “a better world” :D... Who doesn’t. Although I’m happy with my world and my job right now so they don’t represent me. If i have a reason to protest i will but i will have a reason.

Isn't the $1bn still to go into Anglo in about 8 weeks reason to protest?

This protest has attracted some strange types, and the Freemen actually do have some defined aims (just fairly warped ones). But this shouldn't put people off protesting, or the validity of occupying a public space in order to protest.

wellboytoo

dayshah wrote: »

Isn't the $1bn still to go into Anglo in about 8 weeks reason to protest?

This protest has attracted some strange types, and the Freemen actually do have some defined aims (just fairly warped ones). But this shouldn't put people off protesting, or the validity of occupying a public space in order to protest.

But it does!

Yes Boss

dayshah wrote: »

Isn't the $1bn still to go into Anglo in about 8 weeks reason to protest?

This protest has attracted some strange types, and the Freemen actually do have some defined aims (just fairly warped ones). But this shouldn't put people off protesting, or the validity of occupying a public space in order to protest.

Weirdos - Show me your company and all of that.

dayshah

wellboytoo wrote: »

But it does!

I accept that. I mean what's all this fluoride stuff.

wellboytoo

dayshah wrote: »

I accept that. I mean what's all this fluoride stuff.

Lol I saw that! talikng about staying on message.

merlante

Yes Boss wrote: »

Weirdos - Show me your company and all of that.

Yeah, but just because people are at the protests doesn't mean they're all mates.

wellboytoo

merlante wrote: »

Yeah, but just because people are at the protests doesn't mean they're all mates.

I agree but Perception is reality, and if the organisers allow every crackpot and crazy cause to tag onto them, they all get tarred with the same brush, i personally have nothing against their cause but do predict it imploding because of the very nature and make up of the loose grouping.

merlante

wellboytoo wrote: »

I agree but Perception is reality, and if the organisers allow every crackpot and crazy cause to tag onto them, they all get tarred with the same brush, i personally have nothing against their cause but do predict it imploding because of the very nature and make up of the loose grouping.

Well if you know better than the 'perception', then that is the reality. People do actually have a brain and they should use it every now and again rather than just going by what 'they' say about everything. In order for anything to change, 'perceptions', which are always slanted towards the status quo, need to be undermined. A certain amount of people have to be willing to let their definition of 'crazy' slide a bit in order for progress to be made. In Europe, leaving the Euro, defaulting, etc. are all crazy, but there's a lot of crazy going about at the moment. There is a huge amount of mental inertia preventing the world economy from being fixed. All we get is denial from the powers that be because to solve the problems is to go back on all of the 'sane' things that are supposed to always hold true -- that the world will cave in if someone doesn't pay their debts, etc.

The loose grouping in occupy won't remain so forever, then you just change one set of problems to another. As soon as you have a leader, the leader is attacked and discredited. As soon as you establish a controversial principle, half the protest up and leaves. But it will happen, and then you'll have a political movement, or a set of political parties across the world. As soon as that happens, the word "agenda" will rear its ugly head, where the group will be accused of various cynical aims, designed to suit some ideology or group of individuals. If the movement got near real power, the old core membership would turn away leaving only a pragmatic hierarchy intent on remaining in power to accomplish a fairly limited set of goals -- see the Green Party for most/all of the above.

Yet these movements are necessary, even if every necessary stage can be dispiriting. Like it or not, this is how more or less all political change happens. From the civil war politics arising out of grassroots organisations like the GAA, Gaelic League, etc., to the Labour movement arising from trade unionism, up to modern parties like the greens arising from the green and anti-nuclear movements.

At least the occupy movement are willing to "physically" do something, which seems to be a pre-requisite for success. Better than the usual "facebook campaign" with obligatory online petition. People are out in the cold, soon it's going to get grim. Fair play to them. I think I'll do some time down there myself just to put my money where my mouth is. Hope I don't turn crazy overnight.

wellboytoo

merlante wrote: »

wellboytoo wrote: »

I agree but Perception is reality, and if the organisers allow every crackpot and crazy cause to tag onto them, they all get tarred with the same brush, i personally have nothing against their cause but do predict it imploding because of the very nature and make up of the loose grouping.

Well if you know better than the 'perception', then that is the reality. People do actually have a brain and they should use it every now and again rather than just going by what 'they' say about everything. In order for anything to change, 'perceptions', which are always slanted towards the status quo, need to be undermined. A certain amount of people have to be willing to let their definition of 'crazy' slide a bit in order for progress to be made. In Europe, leaving the Euro, defaulting, etc. are all crazy, but there's a lot of crazy going about at the moment. There is a huge amount of mental inertia preventing the world economy from being fixed. All we get is denial from the powers that be because to solve the problems is to go back on all of the 'sane' things that are supposed to always hold true -- that the world will cave in if someone doesn't pay their debts, etc.

The loose grouping in occupy won't remain so forever, then you just change one set of problems to another. As soon as you have a leader, the leader is attacked and discredited. As soon as you establish a controversial principle, half the protest up and leaves. But it will happen, and then you'll have a political movement, or a set of political parties across the world. As soon as that happens, the word "agenda" will rear its ugly head, where the group will be accused of various cynical aims, designed to suit some ideology or group of individuals. If the movement got near real power, the old core membership would turn away leaving only a pragmatic hierarchy intent on remaining in power to accomplish a fairly limited set of goals -- see the Green Party for most/all of the above.

Yet these movements are necessary, even if every necessary stage can be dispiriting. Like it or not, this is how more or less all political change happens. From the civil war politics arising out of grassroots organisations like the GAA, Gaelic League, etc., to the Labour movement arising from trade unionism, up to modern parties like the greens arising from the green and anti-nuclear movements.

At least the occupy movement are willing to "physically" do something, which seems to be a pre-requisite for success. Better than the usual "fabook campaign" with obligatory online petition. People are out in the cold, soon it's going to get grim. Fair play to them. I think I'll do some time down there myself just to put my money where my mouth is. Hope I don't turn crazy overnight.[/Quote

Jesus that is and awfull lot of words to.agree or disagree with me , I'm still not sure.

dayshah

I think it's useful to look at the origin of the 'occupy' movement. It started in the Arab world, where 'occupying' a public space was a strong statement when the government has tanks. Its now been adopted in a totally different environment.

This arguably makes it less effective in free countries. But I still think it is an effective tactic.

I agree it needs more focus. Perhaps something like a protest against the government repaying Anglo non-guaranteed bondholders. The 'Freemen' do have one fairly specific aim about changing the money system, but that seems to me to be a very right-wing policy, and it would attract tiny support. The rest of the aims are not really objectionable, but poorly defined.

So what are people to do? I've no concerns with fluoride, and don't particularly want to be associated with people who are. But this is the only protest movement which is spreading and gaining some attention.

Up in Dublin they have some conspiracy theorists too. I don't like how the SWP try to hijack every protest, and I think its reasonable the 'occupiers' say they want no party banners. But why do they ban SWP banners (which is reasonable) but not ban the conspiracy theorist banners? Fairly weird.

So yes, there is certainly plenty strange about the 'occupiers' but they are keeping some press attention on the issue.

I know there will be a fairly straight forward march in Dublin on 26th November organised by the trade unions (who's members are adding fluoride to the water to control our brains ). I think I'll just got to that.

SteelyDanJalapeno

Thursday 6 PM W.I.T.

WHY OCCUPY?

In association with the WIT Sociology Society, this is a talk to discuss the aims of the Occupy movement

Why occupy? = 6pm Thursday 10th of November, c005, WIT, college st. campus.

Since Occupy Wall St. came to international attention, similar camps have spread all across the world; in Ireland there are now six – Occupy Dame St., Cork, Galway, Waterford, and now Limerick and Letterkenny.

The Occupy movement is a leaderless protest, with no party political affiliations and a variety of demands; it claims to stand for the 99% of ordinary people against the 1%, rich individuals, investors and corporations whose fortunes are soaring everywhere, in booms and busts alike.

In Ireland one of its primary concerns is the continuing paying off of billions of euro in unsecured private bank bonds: the taxpayer is forced by the ECB/IMF to borrow money to pay off investors in private companies.

Why sleep on the street? What good is it? Does protest change anything? What exactly are they protesting about? What are their demands?
What motivates people to sleep on the street? What should you do? Whether you agree or disagree, please take an interest and come along...

6pm: C005, College Street campus, WIT. Thurs, 10th of November.

Speakers: James Sullivan – Occupy Waterford. Tom Boland – Sociology, WIT

CuriousG

Genuine question- Can anyone tell me why there is a black panther-esque fist in the air any time someone beeps (which is rarely)

What has flouride got to do with the banks?

If they hate capitalism and financial gain etc, why do they have so much expensive equipment??

Thanks.

seanybiker

They where on faceache yesterday bumming for tents, food, blankets etc.cheeky gits

celticutd87

People get fairly upset when you point things out.

http://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=307573495935091&id=291038797588561

http://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=307799492579158&id=291038797588561