Limerick Bike Scheme

zulutango

Today was the first time I experienced a queue. I've seen a big uptake in the last few weeks too.

panda100

So last night I cycled into town to have a few beverages and parked back up at the Punches Cross station at around 11pm. While I was getting off the bike and crossing the road I placed my beloved pink bell helmet in the basket. This morning when I work up I couldn't find my helmet anywhere and realised I had left it in the basket (due to stupid tipsy panda brain!).

To my absolute delight and surprise, considering that this type of bell helmet cost about €100, my cherished helmet was still waiting for me this morning at 9.30am at the station. Thank you people of Limerick for not robbing me of one of my absolute favourite possessions

Poxyshamrock

Delighted you got your helmet back but slightly worried that you were cycling while under the influence. :eek:

pigtown

Some stats about the scheme from the Irish Independent.

6,800 cyclists in Cork, 2,000 in Galway and 2,300 in Limerick have taken out annual subscriptions.

Cork
202,702 trips taken.The most popular journey is from Bandfield to St Patrick's Street.

The busiest station is Fitzgerald Park, which has been used more than 18,000 times

Limerick
31,368 journeys taken. The most popular is between Mount Saint Vincent and O'Connell Street, with 606 trips.

The busiest station is Mary Immaculate College with almost 4,300 trips.

Galway
17,348 have been taken. The most popular trip is from Fr Burke Road to Eyre Square, with 355 journeys made.

The busiest station is Cathedral, with 2,127 trips.

phog

Mary I being the busiest would suggest a station at the other 3rd level colleges would increase usage of scheme

dunworth1

The uptake is low enough. And i would assume that the lack of stations outside of the city centre is the reason.

None station by lit/Thomond park
None at the parkway
None at the crescent

I would put Money on the uptake being much higher if stations were in those locations

I'm still amazed that no station was put out at the crescent it would be ideal for most people jump on a bike from town to the crescent drop the bike off go shopping grab another bike and cycle back to town.

I do wonder if bus eirreann had something to do with no station in the crescent as it's one of the busiest routes in the city.

schemingbohemia

dunworth1 wrote: »

The uptake is low enough. And i would assume that the lack of stations outside of the city centre is the reason.

None station by lit/Thomond park
None at the parkway
None at the crescent

I would put Money on the uptake being much higher if stations were in those locations

I'm still amazed that no station was put out at the crescent it would be ideal for most people jump on a bike from town to the crescent drop the bike off go shopping grab another bike and cycle back to town.

I do wonder if bus eirreann had something to do with no station in the crescent as it's one of the busiest routes in the city.

Sometimes there isn't a conspiracy involved.

The way these schemes work is you need clusters of stations at 250-350 metres apart, so if you put a station at the Crescent that would mean another 6 to 8 stations required (probably more) which increases the costs significantly.

Jofspring

Why would you need to that many extra stations? If let's say they put two at the crescent. You could pick up a bike at the crescent and the next stop is right outside scoil Carmel, or Mary I. That's only about 5 minutes of cycling, 10 minutes maximum. Why would another 6+ stations be needed?

pigtown

Because if you cycle out to the Crescent and find that all of the docking stations are full then you cant leave your bike there and go about your business, you need to be able to leave it at another docking station within a reasonable walking distance. Otherwise you won't take the risk.

schemingbohemia

Jofspring wrote: »

Why would you need to that many extra stations? If let's say they put two at the crescent. You could pick up a bike at the crescent and the next stop is right outside scoil Carmel, or Mary I. That's only about 5 minutes of cycling, 10 minutes maximum. Why would another 6+ stations be needed?

Basically what pigtown said.

It's the guts of 2km from the Crescent to scoil carmel and Mary I - 250metres into 2km =?

You need to have natural "churn" of bikes, ie bikes coming and going, otherwise the cost of moving them falls to the operator and these schemes work when cyclists do most of the moving of the bikes naturally.

FobleAsNuck

schemingbohemia wrote: »

Basically what pigtown said.

It's the guts of 2km from the Crescent to scoil carmel and Mary I - 250metres into 2km =?

You need to have natural "churn" of bikes, ie bikes coming and going, otherwise the cost of moving them falls to the operator and these schemes work when cyclists do most of the moving of the bikes naturally.

while I agree in principle, asking people to ditch cars and buses in favor or bikes will only work when you actually can get into and from most desirable spots using one. people from Dooradoyle / Raheen (hure areas) won't walk to Mary I to get onto a bike

schemingbohemia

Jofspring wrote: »

Why would you need to that many extra stations? If let's say they put two at the crescent. You could pick up a bike at the crescent and the next stop is right outside scoil Carmel, or Mary I. That's only about 5 minutes of cycling, 10 minutes maximum. Why would another 6+ stations be needed?

FobleAsNuck wrote: »

while I agree in principle, asking people to ditch cars and buses in favor or bikes will only work when you actually can get into and from most desirable spots using one. people from Dooradoyle / Raheen (hure areas) won't walk to Mary I to get onto a bike

There's no prohibition on people buying their own bike as far as I'm aware.

I'd be hopeful the scheme would gradually extend over time to the Crescent and further but the multiplier effect of going further out and needing multiples of the stations and bikes already there make it a difficult ask.

It took time to extend in Dublin.

FobleAsNuck

I have my own bike, but I wouldn't dare to leave it anywhere in town - now waiting for you to advice me to buy another cheap one for trips to town.
Apart from that, this defies the purpose of public scheme.

dunworth1

schemingbohemia wrote: »

There's no prohibition on people buying their own bike as far as I'm aware.

I'd be hopeful the scheme would gradually extend over time to the Crescent and further but the multiplier effect of going further out and needing multiples of the stations and bikes already there make it a difficult ask.

It took time to extend in Dublin.

but if its doing poorly like the figures above states

i see to choices rapidly expand to actual popular areas
or pretty much abandon it.

i live just outside the city about a 20 minute walk but if i wanted to use one of the bikes i'd have to walk for 15 minutes to the nearest station

and i just dont see the point in unhooking the bike for a 3 minute cycle into the city centre

zulutango

FobleAsNuck wrote: »

I have my own bike, but I wouldn't dare to leave it anywhere in town - now waiting for you to advice me to buy another cheap one for trips to town.
Apart from that, this defies the purpose of public scheme.

There's free secure bike lockers in the multi-storey car parks in Anne Street and Howley's Quay. I used them a fair bit and they're great.

Insect Overlord

zulutango wrote: »

There's free secure bike lockers in the multi-storey car parks in Anne Street and Howley's Quay. I used them a fair bit and they're great.

I've been meaning to find out how those work. Do you bring your own padlock or chain or what?

zulutango

dunworth1 wrote: »

but if its doing poorly like the figures above states

i see to choices rapidly expand to actual popular areas
or pretty much abandon it.

i live just outside the city about a 20 minute walk but if i wanted to use one of the bikes i'd have to walk for 15 minutes to the nearest station

and i just dont see the point in unhooking the bike for a 3 minute cycle into the city centre

It just goes to show how badly designed modern Limerick City is. We really shouldn't have sprawling suburbs like Raheen and Castletroy. For our population we're way too spread out and this makes cycling uptake and public transport provision very difficult. The only way forward for Limerick is to look at condensing its small population into a tighter area and that probably means incentivising more people to live near or in the city centre.

As it is I live about 20 minutes walk from the centre, but I'm still a regular user of the scheme.

zulutango

An File wrote: »

I've been meaning to find out how those work. Do you bring your own padlock or chain or what?

It's like a shopping trolley. You put 1 euro in and then the locker opens. You put your bike in, close the locker, take away the key. When you return and re-open the locker the euro is returned to you.

Insect Overlord

zulutango wrote: »

It's like a shopping trolley. You put 1 euro in and then the locker opens. You put your bike in, close the locker, take away the key. When you return and re-open the locker the euro is returned to you.

That's so simple it's brilliant. Thanks!

Poxyshamrock

31,000 trips so far...not bad!

http://m.limerickleader.ie/news/business/business-news/31-000-trips-taken-on-public-bikes-in-limerick-since-roll-out-1-7067576

zulutango

Poxyshamrock wrote: »

31,000 trips so far...not bad!

http://m.limerickleader.ie/news/business/business-news/31-000-trips-taken-on-public-bikes-in-limerick-since-roll-out-1-7067576

Alan Owens concludes the article by saying that "it is likely that a connection with UL will be establsihed once the Smarter Travel route from the city along the old towpath route next to the canal is completed next year." But he doesn't provide any source to support this. I'd be very surprised if it happens that soon. As noted here previously outlying stations don't really work too well in these schemes.

zulutango

I wonder why there is such a gap between uptake in Cork and Limerick. Obviously, Cork has the bigger population but the uptake is proportionally much greater.

Perhaps more people live centrally in Cork? There's a staggeringly low number of people living in Limerick City centre (about 3000).

Also, the traffic congestion is worse in Cork so there's a greater incentive to leave the car at home

Then again, Cork City has UCC in the centre so a large amount of students are probably using the bikes. Our biggest third level institution isn't served by the bikes at all.

Cork
202,702 trips taken.The most popular journey is from Bandfield to St Patrick's Street.

The busiest station is Fitzgerald Park, which has been used more than 18,000 times

Limerick
31,368 journeys taken. The most popular is between Mount Saint Vincent and O'Connell Street, with 606 trips.

The busiest station is Mary Immaculate College with almost 4,300 trips.

what_traffic

Limerick numbers beat Galway - but Galway only has 13(15) active stations v's 21(23) for Limerick.
More reading on this here
http://irishcycle.com/2015/11/13/galway-bicycle-share-failings-blamed-on-removal-of-key-station-and-on-way-streets/

Hard to compare when none of the 3 cities have the same number of stations and bikes.

Galway is to have 8 additional stations. See:
http://irishcycle.com/2015/08/31/8-new-galway-bike-scheme-stations-says-minister/
After that can then compare Galway and Limerick as both will have 23 stations but still will have local issues like One Way Streets, location of 3rd level colleges, population etc so it will still not be accurate to compare directly.

Poxyshamrock

Cork has an awful lot of European nationals (French, Spanish, German) living there who are more likely to make use of the scheme than their Irish counterparts. As mentioned, the fact that UCC has a station helps too.

thesimpsons

with Mary I proving to have the largest uptake would it not follow that LIT and UL would merit extensions of the scheme.

Jofspring

From cycling the bikes does anyone else feel they wouldn't be very suited for long distance? Have only taken them around town but not sure i'd fancy cycling from UL to town on one.

zulutango

thesimpsons wrote: »

with Mary I proving to have the largest uptake would it not follow that LIT and UL would merit extensions of the scheme.

If you were putting them in UL it would make sense to put a few stations around the campus. That way the bike sharing within the campus (and there would certainly be plenty of this) would ensure a regular rotation of bikes between the stations, such that people who are cycling from town could go to another station if the first one they came across was full. The reason given for not having stations at UL is that if somebody cycling from town arrived at a full station they'd have nowhere to go, so the only real solution is to put a few out there.

Poxyshamrock

thesimpsons wrote: »

with Mary I proving to have the largest uptake would it not follow that LIT and UL would merit extensions of the scheme.

Mary I happens to be situated in an affluent suburb as well so I imagine it's a lot of residents that use it as well.

panda100

Poxyshamrock wrote:

Mary I happens to be situated in an affluent suburb as well so I imagine it's a lot of residents that use it as well.

I used this station frequently until recently and the majority of people using it appeared to be local residents/workers more than students. There was always a queue at station from half 8 on with workers cycling into town. Similarly lots of peopke docking their bikes their after 5. There's a lot of estates around there with people working in city I say.

pigtown

I was in Cork during the week and I can see why it's so successful there. There are plenty of proper segregated bike lanes throughout the city centre. The train station is linked to the centre by a two-way segregated cycle path, making it safe and easy to use. The proposed upgrade for Davis Street and Parnell Street has provision for extensive bike lanes but they are not physically separated from car traffic.

Also, the most popular station was Fitzgerald Park. This area in the Mardyke is a bit like the university here. It's a bit out of town, with lots of walks and trees by the river. It is linked to the city via the Mardyke Walk, and a segregated bike path along the quays.
The upgrade to the Shannon river path that's going ahead would in fact be a nicer route than the Mardyke Walk, and the new bike path that runs from the university to the Parkway Roundabout is a good comparison to the path along the quays. If the university is ever added to the bike scheme then I can imagine that it would be incredibly successful.

I think what Limerick really needs is a bike 'highway', a fully segregated bike path that links Grove Island to Raheen and possibly out to the new Mungret Park, and then Ballysimon to Coonagh. This would connect pretty much the entire city and would go a long way towards getting people cycling.