Beef AI/Bulls MEGATHREAD

onyerbikepat

Mad4simmental wrote: »

VZN is a lovely looking lim bull

He was up for sale 2 days ago. Did you buy him?
Ballysorrell dispersal sale.

Last one in the catalogue.
http://www.irishlimousin.com/Ballysorrell.pdf

Mad4simmental

onyerbikepat wrote: »

He was up for sale 2 days ago. Did you buy him?
Ballysorrell dispersal sale.

Last one in the catalogue.
http://www.irishlimousin.com/Ballysorrell.pdf

Interesting ha, was he not producing the goods?

FYM

i know pleanty will disagree but charolais is the way to go.

i used FSZ on aa/bf cow and the calf is the best one this year.

colour is grey but you couldnt pass him if he was in the ring

calving no problem

ZETOR_IS_BETTER

Lads/ladies

I have a few sim cross limo heifers.
I have looked at putting them to an easy calving limo such as HCA

Would he be a suitable bull to use on them?

Im also interested in using curaheen apostle on a few simx cows. Is he an easy calver?

I have used VIO and am very happy with him. Very nice shapey calves off him and easy calving.

Also as a side interest what would a top quality hereford AI bull be for breeding replacements?

Thanks for the advice

welton john

ZETOR_IS_BETTER wrote: »

Lads/ladies

I have a few sim cross limo heifers.
I have looked at putting them to an easy calving limo such as HCA

Would he be a suitable bull to use on them?

Im also interested in using curaheen apostle on a few simx cows. Is he an easy calver?

I have used VIO and am very happy with him. Very nice shapey calves off him and easy calving.

Also as a side interest what would a top quality hereford AI bull be for breeding replacements?

Thanks for the advice

You wont go wrong with hca.Never a prob with him here.great cattle to grow off him too.They wont lack milk after him either.
Hereford bull Cicero at bova is the only one ive used that i'd recomond.Most seem to be bred with dairy man in mind.

tanko

+1 on HCA for your heifers, easy calved and growthy animals after.

Curaheen Apostle (APZ) is very easy calved. Used him on young Lmx cows here and ended up with nearly all bull calves. Horrible yokes they were too. I'd say nearly any heifer would calve him but wouldn't put him on cows. He brings no muscle from his side anyway.
In saying all that some people think he's great but I can't see what all the fuss is about him.

onyerbikepat

How do you find the HCA cows for shape and muscle?
ICBF have him in the bottom 1% for both muscle and skeletal.

Nettleman

Try this and select Sire breed (SI or LM)-I find it useful and you can them sort by calving diff or what ever trait your looking for

https://webapp.icbf.com/active-bull-list/beef-maternal

I might give HCA a try this year, like milk kgs and calv diff.

tanko

onyerbikepat wrote: »

How do you find the HCA cows for shape and muscle?
ICBF have him in the bottom 1% for both muscle and skeletal.

Have used HCA a good bit on heifers the last few years and have noticed those two figures before. I'd consider both stats to be rubbish and very harsh.
His calves mightn't be the bests sellers as weanlings but come 12 months old they really stretch out and grow. They often end up as big as, if not bigger than their mothers. They won't be overly muscley but not lacking in it either.

HCA isn't as good a bull as FL22 was but his calves are a lot quieter and he has a serious figure for milk. I wouldn't let those icbf figures put you off trying him on a heifer or two.

limo_100

tanko wrote: »

Have used HCA a good bit on heifers the last few years and have noticed those two figures before. I'd consider both stats to be rubbish and very harsh.
His calves mightn't be the bests sellers as weanlings but come 12 months old they really stretch out and grow. They often end up as big as, if not bigger than their mothers. They won't be overly muscley but not lacking in it either.

HCA isn't as good a bull as FL22 was but his calves are a lot quieter and he has a serious figure for milk. I wouldn't let those icbf figures put you off trying him on a heifer or two.

have you any heifers calved to him?? for some reason i always go for a stronger bull on the heifers i put ten in calf to OZS and KEZ this year. I no OZS has a high calving figure but i calved him from cows and heifers no trouble and they make lovely cattle

eoinmk2

would you consider a saler? i hear docility can be a problem with them, but would make super replacements.

anyone on here have any experience of this docility problem with salers? iv heard it from lads, but these lads didnt have any first hand experiences. i feel like alot of people just hear they are mad so they just assume its true.

limo_100

eoinmk2 wrote: »

would you consider a saler? i hear docility can be a problem with them, but would make super replacements.

anyone on here have any experience of this docility problem with salers? iv heard it from lads, but these lads didnt have any first hand experiences. i feel like alot of people just hear they are mad so they just assume its true.

I have a saler springer heifer she wil probably calf in the next month i dont have a time for her. I didnt go out of my way to get her a bought a cow with a calf at foot handy enough i barely looked at the calf and after a few days i thought she was a wierd looking limousine calf looked more like a saler and i checked the card low and behold i was right. I was gonna sell her as a store heifer in the harvest and when i got the heifers scanned she was 5months in calf that was sept/oct time. Mind is a bit on the small side but nice and broad with a very deep body shed weight like lead. Docility hasnt being a problem so far she neither wild or pet shes seems fairly normal to me, however i have heard they can goabit mad at calving so will have to be carefull. Does anyone know how the breed are for milk her mother barely had a drop anyone on if there a milky breed??

tanko

limo_100 wrote: »

have you any heifers calved to him?? for some reason i always go for a stronger bull on the heifers i put ten in calf to OZS and KEZ this year. I no OZS has a high calving figure but i calved him from cows and heifers no trouble and they make lovely cattle

No heifers off him calved yet, hopefully two in March. I like it play it safe on heifers but I know lots of lads use OZS on them without problems. However my vet told me about a couple of cases where he had serious trouble getting OZS bulls out of heifers.
Have eight OZS heifers for bulling here, stylish animals I think, and hope they have a drop of milk.

Mad4simmental

Lad near me breeds allot of pb salers and we walked true the herd the same as my quiet sims. They get a bad rap but allot of it is the nut behind the wheel to start off with. Seem good for milk and are good mothers. Not my cup of tea so to speak but I can't knock them.

Dovas KJB looks like a nice bull to.

onyerbikepat

I had 2 calves here by the Saler bull RIO. Both were from 2 year old heifers. Found him very easy calving. Sorry I didnt keep the heifer. At the time ICBf had RIO very poor for milk and the mother had very little milk, so I got rid of her. Both were poor as weanlings both grew away in the second year. Really surprised how the bull turned out. I kept him as a teaser bull and he killed out at U3 and over 400Kg at around 26 months and straight off grass, no meal after working as a bull.
Very athletic type animals when spooked, but quiet at the same time, if you know what I mean.

Future Farmer

PG AI Tech told me HCA will be gone before the breeding season gets going this year, but ZAG & FTY are good alternatives for heifers.

APZ is according to ICBF figures finishing 100 days before his herd mates! Which is a huge figure - money saved! A few AA x FR 2nd calvers are calving at hoime to him at the moment, solid robust calves.

In terms of maternal and easy calving I think it's very hard to look past Saler - milk and hips to calve anything - although you do want to put them on cows that are quiet. Seen some super Salers in the last few years.

cacs

I have a small suckler farm in the west of Ireland. I have mostly been breeding a stock Limousin or charolais bull. I have decided to use the AI this year. I would like to start breeding more of an export type calf. Initially i am looking to breed more Heifers to bring back into my Herd as cows. We have mainly Simental or Charolais cross cows with varying levels of confirmation and milk. I have decided to start to cross in AI Limousin bulls but i don't understand all the different abbreviations on the bulls charts could someone explain them to me and what to look for.
Secondly is there any bull that you would recommend for Milk, Docility and confirmation on the Limousin side?
Thanks Cathal

Nettleman

according to the "experts", the top ranking maternal (replacement) LM bull is HCA-HAUTECLAIR owned by National cattle breeding society, but as mentioned by other posters, his straws are supposed to be running out. 4.5% calving difficulty (45 out of 1000 cows might b hard calving). Next in line is a bull called PACHA 08 - code PCH, Dovea genetics have his straws. Ring some of the AI companies and get them to send you out a brochure (and prices), and what reps are in your area-good starting point.

Charliebull

cathal irwin wrote: »

I have a small suckler farm in the west of Ireland. I have mostly been breeding a stock Limousin or charolais bull. I have decided to use the AI this year. I would like to start breeding more of an export type calf. Initially i am looking to breed more Heifers to bring back into my Herd as cows. We have mainly Simental or Charolais cross cows with varying levels of confirmation and milk. I have decided to start to cross in AI Limousin bulls but i don't understand all the different abbreviations on the bulls charts could someone explain them to me and what to look for.
Secondly is there any bull that you would recommend for Milk, Docility and confirmation on the Limousin side?
Thanks Cathal

Vermeil S666 was a great Lim Bull for Replacements, not sure if he can still be got, Progressive Genitics used to have him too

why not try simmental bull

cacs

Thanks for that

cacs

I spoke to a few AI reps and they said that Simental and Charolais is a great combination. But i want to start to breed Blues and the Simental / Blue is not always great as Sim may not through the shape back into the calf. The best combination is a Sim / Lim cow with a blue bull

Nettleman

I have some SI & CH cows and after I get a new batch of sim calves on the ground, I am going to cross all with LM AI to produce hardier cattle-Simmentals can be a bit soft on their feet, but have heaps of milk IMO

Tyson Lannister

Would you not try a few Pt or BA on the cow side
Of things if going for export quality?

cathal irwin wrote: »

I have a small suckler farm in the west of Ireland. I have mostly been breeding a stock Limousin or charolais bull. I have decided to use the AI this year. I would like to start breeding more of an export type calf. Initially i am looking to breed more Heifers to bring back into my Herd as cows. We have mainly Simental or Charolais cross cows with varying levels of confirmation and milk. I have decided to start to cross in AI Limousin bulls but i don't understand all the different abbreviations on the bulls charts could someone explain them to me and what to look for.
Secondly is there any bull that you would recommend for Milk, Docility and confirmation on the Limousin side?
Thanks Cathal

Kovu

Initially I'd take a look through your cows and decide what cow needs what bull. If a cow has milk then you can sacrifice some milk off the bull if you'll get a bit more muscle, if she's a tall block of a cow, try choosing a lower bull to breed some of the height out, much better suited to western land

Mainly use Dovea here so their Limousin bulls that appear to be good for replacement material are Castleview Casino, Brooklands F0959 (KJB) and one I've got my eye firmly on this year is Kilskeagh Hill16 (KZH)

Have you ever used AI before Cathal? Or looked through ICBF figures?
I also like use linear scoring to judge a lot of bulls. For example KJB isn't a tall bull so ideal for us as a replacement as we are trying to breed smaller sucklers.

welton john

Sligo ai have a few good maternal lim bulls.They should have a tech up your neck a the woods.They might be worth a try.

cacs

Kovu wrote: »

Initially I'd take a look through your cows and decide what cow needs what bull. If a cow has milk then you can sacrifice some milk off the bull if you'll get a bit more muscle, if she's a tall block of a cow, try choosing a lower bull to breed some of the height out, much better suited to western land

Mainly use Dovea here so their Limousin bulls that appear to be good for replacement material are Castleview Casino, Brooklands F0959 (KJB) and one I've got my eye firmly on this year is Kilskeagh Hill16 (KZH)

Have you ever used AI before Cathal? Or looked through ICBF figures?
I also like use linear scoring to judge a lot of bulls. For example KJB isn't a tall bull so ideal for us as a replacement as we are trying to breed smaller sucklers.

Thanks for that.
We have used AI a lot in the past but to be honest it was a bit like closing our eyes and dropping out figure on to the without looking at any of science behind it. We have have very good quality cows and have always kit the best heifers etc, but we a bit of a mixture of everything. They are all suite to cros breeding with a Charolais but a muscled export calf would not be likely. I suppose I am trying to breed off the cows we have, keep the milk lines and improve it in some cases and breed in more quality. I always like a milky cow to breed a good calf not an Ex friesian.

cacs

Charliebull wrote: »

Vermeil S666 was a great Lim Bull for Replacements, not sure if he can still be got, Progressive Genitics used to have him too

why not try simmental bull

I did see s666. The scores did seem what I understand of them thanks for the reply

cacs

Tyson Lannister wrote: »

Would you not try a few Pt or BA on the cow side
Of things if going for export quality?

Thanks for that, I have one pt heifer I am going keeping nice heifer but I hear the can be lively at calving do I will see how I ho with this one. Blonds seem to have good muscle but the milk is sacrificed . Not sure but I think both breeds are smashing cattle

Nettleman

If anybody knows where to get IS4 straws? PM me. Thanks

limo_100

Nettleman wrote: »

If anybody knows where to get IS4 straws? PM me. Thanks

i wouldnt bother with them theres better bulls out there than him KEZ AHC and ZBF if you really want them ring pg and see if there is any left