Jobs for the Boys ? ?

hallelujajordan

For all who thought this kind of behaviour had disappeared with the removal of FF from office . . .

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/trio-of-new-judges-will-escape-euro12000-pay-cut-2927387.html

The new judges included Mr Kenny's four-time running mate and former Fine Gael senator Patrick Durcan. . . . .

. . . . Solicitor Michael Coghlan, a former election agent for Labour MEP Nessa Childers, and barrister Grainne Malone were also appointed to the bench.
Mrs Malone is a sister of former lord mayor of Dublin, Labour councillor Emer Costello, who is married to Labour TD Joe Costello. She is also a sister of Labour senator Mary Moran, who was nominated by Mr Kenny to the upper house. . . . .

. . . .Earlier this month, the Irish Independent revealed that new High Court judge Michael White, a former Circuit Court judge, has political and personal links to Tanaiste Eamon Gilmore.

And new High Court judge Kevin Cross is a Fine Gael supporter and a son-in-law of a former party minister.

Mr Justice White is a former Workers Party colleague of the Labour leader but he also represented Mr Gilmore as a solicitor in a dispute with the TD's neighbours over a plot of land where he built his house.

Meanwhile, Mr Justice Cross made a political donation of €1,200 to European Affairs Minister Lucinda Creighton prior to February's general election.

So, not only are the government stuffing the bench with their political cronies, they are also rushing to do so before pay cuts become effective. .

jmayo

hallelujajordan wrote: »

For all who thought this kind of behaviour had disappeared with the removal of FF from office . . .

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/trio-of-new-judges-will-escape-euro12000-pay-cut-2927387.html


So, not only are the government stuffing the bench with their political cronies, they are also rushing to do so before pay cuts become effective. .

The public service is rife with "who you know rather than what you know".
In fact it was reason why local government powers were centralised by the first government of this state.

If you care to examine the coalition government of ff/labour there was a marked politicisation of the civil service with the introduction of program manager roles which were supposedly meant to help Labour keep an eye on ff.
Labour have always been very good at maneuvering in their own and FG are also not backward in rewarding their supporters/members.
It happens and it is very hard to see any way to avoid it without creating another slew of committees.
It happens in US where a conservative president stuffs supreme court vacancies with their type of judge.

One big thing is that no new new roles should be created just to give jobs to the boys and girls.
In fact most of the quangoes created since 1997 should be abolished and that is one thing I am angry with the government for not tackling.
It is time Kenny got Howlin to get his fecking finger out.

They all do it, some are more blatant than others and some create a whole slew of new quangoes to create extra places to reward "their friends". :rolleyes:

anymore

hallelujajordan wrote: »

For all who thought this kind of behaviour had disappeared with the removal of FF from office . . .

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/trio-of-new-judges-will-escape-euro12000-pay-cut-2927387.html




So, not only are the government stuffing the bench with their political cronies, they are also rushing to do so before pay cuts become effective. .

Quite unbeleivable ! To appoint judges before the cuts kick in is utterly scandalous - so Bertie Ahern has been re-incarnated as 'Bertie' Kenny.
I now regtert voting for FG. And as for for ' Judicial Independence ' What a joke !
So the boys in Anglo have been taken care of, the party members have been taken care of , what next ?

Son Of A Vidic

They are all the same, looks like the current 'shower' is just making up for lost time.

anymore

Whilst posting another thread, I remembered that FG & Labour had voted in a FF man as Chairman of the Dail's Public Accounts Committee and in Cork FG and Labour voted in a FF man as Cork's Lord Mayor.
SO what exactly is the difference between FF, Fg and Labour. I though I knew the difference but now I dont. Is it jsut that FF have been in Government so much longer - is that the only difference ?

RichardAnd

Gentlemen, this is not unique to the public service or even Ireland at large.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nepotism#Other_examples

Nepotism happens all over the world.

anymore

RichardAnd wrote: »

Gentlemen, this is not unique to the public service or even Ireland at large.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nepotism#Other_examples

Nepotism happens all over the world.

Murder happens all over the world as well, but we really do try to discourage murder !

henryporter

anymore wrote: »

Whilst posting another thread, I remembered that FG & Labour had voted in a FF man as Chairman of the Dail's Public Accounts Committee and in Cork FG and Labour voted in a FF man as Cork's Lord Mayor.
SO what exactly is the difference between FF, Fg and Labour. I though I knew the difference but now I dont. Is it jsut that FF have been in Government so much longer - is that the only difference ?

I was just thinking the same thing yesterday - at least when the tories regained power across the way, they look for all intents and purposes to be different to their labour counterparts, ditto in the US with the democrats and republicans; here it's a case of marginal fractional degrees of being to the left or right of center and the only real differences being civil war historical differences.

blahfckingblah

I would love to be able to say " i vote for x they wont stand for that kind of thing" but irish politics is rife with this and its a shame the media wouldnt concentrate more on this giving the amount of dirt dragging and story inventing they done pre presidential election

Jaysoose

Enda has been a TD for 35 years..and we are expecting his leadership to be any different. Politics will not change when the same people are voted back in time and again.

pigeonbutler

anymore wrote: »

Whilst posting another thread, I remembered that FG & Labour had voted in a FF man as Chairman of the Dail's Public Accounts Committee and in Cork FG and Labour voted in a FF man as Cork's Lord Mayor.
SO what exactly is the difference between FF, Fg and Labour. I though I knew the difference but now I dont. Is it jsut that FF have been in Government so much longer - is that the only difference ?

It's a long standing convention that PAC chair is a member of oppposition. Last few were FG guys, including Michael Noonan for a few years.

As for the Mayor of Cork the big cities usually have rotation arrangements among the parties.

anymore

pigeonbutler wrote: »

It's a long standing convention that PAC chair is a member of oppposition. Last few were FG guys, including Michael Noonan for a few years.

As for the Mayor of Cork the big cities usually have rotation arrangements among the parties.

I understand the supposed logic behind both but many if not most of us who voted FG do so to remove FF from the levers of power. In effect FG/Labour have by both of these appointments said it is ok to trust FF.
So which is it FG/Labour - can FF be trusted or not ?

Liam Byrne

The problem appears to be that some people continue to vote for parties who are guilty of this objectionable crap.

If people who supposedly object to it stopped voting FF when they did it, and stop voting FG now because they do it, then we might get somewhere.

But anyone who still supports FF while highlighting this is being hypocritical. It might put those of us neutrals off voting FG (something they've already managed themselves, to be honest) but it's obviously not something that the OP wholeheartedly objects to because he doesn't punish it by changing parties.

nesf

Liam Byrne wrote: »

The problem appears to be that some people continue to vote for parties who are guilty of this objectionable crap.

The only parties not guilty of this crap are the ones who've never gotten close enough to power to be able to do so.

Easy to appear uncorrupted if you've never been in a position where corruption was possible.

hallelujajordan

Liam Byrne wrote: »

The problem appears to be that some people continue to vote for parties who are guilty of this objectionable crap.

You might want to read the link. Many of the examples are within the Labour party. Didn't you just vote for a Labour candidate in the presidential election. Wasn't he a member of a party "who are guilty of this objectionable crap". Do you now regret that vote ?

If people who supposedly object to it stopped voting FF when they did it, and stop voting FG now because they do it, then we might get somewhere.

But anyone who still supports FF while highlighting this is being hypocritical. It might put those of us neutrals off voting FG (something they've already managed themselves, to be honest) but it's obviously not something that the OP wholeheartedly objects to because he doesn't punish it by changing parties.

Amazing .. everything harps back to FF.

Liam, lets be clear . . FF had nothing to do with this recent bunch of nepotistic appointments, in any way, shape or form . .

And the reason I don't change parties over things like this is because I believe in influencing and changing rather than punishing . .

raymon

I am calling double standards and hipocracy on this thread .

Hallelujajordan, you have called Bertie a great leader in other threads .

hallelujajordan

raymon wrote: »

I am calling double standards and hipocracy on this thread .

Hallelujajordan, you have called Bertie a great leader in other threads .

Where is the double standards ? All I have done is observed FG / LABOUR doing exactly what they have in the past criticised FF of. . I didn't comment on the behavior one way or another . .

If you want to call 'double standards' you should call it against those who so vehemently criticised FF for such behavior in the past but who struggle to hold the current government accountable to the same standards . .

Liam Byrne

hallelujajordan wrote: »

raymon wrote: »

I am calling double standards and hipocracy on this thread .

Hallelujajordan, you have called Bertie a great leader in other threads .

Where is the double standards ? All I have done is observed FG / LABOUR doing exactly what they have in the past criticised FF of. . I didn't comment on the behavior one way or another . .

If you want to call 'double standards' you should call it against those who so vehemently criticised FF for such behavior in the past but who struggle to hold the current government accountable to the same standards . .

They're doing some of what FF did.
We'll act accordingly next election - not sure why you think we won't

The question is - will you ? You still support FF.

hallelujajordan

Liam Byrne wrote: »

They're doing some of what FF did.
We'll act accordingly next election - not sure why you think we won't

Because TODAY you were making a point about why you voted for Labour's Michael D Higgins in the presidential election and you don't seem to see any contradiction between that and your comment within this thread . .

Liam Byrne wrote:

the problem appears to be that some people continue to vote for parties who are guilty of this objectionable crap.

. . despite the fact that there are several blatant examples of Labour's nepotistic behavior highlighted in post #1.

Liam Byrne

hallelujajordan wrote: »

Because TODAY you were making a point about why you voted for Labour's Michael D Higgins in the presidential election and you don't seem to see any contradiction between that and your comment within this thread

Higgins was - by far - the best of a bad lot. Part of my giving him a vote was keeping out undesirables like Gallagher & McGuinness, but part of it was down to his own - personal - record and beliefs.

I think the part that you missed was my phrasing; I clearly said that I couldn't understand people "voting for parties" who engage in this crap. But then that probably goes over the head of people who are of a "party" mindset.

Higgins also voted against Lenihan & FF's sickening guarantee & bailout, which spread the infection from the greedy to the rest of us.

Would I vote for either current government party again - no; and I've emailed and told them that.

So the fact remains that I am 100% consistent and I vote accordingly.

Wider Road

hallelujajordan wrote: »

Liam Byrne wrote: »

They're doing some of what FF did.
We'll act accordingly next election - not sure why you think we won't

Because TODAY you were making a point about why you voted for Labour's Michael D Higgins in the presidential election and you don't seem to see any contradiction between that and your comment within this thread . .

Liam Byrne wrote:

the problem appears to be that some people continue to vote for parties who are guilty of this objectionable crap.

. . despite the fact that there are several blatant examples of Labour's nepotistic behavior highlighted in post #1.

Another example of the Labour Party is their silence in the Lynch case, sorry Lynch caseS.
The no comment from the Lynch's is deafening yet the Michael D fans that shared a party allegience with a family that employs a man that was sentenced for pulling the trigger and murdering another human being! Bernard Lynch was sentenced for murder and got off, not because of his innocence, but because a search warrant was expired. THE CURRENT GOVT employ such a person, his wife is Kathleen Lynch, a junior minister. There is also a warrant out for another Lynch brother, Brendan for his role with a certain Sean Garland in their role in Counterfit notes among other crimes. Yet another Lynch, Ciarian is a Labour TD in Cofk.
Why won't Labour, FG and the Lynch family answer the questions that are hanging over their heads?

Liam Byrne

Wider Road wrote: »

The no comment from the Lynch's is deafening yet the Michael D fans that shared a party allegience....

Why did you quote my post when talking about fans "with a party allegiance" ?

Do FF people not believe that there are people with no party allegiance who are capable of holding parties to account when they screw up and voting for a better option ?

FF allowed the crap to rise to the top and were hopelessly incompetent and looked after vested interests at the expense of the country

FG have made horrendous decisions and appear to have a share of corruption and cronyism; nowhere near as much as FF, but certainly enough to be judges as unfit for office in my eyes.

Basically there doesn't seem to e a party good enough or willing enough to do things for the general good.

I said it before the election that FG were the best of a bad lot but I was worried that they wouldn't be good enough.....I was proven right.

We need better. But until members shout stop and abandon the bad parties bases on principles, nothing will change.

If I can scrape together the funds I might well run next time out.