Bus transport idea

pok3rplaya

I’m working on an idea for a transport website and I’d love to just put it out there and see what you guys think.

Basically I want to make a website where you can setup buses to any event in the country, share them and let people buy tickets for them.

So, say you are going to a concert in Dublin and you live in Clare. You would go to the website, enter the details of the event, where it is and what time etc. You would also say where you want the bus to leave from. Once you complete this step you get a page for your bus.

This page will have the price for a bus ticket and a button to buy tickets. It will also show the number of people who have already bought tickets on the bus.

Now, obviously it isn't feasible to run buses with 3 people on them so the idea is that the bus isn’t confirmed until a minimum number of tickets are sold. No-one is actually charged for their bus ticket until a bus is confirmed.

Then you can share the link to this page around Facebook, Twitter etc and try to drum enough interest to actually get the bus booked.

So that’s it, what do you think? I'm hoping that it might also be useful for things like birthday parties, society day trips etc.

BrianD

The only problem here is that people want certainty when making travel arrangements. If I've paid €250 for a festival ticket, I want to be certain of my travel arrangements. I wouldn't use a service that might run a bus if the numbers are there.

It is an interesting idea, crowd source where there is potential business but unless you run it well in advance of an event and then sell the tickets, you'll find that people will be fickle.

pok3rplaya

BrianD wrote: »

The only problem here is that people want certainty when making travel arrangements. If I've paid €250 for a festival ticket, I want to be certain of my travel arrangements. I wouldn't use a service that might run a bus if the numbers are there.

It is an interesting idea, crowd source where there is potential business but unless you run it well in advance of an event and then sell the tickets, you'll find that people will be fickle.

Yeah it is an issue all right. Thanks for the feedback.

pok3rplaya

So would it be fair to say that the general opinion is something like: "might be cool but I wouldn't be all that interested in using it"?

Genghis

I think this is a brilliant idea. It doesn't exist now, so anyone saying it won't work is merely stating an opinion. Give it a go, see if they are right or wrong. FWIW, I think the social networking aspect you mention makes it feasible. You could also look at some kind of promotion - i.e. fill the bus, and the first X booked on the bus go free.

schemingbohemia

I think it's potentially a great idea, you often see on the gigs & events thread people looking for buses to Oxygen and Electric Picnic.

Your best bet would be to, firstly, patent/copyright your idea (you should have done this before discussing it here where it can be googled) then discuss with CCTC and start getting bus companies interested.

Also look through the Oxygen and EP threads to see which companies did provide services and more importantly which towns didn't have buses to the festivals and where people wanted them.

I'm not sure you'll make a lot of money as you'll basically be acting as a broker for the bus companies and getting a euro a ticket sold, but it could work. Best of luck with it.

robd

pok3rplaya wrote: »

So would it be fair to say that the general opinion is something like: "might be cool but I wouldn't be all that interested in using it"?

It's a good idea from an entrepreneurial perspective. You should do some surveys using some of the online tools and try to target festival goers to answer your surveys and hence get an idea of what the demand would be and how fickle they would be to it not happening due to lack of numbers and what exactly they'd want to see.

You could always run buses via various towns to pick up passengers rather than point to point (if numbers are lower). Then it's a case of better service for more punters but still a guaranteed service for others.

I'd advise you don't pay too much attention to what's said on a board site like this. The opinions tend to be quite harsh and hardline one way or the other and may not necessarily be reflective or your target market. There's a lot of idealists and transport buffs who browse the transport boards on this and various other sites.

Crowd sourcing is definitely an up and coming area and something that could well attract funding to develop. Novel ideas are often hard to gage though as people don't know what they want till they see how great it is.

Best of luck with your idea.

dowlingm

What's the law like on ad-hoc charters? We don't want another Patton Flyer thread...

Victor

dowlingm wrote: »

What's the law like on ad-hoc charters? We don't want another Patton Flyer thread...

There is a licence, I think called an "occassional licence" where services are run for events at a specific location. I suspect it needs to operate on a specific route, but is more flexible than other licences.

The alternative is a private hire, which would be difficult to arrange as it would be close to a contrived situation.

Concert promoters would be weary of such an arrangment as they would need a travel/tour operators licence also as the would be providing transport and entertainment. Such licences are required when organisaing at least two of the three from transport, entertainment and accommodation.

Cookie_Monster

potentially good from customer point of view but why would the bus companies pay you a premium for the info?

If you contact Co A and say that you'll pay them whatever price for a bus for the day. Price is rental plus your overheads plus your profit / 53 seats.

Operator then knows there is demand, advertises and undercuts your cost...

bk

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

Operator then knows there is demand, advertises and undercuts your cost...

Because the op's cost might be the same or less then the operator doing their own advertising.

Many small bus operators wouldn't necessarily have the advertising budget and reach that a service like this might have if it had a strong brand and became well known.

I think there is definitely a niche for this sort of service.

dRNk SAnTA

Sounds like a very good idea buddy, best of luck with it. Well worth a go, and make sure you come up with a catchy name! :-)

Also sounds like something that is easily extended to bigger markets abroad.

pok3rplaya

Wow! Sorry for bumping a month old thread but I only just saw all the posts since my last post now. I thought that I was supposed to get email notifications when I follow a thread but it doesn't seem to have worked. Thanks for all the input so far.

Anyway, I've been working on this solidly for the last month or so.

The idea has shifted somewhat since I posted the OP. Basically I realised that, currently, not only can you not share bus tickets among your friends, you can't even book a bus online in the first place.

So, I thought that a nice first step towards making this idea a reality would be just to set up a website which offers (instant) private bus booking. You go to my website, enter some details via an online interface, get a price and book the bus then an there with a card. Then I will pass that booking onto a reputable bus company. My launch page is up on busables.ie (you can't actually book a bus there yet, soon...).

I'm hoping that I can offer features that people will want such as:

1. Instant quotes. I'm offering instant quotes on journeys based on distance and travel time.
2. Route saving. I'm planning on offering a place where you can save routes that you might run buses along frequently. A supporters club who run buses to Croke Park for example.
3. Posting of the bus's details to your Facebook etc. So, lets say you are a society running a bus for it's members. You could post the details on your societies Facebook so that everyone knows when and where to get picked up.

I'm still worried that nobody will want to use it or be interested in these features. What do you guys think, would they be useful?

When I talk to people about this idea the main issue I run into is that most people who book buses regularly "have a guy" that they go to already. I'm not sure how I can get them to even try any service I put together?

Anyway, I'm excited to know what you all have to say?

SandyfordGuy

dowlingm wrote: »

What's the law like on ad-hoc charters? We don't want another Patton Flyer thread...

It actually reminds me of that whole saga very well!

Victor wrote: »

The alternative is a private hire, which would be difficult to arrange as it would be close to a contrived situation.

Perhaps you could make an arrangement between a ticketing company and a bus company, to provide travel for their club members. The daily membership fee of the club would allow you to travel, but there would be no fare. As this is a private hire arrangement between two companies, a route license would not be needed?

Armada

I would imagine that if there was large scale public demand for services then existing bus companies would cater for it:

For instance www.kellytravel.ie , www.fureysofsligo.com and www.busestoconcerts.com all advertise services to events at The O2, presumably because the the venue sells so many tickets, there is a greater likely hood of finding enough people in any given area going to the same event on the same day to justify a bus service.

It would work for Oxegen etc but for smaller events it might be difficult.


The main problem with private bus bookings is that people will not want to share a bus if they think they are booking it as a group.

As you mentioned, most people/goups "have a guy" who books the bus.

YouBuyLocal

OP,

How are you providing automated quotes? Surely you'd need to contact all of the different companies right? How do they decide which company gets the tender? Is this for private or public use? Can people who don't know each other collectively book?

I don't understand this:

What's the law like on ad-hoc charters? We don't want another Patton Flyer thread...
It actually reminds me of that whole saga very well!

Quote: Originally Posted by Victor
The alternative is a private hire, which would be difficult to arrange as it would be close to a contrived situation.

Perhaps you could make an arrangement between a ticketing company and a bus company, to provide travel for their club members. The daily membership fee of the club would allow you to travel, but there would be no fare. As this is a private hire arrangement between two companies, a route license would not be needed?

Is there a license that a booking agent needs if it is "public" transport. Actually, taking out payment systems, what is the difference between a bus company with a route license and a bus company that does a group of people without taking a fare on the bus? Does it have to be a club? Why not just a random group of people booking a bus together? How many companies have route licenses?

Armada

YouBuyLocal wrote: »

OP,

How are you providing automated quotes? Surely you'd need to contact all of the different companies right? How do they decide which company gets the tender? Is this for private or public use? Can people who don't know each other collectively book?

I don't understand this:


Is there a license that a booking agent needs if it is "public" transport. Actually, taking out payment systems, what is the difference between a bus company with a route license and a bus company that does a group of people without taking a fare on the bus? Does it have to be a club? Why not just a random group of people booking a bus together? How many companies have route licenses?

I was told once that any bus where the company takes individual fares requires a licence of one type or another - full details at http://www.nationaltransport.ie/bus_licensing.html

I live in Limerick and have used the Park&Ride bus to Thomond Park games several times and I have never seen any licence displayed or mentioned. I wonder if the rules are enforced?

YouBuyLocal

Armada wrote: »

I was told once that any bus where the company takes individual fares requires a licence of one type or another - full details at http://www.nationaltransport.ie/bus_licensing.html

I live in Limerick and have used the Park&Ride bus to Thomond Park games several times and I have never seen any licence displayed or mentioned. I wonder if the rules are enforced?

Yeah, I did a bit of research and found that after posting. The bus route market is highly regulated. CIE companies don't need a license and if they want to start a new route it gets processed very quickly, where as a private company can wait for over a year.

The thing I'm wondering is whether there is a way around this. If a middle-man groups a bunch of people together to rent a private bus to go at a pre-arranged time (not time-tabled per se, but fairly regular and times available week to week online), if the people don't know each other does that make it a public "route". Can a bunch of people not just come together and form a group to rent a private bus to get them from A to B, while the middle-man manages payment? The bus company would then be taking a flat fee from the middle-man while the customers are arranging the time/date place three/four days in advance based upon peer-to-peer communication, sharing virally through facebook/Twitter and aggregation in an automated process. The middle-man would just process payment. Can that be classed as private hire or a "route"?

I don't expect to get the answer here as I don't believe there is an answer. I am just weighing the costs and risk potential. Would CIE go for the jugular if this was to work, similar in fashion to Groupon, organised not by timetable, but by peer-to-peer communications and group buying? Could they stop it if all of the private bus companies got behind it, cornering the market for popular high density routes?