Neighbour slapped my child.

Abi

daltonmd wrote: »

Ah, you are quite wrong. The child had no right to touch his car= no crime.

Man strikes/hits/wallops child. = Assault=crime.

I think it's fair to say that we all understand what he did was wrong, and is a crime, that's not under question here.


Can I ask you, if this was your son, exactly how would you talk to him about this?

Penny Dreadful

On topic (kind of) have any of you read this? If not its worth the time.

The Slap by Christos Tsiolkas.

sbsquarepants

Zulu wrote: »

No one is making that point.

"Paedophiles OUT!!!"

Are they not? Read the thread again.

And yea, paedo's out too!!

psychward

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Are they not? Read the thread again.

And yea, paedo's out too!!

Not out but IN jail .

Abi

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Are they not? Read the thread again.

That's a flimsy out. Why won't you answer him?

Are you sure you're seeing this correctly? Nobody has said the man was right to hit this child. What some have chosen to do is bring up the child's behaviour also. Some are seeing two wrongs here, not one.

daltonmd

Zulu wrote: »

And they saw the man strike the child across the face? I ask because I think you implied that they weren't sure earlier.
To find out definatly: I would suggest asking them if they'd be happy to stand up in court as a witness to the assault.

Who made that point? Who stated the adult had the "right" to hit the child?

When you look to a child to have sense beyond his years and make allowances for a man to strike a child then you are condoning this behaviour. Thereby giving any adult, who overreacts the right to hit a child.

Neyite

Penny Dreadful wrote: »

On topic (kind of) have any of you read this? If not its worth the time.

The Slap by Christos Tsiolkas.

I have. Great book. Came to mind too when I read this thread, like the book, opinions will be greatly divided.

Penny Dreadful

meitina wrote: »

The more I think ,my problem is that this happened out of such small thing!
In fairness ,myself would wet the pants if man his size came up to me violently ,no need to even hit!
So now he hit the boy for touching the car ,imagine what would he do if a child really damaged something-then he would be aloud to use a baseball bat?????

When this man apologised to you for slapping your son what did he say happened? Did he say that your son simply patted the car (as stated by the witness) and that he over reacted and so slapped your son and he was apologising for that OR did he say he thought he'd run someone over because he heard a really loud thump against his car?
In many ways this isn't "such a small thing". You child was playing, unsupervised, very close to moving traffic and interacted with this traffic. He could have had his foot run over by a car tyre and broken if he was standing a fraction closer and the driver may not even have known. Everything else aside, if he is going to play on his own outside then he needs to know how to behave responsibly with traffic.

Ophiopogon

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Are they not? Read the thread again.

And yea, paedo's out too!!

I have read the thread and I can't see anyone saying that the man had the right to hit the child...may you could find it for me?

ash23

daltonmd wrote: »

When you look to a child to have sense beyond his years and make allowances for a man to strike a child then you are condoning this behaviour. Thereby giving any adult, who overreacts the right to hit a child.

They are two separate issues. The man, if he struck the child, was wrong.
The child, if he struck the car, was wrong.
Both should be punished.

Penny Dreadful

daltonmd wrote: »

When you look to a child to have sense beyond his years and make allowances for a man to strike a child then you are condoning this behaviour. Thereby giving any adult, who overreacts the right to hit a child.

Expecting an 8 year old to have the sense not to engage with traffic when playing outside is NOT expecting them to have sense beyond their years. If it is, then they shouldn't be outside unsupervised.

wolfpawnat

Bullseye1 wrote: »

And your solution for the child slapping moving cars?

If in a few years time my son does this, I would hope the person he does this to is intelligent enough to come to me and explain what happened. My son will be forced to apologise for his actions, I then will explain to him what he did was very dangerous and could have caused him or another person to get hurt and remove privileges and ground him accordingly. If he were to nearly go out in front of car near me, I will not lie I would more than likely out of shock smack his hand and screech at him, I would never in a million years smack him across the face!!!!! You can teach people to respect other peoples property and teach them safe conduct near cars without resorting to making yourself seem like an abusive tyrant! At 8 a child has enough cop on to understand basic logic if it is explained to them.

OP, I understand your anger and upset. See if you can have a proper conversation with the neighbour, explain you have another person who saw the incident and you feel that your child is owed an apology and that at the very least you will be keeping record of the incident and if there is ever one like it again, be it your son or other child you will report them for it!

Penny Dreadful

Neyite wrote: »

I have. Great book. Came to mind too when I read this thread, like the book, opinions will be greatly divided.

It was a great read. Some of the characters drove me nuts:eek::D It was the first thing that came to mind for me too when reading this thread.

psychward

Ophiopogon wrote: »

I have read the thread and I can't see anyone saying that the man had the right to hit the child...may you could find it for me?

what I remember reading was that some people think the matter should not be reported to the Guards... essentially handing an adult who hits a child and commits a crime a free pass.
However if an adult hit them personally they wouldn't be long reporting it.

daltonmd

Abi wrote: »

I think it's fair to say that we all understand what he did was wrong, and is a crime, that's not under question here.


Can I ask you, if this was your son, exactly how would you talk to him about this?

Again you are looking to the childs behaviour before the adults.

The child acted in a stupid and childish manner and the only acceptable correct behaviour of the adult was to knock on the parents door.

Then you deal with the child.

A different issue altogether.

Now how do you deal with an adult that has assaulted a child?

daltonmd

ash23 wrote: »

They are two separate issues. The man, if he struck the child, was wrong.
The child, if he struck the car, was wrong.
Both should be punished.

Grand so can the parents go to the man and give him a punch?

daltonmd

Penny Dreadful wrote: »

Expecting an 8 year old to have the sense not to engage with traffic when playing outside is NOT expecting them to have sense beyond their years. If it is, then they shouldn't be outside unsupervised.

Oh please, then explain the mans reaction and behaviour?

ash23

daltonmd wrote: »

Grand so can the parents go to the man and give him a punch?

Do you think that if I already stated that the man should be reported to the gardai, that I would condone the parent breaking the law or getting violent? :rolleyes:

The mother cannot ignore what was done to her child. Nor should she ignore her childs behaviour.
You're getting slightly manical. I did specifically state that they are two separate issues.
The parent should punish the child by whatever way they choose to usually discipline their child but to also be aware that the gardai may come knocking if the neighbour chooses to pursue the issue of the child hitting the car.
The parent should report the man to the gardai for hitting the child and let them deal with it in a legal manner.

Ophiopogon

psychward wrote: »

what I remember reading was that some people think the matter should not be reported to the Guards... essentially handing an adult who hits a child and commits a crime a free pass.
However if an adult hit them personally they wouldn't be long reporting it.

I have said I may not report it and I would not advise the OP to report it as I don't know the full situation. This does not mean I think anyone has the right to hit a child.

As I have said running to guards could have have serious repercussions for a possibly innocent man.

Dublin_Gunner

Slap the neighbour. Discuss it afterwards.

Should work both ways, right?

No matter what my little one did, if I found out a neighbour had slapped her, I'd beat down the door until they got a slap back.

NOOONE slaps my child. There are no reasons, and no excuses for someone slapping anothers young child. By all means, if the child is acting the brat, walk the child home, tell the parents etc but hitting someone else's child is WAY out of order.

Zulu

meitina wrote: »

Where did I say the witness could not see.

Apologies when I read:

meitina wrote:

Later he said that he did not really slap him,that it look like he slapped him.

Perhaps I picked you up wrong.

zyndacyclone

meitina wrote: »

The more I think ,my problem is that this happened out of such small thing!
In fairness ,myself would wet the pants if man his size came up to me violently ,no need to even hit!
So now he hit the boy for touching the car ,imagine what would he do if a child really damaged something-then he would be aloud to use a baseball bat?????

How about you just teach your child not to damage things? Not to hit cars? Not to play so close to the street?

This talk about a baseball bat is just dramatizing. The man has apologized for his behavior already and frankly it sounds as if the one you should be furious with is your child (and by association yourself for letting him do it). You're focusing on everything but the real problem, the child's behavior.

sbsquarepants

Abi wrote: »

That's a flimsy out. Why won't you answer him?

Are you sure you're seeing this correctly? Nobody has said the man was right to hit this child. What some have chosen to do is bring up the child's behaviour also. Some are seeing two wrongs here, not one.

Ophiopogon wrote: »

I have read the thread and I can't see anyone saying that the man had the right to hit the child...may you could find it for me?

Ok, i accept your points that i have over stated it, sorry my mistake.
But the gist of my argument still holds, i'm absolutely appalled at any suggestion that when a grown man hits a child there can be any idea that there is 2 sides to every story. No there isn't. The man hit the child, man was wrong every time.

Edit: - See above post for what i mean. The real issue is not the childs behaviour, not by any stretch of the imagination!

daltonmd

ash23 wrote: »

Do you think that if I already stated that the man should be reported to the gardai, that I would condone his parent breaking the law? :rolleyes:

The mother cannot ignore what was done to her child. Nor should she ignore her childs behaviour.
You're getting slightly manical. I did specifically state that they are two separate issues.
The parent should punish the child by whatever way they choose to usually discipline their child but to also be aware that the gardai may come knocking if the neighbour chooses to pursue the issue of the child hitting the car.
The parent should report the man to the gardai for hitting the child and let them deal with it in a legal manner.

But you are looking at the situation as if both the boy and man are equal.
You seem to believe that the boys crime was equal to the mans. It wasn't.

Let me ask you honestly.

If you seen an 8 year old outside a shop and a Garda car was passing slowly and the child struck it.

What would your reaction be if the Garda jumped out and struck the child in the face?

If you seen a father and a child at a set of traffic lights and the child struck a car and the father struck him in the face what would you think?

If a juvenile prisoner (a minor) was in prison and struck something, anything and a prison officer struck the child in the face, then that officer would at worst lose his job and at best get suspended and have to go through a court case.

There is and can be no feasible or acceptable reason for a grown man to strike a minor. And looking at the childs behaviour as some kind of excuse is simply wrong. Maybe you are not doing this, but plenty here are.

Penny Dreadful

daltonmd wrote: »

Oh please, then explain the mans reaction and behaviour?

I've never once said that I think the man's reaction or his behaviour were appropriate.
What I have said is the following:
1) I think the mum needs to get her son to tell her what happened.
2) She needs to speak to the man who has apologised for slapping her son
3) She needs to teach her child how to behave when playing outside in a place where there is traffic.
4) She needs to teach her child how dangerous cars can be and how easily accidents can happen.
5) She needs to teach him that he can talk to her without fear and so allow her to get the full story of what happened.
6) If none of these things happen then she needs to stay outside with her son when he is playing outside the house until he has sense.

coffee_cake

daltonmd wrote: »

There is and can be no feasible or acceptable reason for a grown man to strike a minor.

What are you on about?
The poster you're quoting agreed with that and said the man should be reported to the gardai.
A separate issue, as they said, is the child's behaviour which should be dealt with by the parent.
You're just ranting in an unrelated manner at this stage

Abi

daltonmd wrote: »

Again you are looking to the childs behaviour before the adults.

I am not. But I can see you are desperately trying to make it look like I am.

I'm saying there are two issues, and I've never said that the child's is more important than what the man has done.

The child acted in a stupid and childish manner and the only acceptable correct behaviour of the adult was to knock on the parents door.

I happen to agree.

Then you deal with the child.

A different issue altogether.

Oh it's a very serious issue. You still haven't said exactly what you would say to the child.

psychward

Ophiopogon wrote: »

I have said I may not report it and I would not advise the OP to report it as I don't know the full situation.

We can only comment on what the OP has written.

Ophiopogon wrote: »

This does not mean I think anyone has the right to hit a child.

Does a child not have the same rights to justice as anyone else ?

Ophiopogon wrote: »

As I have said running to guards could have have serious repercussions for a possibly innocent man.

And whos best qualified, most objective and impartial to judge whether hes innocent or guilty if not the Guards and the courts ?

It should be reported

1) Because hitting anyone is a crime and hitting a child a tenth of your size is heinous.
2) Because if the adult who allegedly hit the child has been accused of similar behaviour before or in future then it will leave the Guards in little doubt about his character in future cases.

3) Because a child needs justice for it's psychological well being. Being assaulted by someone in a position of trust as an adult neighbour and then having it shamefully covered up can lead to the child thinking this is normal and that it is normal not to report future physical or sexual assaults by adults. This is not an attempt to accuse the adult of being a paedo or to create hysteria. It is a simple statement of fact that the well being of the child should be central to all of this.

ash23

daltonmd wrote: »

But you are looking at the situation as if both the boy and man are equal.
You seem to believe that the boys crime was equal to the mans. It wasn't.

What are you saying that for? Nowhere at all did I say that! I suggested that there are two separate wrongs for which there should be two separate punishments, one decided for the child by it's parents and the other decided by the legal system and you say I'm saying both situations are equal. Wtf???

Let me ask you honestly.

If you seen an 8 year old outside a shop and a Garda car was passing slowly and the child struck it.

What would your reaction be if the Garda jumped out and struck the child in the face?

If you seen a father and a child at a set of traffic lights and the child struck a car and the father struck him in the face what would you think?

If a juvenile prisoner (a minor) was in prison and struck something, anything and a prison officer struck the child in the face, then that officer would at worst lose his job and at best get suspended and have to go through a court case.

There is and can be no feasible or acceptable reason for a grown man to strike a minor.

Ummmmm, are you missing the many occasions where I said the man should be punished for striking the child? :rolleyes:
I would suggest the same be done in each of your hypothetical situations above and that the adult be reported for assaulting the child.

However if I saw a child hit a garda car I would think it was a bold little fu*ker and it's parents should teach it some respect.
Does that mean the child should be struck by the cop? No. But children with no respect for others are going to end up in trouble, especially when they cease to be young enough for people to pass it off as "ah they're only a child".

Abi

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Ok, i accept your points that i have over stated it, sorry my mistake.
But the gist of my argument still holds, i'm absolutely appalled at any suggestion that when a grown man hits a child there can be any idea that there is 2 sides to every story. No there isn't. The man hit the child, man was wrong every time.

Edit: - See above post for what i mean. The real issue is not the childs behaviour, not by any stretch of the imagination!

There really is. One criminal, and one behaviourial.


This child had gone literally to play with the traffic.