Big black cat......

kildare.17hmr

EnterNow wrote: »

If that was the case half the people on the planet should probably be killed?

Animals and humans are no different to you then?

lizzybradbury

E. Fudd wrote: »

Was out for a stalk this morning and got talking to the farmer when I came back down off the hill
Now I would consider this lad to be of sound mind and not a bullsh1tter.
He tells me that there's a big black cat taking sheep from the farm behind the wood which borders his farm. 5 sheep taken in the past two weeks and a couple "bitten". Apparantly it has been seen by two local farmers who describe it as being "like a panther".
Now I'm a bit of a pessimist and find it hard to believe, but I said I'd put it out there and see has anybody else heard any reports of a big black pussy on the prowl in the Saggart area???

Yes, but although the farmer says it's a big black cat has he actually seen it or just what it leaves behind?

There have been articles on super-sized foxes growing because they eat all our rubbish and grow huge - perhaps one of these creatures could have inflicted the damage?

Myrddin

Alan 1990 wrote: »

That doesn't make much sense to be honest, the situation is regarding dangerous species, ie. Animals!
Not people! Big difference.

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

Animals and humans are no different to you then?

You are both aware the human species is just another form of animal? And tbh, sometimes I wonder which is more civilized, the animal kingdom or human society. But anyway, I digress.

There was a time in the 80's & 90's that there were reports of large predatory cats being kept as pets here. One fellow not too far from me actually had a large cat & used to walk it around with a Panther on a chain for a time. Surely it's not beyond reason to think that characters like these have in the past kept & released such cats into the wild?

LeBelleMorte

Alan 1990 wrote: »

That doesn't make much sense to be honest, the situation is regarding dangerous species, ie. Animals!
Not people! Big difference.

So i see you either think people are 1. not dangerious or 2. not animals meaning we are all plants =S someone is extremely smart.

Big cats were a fashion trend to people rich people like exotics so they were brought here by us, released by us and they should be trapped and checked by us. We have killed and made a lot of species extinct or do you not no how alien the human species is??
We are the reason for so many animals being out of their own natural environment but anyway getting off the point. It was years ago that any "Wild and dangerious" (for use of a better word as all animals have the potentional to be vicious as is in their nature) cats were in ireland as pets (that is of course pretending we dont illegally have exotics that we should not have) therefore these animals would be far and few between could they have interbreed sure they could have and very likely would have as animals have a big need to pass on gene's. Are these animals doing us harm? Clearly not or has someone been mauled to death? or even injured?? leave the big cats or if you must take them out of ireland (as they are alien species) then atleast cage them let people see what they are.

Alan 1990

Wow talk about being mind f**ed.

Time to dumb this down.. A lot it seems.
This thread is about BIG BLACK CATS and not HUMANS!!
I'm not going to even begin to entertain you by distinguishing
The difference between cats or animals and humans!
And yes to answer your last question, They would do damage, killing livestock and what not. They don't just have to attack humans to be regarded a pest! Thats if they were here in the first place ha.

LeBelleMorte

Dumb it down?? You can post on this so as far as im aware it already is dumbed down. I didnt use another language or state anything people cant read so my post is fine. In regards to your post though yes this is a trend on animals but when your claiming that dangerous animals should be culled i'm going to bring humans into in. You also stated that its regarding dangerous animals which humans are or did you not know about the key reasons for extinction?? If you need them i can go through them. Entertain me? I can tell you the difference between animals and humans they kill for food we kill for fun =] how spot on am i if you need the genetic or anatomy differences i know all of them too so no need wasting you time looking them up and trying to pretend you knew them all along. They would?? but didn't you just state if they were here, well show me animals that have been killed by them =P also two wild cats were released in N.Ireland in the 2000's(think it was 2003 or 2006 not too sure) while some livestock was killed i cant remember if they were ever found if they are out there still though there has not been any farmers claiming a giant loss from livestock killers or people getting dragged away by big cats so like i stated maybe they are out there but if they are so be it, unless we see kills why drive the gun nuts on a hunt to kill something that might not even be there or causing harm. Also wild cats can live off deer and smaller mammals they might not even need livestock kills. To be regarded at pest something must destroy livestock planted foods or crops like stated have we seen a livestock kill we can say is from a wild cat?? And what next culling of dogs?? As we all know they can kill livestock. Humans kill livestock and crops too btw. And like stated by you if they are here in the first place, well that proves we have not had killers by them meaning they can not be stated as being a pest.

SdoowSirhc

Alan 1990 wrote: »

That doesn't make much sense to be honest, the situation is regarding dangerous species, ie. Animals!
Not people! Big difference.

People are animals
Homo Sapiens, mammals like a big black cat and more specifically primates like monkeys.

SdoowSirhc

EnterNow wrote: »

You are both aware the human species is just another form of animal? And tbh, sometimes I wonder which is more civilized, the animal kingdom or human society. But anyway, I digress.

You've been watching Mononoke Hime :P

él statutorio

Spunk84 wrote: »

California is roughly the size of Ireland. They have somewhere between 2000-6000 "mountain lions" ie brown panthers LOL something like 10 in every 100 mile radius. I have hunted in Cali for more years than I remember and in that time I have come across these cats, their droppings,fresh kills,old kills,sitting in trees and paw prints. I've shot many of them as well and can honestly say from "experience " not scientific "Theories " that if there are big cats in Ireland you would see them or evidence of their residence here,plain and simple. Not to long ago there was a mountain lion shot out of a tree in the middle of Oakland city,
It's easy to say because of their sense of smell,easy to come and go from land without being noticed that's why their elusive is absurd. When breeding season comes for these cats it doesn't matter who are what you are they will kill you and any animal around !!! The mating calls as well is something unreal to listen to,it's like someone ripping your throat out and your still screaming, horrible sound it is..
so back to Ireland, IMO with years of hunting around big cats and not "scientific unfounded research" from behind a desk or reading Wikipedia or someother half wit site, I can say that the only wild cat you will find is the moggy down the road out after rabbits. Now with that Ireland s exotic wild life act is a joke!!! I can buy a rattlesnake, blackmamba and poison dart frogs for less than a score so getting a big cat isn't really hard if u have the money. What I think we will see sometime in the future is a big cat shot but it will be someone's pet not a wild, well tuned hunter that they are. As for hunting folks on here that they swear they seen one why didn't you shoot it? Run it down with the car or even take out your mobile and take a pic

Your opening line makes me believe that the rest of your statement is spurious. Anyone who has spent any time in California would know that it's significantly larger than Ireland. The state is huge, one of the larger ones in the US. If you had spent any time hunting in CA you'd have copped on to that fact fairly quickly. I spend a lot of time there as my wife is from there.

On topic, I believe it's entirely possible for some sort of a "big cat" to be living in Ireland. It could survive here, i don't think there are any currently but if there were a few escapees, i think they could possibly survive.

* Edit, 6 times larger * http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_size_of_California_compared_to_Ireland

Spunk84

él statutorio wrote: »

Spunk84 wrote: »

California is roughly the size of Ireland. They have somewhere between 2000-6000 "mountain lions" ie brown panthers LOL something like 10 in every 100 mile radius. I have hunted in Cali for more years than I remember and in that time I have come across these cats, their droppings,fresh kills,old kills,sitting in trees and paw prints. I've shot many of them as well and can honestly say from "experience " not scientific "Theories " that if there are big cats in Ireland you would see them or evidence of their residence here,plain and simple. Not to long ago there was a mountain lion shot out of a tree in the middle of Oakland city,
It's easy to say because of their sense of smell,easy to come and go from land without being noticed that's why their elusive is absurd. When breeding season comes for these cats it doesn't matter who are what you are they will kill you and any animal around !!! The mating calls as well is something unreal to listen to,it's like someone ripping your throat out and your still screaming, horrible sound it is..
so back to Ireland, IMO with years of hunting around big cats and not "scientific unfounded research" from behind a desk or reading Wikipedia or someother half wit site, I can say that the only wild cat you will find is the moggy down the road out after rabbits. Now with that Ireland s exotic wild life act is a joke!!! I can buy a rattlesnake, blackmamba and poison dart frogs for less than a score so getting a big cat isn't really hard if u have the money. What I think we will see sometime in the future is a big cat shot but it will be someone's pet not a wild, well tuned hunter that they are. As for hunting folks on here that they swear they seen one why didn't you shoot it? Run it down with the car or even take out your mobile and take a pic

Your opening line makes me believe that the rest of your statement is spurious. Anyone who has spent any time in California would know that it's significantly larger than Ireland. The state is huge, one of the larger ones in the US. If you had spent any time hunting in CA you'd have copped on to that fact fairly quickly. I spend a lot of time there as my wife is from there.

On topic, I believe it's entirely possible for some sort of a "big cat" to be living in Ireland. It could survive here, i don't think there are any currently but if there were a few escapees, i think they could possibly survive.

* Edit, 6 times larger * http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_size_of_California_compared_to_Ireland

Will thank god for wiki I said roughly interms of length and breth . As for someone who lived their for 10 yrs I think I would know more than someone who is a FIFO lol . It's not possible for a cat to be living in Eire without a sustainable food supply ,you will probably say "deer,will feed them" but look how many people and farmers are out on the land and only a few so called reports have come up about a "black cats"

dodderangler

Always amazes me that it's a black cat always been spotted
Never any other colour
Large black cats like panthers are hard to be brought into this country in first place
Other animals like cougars are easier to bring in and escape but just think its weird that it's always black

As for food a rabbit is a lot easier to catch than a deer so that'd be there stable diet and you'd see the remains of deer around with obvious signs of a large cat about yet none reported

steddyeddy

dodderangler wrote: »

Always amazes me that it's a black cat always been spotted
Never any other colour
Large black cats like panthers are hard to be brought into this country in first place
Other animals like cougars are easier to bring in and escape but just think its weird that it's always black

As for food a rabbit is a lot easier to catch than a deer so that'd be there stable diet and you'd see the remains of deer around with obvious signs of a large cat about yet none reported

Apart from the north of Ireland what counties are they reported in anyway?

garv123

steddyeddy wrote: »

Apart from the north of Ireland what counties are they reported in anyway?

Waterford, cork, clare, tip and kilkenny.


* one of the many reported sightings in Waterford was my fathers rothweiler..:rolleyes:

Two of us spotted a black thing running across afield in the middle of nowhere at a very fast pace a few months ago, we didnt know what it was at first but we had two rifles with us so we could use the scopes to make it out to be a black lab.

If someone had seen it without a view through the scope no doubt they would claim it as a black panther.

dodderangler

steddyeddy wrote: »

dodderangler wrote: »

Always amazes me that it's a black cat always been spotted
Never any other colour
Large black cats like panthers are hard to be brought into this country in first place
Other animals like cougars are easier to bring in and escape but just think its weird that it's always black

As for food a rabbit is a lot easier to catch than a deer so that'd be there stable diet and you'd see the remains of deer around with obvious signs of a large cat about yet none reported

Apart from the north of Ireland what counties are they reported in anyway?

Nearly every counties in Ireland has reported it
And most popular has been Wicklow also nicknamed the 'beast of blessington'
Well I nickname it that lol
But seems to have been reported everywhere but no proper pictures one or two from too far on phones
Theres confirmed sightings of other animals tho like muntjac and wild boar and there has been some shot but not muntjac as I believe I've seen one or two and most hunters have sworn to seen them but not close enough for a shot
I wasn't close enough

Adam Khor

Speaking of black cats and the ever legendary "black cougar", I found this photo which supossedly depicts a captive dark colored cougar kept in a zoo/sanctuary in Maine.
But... I'm not sure about it. It could be a small leopard, couldn´t it? What do you think?

steddyeddy

Adam Khor wrote: »

Speaking of black cats and the ever legendary "black cougar", I found this photo which supossedly depicts a captive dark colored cougar kept in a zoo/sanctuary in Maine.
But... I'm not sure about it. It could be a small leopard, couldn´t it? What do you think?

Thats a tough one Adam. Its hard to say for certain especially given that leopards have a much larger variation in skull and teeth size than cougars do. It could be a small leopard but leopard teeth are usually set farther apart than cougar teeth. Its 50/50 really but I might out my money down on cougar!

dodderangler

Adam Khor wrote: »

Speaking of black cats and the ever legendary "black cougar", I found this photo which supossedly depicts a captive dark colored cougar kept in a zoo/sanctuary in Maine.
But... I'm not sure about it. It could be a small leopard, couldn´t it? What do you think?

The colour of the head and ears kinda looks like a jaguarundi and size of its ears

Adam Khor

dodderangler wrote: »

The colour of the head and ears kinda looks like a jaguarundi and size of its ears

Most definitely not a jaguarundi. The ears are too big, and the fangs are those of a large cat. A jaguarundi has small teeth, much like a house cat.

dodderangler

I know I meant it reminds me of one
Have a look at its colour tho it's quite strange colour like the coat of a jaguarundi
It definately isn't black unless the light is just hittin it weird In the pic

Adam Khor

dodderangler wrote: »

I know I meant it reminds me of one
Have a look at its colour tho it's quite strange colour like the coat of a jaguarundi
It definately isn't black unless the light is just hittin it weird In the pic

More like chocolate brown, yeah... but then again, many black leopards ARE more brown than black:

dodderangler

That second pic looks like its gonna talk
With a big deep voice aswell lol

él statutorio

Spunk84 wrote: »

Will thank god for wiki I said roughly interms of length and breth . As for someone who lived their for 10 yrs I think I would know more than someone who is a FIFO lol . It's not possible for a cat to be living in Eire without a sustainable food supply ,you will probably say "deer,will feed them" but look how many people and farmers are out on the land and only a few so called reports have come up about a "black cats"

Length and width of the state of CA 770 miles x 250 miles.
Length and width of the island of Ireland 301 miles x 170 miles.

If you think that's roughly the same then that's your own business.


A large cat does need a sustainable food supply, absolutely no arguments on that whatsoever!

One of the most sustainable food supplies on this island is rabbits. We have loads of the feckers, nobody is going to notice them missing either. Rabbits are more than enough to keep a large cat going.

And for those that doubt my rabbit hypothesis.

The Iberian Lynx feeds primarily on rabbits. Linky.
A large cat equivalent to the Lynx should have no trouble surviving in Ireland.

I think it depends on your definition of "large". An Iberian Lynx is plenty big in my eyes (about 28lbs according to wiki) its Eurasian cousin can hit close to 50lbs!.

As I've already said, I don't think that there is any large cat currently living in the countryside of Ireland. I do however think that something like the aforementioned Lynx would have no issues surviving here relatively unnoticed.

As regards anything bigger like a panther or a leopard, unless it's an escapee it's highly unlikely it'd survive for long without being spotted.

steddyeddy

The thing is like any big cat, a leopard is very adaptable to its surroundings. I know that the psni in northern Ireland take these reports very seriously.

Adam Khor

él statutorio wrote: »

As regards anything bigger like a panther or a leopard, unless it's an escapee it's highly unlikely it'd survive for long without being spotted.

Fortunately, panthers and leopards (which are really the same thing) are ALWAYS spotted :pac:

No, seriously, leopards are incredibly adaptable animals. They survive in the cold East Siberian forests and in places where large prey is asbent they do well on rodents and such prey- I remember reading about a leopard that fed mostly on squirrels. They may become smaller over time to cope with this meager menu, but they still find the way to survive. Only lions and tigers are truly dependant on large prey.

dodderangler

Lions yes
Tigers no
Difference here is being a pride means larger prey the better
Tigers will take anything from crocs and deer to lizards and small monkeys and even turtles

Adam Khor

Yet when large prey such as deer, wild boar etc is depleted (by humans more often than not), tigers usually become scarcer, and may even be outcompeted by leopards, much better adapted to hunt smaller prey. In many South East Asian regions the big problem for tigers is not even direct hunting anymore but rather the depletion of large prey species.

No matter that tigers don´t live in prides, they still prefer large prey, sometimes as large as those targeted by lions.

I really would never have believed in this, as a professional scientist, rational sceptic, until I saw what I now know to be a black puma perhaps 100 metres away from me on my Dad's farm in Laois.

I was out walking my dog in a quiet beet field when I saw the cat. I instantly recognised that this was a large cat, despite there not being much to scale it too. The wide head, rounded ears, long curved thick tail, wide set shoulders etc. Also the way it ran and leapt into the hedgerow as it saw me, and the height with which it was able to leap into the ditch. My dog would usually run after a cat, but was obviously terrified.

Having just finished my final uni exams, I was first worried about my mental health, as a single sighting would to me suggest more that I've lost the plot rather than there existing phantom cats. It came as a great relief to me a few month later when my Dad rang me to tell me he'd seen it, and perhaps a couple of months later, during the harvest, when the crops were first cut, my uncle ran home and was almost dizzy with fear after seeing a very large black cat. My uncle had not known about this before, as myself and my Dad had kept it quiet, as we did not want the authorities to hunt it down, or indeed for people to think we were both cracked.

I find the phenomenon of phantom cats really strange. I cannot offer an explanation of why there has never been proper photographic evidence or concrete proof of their existence, and I really wouldn't judge or blame anyone for disbelieving someone like me on the internet. I'm even wary of telling people about it TBH. But for what it's worth (and perhaps that's not a lot), I'm certain I saw a black cat at least as large as a large fox in the laois countryside around 2009, I'm 90% sure it was a black puma, and myself and my Dad simply know this creature to have existed, but have no way of proving it.

The three sightings were within a few months of each other in 2009, and the cat has not been seen since.

I don't care who believes me, and I'm not interested in discussing theories about optical illusions or hallucinations, as I'm pretty certain this was neither.

kylith

Deleted User wrote: »

I really would never have believed in this, as a professional scientist, rational sceptic, until I saw what I now know to be a black puma perhaps 100 metres away from me on my Dad's farm in Laois.

I was out walking my dog in a quiet beet field when I saw the cat. I instantly recognised that this was a large cat, despite there not being much to scale it too. The wide head, rounded ears, long curved thick tail, wide set shoulders etc. Also the way it ran and leapt into the hedgerow as it saw me, and the height with which it was able to leap into the ditch. My dog would usually run after a cat, but was obviously terrified.

Having just finished my final uni exams, I was first worried about my mental health, as a single sighting would to me suggest more that I've lost the plot rather than there existing phantom cats. It came as a great relief to me a few month later when my Dad rang me to tell me he'd seen it, and perhaps a couple of months later, during the harvest, when the crops were first cut, my uncle ran home and was almost dizzy with fear after seeing a very large black cat. My uncle had not known about this before, as myself and my Dad had kept it quiet, as we did not want the authorities to hunt it down, or indeed for people to think we were both cracked.

I find the phenomenon of phantom cats really strange. I cannot offer an explanation of why there has never been proper photographic evidence or concrete proof of their existence, and I really wouldn't judge or blame anyone for disbelieving someone like me on the internet. I'm even wary of telling people about it TBH. But for what it's worth (and perhaps that's not a lot), I'm certain I saw a black cat at least as large as a large fox in the laois countryside around 2009, I'm 90% sure it was a black puma, and myself and my Dad simply know this creature to have existed, but have no way of proving it.

The three sightings were within a few months of each other in 2009, and the cat has not been seen since.

I don't care who believes me, and I'm not interested in discussing theories about optical illusions or hallucinations, as I'm pretty certain this was neither.

I would say you are mistaken re: the part in bold; a large red fox is about 35 inches in length, a puma would be 2 meters in length. Foxes can also jump surprisingly high; about 2 meters. I would suggest that it's not a wild cat, it's a large fox with a darker colouration than normal.

Since your land seems to be in its territory, have you considered setting up a camera trap to see if you can id it?

It was definitely a large cat. Not large enough to be a leopard or anything, but at least as large as a fox. perhaps I'm being hasty in saying that I'm 90% sure it was a cougar, as I'm not expert on big cats. But was definitely a big cat. It was not only it's size, but the shapes of it's features, like the tail,head and paws, and the way it moved, with heavy feel and high shoulders. It was not a case of seeing it really far away and speculating; there are always domestic, and even semi-feral cats wandering around our fields. This was completely different, and I saw it very clearly from head to foot.I had no idea what kind of cat it was at the time, and I guess I still don't, but looking at pictures I just thought it could have been puma. It looked a lot like that cougar above either. I had never even heard about the phantom cat phenomenon when this happened, so there were no conclusions to jump to.

The cameras would be a great idea and if I hear of it being spotted again, I will, but I live in London, and this was back in 2009, and it hasn't been seen since that I know of. I suspect that someone must be releasing these animals, and perhaps they're just not surviving very long in the wild.

Adam Khor

Deleted User wrote: »

I really would never have believed in this, as a professional scientist, rational sceptic, until I saw what I now know to be a black puma perhaps 100 metres away from me on my Dad's farm in Laois.

I was out walking my dog in a quiet beet field when I saw the cat. I instantly recognised that this was a large cat, despite there not being much to scale it too. The wide head, rounded ears, long curved thick tail, wide set shoulders etc. Also the way it ran and leapt into the hedgerow as it saw me, and the height with which it was able to leap into the ditch. My dog would usually run after a cat, but was obviously terrified.

Having just finished my final uni exams, I was first worried about my mental health, as a single sighting would to me suggest more that I've lost the plot rather than there existing phantom cats. It came as a great relief to me a few month later when my Dad rang me to tell me he'd seen it, and perhaps a couple of months later, during the harvest, when the crops were first cut, my uncle ran home and was almost dizzy with fear after seeing a very large black cat. My uncle had not known about this before, as myself and my Dad had kept it quiet, as we did not want the authorities to hunt it down, or indeed for people to think we were both cracked.

I find the phenomenon of phantom cats really strange. I cannot offer an explanation of why there has never been proper photographic evidence or concrete proof of their existence, and I really wouldn't judge or blame anyone for disbelieving someone like me on the internet. I'm even wary of telling people about it TBH. But for what it's worth (and perhaps that's not a lot), I'm certain I saw a black cat at least as large as a large fox in the laois countryside around 2009, I'm 90% sure it was a black puma, and myself and my Dad simply know this creature to have existed, but have no way of proving it.

The three sightings were within a few months of each other in 2009, and the cat has not been seen since.

I don't care who believes me, and I'm not interested in discussing theories about optical illusions or hallucinations, as I'm pretty certain this was neither.

Do you think it may have been a melanistic serval? Servals are sometimes kept as pets- really not recommended, tho- or kept in captivity to create hybrids with house cats.
Melanistic servals are not that uncommon, and they would be within the size range of foxes-domestic dogs (the largest being about the size of a German shepherd, although not as heavy).



(Point against this idea, you say it had a long tail and the serval has a relatively short tail... )

Then there's also the jungle cat, which can be melanistic as well and is about fox-sized too.



The Jungle cat can also be mixed with the house cat and the resulting hybrid is called a Chausie (from the scientific name of the jungle cat, Felis chaus), and is often twice the size of your ordinary house cat. It comes in dark colors:

Here you can see the size of a chausie cat:

I can totally see a black jungle cat or, more likely, a dark colored chausie being mistaken for a small cougar, especially if its a fleeting sight or during nightime/twilight.

Just thinking of possibilities...