Does this Govt have 'balls' ?

Fr Tod Umptious

Ok so here are three thing that have happened since this Govt took office that I think would never have happened with the previous administration.

1. Judges Pay
Last Govt told us there was nothing that could be done about it.

Enda Kenny had a meeting back in the spring with the head of the high court and told him in no unceratin terms that this was going to the people whether they like it or not.

2. Reduction in bailout interest rate.
Last Govt. told us it was the best we could get and could not be changed.

This Govt got it reduced, as part of an overall EU package.

I would well imagine the last administration would have gone to that meeting in July and not even asked for a rate reduction as it would have been a climb down for them, seeing as they said a rate cut was impossible for so long.

3. AIB interest rate U-Turn.
When AIB said they would not pass on the ECB rate cut the Govt were ready to set the regulator on them, they u-turned 24 hours later

The last Govt. would have told us 'there is nothing we could do about it'.

Thanks you Mr Kenny and Co, you are doing a good job.

Manach

On the International stage however, the lack of prestige is still present with the failure to make any meaningful gesture over the Israeli seizure of Irish citizens?

Fr Tod Umptious

Manach wrote: »

On the International stage however, the lack of prestige is still present with the failure to make any meaningful gesture over the Israeli seizure of Irish citizens?

What are you on about ?.

I am taking about things that matter to the people of Ireland, the state of the public finances, public pay, the conduct of bailed out banks and their treatment of their hard pressed customers.

Not some wishy-washy s**t about a shower of hippies who tried to run a blockade.

Supraman

Will they get rid of the usc that they criticised FF for bringing in ? I severely doubt they will .

jmayo

Manach wrote: »

On the International stage however, the lack of prestige is still present with the failure to make any meaningful gesture over the Israeli seizure of Irish citizens?

Do you want Kenny to declare war on Israel ?

BTW where were these Irish citizens when they were ceased ?
And what about the citizens from other countries, have their governments done "anything meaningful" ?

Africa

Nice post.

Still a lot to be done though. More control over the banks for sure.

Fr Tod Umptious

Supraman wrote: »

Will they get rid of the usc that they criticised FF for bringing in ? I severely doubt they will .

I will not expect them to keep ever election promise, some promises will be watered-down, others will not happen and excuses with lots of spin will be given, but overall I think they are a lot more willing to take thing on that their predecessors.

Everyone from the banks, to the bond holders, to the civil service seemed to have the last Govt over a barrel for no reason other than the Govt were too afraid to take them on.

toxicity234

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Ok so here are three thing that have happened since this Govt took office that I think would never have happened with the previous administration.

1. Judges Pay
Last Govt told us there was nothing that could be done about it.

Not true, It was the judges who told the government they could not deduce the pay of a sitting judge,So any government had no choice but to go to the people, One thing that should be noted, is that the cost of holding the vote, must be weight against saving of around of 3000 Pension Levy to be applied to all Judges and the reduction of 8% pay cut applied to the 24 Judge who didn't volunteer to take a pay cut.
A total saving to the people of around €200,000 a year(its only this small because 180 Judge have already taking cut cuts Voluntary, this saving and the enforced cut on the other 20 or so will make a total saving of 3 Million) . The really problem will be the inevitable high court ruling and what the wording of the referendum means??.

Enda Kenny had a meeting back in the spring with the head of the high court and told him in no unceratin terms that this was going to the people whether they like it or not.

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

2. Reduction in bailout interest rate.
Last Govt. told us it was the best we could get and could not be changed.

This Govt got it reduced, as part of an overall EU package.

I would well imagine the last administration would have gone to that meeting in July and not even asked for a rate reduction as it would have been a climb down for them, seeing as they said a rate cut was impossible for so long..

Again the Goverement had little to do with this, the Bail package of greece and the problem in Spain and italy mean that to keep the Euro together the rate had to be reducted in line with other EU county.

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

3. AIB interest rate U-Turn.
When AIB said they would not pass on the ECB rate cut the Govt were ready to set the regulator on them, they u-turned 24 hours later.

Yeah, this was good work.

They have done an OK job,
But i still think half of there PR is for show,

murphaph

This is all moving the deckchairs on the Titanic stuff folks.

Real balls would be shown if they cut our current public spending BEFORE destroying the capital programme completely, as they have basically done yesterday.

We will now be borrowing to pay above EU average welfare and PS rates instead of borrowing for infrastructure that would serve us and our future generations for decades.

No balls, no.

Fr Tod Umptious

toxicity234 wrote: »

Not true, It was the judges who told the government they could not deduce the pay of a sitting judge,So any government had no choice but to go to the people, One thing that should be noted, is that the cost of holding the vote, must be weight against saving of around of 3000 Pension Levy to be applied to all Judges and the reduction of 8% pay cut applied to the 24 Judge who didn't volunteer to take a pay cut.
A total saving to the people of around €200,000 a year(its only this small because 180 Judge have already taking cut cuts Voluntary, this saving and the enforced cut on the other 20 or so will make a total saving of 3 Million) . The really problem will be the inevitable high court ruling and what the wording of the referendum means??.

Enda Kenny had a meeting back in the spring with the head of the high court and told him in no unceratin terms that this was going to the people whether they like it or not.


Again the Goverement had little to do with this, the Bail package of greece and the problem in Spain and italy mean that to keep the Euro together the rate had to be reducted in line with other EU county.

Yeah, this was good work.

They have done an OK job,
But i still think half of there PR is for show,

i am aware that the interest rate cut was part of an overall EU plan but my point is that the last govt were so spineless that they would not have even lobbied for an interest rate cut for Ireland after the bailout was origionally agreed.
I recall that one of the EU\IMF guys who did the deal back in 2010 was astonisted at how easily the Cowen Govt accepted the interest rate offered at the time without even an argument.

Then for the duration of the election campaign FF told us that the rate could not be changed.

bijapos

I was disappointed that they didn't introduce a mini budget in April to start work on some of their policies, it would have been allowed under the troika agreements, I think they just wanted a longer honeymoon.

Judges pay referendum was very populist, I think it was used to draw attention away fro ma lot of things such as whya are there no massive cuts on their own expenses regime? No action there. How about introducing a rule so that TD's/Senators dont get their pension until the same age as the rest of us? No action there either.

The interest rate reduction was not down to ireland, it was down to other countries, its still madness that we pay so much for essentially doing European banks a huge favour.

AIB reduced its interest rate, what about the rest of the banks?

They promised to get rid of corporate donations, the legislation is ready to be signed, whay aren't they doing that?

What about their promise to stop appointing cronies to government posts, they haven't stopped this.

And what about the €715,000,000 that was handed over last week?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LTCT7QIeP8

Its far too early to be giving any pats on the back, give them a year or two to see how they work out, but so far its been disappointing for me, and I wasn't expesting a lot either.

Fr Tod Umptious

bijapos wrote: »

I was disappointed that they didn't introduce a mini budget in April to start work on some of their policies, it would have been allowed under the troika agreements, I think they just wanted a longer honeymoon.

Judges pay referendum was very populist, I think it was used to draw attention away fro ma lot of things such as whya are there no massive cuts on their own expenses regime? No action there. How about introducing a rule so that TD's/Senators dont get their pension until the same age as the rest of us? No action there either.

The interest rate reduction was not down to ireland, it was down to other countries, its still madness that we pay so much for essentially doing European banks a huge favour.

AIB reduced its interest rate, what about the rest of the banks?

I would expect the same from BOi and other bailed out banks soon, banks that are not bailed out are not the issue here.

I really doubt that that last administration would have been so strong in the condemnation of the bailed out banks over the interest rate, in fact i doubt we would have heard boo from them.

It's easy to sit back and wax lyrical about what should be done with our economy, the banks, the bond holders, the public sector etc and then berate the Govt for not doing it or doing something different.

In this case I think they should be given great credit for forcing AIB into what is a humiliating u-turn.

PRAF

In answer to the OPs question, yes I think they do have some liathroidi. They've done some good stuff since they got power. It seems they are not saddled with the same baggage and guilt that was stopping the last govt from taking decisive action.

They are bring some integrity, some fresh ideas and some decisiveness. Fair play to them.

Yes, we'd all love if they had sorted out the health service by now, reduced unemployment to 5%, increased our pay, reduced taxes etc. Unfortunately, back in the real world that was never going to happen in 8 or 10 months.

bijapos

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

It's easy to sit back and wax lyrical about what should be done with our economy, the banks, the bond holders, the public sector etc and then berate the Govt for not doing it or doing something different.

I'm hardly sitting back and waxing lyrical about anything, the government said they would do certain things, they have been slack on a number of these. i stand by the right to point out where I believe they are not pulling their weight.

In this case I think they should be given great credit for forcing AIB into what is a humiliating u-turn.

They were doing their job, I would have expected nothing less, it was hardly humiliating for AIB either, I think thats putting a bit too much spin on it.

Either way its early days yet, I said in March that I'll give them 2 years to see how they do, running a country of 4.5m people is a very complex issue.

gandalf

When they tackle proper modernisation of the public services and reduce the costs accordingly I will agree with OP. To borrow and change a phrase from Failure Fail "a little done and a lot more to do"!

They are a major step in the right direction from the previous pack of crooks!

Fr Tod Umptious

bijapos wrote: »

I'm hardly sitting back and waxing lyrical about anything, the government said they would do certain things, they have been slack on a number of these. i stand by the right to point out where I believe they are not pulling their weight.

They were doing their job, I would have expected nothing less, it was hardly humiliating for AIB either, I think thats putting a bit too much spin on it.

Either way its early days yet, I said in March that I'll give them 2 years to see how they do, running a country of 4.5m people is a very complex issue.

That's a bit of a contradiction is it not ?

Fr Tod Umptious

gandalf wrote: »

When they tackle proper modernisation of the public services and reduce the costs accordingly I will agree with OP. To borrow and change a phrase from Failure Fail "a little done and a lot more to do"!

They are a major step in the right direction from the previous pack of crooks!

Exactly the way I see it, and like others I agree that a few years will give us a better idea

irishh_bob

they havent done a single thing which wasnt politically convenient and i include the taoiseachs berating of the catholic church over the summer

something i agreed with btw

toxicity234

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

i am aware that the interest rate cut was part of an overall EU plan but my point is that the last govt were so spineless that they would not have even lobbied for an interest rate cut for Ireland after the bailout was origionally agreed.
I recall that one of the EU\IMF guys who did the deal back in 2010 was astonisted at how easily the Cowen Govt accepted the interest rate offered at the time without even an argument.

Then for the duration of the election campaign FF told us that the rate could not be changed.

will again it was not until the EURO crisis deepened that these cuts were possable. Its was all of europe that benifit from this not just ireland.
and from what i have seen and read. Kenny sit back and let the other sort it out and just step up for the odd photo opp.

PRAF

toxicity234 wrote: »

will again it was not until the EURO crisis deepened that these cuts were possable. Its was all of europe that benifit from this not just ireland.
and from what i have seen and read. Kenny sit back and let the other sort it out and just step up for the odd photo opp.

I think it is a little unfair to suggest that the new govt were just plain lucky with these interest rate cuts. Let's face it:
- FF stated categorically that it would not be possible to renegotiate the bailout as they had gotten the best possible deal for Ireland. Recent events have proven that to be untrue.
- There was some talk about Ireland not benefiting from interest rate cuts granted to Portugal and Greece unless Ireland gave up its low corp tax rates. At the time Kenny & co were criticised for this. However, they hung tough and managed to secure the reductions for Ireland.

Unless you have some inside information that suggests the new regime are just jammy b***tards, give them a little bit of credit. Worst case scenario is that they are indeed just jammy b***tards. If thats the case, I'd rather than a lucky incompetent govt than an unlucky and tarnished incompetent govt.

tipptom

They have a cheek to sat they had any thing to do with the intrest rate reduction,just a month before that Noonan and Creighton were saying that they were fighting hard to get a 1 per cent reduction,then they are practically given money without any knowledge,that must have been a shock..Quangos are still out there somewhere floating around waiting to be zapped.Cronies still being elevated from lab and FG.Public sector unions are not being faced down and just let do what they want and blame the last gov for the meaningless deal. Enda seems to be an executive leader who is told what the announcment is and announces it.Still,they are by and large honest and we have not had this in this country for many many years.

PRAF

Apparently 14 quangos were abolished since they gained power and many more to come.

irishh_bob

PRAF wrote: »

toxicity234 wrote: »

will again it was not until the EURO crisis deepened that these cuts were possable. Its was all of europe that benifit from this not just ireland.
and from what i have seen and read. Kenny sit back and let the other sort it out and just step up for the odd photo opp.

I think it is a little unfair to suggest that the new govt were just plain lucky with these interest rate cuts. Let's face it:
- FF stated categorically that it would not be possible to renegotiate the bailout as they had gotten the best possible deal for Ireland. Recent events have proven that to be untrue.
- There was some talk about Ireland not benefiting from interest rate cuts granted to Portugal and Greece unless Ireland gave up its low corp tax rates. At the time Kenny & co were criticised for this. However, they hung tough and managed to secure the reductions for Ireland.

Unless you have some inside information that suggests the new regime are just jammy b***tards, give them a little bit of credit. Worst case scenario is that they are indeed just jammy b***tards. If thats the case, I'd rather than a lucky incompetent govt than an unlucky and tarnished incompetent govt.

Greece got half it's debt written off, we merely got our interest rate halved, it's the least we could have got

Icepick

irishh_bob wrote: »

Greece got half it's debt written off, we merely got our interest rate halved, it's the least we could have got

Greece is screwed even if they have 100% written off so you are not comparing like with like.

There most likely will be further reductions though.

Godge

This Government have done well.....so far.

The budget is their real test.

Chips Lovell

Am I the only one who thinks that forcing the rate cut was a dumb, populist move?

pragmatic1

They're better than the last shower of traitors but thats not really saying much. I have zero faith in Irish politics. The people deserve better.

jonsnow

pragmatic1 wrote: »

They're better than the last shower of traitors but thats not really saying much. I have zero faith in Irish politics. The people deserve better.

We get the government we deserve.We do live in a democracy after all.Noone was forced to vote for Jackie Healy Rae/Lowry/Flynn/Haughey/Ahern etc etc etc

johngalway

bijapos wrote: »

And what about the €715,000,000 that was handed over last week?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LTCT7QIeP8

The not another cent commitment, as I understand it, was that the new Government would not spend any EXTRA monies that had not ALREADY been committed by the PREVIOUS Government. As far as I am aware, they have held to that.

As for the upcoming budget, it will be harsh. It has to be. Anyone thinking or expecting otherwise is only fooling themselves.

Further budgets will possibly be harsher than expected to date, as the European and World economy is taking a bit of a beating. But, no doubt, the usual moaners will leave out that important fact when the time comes around and criticize the Government for not making a silk purse out of a sows ear.

murphaph

johngalway wrote: »

As for the upcoming budget, it will be harsh. It has to be. Anyone thinking or expecting otherwise is only fooling themselves.

Further budgets will possibly be harsher than expected to date, as the European and World economy is taking a bit of a beating. But, no doubt, the usual moaners will leave out that important fact when the time comes around and criticize the Government for not making a silk purse out of a sows ear.

I have no problem with harsh budgets. I just have a problem when every effort is being made to ensure nobody in one particular sector loses their job or even sees a pay cut.

The government should work on all our behalf's, not just on behalf of those protected by the CPA.

woodoo

They will have balls if they take a little of the pensioners. And if they put some serious pressure on the rich to pay their taxes here.

murphaph

woodoo wrote: »

They will have balls if they take a little of the pensioners. And if they put some serious pressure on the rich to pay their taxes here.

It will be very interesting to see if the pension is reduced (hasn't been touched yet, despite the crisis starting 3 or 4 years ago now).

There are so many schmucks in Ireland that think reducing the pension by 10 quid is going to see them all freezing to death huddled around a candle. Nothing could be further from the truth: pensioners above even the PS have barely been affected by the crisis. Indeed, as the cost of living on average has fallen, pensioners are arguably better off now than when the problems started.

State pension should be in line with dole, which should also be cut a bit again this year. It has to be cut a bit each year until it's in line with European averages. A new system should be introduced with payments for the first year of unemployment reflecting what you paid in in PRSI and after that reducing to a standard rate, being reduced further to s subsistence level after say 2 years of unemployment.

Does the government have the balls to do any of this?

blackdog2

No, the country is still the same inconvenient hole it was when the last shower was in charge, except it seems that many seem to be aware of how much of a hole it is.