Help Cut this down in costs a bit.

Korvanica

Im currently thinking of upgrading my machine to be able to handle BF3 and Skyrim on highest settings

This should do it no problem:

Total build cost: €604.98 + €30 shipping
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T Black Edition, AM3 €168.18
ASUS M4N98TD EVO, AM3, ATX €100.97
Thermaltake Overseer RX-I, ohne Netzteil €98.43
ASUS ENGTX560 Ti DCII/2DI/1GD5, 1024MB,PCI-E,2xDVI,HDMI €203.66
8GB-Kit Corsair ValueSelect PC3-10667U CL9 €33.74

Anyone have any alternatives that would work out cheaper?

If i can cut enough off this i can probably spring for an SSD

EDIT: I have the case in there as I want to upgrade to a Full Tower, current machine is only a Mid Sized one so no filthy big Graphics cards ...

Serephucus

i5 2500K + Asrock P67 Pro3 = ~€270 and would destroy the X6.

Korvanica

Cool thanks



Total build cost: €597.04 + €30 shipping
Thermaltake Overseer RX-I, ohne Netzteil €98.43
ASUS ENGTX560 Ti DCII/2DI/1GD5, 1024MB,PCI-E,2xDVI,HDMI €203.66
8GB-Kit Corsair ValueSelect PC3-10667U CL9 €33.74
ASRock P67 Pro3 SE (B3), Sockel 1155, ATX €77.51
Intel Core i5-2500K Box, LGA1155 €183.70


Any other suggestions ?

Unregistered.

Korvanica wrote: »

Cool thanks



Total build cost: €597.04 + €30 shipping
Thermaltake Overseer RX-I, ohne Netzteil €98.43
ASUS ENGTX560 Ti DCII/2DI/1GD5, 1024MB,PCI-E,2xDVI,HDMI €203.66
8GB-Kit Corsair ValueSelect PC3-10667U CL9 €33.74
ASRock P67 Pro3 SE (B3), Sockel 1155, ATX €77.51
Intel Core i5-2500K Box, LGA1155 €183.70


Any other suggestions ?

Use skinflint.co.uk/eu/ to save a couple of quid.

deconduo

Korvanica wrote: »

Cool thanks



Total build cost: €597.04 + €30 shipping
Thermaltake Overseer RX-I, ohne Netzteil €98.43
ASUS ENGTX560 Ti DCII/2DI/1GD5, 1024MB,PCI-E,2xDVI,HDMI €203.66
8GB-Kit Corsair ValueSelect PC3-10667U CL9 €33.74
ASRock P67 Pro3 SE (B3), Sockel 1155, ATX €77.51
Intel Core i5-2500K Box, LGA1155 €183.70


Any other suggestions ?

Item|Price
Total build cost: €510.82 + €30 shipping
Intel Core i5-2500K Box, LGA1155|€183.70
8GB-Kit G.Skill PC3-10667U CL9|€31.51
Cooler Master 690 II LITE Midi-Tower - PURE Black Edition, ohne Netzteil|€69.51
Sapphire HD6870 1G GDDR5 PCI-E DL-DVI-I+SL-DVI-D / HDMI / DP|€143.49
ASRock P67 Pro3 (B3), Sockel 1155, ATX|€82.61


-Cheaper case thats still decent
-Slightly cheaper RAM
-6870 instead of the 560 Ti. The 560 Ti is 40% more expensive for only ~15% more performance.

Korvanica

Cool cheers deconduo, Im gonna stick with the Full size tower though for future upgradability. Currently have a mid tower, but cannot fit most cards into it ...

Can that 6780 be crossfired ? (in case I decide to do so in the future) ?

deconduo

Korvanica wrote: »

Cool cheers deconduo, Im gonna stick with the Full size tower though for future upgradability. Currently have a mid tower, but cannot fit most cards into it ...

Can that 6780 be crossfired ? (in case I decide to do so in the future) ?

The 690 II is big enough to hold any graphics card out at the moment. It takes cards up to 30.4cm which is the size of the HD 6990. Most cards will be much smaller than that giving you plenty of room.

The 6870 can be crossfired but you'd want this board instead then:
http://www2.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=50900&agid=1601

Make sure you PSU is good enough to handle it, a good 600W unit will be fine.

Korvanica

Would the stock cooler that comes with the CPU be okay for Overclocking or would I be better off buying a better one ?

Such as:
Artic Cooling 13

If anyone has cheaper/just as good alternatives it'd be appreciated.

Korvanica

I also have this power supply at home - I assume this'll be fine until I want to crossfire?

Antec EA 500 GREEN

Dublin_Gunner

Korvanica wrote: »

I also have this power supply at home - I assume this'll be fine until I want to crossfire?

Antec EA 500 GREEN

Too small to be safe. Plus it only has 1 x 6pin PCI-E apadter, 6870 takes two (so that would be 4 if crossfired).

These days, TBH if you're looking to crossfire and overclock, you should be looking at getting at least a quality 750W supply.

PSU is the most important part of any build, don't skimp.

People on here seem to go for these Super Flower PSU's (i've never used one so cant comment)

Super Flower 800W 80plus gold €82.22

Monotype

Yeah, as DG says, 500W wouldn't really be enough.

deconduo wrote: »

a good 600W unit will be fine.

(Note the good).

800W is a bit excessive unless there's a lot of upgrades in store. You could even get by with about 550W with some light overclocking, but I'd go for 650W or so to give a bit of room including graphics overclocking.

Re: the heatsink.
It's not necessary, but it is a good idea to get one if you want a quieter system. The AC freezer 13 pro is probably slightly better than the non pro version for €22 or so last time I checked. Another reasonably good one about the same price is the coolermaster 212 plus. It's something that you can upgrade later if you don't have the money now but you might end up paying more for postage/VAT increases and smaller selection if you're buying small quantities (making a HWV order not worth it).

Korvanica

Monotype wrote: »

Yeah, as DG says, 500W wouldn't really be enough.

(Note the good).

800W is a bit excessive unless there's a lot of upgrades in store. You could even get by with about 550W with some light overclocking, but I'd go for 650W or so to give a bit of room including graphics overclocking.

Re: the heatsink.
It's not necessary, but it is a good idea to get one if you want a quieter system. The AC freezer 13 pro is probably slightly better than the non pro version for €22 or so last time I checked. Another reasonably good one about the same price is the coolermaster 212 plus. It's something that you can upgrade later if you don't have the money now but you might end up paying more for postage/VAT increases and smaller selection if you're buying small quantities (making a HWV order not worth it).

Cheers. Yea I plan on overclocking both graphics and cpu to some extent. So an 800W would cover that and would future proof me for some future upgrades aswell.

Good point on the postage/vat - may as well order a heatsink now for the sake of 20 quid.

So this is what the build looks like at the moment:


Total build cost: €659.11 + €30 shipping
ASRock Z68 Extreme3 Gen3, Sockel 1155, ATX €117.29
Sapphire HD6870 1G GDDR5 PCI-E DL-DVI-I+SL-DVI-D / HDMI / DP €144.51
Cooler Master 690 II LITE Midi-Tower - PURE Black Edition, ohne Netzteil €68.33
8GB-Kit G.Skill PC3-10667U CL9 €28.55
Intel Core i5-2500K Box, LGA1155 €195.78
ARCTIC COOLING Freezer 13 Pro(Sockel 775/1155/1156/1366/754/939/AM2/AM2 +/AM3/AM3+/FM1) €22.43
Super-Flower Amazon 80Plus 800W €82.22

Hah cut costs - and theyve gone up .. although il have a better system in the end anyway so its all good :P

Serephucus

800W is still overkill. A good 650W unit will do 6870 CF, 700W if you want OC and upgrade room. Everything else looks good though.

Dublin_Gunner

Serephucus wrote: »

800W is still overkill. A good 650W unit will do 6870 CF, 700W if you want OC and upgrade room. Everything else looks good though.

So you're saying 800 is overkill, but recommending 700W?? lol are you for real?


Its not overkill, and for the price difference there's really little point going for less.

A decent crossfire rig, and overclocked CPU 800W is perfect, and the PSU will serve him through many upgrades.

Why skimp with the bare minimum?? 550W is not enough for an overclocked Crossfire rig for a start.

And then take into account capacitor aging over the next few years, and the fact a 550W will NOT come with enough PCI-E connectors (meaning you'll have to make an unholy mess inside your PC to accommodate the power requirements of the cards) and you'll quickly find the 20 euro you saved has caused you a right pain in the left bollock.

deconduo

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

Too small to be safe. Plus it only has 1 x 6pin PCI-E apadter, 6870 takes two (so that would be 4 if crossfired).

These days, TBH if you're looking to crossfire and overclock, you should be looking at getting at least a quality 750W supply.

PSU is the most important part of any build, don't skimp.

People on here seem to go for these Super Flower PSU's (i've never used one so cant comment)

Super Flower 800W 80plus gold €82.22

I dunno what you are talking about, the EA 500 is plenty for a single 6870. It does have 2 PCI-E connectors, and even if it didn't you'd just need to use a molex adapter.

The OP didn't ask if it was enough for crossfire, he asked was it enough UNTIL he wanted to crossfire. Its perfectly fine.

Dublin_Gunner

deconduo wrote: »

I dunno what you are talking about, the EA 500 is plenty for a single 6870. It does have 2 PCI-E connectors, and even if it didn't you'd just need to use a molex adapter.

The OP didn't ask if it was enough for crossfire, he asked was it enough UNTIL he wanted to crossfire. Its perfectly fine.

Your splitting hairs.

And I was talking about crossfire (in case you missed the good few times I mentioned it). The OP said he wishes to go crossfire when he has the cash up, so it would be best to get a PSU now that will accommodate that setup.

Whats the point of buying one now, only to replace it when you want to crossfire?? Just stump the extra 20 quid and get the bigger PSU and be happy.

Please tell me the advantage of buying a 500W unit now, only to replace it later on?

Jesus H christ.

Monotype

550W is enough for two 6870s. Maximum power for one is measured as 163W.
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/Radeon_HD_6870/27.html
The rest of an average overclocked Sandy Bridge system is well below 200W.

The point with the connectors is fair enough and if you're overclocking graphics cards and want a good bit of room, 650W is plenty and most come with the appropriate connectors. The price of the 800W one is very good alright but efficiencies drop on low loads with PSUs rated well above your needs.

deconduo wrote: »

The OP didn't ask if it was enough for crossfire, he asked was it enough UNTIL he wanted to crossfire. Its perfectly fine.

Ah, you're right. I misread that. With one card, the current PSU is fine.

Serephucus

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

So you're saying 800 is overkill, but recommending 700W?? lol are you for real?

Obviously, or I wouldn't have posted that.

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

Its not overkill, and for the price difference there's really little point going for less.

Yes it is, and I'm not thinking price difference so much as PSU efficiency and the OP's ESB bill.

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

And then take into account capacitor aging over the next few years, and the fact a 550W will NOT come with enough PCI-E connectors (meaning you'll have to make an unholy mess inside your PC to accommodate the power requirements of the cards) and you'll quickly find the 20 euro you saved has caused you a right pain in the left bollock.

Wrong again. The PSU does come with enough connectors, and even if it didn't, molex adapters are always an option. As for capacitor ageing? Maybe google it first. Even if you were horribly unlucky, we're talking maybe a 2% drop after about three years. Not worth mentioning.


A good 650W unit will power 6870 CF, probably with OC room to spare.

Dublin_Gunner

Monotype wrote: »

550W is enough for two 6870s. Maximum power for one is measured as 163W.
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/Radeon_HD_6870/27.html
The rest of an average overclocked Sandy Bridge system is well below 200W.

The point with the connectors is fair enough and if you're overclocking graphics cards and want a good bit of room, 650W is plenty and most come with the appropriate connectors. The price of the 800W one is very good alright but efficiencies drop on low loads with PSUs rated well above your needs.

526W or thereabouts, thats cutting it fine, and not considering a PSU loses power output over time.

What is it with you guys and skimping on PSU's?

PSU isn't a part of your rig you should be looking to save money TBH.

Once again, someone please give the advantage of buying a low power PSU now, and then having to upgrade it in a while??

Anyway, the OP has already stated he'd prefer to spend the extra and go with what I recommended, so it doesn't matter at this stage.

Korvanica

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

Whats the point of buying one now, only to replace it when you want to crossfire?? Just stump the extra 20 quid and get the bigger PSU and be happy.

Please tell me the advantage of buying a 500W unit now, only to replace it later on?

I already have one in my current rig. So i dont need to buy a PSU now. And would only need to buy one when I decide to crossfire. Meaning the 30 delivery from HVS would be spread between 2 products aswell (possibly 3 as I will probably get an SSD in the future aswell.)

Serephucus

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

526W or thereabouts, thats cutting it fine, and not considering a PSU loses power output over time.

See my post. 2% or less over a few years.

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

Once again, someone please give the advantage of buying a low power PSU now, and then having to upgrade it in a while??

Ok, I will. Again. Efficiency.

If he buys a 650W unit, he'll have enough for Crossfire, so won't have to buy a new one, and it'll be more efficient than having power he'll never use.

@ OP: I made the mistake of buying and over-powered PSU for my needs. Recently, I swapped my 1200W unit for a 700W unit, and I'm now saving €20 a month on my ESB bill. Not as big a difference with you, but still something to think about.

Dublin_Gunner

Serephucus wrote: »

See my post. 2% or less over a few years. 1



Ok, I will. Again. Efficiency.

If he buys a 650W unit, he'll have enough for Crossfire, so won't have to buy a new one, and it'll be more efficient than having power he'll never use. 2

@ OP: I made the mistake of buying and over-powered PSU for my needs. Recently, I swapped my 1200W unit for a 700W unit, and I'm now saving €20 a month on my ESB bill. Not as big a difference with you, but still something to think about. 3

1 I'm sorry, but I don't take a post of yours as proof lol

2 That is impossible to state without knowing the efficiency of the unit at the output specified.

3 If you saved 20 a month, that must have been a horribly inefficient 1200W PSU you had, your rig was only using about 25% of the rated output, or your talking BS. What spec was your rig? Unles it was using 2 x 6990 or 590's with a highly overclocked CPU you were a bit silly buying it.

Depending on the units, and 800W 80% unit working at 60% output could easily be more efficient than a 550W unit working at 90%, actually saving money.

Sorry, but you cannot spout the figures out of your arse without knowing all of the specifics involved.

Anyway, I'm out.

Serephucus

Ok, since you're being overly-aggressive for no reason...

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

1 I'm sorry, but I don't take a post of yours as proof lol

I never said you should. If you actually looked at the post in question I suggested you google around and see for yourself. I never said my word was the truth.

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

2 That is impossible to state without knowing the efficiency of the unit at the output specified.

To a certain extent, yes, but broadly speaking, the figures are less than you're making them out to be. Unless you keep your PSU for fifteen years, running it very hard all that time, capacitor ageing is a non-issue.

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

3 If you saved 20 a month, that must have been a horribly inefficient 1200W PSU you had, your rig was only using about 25% of the rated output, or your talking BS. What spec was your rig? Unles it was using 2 x 6990 or 590's with a highly overclocked CPU you were a bit silly buying it.

I've only had it for a month, so I can't say for certain. Nothing else has changed, and yes, I probably was only using 25% of its output. My current rig, with my CPU at stock clocks. Was I silly buying it in the first place? Hell yes, that's the very point I'm trying to make here.

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

Depending on the units, and 800W 80% unit working at 60% output could easily be more efficient than a 550W unit working at 90%, actually saving money.

Yes. But what you're completely overlooking in lieu of trying to support you own points, is that no-one is going to be gaming 24/7. At least 60% of the time (and that's being generous to your side) he using will be idling or on the desktop or whatever, drawing maybe 80W, meaning a lower power PSU is a far better buy.

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

Sorry, but you cannot spout the figures out of your arse without knowing all of the specifics involved.

Anyway, I'm out.

Did I say anywhere here that I was? No. Quite the opposite in fact. I actively encouraged you to see for yourself.

And with that I'm done. I learned my lesson with the good Sir, Hackett.

Monotype

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

526W or thereabouts, thats cutting it fine
What is it with you guys and skimping on PSU's?

Yes it is, hence the recommendation of 650W or so. Note that the figures I said were maximums and I can't find exact numbers on CPU consumptions since nearly all reviews include a graphics card. Most are measuring at the wall too so it's hard to say exactly.

The 80 plus rating doesn't cover below below 20% load. Ideally you want your idle power consumption to be inside that band, and PCs tend to be idle a lot. Even under load, your average consumption will still be in the lower half and you won't be getting the best out of your PSU.
It's unlikely that you'll be saving much in your regular bills but across one and multiple years, it would add up.

deconduo

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

Your splitting hairs.

And I was talking about crossfire (in case you missed the good few times I mentioned it). The OP said he wishes to go crossfire when he has the cash up, so it would be best to get a PSU now that will accommodate that setup.

Whats the point of buying one now, only to replace it when you want to crossfire?? Just stump the extra 20 quid and get the bigger PSU and be happy.

Please tell me the advantage of buying a 500W unit now, only to replace it later on?

Jesus H christ.

He already has the EA 500...

Please read the thread before going off on rants for no reason.

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

Anyway, the OP has already stated he'd prefer to spend the extra and go with what I recommended, so it doesn't matter at this stage.

Only because you gave him bad information.

Korvanica

So anyway this is the exact PSU I have at home:

Linkage

Which has 1 x 8-pin (6+2) and 1 x 6-pin PCI-E connector. So I should be fine until I decide to Crossfire.

Sorted..

Total build cost: €579.29 + €30 shipping
ASRock Z68 Extreme3 Gen3, Sockel 1155, ATX €117.29
Sapphire HD6870 1G GDDR5 PCI-E DL-DVI-I+SL-DVI-D / HDMI / DP €144.51
Cooler Master 690 II LITE Midi-Tower - PURE Black Edition, ohne Netzteil €68.33
8GB-Kit G.Skill PC3-10667U CL9 €28.55
Intel Core i5-2500K Box, LGA1155 €195.78
ARCTIC COOLING Freezer 13 Pro(Sockel 775/1155/1156/1366/754/939/AM2/AM2 +/AM3/AM3+/FM1) €22.43
Arctic Cooling Wärmeleitpaste MX-2 Tube 4g €2.40

Cheers folks, Probably order this tonight / tomorrow.

Monotype

You should probably go with mx-4 at this stage. It's in stock too.
http://www4.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=49231

ShadowHearth

i will put some oil in to fire...


i run my 6870 on dells 375w PSU


*sits down and watches the show!

Korvanica

ShadowHearth wrote: »

i will put some oil in to fire...

i run my 6870 on dells 375w PSU

*sits down and watches the show!

*Grabs popcorn to share with ShadowHearth...

Korvanica

Decided against the ATI graphics. Gonna spend a bit more and go with Nvidia

ASUS ENGTX560 Ti DCII

Can anyone recommend me a power supply? 700-750Watt
as the one I currently have wont be able to handle the card properly AFIK (or so ive been told be a few people anyway)...

Monotype

You can get an asus 560ti for €27 cheaper, delivered for free, from dabs.
http://www.dabs.ie/products/asus-geforce-gtx-560-ti-822mhz-1gb-gddr5-pci-express-hdmi-7TNV.html?q=560%20ti&src=16
Clock speed is slightly lower and heatsink is not quite as good but I think it's a good saving.