What ARE you willing to have cut?

oppenheimer1

TimTim wrote: »

Look at what we have today. I think we're already scraping the bottom of the barrel here.

It can get much worse. Believe it or not, Ireland (with the major exception of the financial crisis) is a relatively well run and governed country, with little corruption. It was one positive legacy the brits left us.

noodler

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

OAPs shouldn't get state assistance for things they can afford. Many OAPs have pensions larger than my salary yet they get a free tv licence and a free travel pass and free healthcare. Those that have to work pay for all of the above.

What the f***? They have whatever pensions they bloody contributed to for their whole lives. A simple state one in most cases.

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

When someone has been working they are paying for expenditure at that time. Old people who paid tax in their working life were paying for pensioners at that time. It isn't and shouldn't be seen as some sort of saving scheme, that they paid in so much in tax over they years, then they are entitled to the same back. It doesn't work like that.

Thats pretty much exactly how pensions are expected to work.

There may, and I stress may, be some room to cut the state pension to pensioners who have access to other significant sources of funds but thats about it.

Ace2007

Cill Dara Abu wrote: »

They get free electricity units and fuel allowance i.e money for briquettes, coal, etc.

Well when I was 17 and starting driving I was paying €2,200 per year for insurance, why wasn't I given a free driving licence?

Level playing field??? Were you around for the last budget where OAP's were not touched yet every other member of society was! So don't talk bull!

Lets give OAP's vouchers aswell if you are going down that route?

A couple in their 70s up the road from me just last week had brand spanking new double glazed windows installed at the expense of the tax-payer.

Absolute madness!

No they don't, it's either Electricity Allowance or Gas Allowance not both as you are implying.

And how do you know that we the tax payer paid for their windows?

at 17 what have you contributed to the state that should allow you to get anything,

a retired person could have over 40 years of tax behind them.

noodler

Cill Dara Abu wrote: »

No, I'm not a teenager. People whinge about fairness when it comes to cuts in Budget 2011 yet when it comes to the little old dear down the road they can't be touched.:rolleyes:

How is it fair to take from the people who have contributed more than anyone else to the system when what we are talking about is as basic as electricity credits, a bus pass and less than 200e a week?


Talking about "the little old dear down the road" and adding moronic rollieeyes just highlights that you are painting everybody with the same brush and haven't really given this much thought.

Could you move onto the next logical step in your argument without spouting more generalistic crap because it simply makes you sound like someone who is struggling in life and saw his neighbour having a lie in one morning.

oppenheimer1

noodler wrote: »

What the f***? They have whatever pensions they bloody contributed to for their whole lives. A simple state one in most cases.



Thats pretty much exactly how pensions are expected to work.

There may, and I stress may, be some room to cut the state pension to pensioners who have access to other significant sources of funds but thats about it.

The state pension and other associated entitlements doesn't work like that. It is todays taxpayers that pay for todays pensioners. If todays taxpayers cannot afford to give todays pensioners the free stuff, then it has to be cut.

As I said it shouldn't be seen as a savings scheme, as these entitlements are paid from the current account budget.

dark crystal

We need a serious cut in the amount of international overseas aid Ireland pays out (in 2010 the official development assistance programme paid out 675.8 million).

Also, Means test Children's Allowance and stop paying for children no longer living in the country.

noodler

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

The state pension and other associated entitlements doesn't work like that.

Doesn't work like what? You pay PSRI your whole life and you are entitled to the State pension - it is quite simple.

Did I misunderstand your point there?

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

It is todays taxpayers that pay for todays pensioners. If todays taxpayers cannot afford to give todays pensioners the free stuff, then it has to be cut.

Lets be very clear here. You can live on 30,000 a year even if it is below the average industrial wage. There is room for manouvere. You could get a better job, you could move etc etc

State pensioners are on around 200e a week (a little more depending), you can probably make the assumption that they do not have to pay their mortgages or any rent (although that would be dangerous in today's climate).

Our state pension should not be our first port of call for cuts, welfare and or public sector pay (which has doubled since 2000) are far more bloated and worthy of consideration before the country starts casting adrift the weakest in society after they've contributed so much.

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

As I said it shouldn't be seen as a savings scheme, as these entitlements are paid from the current account budget.

We pay about 3bn in public sector pensions everywhere too, that money doesn't exist, has to come out of public expenditure and the vast amount of people who paid in to these schemes see more back then they paid in.

storker

Spudmonkey wrote: »

You are willing to have someone acting on a national scale drawing the same amount as a industrial worker?

Yes. Having them on their current bloated incomes hasn't exactly been a roaring success. These are desperate times. Time to try something radical i.e. people not in the job for self-enrichment.

Stork

oppenheimer1

noodler wrote: »

Doesn't work like what? You pay PSRI your whole life and you are entitled to the State pension - it is quite simple.

Did I misunderstand your point there?



Lets be very clear here. You can live on 30,000 a year even if it is below the average industrial wage. There is room for manouvere. You could get a better job, you could move etc etc

State pensioners are on around 200e a week (a little more depending), you can probably make the assumption that they do not have to pay their mortgages or any rent (although that would be dangerous in today's climate).

Our state pension should not be our first port of call for cuts, welfare and or public sector pay (which has doubled since 2000) are far more bloated and worthy of consideration before the country starts casting adrift the weakest in society after they've contributed so much.




We pay about 3bn in public sector pensions everywhere too, that money doesn't exist, has to come out of public expenditure and the vast amount of people who paid in to these schemes see more back then they paid in.

Yes but the money for the state pension and other associated entitlements comes from todays tax receipts. About PRSI etc. one only needs three years of stamps to qualify for the contributory pension, while the non-contributory pension is only marginally smaller. You don't need to have worked a day in your life to get the pension. You do not pay tax in order to get the pension in the future. People have it in their heads that this is true but it isn't

The pension hasn't been the first port of calls for cuts. In fact it has been far from it. Pensioners have been insulated from the deep economic malaise from which this country has suffered. In fact they have seen their purchasing power increase with the deflation that hit the economy as their pension has been protected. Pensioners also came out in force at even a small measure to reduce their entitlements while the rest of us have to go out and earn the money to pay for them.


Pensioners are not entirely blameless either. Many of them voted for politicians that led us into the crisis. They should not be insulated any more than any other sector of society. The way it stands is that well off pensioners are being protected while SNA and other necessary contract staff are being cut. The vulnerable need to be protected but are all pensioners vulnerable?

chasm

Cill Dara Abu wrote: »

Pensioners need to take a huge cut in this budget, they have gotten away without been touched for too long now, let them whinge all they want.

Pension: €220 p/w
Free electricity units
Medical card
Free fuel
Free travel
Free household upgrades.
And lots of other little things like free passports, driving licenses, TV licence etc.

AFAIK since April 2011 Pensioners have had to pay for their passports. Never heard of free household upgrades, what are they?

I know a couple who are OAPs and even though they have a travel pass they have never used it, mainly because the guy wouldn't be able to manage public transport, he would be able to swap his travel pass (with a small fee) for a parking permit but he never bothered.They have an 11 year old car and tip in and out of town to do their shopping etc and the odd trip away to the Uk. When they needed new windows and doors in their house they had to save for ages and then take a loan out from the credit union - not all pensioners live the highlife on a big fat pension. I certainly don't begrudge pensioners a free drivers licence considering once they hit 67 years old they have to apply every 3 years for it.

Cill Dara Abu

Ace2007 wrote: »

No they don't, it's either Electricity Allowance or Gas Allowance not both as you are implying.

And how do you know that we the tax payer paid for their windows?

at 17 what have you contributed to the state that should allow you to get anything,

a retired person could have over 40 years of tax behind them.

Who said anything about Gas?? You can't heat a house on electricity alone! Read the post properly before spouting bull :rolleyes:

noodler wrote: »

How is it fair to take from the people who have contributed more than anyone else to the system when what we are talking about is as basic as electricity credits, a bus pass and less than 200e a week?


Talking about "the little old dear down the road" and adding moronic rollieeyes just highlights that you are painting everybody with the same brush and haven't really given this much thought.

Could you move onto the next logical step in your argument without spouting more generalistic crap because it simply makes you sound like someone who is struggling in life and saw his neighbour having a lie in one morning.

Less than €200 p/w? Again get the facts right before spouting off!:rolleyes:

I'm far from struggling, I have never been on SW and hopefully never will!

Cill Dara Abu

chasm wrote: »

AFAIK since April 2011 Pensioners have had to pay for their passports. Never heard of free household upgrades, what are they?

Windows, insulation, etc.

storker

harrythehat wrote: »

Let's start a new discussion. What WOULD you cut? Now before 100 posts go up about TD's salaries and pensions etc bear in mind that fun as it would be to make them work for minimum wage, it would have a negligible effect on our national debt.

Irrelevant. The situation requires, nay, cries out for leadership. TDs salaries, taxing the very well off etc should be done, not because they would fix the situation but because it would be the right thing to do.

Either we're in desperate financial straits or we're not. If we are, then let's at least act like it. That means everyone takes a hit; real pain-sharing, as opposed to pain-sharing that's just talked about but never actually happens. Then and only then, go to the taxpayers, and vulnerable members of society for their contribution.

Stork

Ace2007

it is about €200 p/w if your on the pension - so that's around 10k a year, you try living off 10k a year for the rest of your life, you have no idea of the facts if you think it's possible.

it's not like being on the dole, where say you have the possibility of getting off it and getting a job.

this is what you get:

•The Electricity Allowance or
•The Electricity (Group Account) Allowance or
•The Natural Gas Allowance or
•The Bottled Gas Allowance

one can only choose 1 of them,

storker

Dean09 wrote: »

Yes.
Earlier this year Joan Burton said she was going to review the situation and speak to the EU about it.
I haven't heard anything else about it since then though.

Let me consult my crystal ball... "I prostrate myself before you my Euro-masters...it is I , La Burton...I was just...er..um...mumble...wondering if we could...you know, review that situation...if you're not too busy, of course...oh, I see...no chance at all then...right...sorry for bothering you..."



Stork

storker

Zebra3 wrote: »

Merge loads of the local authorities around the country.

Dublin has four? Wtf? There should be one local authority covering the GDA (Dublin and its commuter belt).

How about reducing them to four? Munster, Leinster, Connaught, Dublin. Until we get the fourth green field back, fold Donegal into Connaught and Cavan into Leinster.

Stork

storker

Dean09 wrote: »

The next 2 are somewhat controversial but should be considered in some detail but carefully regulated and monitored....
Legalize cannabis ( I don't smoke weed so this isn't for personal/selfish reasons.
Legalize prostitution. (This would have to be extensively regulated. I'm not 100% sure on this one myself but it could be considered.)

Well, they are always talking about widening the tax base...you can't get much wider than that!

In all seriousness, I agree.

Stork

oppenheimer1

Ace2007 wrote: »

it is about €200 p/w if your on the pension - so that's around 10k a year, you try living off 10k a year for the rest of your life, you have no idea of the facts if you think it's possible.

it's not like being on the dole, where say you have the possibility of getting off it and getting a job.

this is what you get:

•The Electricity Allowance or
•The Electricity (Group Account) Allowance or
•The Natural Gas Allowance or
•The Bottled Gas Allowance

one can only choose 1 of them,

I'd say its pretty manageable as a lifetime of work, one will have built up assets. It is unlikely you'll be paying rent or a mortgage at that stage. You also get free healthcare and prescriptions (the 50c charge is on the way out).
€220 a week is plenty to live on, to pay what bills you have in excess of your allowance. In fact all a pensioner needs their money for is food and clothes and minor household chores/repair. The state takes care of the rest.

storker

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

I have to laugh at some of the acceptable cuts being proposed here. For example reducing politicians pay and allowance is very small beer compared with what needs to be saved.

It's not about the savings - it's about a little thing called leadership.

I'm not saying that their pay and allowances shouldn't be looked at, but the budget adjustment is in the order of billions not millions. Cutting politicians pay leads to two things btw. It reduces the quality of candidates and it aids corruption.

Rubbish. The quality of people in the Dail could scarcely be any lower, and they're on some of the best parliamentary salaries in the world.

Out of curiosity, have you got a cite to back up that claim?

Stork

Duffy the Vampire Slayer

papajimsmooth wrote: »

Well, we have to end apartheid for one. And slow down the nuclear arms race, stop terrorism and world hunger. We have to provide food and shelter for the homeless, and oppose racial discrimination and promote civil rights, while also promoting equal rights for women. We have to encourage a return to traditional moral values. Most importantly, we have to promote general social concern and less materialism in young people

Does nobody else get this reference? For shame.

Ace2007

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

I'd say its pretty manageable as a lifetime of work, one will have built up assets. It is unlikely you'll be paying rent or a mortgage at that stage. You also get free healthcare and prescriptions (the 50c charge is on the way out).
€220 a week is plenty to live on, to pay what bills you have in excess of your allowance. In fact all a pensioner needs their money for is food and clothes and minor household chores/repair. The state takes care of the rest.

Also talkin about life time of work, you will see a lot of pensioners lost thousands in shares when the banks went silly up. -

See from the way you guys are talking you want pensioner to exist not live, but please continue, becuase it's not going to happen - no hugh cuts like you are talking about.

Cuts should be:

College fees should be introduced - as it is guys coming out of college disappear abroad and don't pay back the state.

Water charges should be brought in - if a business has to pay - surely individuals should be to.

chasm

CorkBabe33 wrote: »

And as for children's allowance being paid for children not even living here - should be stopped with immediate effect.

Will never happen. I have no problem with children's allowance being paid for children resident in their home country if the parent is working here, or if they were working here. I am sure there are many Irish parents that receive it for their children and never worked a day in their life.

Part of Joan Burton's reply in the Dáil on November 2nd in relation to the matter:

"A key principle of the co-ordination system is that persons moving to different Member States are subject to the same obligations and enjoy the same benefits as the nationals of those Member States. With few exceptions, it is the country of employment which receives the social security contributions and which is generally responsible for the payment of benefits.

Irish child benefit is classed as a family benefit and there are specific rules governing the payment of these benefits. EU nationals who come to work in Ireland, and who pay Irish social security contributions, are entitled to receive child benefit in respect of their families, even if the family resides in another EU Member State. The equality provisions of the Regulations require that these payments are made at the same rates applicable to a person whose family is resident in Ireland. These provisions are seen as important in an EU context for the role they play in encouraging and facilitating the free movement of EU citizens.

The cost of paying child benefit in respect of the 4,929 customers with 7,798 children in 2011 to date has been €10.9m. It is estimated that the full year cost will be €13.1m.

I raised the possibility of a change to the EU regulations informally with EU Commissioner Andor on his visit to Dublin in June. The Commissioner indicated he would not favour putting forward such a proposal for the foreseeable future, as the Commission views the current arrangements as providing greater equality between citizens of different EU States. However, I am continuing to raise the issue with appropriate Ministers from other EU countries and am considering what further action may be possible."
http://debates.oireachtas.ie/dail/2011/11/02/00169.asp

I think the idea the Govt were throwing around earlier this year about linking the payment to immunizations or school attendance is possibly an idea to get around the EU regulations. That's just my own opinion, i am most probably wrong lol

Toad-Girl

Ace2007 wrote: »

College fees should be introduced - as it is guys coming out of college disappear abroad and don't pay back the state.

As a student, i'm gonna agree with you on this. Makes a lot more sense to me then just increasing the registration fee every year to the point where we may as well have them. I for one couldn't afford to pay it. Wouldn't even be a student was my mother not willing to incur massive debt to finance it. But secondary to this the grants scheme needs to be scrapped entirely. In it's place a loans system should be introduced, available to ALL students and not just those who are lucky to fall just below the line for grant eligibility. We're all free to do the same degree courses, points allowing, why should only the unlucky children of the middle class be saddled with debt? We'll all be on a level playing field for jobs eventually. Seriously sick of a system where I get slagged for being 'dry' because my classmates on the grant can afford to go out 3/4 nights a week.

policarp

policarp wrote: »

Devalue the Euro. . .

I still think the Euro should be devalued. . .

The Internet Explorer

Probably some hair, maybe some paper too. I'm not sure.

Ace2007

Toad-Girl wrote: »

As a student, i'm gonna agree with you on this. Makes a lot more sense to me then just increasing the registration fee every year to the point where we may as well have them. I for one couldn't afford to pay it. Wouldn't even be a student was my mother not willing to incur massive debt to finance it. But secondary to this the grants scheme needs to be scrapped entirely. In it's place a loans system should be introduced, available to ALL students and not just those who are lucky to fall just below the line for grant eligibility. We're all free to do the same degree courses, points allowing, why should only the unlucky children of the middle class be saddled with debt? We'll all be on a level playing field for jobs eventually. Seriously sick of a system where I get slagged for being 'dry' because my classmates on the grant can afford to go out 3/4 nights a week.

exactly, this is what it should be, everyone is entitiled to get a loan, and pay it back when you qualify and get a job, if you want to buzz off to england you can but this loan will still have to be paid off. that way it's a fair system.

melekalikimaka

i'm will to see college fees reintroduced, loan system similar to norway introduced.

I'm willing to see SW slashed at all levels including rent allowance

I'd love to see PS wages brought in line with rest of europe and streamlining too

Health care Id like to see an overhaul of system but perhaps improve the system as opposed slash it down.

saa

Interesting how the OAP cuts are a very emotive subject, not for me if the pensioner is financially comfortable if a day comes when they are not they will receive me, the days of blanket benefits for all are gone.

Means test the Child benefit, most don't need it. but to cut everyone would mean some children would really be feeling the brunt of that for food clothing and heat. Well I wouldnt know my ma squirreled away the benefit, other parents drank their benefits you know I think the children themselves would be more responsible even if they ended up spending it on refresher bars.

A lot of things these days must be means tested as resources are so scarce, but this in itself is expensive so if only there was one means test that was super efficient

Squall19

Toad-Girl wrote: »

.why should only the unlucky children of the middle class be saddled with debt?

Seriously sick of a system where I get slagged for being 'dry' because my classmates on the grant can afford to go out 3/4 nights a week.

They are right too:p

You would think with you being middle class and a higher person, that you would have figured out that it costs nothing to go out 3/4 nights a week.

What ous normal people, not middle class and a higher person like yourself, do is this.

20 cans for 20 euro, does fine for 3/4 nights, you drink them at your place and then go to the free disco ( always free entrance before 11 at some place ) and buy nothing when your there, free tap water to sober up at the end of night.

See you are dry:D

Freddie59

Squall19 wrote: »

They are right too:p

You would think with you being middle class and a higher person, that you would have figured out that it costs nothing to go out 3/4 nights a week.

What ous normal people, not middle class and a higher person like yourself, do is this.

20 cans for 20 euro, does fine for 3/4 nights, you drink them at your place and then go to the free disco ( always free entrance before 11 at some place ) and buy nothing when your there, free tap water to sober up at the end of night.

See you are dry:D

Not quite the situation though. Because of the ridiculous system one person might be just a few quid over and not qualify, and a person whose parents are on a similar income (just below the threshold) so. Much the the medical card criteria.

noodler

Cill Dara Abu wrote: »

Less than €200 p/w? Again get the facts right before spouting off!:rolleyes:

I'm far from struggling, I have never been on SW and hopefully never will!

What a child.

Sorry, 220 a week if you feel that substantially changes your ill-thought out arguments.

foreverandever

Squall19 wrote: »

20 cans for 20 euro, does fine for 3/4 nights, you drink them at your place and then go to the free disco ( always free entrance before 11 at some place ) and buy nothing when your there, free tap water to sober up at the end of night.

See you are dry:D

That sounds so awful

Mike 1972

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Cutting politicians pay leads to two things btw. It reduces the quality of candidates and it aids corruption.

How you came to this conclusion in the light of everything which has happened in the last 1050 years is beyond me

Scanlas The 2nd

Squall19 wrote: »

They are right too:p

You would think with you being middle class and a higher person, that you would have figured out that it costs nothing to go out 3/4 nights a week.

What ous normal people, not middle class and a higher person like yourself, do is this.

20 cans for 20 euro, does fine for 3/4 nights, you drink them at your place and then go to the free disco ( always free entrance before 11 at some place ) and buy nothing when your there, free tap water to sober up at the end of night.

See you are dry:D

Good idea

Stiffler2

oooo, rubs hand together.
Right here's how it's done.

Cut the following :

Army - why the **ck do we need an army, *&*kin stupid,
Arts
TD's salaries, judges salaries, in fact all public sector workers who earn too much
You are there to serve the public, not get rich, if you want to be rich go into the private sector ffs

President - Gone, why do we have a f*&*n president & an ambassador - stupid

Take everying off, Sean Quinn, Sean Fitzpatrick / the golden circle & I do mean everything including their clothes which can be sold on.

Start up 1 nuclear power plant ( in Cork ( city centre preferably )) and sell the extra power to Europe now that we are connected to the whole grid just recently.

Tear the contract with Shell drilling our gas fields in half & spit on their face.
When they take us to court, just don't show up. Get a better deal from Esso that gives Ireland more. These fields could pay off our debt alone from what I've read on it. no linkys

& that's just for starters. Elect me and I will rule with an Iron Fist like my hero Stalin. Ireland will be rich, rich rich.

gazzer

A 10% tax on anybody who voted Fianna Fail and an extra 10% for those who voted for Bertie Ahern 3 times in a row would generate a fair amount of income.

Toad-Girl

Squall19 wrote: »

What ous normal people, not middle class and a higher person like yourself, do is this.

Just saw this now. I wasn't intentionally describing myself as 'middle-class.' My family basically falls above the grant line due to the extra income my mother accrues from my dead father's pension. I've never really considered myself and my peers on a class line. But i'm certainly not a higher class of person than my friends on grants who all afforded to go on holidays this summer on them, majority of them even have cars. I can't even afford a driving lesson never mind a car. 20euro a night for four nights is eighty euro. There goes all my travel and food money for the week.
Just because i'm jealous of the free money they're entitled to by a ridiculous system doesn't mean I think i'm 'a higher person.' I'm not even gonna pretend I wouldn't be delighted to take a grant if I was allowed, I'm not blaming them for claiming it. I'm just sick of hearing 'grant cheques in, shopping trip.'

talkinyite

I'd cut taxes, and ties with any government or organisation that tries bully Ireland.

kincsem

2,000 of the 2,600+ Quangos ( quasi non-governmental organisation, quasi-autonomous non-governmental organisation)

talkinyite

is it not doublespeak when cuts mean more taxes rather than less? Am I the only one here that thinks taxes should be cut?

Freddie59

Toad-Girl wrote: »

Just saw this now. I wasn't intentionally describing myself as 'middle-class.' My family basically falls above the grant line due to the extra income my mother accrues from my dead father's pension. I've never really considered myself and my peers on a class line. But i'm certainly not a higher class of person than my friends on grants who all afforded to go on holidays this summer on them, majority of them even have cars. I can't even afford a driving lesson never mind a car. 20euro a night for four nights is eighty euro. There goes all my travel and food money for the week.
Just because i'm jealous of the free money they're entitled to by a ridiculous system doesn't mean I think i'm 'a higher person.' I'm not even gonna pretend I wouldn't be delighted to take a grant if I was allowed, I'm not blaming them for claiming it. I'm just sick of hearing 'grant cheques in, shopping trip.'

Yep. There are all sorts of scams (legal ones) to qualify. For example, some people put part of their salary into Pension AVCs and it is then not included when applying. I don't know about everyone else, but I could never have afforded to do that.

Richard Hillman

talkinyite wrote: »

is it not doublespeak when cuts mean more taxes rather than less? Am I the only one here that thinks taxes should be cut?

i think the higher band tax rate should be cut greatily. I couldn't imagine what it's like to see half your wages docked every month just because you put the hard work in from a young age.

AhSureTisGrand

All those state boards the likes of Mary Davis serve on. What the fuck do they do?

cock robin

Ghandee wrote: »

My banjo string.

I think circumcision would quite suit me. :pac:

I agree a 50% cut in my rod would give me an average of 5.5 inches which is more than enough

Galtee

gazzer wrote: »

A 10% tax on anybody who voted Fianna Fail and an extra 10% for those who voted for Bertie Ahern 3 times in a row would generate a fair amount of income.

And a 25% tax on any idiot who voted yes to lisbon the first time and a 50% tax on any idiot who voted yes to lisbon the second time.

srsly78

Galtee wrote: »

And a 25% tax on any idiot who voted yes to lisbon the first time and a 50% tax on any idiot who voted yes to lisbon the second time.

Thrice-accursed EU giving us all that money :mad:

tonsiltickler

Rent allowance is ridiculous. Should be scrapped unless there are some extenuating circumstances.

No problem with child benefit; it's the fact that non nationals can claim here for their children abroad is ludicrous.

Galtee

srsly78 wrote: »

Thrice-accursed EU giving us all that money :mad:

Thrice-accursed EU running our country. :mad:

TwoShedsJackson

Cill Dara Abu wrote: »

No, I'm not a teenager. People whinge about fairness when it comes to cuts in Budget 2011 yet when it comes to the little old dear down the road they can't be touched.:rolleyes:

Pensioners aren't going to get anything cut because they usually vote. Simple as. If pensioners didn't vote everything they get would have been slashed by now.

Social welfare won't be cut much more (if at all) because it's a cost the State pays to keep the crime rate down. If there was far lower, or no, social welfare, the crime rate would rocket immediately because people have to survive.

A social welfare payment to a junkie isn't because the State cares about them, quite the reverse I would say, it is to keep them off the crime records and make it look like the Government is controlling things.

Galtee

TwoShedsJackson wrote: »

Pensioners aren't going to get anything cut because they usually vote. Simple as. If pensioners didn't vote everything they get would have been slashed by now.

Social welfare won't be cut much more (if at all) because it's a cost the State pays to keep the crime rate down. If there was far lower, or no, social welfare, the crime rate would rocket immediately because people have to survive.

A social welfare payment to a junkie isn't because the State cares about them, quite the reverse I would say, it is to keep them off the crime records and make it look like the Government is controlling things.

Bizarre assertions.