Information evening for new post primary school Maynooth

Moonbeam

MAYNOOTH POST PRIMARY PTA / KILDARE VEC

NEW SCHOOL INFORMATION MEETING

THURSDAY 17TH NOVEMBER 2011 – 8PM

MAYNOOTH POST PRIMARY SCHOOL

The Department of Education and Skills announced on June 27th 2011 that a second post primary school would be built for the Maynooth catchment area on the same site as the new Maynooth Post Primary School at Mariaville, Moyglare Road, Maynooth. The patronage of this school is yet to be decided. Parental support for the applying patrons will be taken into consideration and their views must be submitted to the Department of Education and Skills by January 2012

WHY SUPPORT MAYNOOTH POST PRIMARY/KILDARE VEC PATRONAGE? Click here.

The Parent Teacher Association of Maynooth Post Primary School are holding information evenings and are inviting parents to attend a meeting on Thursday 17th November 2011 at 8pm in Maynooth Post Primary School, Moyglare Road, Maynooth.


If you have an opinion please voice it!!

Orion

The Click Here link missing above is here.

Original post is at the Maynooth Post Primary website

Moonbeam

http://www.kildarevec.ie/maynoothschools/register_now.html you can register your interest in the secondary school.

swordofislam

Isn't there a campaign for a Loreto school as well? Frankly I would rather have the Loreto nuns than the VEC. Also why a second school on the same site?
Split the school into Junior cycle and senior cycle.
There was a letter about this in the Champion recently.

L1011

swordofislam wrote: »

Isn't there a campaign for a Loreto school as well? Frankly I would rather have the Loreto nuns than the VEC. Also why a second school on the same site?
Split the school into Junior cycle and senior cycle.
There was a letter about this in the Champion recently.

That's precisely what's being planned.

I'd far prefer the VEC than any religious organisation, and seeing as Maynooth BNS is one of the schools the Dublin Diocese is planning to hand over to the state due to 'lack of demand' for Catholic education, I suspect most of the town is in the same mode.

There wouldn't be any nuns left to teach in it if Loreto got it, nor do I think they have any reputable experience running mixed sex schools.

VECs link for interest has changed: http://www.kildarevec.ie/newmaynoothschool/register_now.html
And in the interests of non-bias, here's Loretos: http://www.loretoeducationcentre.ie/maynooth-new-school

Orion

Also why a second school on the same site

Just to clarify one thing - There will be a second school on the same site. This is dictacted by the Department. The only question is will it be a VEC one or a Loreto one.

If the former the proposal is to have it as a Junior cycle school and a Senior cycle one. If the latter it is a step backwards. Loreto, as mentioned, have no reputation for running a co-ed school while the current VEC school is very well regarded for being progressive and having excellent academic standards as well as extra-curricular results.

granturismo

swordofislam wrote: »

Isn't there a campaign for a Loreto school as well? Frankly I would rather have the Loreto nuns than the VEC. Also why a second school on the same site?

The Dept of Ed have sanctioned a new secondary campus up the Moyglare Rd with 2 secondary schools. The current secondary site is being sold to the university or Froebel teacher training college and the VEC school is moving to one of the new schools - the 2nd school on the same site is up for grabs.

swordofislam wrote: »

Split the school into Junior cycle and senior cycle.There was a letter about this in the Champion recently.

That's why the VEC want to manage both schools, they are offering to run the first 1000 pupil school as a junior school and the second for the senior cycle .

If there are two different patrons, each will have approx 1000 pupils from 1st to senior cert right beside each other, sharing common facilities, then one uniform will eventually be perceived (rightly or wrongly) to be the better school and eventually morale in the 'other' school will be affected.

In my opinion both schools should be managed by the same patron, and by default this is the N Kildare VEC. If the Loreto or anyone else was already managing the existing school then I'd support them but they aren't.

ixus

With government planning and expenditure there is only one way this will go. Two schools managed by the Kildare VEC which is to be joined with Wicklow VEC.

People are kidding themselves if they think otherwise.

You have no voice.

SQ2

ixus wrote: »

With government planning and expenditure there is only one way this will go. Two schools managed by the Kildare VEC which is to be joined with Wicklow VEC.

People are kidding themselves if they think otherwise.

You have no voice.

Not true.
The right option would be to have the VEC run both of them rather than have 2 schools pulling against each other on almost the same patch of land.
The Maynooth post primary has an excellent reputation, and does well in the university feeder tables also.
But the the choice is firmly with the public here. Do you really think that either party would be wasting their time and effort with their respective campaigns?
It's certainly not a foregone conclusion as far I'm aware.

ixus

SQ2 wrote: »

Not true.
The right option would be to have the VEC run both of them rather than have 2 schools pulling against each other on almost the same patch of land.
The Maynooth post primary has an excellent reputation, and does well in the university feeder tables also.
But the the choice is firmly with the public here. Do you really think that either party would be wasting their time and effort with their respective campaigns?
It's certainly not a foregone conclusion as far I'm aware.

Of course it's a foregone conclusion. You just think you have a say. Maybe, if the IMF weren't in the mix.... I'm not debating the merits of any option here, purely financial.

I attended Maynooth P.P. and know its qualities/flaws.

SQ2

ixus wrote: »

Of course it's a foregone conclusion. You just think you have a say. Maybe, if the IMF weren't in the mix.... I'm not debating the merits of any option here, purely financial.

I attended Maynooth P.P. and know its qualities/flaws.

I personally hope you're theory is correct, but the reliable word I have is that it's a case of who shouts loudest in this case.

I don't have any say at all by the way.

Orion

SQ2 wrote: »

I personally hope you're theory is correct, but the reliable word I have is that it's a case of who shouts loudest in this case.

So I've heard too. I believe there's opposition within the Department (civil service level) to splitting the junior and senior cycle. The thought that it's a perfectly logical thing to do is irrelevant. This is going to come down to public support. And overcoming the pulpit is a big ask but there is a lot of support for the VEC model.

ixus

Just read the Liffey Champ last night. Looks like the Junior/Senior school has been whacked on the head and the VEC would have to set up a seperate school with only first years starting out.

That is nuts. So much for central planning!:o

SQ2

ixus wrote: »

Just read the Liffey Champ last night. Looks like the Junior/Senior school has been whacked on the head and the VEC would have to set up a seperate school with only first years starting out.

That is nuts. So much for central planning!:o

Nut's altogether. Your old Principal has someone above him pulling rank it seems

L1011

ixus wrote: »

Just read the Liffey Champ last night. Looks like the Junior/Senior school has been whacked on the head and the VEC would have to set up a seperate school with only first years starting out.

That is nuts. So much for central planning!:o

I'd imagine someone in the Department is unwilling to try something that hasn't been done elsewhere before

Not splitting them is going to leave one of the sides busting to the seams and the other half empty for a number of years until numbers start to even off.

There'll be extra financial overhead if its two separate schools which is probably the only argument that could win Education over.

Orion

The Champion is simplifying it somewhat. It's not off the table - it's just not going to be a factor when deciding patronage.

MYOB is right about the civil servants using the old "it's never been done before" excuse. It the same attitude that allowed Neil Amstrong to land ... oh wait.

However, Ashe also stated that parent's views will be considered and if we want a split cycle school then we need to get off our collective arses and fight for it (I'm paraphrasing obviously )

L1011

This is where I'm rather irritated that my kids don't exist yet... they'll likely be going to that school in 15 years time or so, but I'm unable to make input now.

However, I currently have money and spare time and other things you don't with kids, so I'll live!

Moonbeam

http://www.foras.ie/pages/news-campaigns.php
For an irish language secondary school

L1011

Received a flyer through the door from the VEC today. They're certainly trying to ensure ground gets covered.

Champion has a headline claiming that "Maynooth Parents" (what, all of them?) "Demand Irish Speaking Secondary School", but that's their typical journalistic standards...

Jamontoast

Hello there to anyone interested with regards to the decision on the new Maynooth Post Primary as school. Despite a public meeting in MPPS last year where Tom Ashe proposed a Junior and Senior cycle in each new building respectively, the decision by the dept of Education is that there will be two seperate schls on one site side by side. MPPS shall move into one of the new buildings with aporox 1400 pupils, the other building will have a first year only of 120/150 pupils, the capacity.of each building is 1000 pupils, the VEC propose to share teaching staff accross both buildings and move kids from the overcrowded first school to the empty second school during the schl day to avail of empty classrooms. surely it woul make more sense to go with the junior / senior sch model and have around 600 in each ? Does amyone have any opinions ?

L1011

I'd say the majority of people favour the junior/senior split - its only being refused because its "new".

The overcrowding/underuse is only one issue with having two separate - there'll also inevitably end up being a perception of a "better" school in time, pointless inter-school rivalries will develop and so on.

Also, as the current school has the Irish language junior cycle and the new one is meant to offer a full-length cycle, there will be a few years of possible Irish language senior cycle students that will miss out without a split (as there won't be a TY/5th year in the new school for a few years). Not that I'm hugely in favour of Irish language secondary subjects myself, but there is obviously *some* demand for it going on the now quite long running junior cycle in MPPS.

Orion

There have been two parent meetings already with Dr Gerry Jeffers (Education expert from NUIM who's been appointed by the VEC to consult on the new school). While the meetings have been supposed to be about enrollment policies for the schools the parents have been insisting on them being junior/senior cycle schools for exactly these reason. There's another in Maynooth Educate Together at 8pm tomorrow (Tuesday).

For me personally I've been involved in a startup primary school with my two kids - I don't want to do that again. My preference is the established school if they go with two separate schools. So how will that work? I will have a big issue if the VEC decide which school my kids go to based on where they live (North/South Maynooth) or any other criteria. I want to choose which school my kids go to in 2015. And from speaking to other parents I'm not alone. Having two school is going to lead to the pointless rivalry mentioned above and potentially court cases if parents are forced to go to a school not of their choosing.

metalloa

So the Department of Education want two different schools on the same site. So now we are to have Maynooth Post Primary School and Maynooth Community College.The parents want a junior/senior school. Where do we go from here?

Orion

metalloa wrote: »

So the Department of Education want two different schools on the same site. So now we are to have Maynooth Post Primary School and Maynooth Community College.The parents want a junior/senior school. Where do we go from here?

Come to the meeting tonight and have your say about it. That's what I'll be doing.

Orion

The meeting in METNS is actually next week not this week.

Orion

The meeting last night was very interesting. It was Gerry Jeffers 6th meeting with parents in feeder schools. He's been appointed as an independent consultant by the VEC to report back on enrollment policies for the two schools. He told us last night that the response from parents has been unanimously in favour of a junior cycle and a senior cycle school from the parents in Maynooth. The next proposed step is for a rep from each of the primary schools and the post primary to collectively meet the minister and detail the views of the parents and the objections to the proposed two school model. The outcome of that is anybody's guess.

One thing is clear - there will be two separate schools sharing resources - that is non-negiotable for logistical and management reasons which are understandable. The only thing to be decided is whether it will be two schools from 1st to 6th year or a junior/senior school split. Obviously the latter is the desired outcome. It would be a win/win - the parents and students will have what will be in practice a single school (1st to 6th year not in rivalry) but the civil servants who proposed this madness will get their two schools on paper (2 BoMs/2 principals/etc). One potential outcome is Johnny Nevin as Campus manager with the two current deputy principals as principals of the two schools - in effect almost the exact situation as currently exists in reality.

Hopefully the Department and Minister won't shut the door and will listen to the parents concerned with their children's education. Quinn is professing to be in favour of changing how education is provisioned and actually listening to parents would certainly be a revolutionary step towards that.

Orion

Forgot to mention something I didn't know before the meeting. Part of the proposal is to have an Aonad (correct me if I'm wrong but an Aonad is Irish medium education up Leaving Cert.) Currently there's only Irish medium education up to Junior Cert. And if enrollments are over 70 per annum in 2016 (iirc) consideration will be given to making it an fully recognised school - separate but under the same roof. The language from the Department was very vague but it does give hope to the Irish speakers for a full Irish medium education while being included in the resource sharing campus being proposed. That's a positive at least.

Call me Al

There is a meeting on in the boys national school tomorrow night. Does anyone know what this is about or if it is more of the consultation process that has been happening in the other schools?

Orion

I only heard about this today. I've sent off a couple of texts to find out - if anyone gets back to me I'll post here.

Orion

My contact only got back to me while I was on the way to my own PA meeting. Tonight's meeting was not an official one as far as I can tell. Dr. Jeffers is writing his report and is finished his consultation with the feeder schools. Not sure what the point of tonight's meeting was tbh - it seems to have been called by disaffected parents without full information.

The next formal meeting is on Friday which is of the chairpersons of all feeder schools' PA/PTAs. They will then agree a common approach and request a meeting with the minister to put forward the parents' wishes for the new school.

If I hear any more I'll post here.

Moonbeam

Orion wrote: »

Forgot to mention something I didn't know before the meeting. Part of the proposal is to have an Aonad (correct me if I'm wrong but an Aonad is Irish medium education up Leaving Cert.) Currently there's only Irish medium education up to Junior Cert. And if enrollments are over 70 per annum in 2016 (iirc) consideration will be given to making it an fully recognised school - separate but under the same roof. The language from the Department was very vague but it does give hope to the Irish speakers for a full Irish medium education while being included in the resource sharing campus being proposed. That's a positive at least.

That is about the only bit of the proposal that I knew about:)