A Question About PSU's

sjlc

I'm in the process of ordering parts for a new pc and i was wondering what the difference was between these two PSU's:

http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?agid=1628&aid=24477&basket.changed=1

http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=30069&agid=1628

I think the Amazon is more eco-friendly or something, but is it enough to justify the extra 20e?
Any info would be appreciated, thanks.

deconduo

sjlc wrote: »

I'm in the process of ordering parts for a new pc and i was wondering what the difference was between these two PSU's:

http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?agid=1628&aid=24477&basket.changed=1

http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=30069&agid=1628

I think the Amazon is more eco-friendly or something, but is it enough to justify the extra 20e?
Any info would be appreciated, thanks.

Don't get the cheap one, its a pretty bad PSU (hence the price) The Amazon is quieter, more efficient and a better PSU all round. Its also not going to explode or anything :P

asif2011

While the second one is 80+ Bronze you will probably never see a saving of €20 over the life of the PSU. The only thing is the voltage supply is more regulated in the 80+ range and if you have a €300 GPU then I'd be more inclined to give it as good a quality power supply as I could afford. But for a general usage PC the lower PSU will do fine...

PseudoFamous

The amazon also has a blue LED, which I think is pretty snazz.

Although it clashes with the red/black of everything else in my computer =/

Serephucus

The Amazon is a much better choice. More efficient - it has 80+ Bronze certification - and has more connections. 6 SATA vs. 4 on the other one, for one.

deconduo

asif2011 wrote: »

While the second one is 80+ Bronze you will probably never see a saving of €20 over the life of the PSU. The only thing is the voltage supply is more regulated in the 80+ range and if you have a €300 GPU then I'd be more inclined to give it as good a quality power supply as I could afford. But for a general usage PC the lower PSU will do fine...

Do not do this. Even on a mid-range system, using a bad PSU can take out your entire computer. Bad PSUs will blatantly lie about their capabilities, with most only being able to deliver 75% or even less of what they claim. This is what can happen if you use a bad unit:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTVEtr14FEA

That's not to say that you have to buy expensive PSUs, there are good bargains to be found at all price ranges if you look. For example the SuperFlower Amazon thats in the OP is a lot cheaper than most other good 550W PSUs, but is just as good. However the cheaper SF unit is actually equivalent to only a 380W PSU as it can only take 32A on the +12V rail.

Serephucus

asif2011 wrote: »

While the second one is 80+ Bronze you will probably never see a saving of €20 over the life of the PSU. The only thing is the voltage supply is more regulated in the 80+ range and if you have a €300 GPU then I'd be more inclined to give it as good a quality power supply as I could afford. But for a general usage PC the lower PSU will do fine...

Wrong, and wrong! You actually would save about €20 - if not more - over a year of use with the second PSU versus the first. You'd also save money when the 80+ one doesn't blow up in your face and take half your hardware with it.

@ OP: What are the specs of your machine? If you're not sure, Speccy is a great program that will tell you.

asif2011

Deconduo, I've seen that before, but don't get me wrong I would go for the more expensive PSU, but not everybody thinks like that. Some people build PCs because they are on a real budget. If I were going for a PSU I would go for a ~€150 Corsair AX850 (I have a Corsair AX750 in both of my machines)...

asif2011

Serephucus wrote: »

Wrong, and wrong! You actually would save about €20 - if not more - over a year of use with the second PSU versus the first. You'd also save money when the 80+ one doesn't blow up in your face and take half your hardware with it.

Please show me a link to your savings. Most PSUs are at least 75% efficient, but don't have a regulated PSU enough for 80+ certification...

Serephucus

asif2011 wrote: »

Please show me a link to your savings. Most PSUs are at least 75% efficient at loads above 50%, but don't have a regulated PSU enough for 80+ certification...

Fixed.

Craptastic PSUs in particular have horrible idle efficiency, sometimes as low as 40%, where as a good 80+ unit is likely to be closer to 70%. Considering this is where most computers sit for at least 50% of their life, savings would easily be made.

asif2011

Serephucus wrote: »

Fixed.

Craptastic PSUs in particular have horrible idle efficiency, sometimes as low as 40%, where as a good 80+ unit is likely to be closer to 70%. Considering this is where most computers sit for at least 50% of their life, savings would easily be made.

Can you show me a link please...

Serephucus

If you insist on other people googling for you...

http://www.madshrimps.be/articles/article/889/No-name-brand-PSUs-vs-Known-Brands-MAD-testing/6#axzz1dt1ef82d

Most of those were relatively good budget PSUs too.

deconduo

asif2011 wrote: »

Can you show me a link please...

Here's a sample:

- Antec EarthWatts 380 Watts
- Cooler Master eXtreme Power Plus 400 Watts
- Fortron Saga Plus 400 Watts
- Gigabyte Superb 460 Watts
- Heden PSX-A870 500 Watts
- Hiper Type S 425W
- Max In Power 972VP 520 Watts



If we say a computer is on for 8 hours idle, and used for gaming for 2 hours, the difference between the Antec and the Fortron (not the worst one by far) is:

8hrs/day @ 65W -> 20 units/year
2hrs/day @ 440W -> 50 units/year

70 units @ 15c : €10/year

If you compare a proper 80+ bronze unit like the SuperFlower Amazon, the results would be even bigger.

asif2011

Serephucus wrote: »

If you insist on other people googling for you...

I'm not insisting someone else googles for me, I'd like to think the person who says something can back it up with knowledge and where they got that information.

It backs up my statement that most PSUs are 75% efficient but I still don't see anything about savings of €20 a year... at the end of the day I would be going for the more expensive one but not everyone thinks like that...


Christ deconduo do we not have a job to go to or something for a PC to be on 8 hrs a day, for a standard PC at home it'd be on about half that... My PC during gaming runs @ 250W and during idle at 100W. All I'd like is a link to someone who has calculated this independently than just getting the word of some random person on the Internet

Monotype

asif2011 wrote: »

My PC during gaming runs @ 250W and during idle at 100W.

What on earth do you need a AX750 for?

About original topic, there's not enough info on the PSU. I can only find an outline of specification which are certainly worse but not terrible. The only thing that we can really determine about efficiency is that it is below 80% but we can not really quantify how good or bad it is without reviews. With PSUs, you're safer assuming that it is sub par if information is scant. I wouldn't use it myself and I definitely wouldn't encourage anyone to use a component on which all other devices are heavily dependant upon when its quality is questionable.
Even if Mr X from down the road buys a GamerZ PC from ebay with a Cooltek PSU and it's running okay for over a month doesn't mean it's a good idea.

Serephucus

asif2011 wrote: »

All I'd like is a link to someone who has calculated this independently than just getting the word of some random person on the Internet

What is "someone who has calculated this independently" going to be other than "some random person on the Internet"? Do you expect to know the reviewer personally?

Anyway, Monotype said it; if you don't have much information on the PSU - which we don't, where the lower-tier SuperFlower is concerned - best to take it with a grain of salt and go for something better. With PSUs, no news is usually bad news.

asif2011

Monotype wrote: »

What on earth do you need a AX750 for?

I got a GTX460, wasn't running SLI and wanted something with 80+ Gold and could do SLI if I wanted and probably last 4/5 years with good current stability. It gets worse though, I really wanted the AX850s, they were out of stock, didn't want to wait and didn't really have the cash for it either as I was building 2 identical PCs...

Serephucus wrote: »

What is "someone who has calculated this independently" going to be other than "some random person on the Internet"? Do you expect to know the reviewer personally?

I'm thinking if it was some place which reguarly reviews components then that would have some standing, unlike a forum or a blogger there is more a through examination by its readers - a peer review if you will... I'm surprised this hasn't been done by someone...

Monotype

Have a look at the reviews at jonnyguru.com. They inspect efficiency at various loads. They mostly review decent ones though. There was one or two extremely bad ones - I think that they were titled, "Death of Gutless Wonder" or something similar.

For actual savings, you need to calculate it based on current energy costs yourself.

sjlc

@Deconduo Heres what im planning on buying

http://www3.hardwareversand.de/basket.jsp

Its pretty much the same as partatmygaff's but for a different case. My budgets only 600 so im getting this, windows 7 at the student price, a cheap logitech mouse and keyboard and one of those 20euro hard drives from adverts.
Thanks for your answer, seems to have started a little debate

asif2011

That's only the link to the shopping basket, we can't see what's in your basket... you'll have to list it seperately

sjlc

Feck

Here there are individually so:

http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=41224&agid=1617

http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=44319&agid=1192

http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=39504&agid=1004

http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=46219&agid=1601

http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=27402&agid=699

http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=49126&agid=631

http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=30069&agid=1628

That totals 503.77 euro + shipping. Any advice will be taken on board. Cheers

Monotype

You can also use Fluffy's script.

[php]javascript:var before = 'Item|Price'; var after = '';var format='{itm_quantity}{itm_name}|{itm_price}';var debug = false;function loadScript( url ){if ( document.getElementById( "basket_parser" ) == null ){var script = document.createElement( "script" );script.setAttribute( "id", "basket_parser" );script.setAttribute( "type", "text/javascript" );script.setAttribute( "src", url + "?" + Math.pow( new Date().getMonth(), 2 ) + Math.pow( new Date().getDate(), 3 ) );document.getElementsByTagName( "head" )[0].appendChild( script );setTimeout( "loadScript('" + url + "')", 200 );log( "Started loading script: " + url );}else if ( typeof( init_script ) != 'undefined' ){log( "Loaded." );init_script();}else{setTimeout( "loadScript('" + url + "')", 200 );log( "loading ..." );}}function log( string ){if ( debug ){document.body.appendChild( document.createTextNode( string ) );document.body.appendChild( document.createElement( "br" ) );}}loadScript( "http://dl.dropbox.com/u/19453211/basket_parser.js" );void( 0 );[/php]

Copy and paste into the address bar when you are on the shopping basket. It gives you a window of code for a nice table layout in a post.

The main thing about that build is that you have the powerful 2500K whose main strength is the fact that you can overclock it. However, you have it paired up with a H61 motherboard which will not allow overclocking. I suggest that you try to see if you can squeeze in the extra money for a P67 or Z68 board which will allow you to get the most from the processor.

sjlc

Could you link me to one of those mono? On an iPod at the moment and Im finding it hard to browse hardwareversand

Monotype

Sure, no problem. Asrock P67 Pro3 €81.59.

deconduo

Monotype wrote: »

Sure, no problem. Asrock P67 Pro3 €81.59.

Get this case instead as well:
http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=28607&agid=631