Clubs and Societies Working Group Interim Report

yuppy700

This report is based on an investigation into matters relating to capitation allocated to clubs and societies by the University of Limerick Students' Union

The working group was setup after the Students' Union accessed a clubs and societies reserve fund in a manner that clubs and societies council felt was inappropriate.

What do people think of the report ?

Delta Kilo

This thread will undoubtedly begin looking innocent enough, then will begin the onslaught of:

1. Daly getting bashed
2. Rabble rabble rabble
3. ULFM
4. rabble rabble rabble
5. censorship in UL
6. rabble rabble rabble
7. /thread locked

Sits back, puts popcorn in microwave and awaits Sid_Justice et al to come forth and go to battle on their keyboards. Never fails to entertain...

Ginge Young

As one of the members of the working group I would very interested to get peoples opinions on the interim report. There seemed to be quite an appetite for it to be discussed at council Tuesday night.

mayo_lad

Ginge Young wrote: »

As one of the members of the working group I would very interested to get peoples opinions on the interim report. There seemed to be quite an appetite for it to be discussed at council Tuesday night.

hi Ginge
i'ed love to know where i could get access to this report

Rgds
Mayo_lad

Ginge Young

It has been distributed to all C+S Committee's, who in turn I believe (at least I know some) who are distributing it to their members. As far as I know it will be available online by the end of the week, but I'll try and confirm and sort that tomorrow.

PROGRAM_IX

I can host it if ye like, in the meantime.

Edit: Haven't had time to sit down and read the whole thing, so I won't comment on it, but I was highly impressed by this presentation that explains most of what the group did. Check that out, if they don't want me to be hosting the PDF.

Nockz

Occupy ULSU! We are... the... 67%?

OhMSGlive

Delta Kilo wrote: »

This thread will undoubtedly begin looking innocent enough, then will begin the onslaught of:

1. Daly getting bashed
2. Rabble rabble rabble
3. ULFM
4. rabble rabble rabble
5. censorship in UL
6. rabble rabble rabble
7. /thread locked

Sits back, puts popcorn in microwave and awaits Sid_Justice et al to come forth and go to battle on their keyboards. Never fails to entertain...

We won't be seeing Sid_Justice for a while, he got sitebanned for re-regging.

EDIT (18/11/11): Turns out that it he was banned in error. Sorry Sid/horsemeat.

But going back on topic, I was pretty impressed by the slides I saw there of the presentation.

Nockz

OhMSGlive wrote: »

We won't be seeing Sid_Justice for a while, he got sitebanned for re-regging.

But going back on topic, I was pretty impressed by the slides I saw there of the presentation.

Woah! How did that happen? How do you know such a thing? =o I was wondering why the place was so... peaceful around here.

On Topic: I can tell you right now a lot of that document went over my head. Having attended quite a few C&S council meetings in my time, however, I have faith in a certain Ginge Young to keep the interests of C&S at heart. I'm sure the same can be said for the other members of that group too.

It's saddening to think I'll be graduating next year, only to leave such amazing experiences such as the SU and C&S behind

OhMSGlive

Nockz wrote: »

Woah! How did that happen? How do you know such a thing? =o I was wondering why the place was so... peaceful around here.

Check your PM. I don't want this thread turning into an anti-Sid hatefest which will give sceptre ample reason to close it.

Nockz wrote: »

On Topic: I can tell you right now a lot of that document went over my head. Having attended quite a few C&S council meetings in my time, however, I have faith in a certain Ginge Young to keep the interests of C&S at heart. I'm sure the same can be said for the other members of that group too.

It's saddening to think I'll be graduating next year, only to leave such amazing experiences such as the SU and C&S behind

I'll be honest, I only ever met Ginge once, and that was when I was in the same room as bazkennedy. At that point, he seemed like someone who was genuinely interested in the best interests of both the SU and the C&S. As for the others, Alex would have made a great contribution to the group, had college not gotten in the way.

Teslacuted

It's been an interesting investigation. I feel that the SU is starting down a line of misrepresenting C&S. UL is the final arbiter, though they're understandably reluctant to recognise us as a group of people they may have to deal with separately. They are, however the purse holders, so their word is what really counts.

C&S (AFAIK) represents quite a significant portion of 'active' students, and since the SU is democratically elected, it's likely that C&S could influence the outcome of any democratic process. Unless there's some rule against that, which wouldn't surprise me.

Either way, I think we deserve clarification from Fox and Daly, as they are both in positions of power over C&S and are both of differing opinions on what is to be done.

(For more info checkout the presentation)

Hugh

PS - I'm speaking from personal opinion. This post does not represent the opinion(s) of the working group.

Chimaera

C&S (AFAIK) represents quite a significant portion of 'active' students, and since the SU is democratically elected, it's likely that C&S could influence the outcome of any democratic process. Unless there's some rule against that, which wouldn't surprise me

IME there's nothing in the rules to stop a determined lobby from marshalling people in a vote. A notable example was in 2003 when a referendum was held alongside the sabbat elections to approve funding for the boathouse. The clubs involved put a lot of work into getting people to vote and it resulted in the largest turnout in some time (figures escape me at this point).

If the combined membership of all clubs and societies are of a mind to vote in a particular way, then it could substantially affect an election.

Teslacuted

The documents have been officially released.

Link to written interim report

Link to C&S council presentation

Link to working group's understanding of new SU structure (likely to be inaccurate, do not rely on)

Chimaera

On ownership of assets:
A fundamental issue here is whether Clubs & Societies operate as a sub-section of the Students' Union or whether they should become a separate entity altogether. The way some of the proposals are worded suggests that C&S is being considered the latter by C&S themselves, and very much the former by the SU.

As part of the SU, all assets owned by C&S are implicitly owned by the SU. This includes all assets owned by individual clubs and societies all the way up to vehicles collectively owned by C&S. So I don't think C&S can take exclusive ownership of these assets, but there should be agreements in place to ensure that C&S have first call on their use at all times.


In General:
Overall, I've an uncomfortable feeling that this could end up with a breakaway Clubs & Societies organisation distinct from the SU.

Regarding an agreement existing in writing, I'd suggest that the email from John Fox (guessing from the context) constitutes such a written agreement (quoted here):

"The ULSU Executive has formally confirmed to the University that it will
conform to the agreed 67:33 split with respect to student capitation income,
with the 67% element being allocated to support Clubs and Societies. This
arrangement takes account of both past and future allocations of capitation
funding and will be underpinned by the establishment of a separate bank
account for Clubs and Societies funds."

Given that an email has the same legal status as a written letter, I would submit that this is adequate written confirmation of the arrangement. Not being a lawyer, I'm open to correction here

Steeevvyb

We've been looking for a copy of this. If anybody has a copy of it they could email it to info@thomondstudenttimes.com and we will upload it.

It'd be good to distribute this.

Stephen
TST

Ginge Young

Teslacuted posted links to them above.

Polar Ice

Steeevvyb wrote: »

We've been looking for a copy of this. If anybody has a copy of it they could email it to info@thomondstudenttimes.com and we will upload it.

It'd be good to distribute this.

Stephen
TST

TST. Writing stuff, but clearly not reading stuff :pac:

Steeevvyb

Polar Ice wrote: »

TST. Writing stuff, but clearly not reading stuff :pac:

Haha fair play, noticed the post just after I posted. Should have gone to specsavers.

Ginge Young

Thought I'd give this thread a post back to the top.

The working group will be continuing it's work as of tomorrow. We will be making the full report available as early as we possibly can this semester. It all depends on when we have completed our meetings with individuals and draw up the recommendations to C+S Council.

Just making sure people know this issue hasn't been closed up just yet

Keith