Arcade cab: Mission Impossible???

steviebg

Alright lads been reading the the threads on this forum with great interest and its got me wanting to build a cab and play all my old favourite arcade games the way they were meant to.Now the problem i face is not the construction of the cab, it's the computer side of things i don't know jack! I suppose i'm asking is it worth going ahead with this? If it is then where can i find a guide that will explain what needs to be done in basic terms, such as whats the difference between an ipac and a jpac?What spec computer do i need,and how to put it all together.
Well thanks for any help and i do hope this is possible and i'm not out of my depth!

Pyongyang

As per the other thread. The lads you really need to speak to are Keith 'I'll Have My Cab Finished By July 7th 2018 I Promise' Geo or Adultappleflavouredbeveragemale.

What those two don't know about cab building is probably worth knowing. :pac:

Myrddin

Pyongyang wrote: »

What those two don't know about cab building is probably not worth knowing. :pac:

Lets be fair to them

What type of games will you be looking to run on it op?

Pyongyang

EnterNow wrote: »

What type of games will you be looking to run on it op?

Darius? Darius II? Darius Burst? Darius Gaiden? G-Darius? G-Darius Rev 2.0? etc...

steviebg

EnterNow wrote: »

Lets be fair to them

What type of games will you be looking to run on it op?

Hey all i'll mainly looking at street fighter, mortal kombat, x-men, sunset riders and maybe darius!! Basically games of that generation and maybe some snes games and my first computer the atari 2600 which had some great games like joust and H.E.R.O

Pyongyang

steviebg wrote: »

maybe darius!!

Myrddin

steviebg wrote: »

Hey all i'll mainly looking at street fighter, mortal kombat, x-men, sunset riders and maybe darius!! Basically games of that generation and maybe some snes games and my first computer the atari 2600 which had some great games like joust and H.E.R.O

The likes of SF2, Sunset Riders etc will run on very low specs, you could just dump a low end pc still in its case into a cab in that instance as cooling it won't be an issue.

Install Mame, a nice front end, a JPAC is using a real arcade CRT, & your set.

Pyongyang

Just to make an anchor point here, he said he's playing Darius on it. Of course photos and video evidence will be mandatory.

Oh, and buy an Iron Horse PCB too. Just to complete the goodness.

CathalDublin

If you want to run a nice frontend such as hyperspin, a Dual core and 2GB ram is a must

Of course it will run on a lower spec PC but for full performance

steviebg

Cool stuff thanks for the replies lads, as i said i don't have much of a clue about the computer side of of things so it's nice to know i can stick in a basic pc and get it running:D

I'll post some pics when i get the show off the ground, damn work and famliy stuff getting in the way of gaming.

steviebg

All right all i've been tipping away at this for a while,got the cab put together got the pc with front end and emulator's set up, i picked up an old black diamond tv and one of these:

http://wp1114205.wp150.webpack.hosteurope.de/xtcmodified/index.php?cPath=15&XTCsid=6ulibfjhchpvu325tcvea9n685

I've downloaded soft15khz but when i go to install it a message pops up saying
"intel drivers don't allow more than 5 resolution definitions"

So i suppose my question is what happens next how do i get my frontend to display on the tv? By the way im running windows7 not sure if that makes a difference.

Thanks for any help.

Jack burton

Personally I'd run windows XP lite on a machine, windows 7 its a bit of a fiend for memory etc

Myrddin

Soft15 isn't compatible with Windows 7. Use XP for a Mame cab unless you have >4GB ram & an Arcade VGA.

I use XP 64 in mine so I can use the full 4GB ram, Soft 15 runs perfectly under that.

LoGiE

EnterNow wrote: »

Soft15 isn't compatible with Windows 7. Use XP for a Mame cab unless you have >4GB ram & an Arcade VGA.

I use XP 64 in mine so I can use the full 4GB ram, Soft 15 runs perfectly under that.

What Resoultion are you running your monitor at for windows? I seem to rememeber you saying you have a hantrex Polo in your cab.

I've had to rebuild after a disk failure and am toying around with front ends again.

Myrddin

LoGiE wrote: »

What Resoultion are you running your monitor at for windows? I seem to rememeber you saying you have a hantrex Polo in your cab.

I've had to rebuild after a disk failure and am toying around with front ends again.

Hantarex Polo 25", Soft 15Khz & XP 64.

I think the desktop resolution is 640x480, I'd have to double check that for you but I can't at the minute as the chassis is borked. On the lookout for a replacement, as the HT voltage is leaking from the flyback & cable so I can't use it.

But I'm nearly sure its 640x480 for windows, & then HS takes care of everyting esle

LoGiE

EnterNow wrote: »

Hantarex Polo 25", Soft 15Khz & XP 64.

I think the desktop resolution is 640x480, I'd have to double check that for you but I can't at the minute as the chassis is borked. On the lookout for a replacement, as the HT voltage is leaking from the flyback & cable so I can't use it.

But I'm nearly sure its 640x480 for windows, & then HS takes care of everyting esle

That's the standard monitor in a Midway Cab I reckon and that's the resolution it's running at currently but I get that flicker that give's you a headache after about five minutes. I've used the arcade resolution tool to create ini files so the games all display correctly so it's not to bad.

I'll mess around with HS and Maximus Arcade this weekend to see which works best.

I'm concerned about my monitor giving up the ghost although I was speaking to a guy recently and he suggested going to my local old school tv repair man. He should be able to fix those kinds of problems as they where his bread and butter at one time or another.

o1s1n

Finding an expert repair person for a CRT monitor is most of the battle really! If you have a local guy you can bring it to then I doubt the problem won't be anything he cant fix, especially if it's something as generic as a Hantarex monitor.

Even if it does break, there doesn't seem to be any shortage of replacements at the moment. That guy Jeff at Digitalsystemsdesign seems to have loads of monitors in stock.

Myrddin

LoGiE wrote: »

That's the standard monitor in a Midway Cab I reckon and that's the resolution it's running at currently but I get that flicker that give's you a headache after about five minutes. I've used the arcade resolution tool to create ini files so the games all display correctly so it's not to bad

Does the flicker persist in games too? The desktop does grain in on you on my cab a bit at that res, but once HS is running or a game its perfectly smooth.

Maybe try different drivers for your video card? Or use quick res to try even lower resolutions maybe for the desktop?

If its flickering in game, then that could be a HS setting I think

LoGiE

No in game resolution is fine. I just need to play around with it again. I might even try and document it this time...

Digitalsystemsdesign doesn't look bad. Has anyone ordered off them?

o1s1n

If you buy something from them, their support is meant to be great, as well as the quality of their gear.

Pyong got an astro for them and was really happy with it.

Contacting them in the first place is the problem! Jeff is very hard to get hold of.

Pyongyang

Yep my Astro cab is still running great, although I have made some changes to it. Bought a new CP, stick, buttons etc. But that was done over a period of time, plus I knew exactly what sticks/buttons I wanted to populate the CP with.

I recommend using Jeff for your cab purchase, however Jeff does appear to be difficult to get hold of sometimes, which is a shame. But when a deal is on, he won't leave you hanging.

On delivery day he rang the driver to make sure where he was and followed up with me. He also answered his mobile phone after hours to help me with some technical stuff getting the cab in to the house and switched on. You get a 30 day no quibble warranty too.

Well worth it I thought, just remember you are never going to get a mint cabinet and a lot of people sell on scrapped cabs. Doesn't matter really so long as the cab is working and in good enough nick. The price usually reflects this.

o1s1n

I contacted Jeff twice via Digitalsystemsdesigns, twice via ebay and I'm pretty sure I tried to contact him via Arcade Otaku too - he didn't reply to a single email.

So I went with Ronnie instead, who replied instantly!

Steve X2

o1s1n wrote: »

I contacted Jeff twice via Digitalsystemsdesigns, twice via ebay and I'm pretty sure I tried to contact him via Arcade Otaku too - he didn't reply to a single email.

So I went with Ronnie instead, who replied instantly!

Aren't you having issues with your arcade monitor

o1s1n

I'd rather have my cab with this minor thing then still be waiting for Jeff to reply to my emails!

Ah it's nothing to the extent of what was happening with yours - I'm pretty sure I'm only seeing it as I put the colour pots and brightness too high (seems to be what the test screen is saying).

Other than that, the monitor has zero burn, lovely a clear picture and is probably one of the best condition first generation candy cabinets knocking about the western world. It's in better condition than a lot of newer cabs I've seen about

Going back to Jeff though, if you CAN get in contact with him, then that would be ideal. Less distance for your cab to travel to you too.

I did have a chat with him last year or so and he's a really nice guy. Just a shame I didnt buy a cab from him when I had his full attention!

steviebg

All right all i've been tipping away at this for a while,got the cab put together got the pc with front end and emulator's set up, i picked up an old black diamond tv and one of these:

http://wp1114205.wp150.webpack.hoste...u325tcvea9n685

I've downloaded soft15khz but when i go to install it a message pops up saying
"intel drivers don't allow more than 5 resolution definitions"

So i suppose my question is what happens next how do i get my frontend to display on the tv? By the way im running windows7 not sure if that makes a difference.

Thanks for any help


Well i installed xp and have everything running but im still getting the same message when i istall soft 15, im at a loss as what to do next. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Steve X2

steviebg wrote: »

All right all i've been tipping away at this for a while,got the cab put together got the pc with front end and emulator's set up, i picked up an old black diamond tv and one of these:

http://wp1114205.wp150.webpack.hoste...u325tcvea9n685

I've downloaded soft15khz but when i go to install it a message pops up saying
"intel drivers don't allow more than 5 resolution definitions"

So i suppose my question is what happens next how do i get my frontend to display on the tv? By the way im running windows7 not sure if that makes a difference.

Thanks for any help


Well i installed xp and have everything running but im still getting the same message when i istall soft 15, im at a loss as what to do next. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

I don't think soft15khz supports Windows 7, or maybe its Windows 7 64bit.
What version are you running.

steviebg

I was running windows 7 but i installed xp instead but im still getting that message about the drivers. I'm only guessing but would it be my graphics card?

I have the desktop version of this:
http://www.dell.com/downloads/global/products/optix/en/opti_745techspecs.pdf

CathalDublin

Soft15 doesn't support support intel onboard graphics
Its gotta be a nvidea or ATI see the wiki

smliv

If your using a black diamond tv as display you shouldn't need soft15khz just video card with tv out

CathalDublin

To get 15khz RGB you will

steviebg

Just had a look at graphic cards and oh crap! I've no bloody idea which ones will fit my pc, don't suppose anyone can link me to the cheapest one that can do the job thanks.





I have the desktop version of this:
http://www.dell.com/downloads/global...5techspecs.pdf

CathalDublin

looking at that spec you have 2 pci and 1 pci express, all are low profile which might be an issue

I would imagine this would work http://www.elara.ie/productdetail.aspx?productcode=ECE2500028

steviebg

outstanding i'll buy it and give it a shot thanks!

CathalDublin

You might want to double check that on one of the development threads on byoac to make sure

Myrddin

CathalDublin wrote: »

To get 15khz RGB you will

A tv won't accept a 15Khz signal though

CathalDublin

EnterNow wrote: »

A tv won't accept a 15Khz signal though

Yes it will.
Standard Irish/Eurpoeen CRT TVs use 15khz
It is the exact same thing as an arcade monitor and the picture will be no different.
I've used a bunch of different TVs in my jamma cabinet over the years

see references, pictures, etc below
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,77370.0.html

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=120798.0

http://www.willcoxonline.com/mame/video/video.html

http://www.ultimarc.com/monfaq.html

ultimarc monfaq wrote:

But there is one way we can use a TV very satisfactorily, which is going in via the RGB pins on a SCART connector (US readers look away at this point, SCART is a European standard!). This actually turns the TV into an arcade monitor because it by-passes all the signal-degrading PAL or NTSC decoder, We can even run native resolutions providing the TV is happy with non-interlaced screens. Beware of RGB "dongles" which attach to some VGA cards. When fitted these tell the VGA card to always use a TV-out fixed resolution so our chance of driving the monitor at the native game resolution is lost.

I've tested ferguson, Sanyo, Mitsubishi without any problems using jamma boards & Mame via ArcadeVGA

Myrddin

CathalDublin wrote: »

Yes it will.
Standard Irish/Eurpoeen CRT TVs use 15khz
It is the exact same thing as an arcade monitor and the picture will be no different.

Really? I always thought they were 31Khz & thats why you can output a pc via s-video straight into a tv. Learn something new every day

CathalDublin

EnterNow wrote: »

Really? I always thought they were 31Khz & thats why you can output a pc via s-video straight into a tv. Learn something new every day

Yup
I think only certain video cards support svhs out but i'm not sure on that as I've only ever read up on and used RGB
Alot of the forums would lead you to believe svideo is the best option if your using a TV but these are all US forums where their TV's are not capable of receiving RGB through scart.

Myrddin

CathalDublin wrote: »

Yup
I think only certain video cards support svhs out but i'm not sure on that as I've only ever read up on and used RGB
Alot of the forums would lead you to believe svideo is the best option if your using a TV but these are all US forums where their TV's are not capable of receiving RGB through scart.

I think I used to have an old Voodoo 3200 with a native s-video out, the quality was terrible as I remember. So tv's can handle both 15Khz and 31Khz? Or would the s-video out on certain cards be already converted to 15Khz?

CathalDublin

EnterNow wrote: »

I think I used to have an old Voodoo 3200 with a native s-video out, the quality was terrible as I remember. So tv's can handle both 15Khz and 31Khz? Or would the s-video out on certain cards be already converted to 15Khz?

I'd imagine its converted to 15khz, I remember selling those voodoo cards in Peats and couldnt see the attraction of them as the quality was shocking.
Heres a few old photos I found of me using arcadevga and RGB out to a TV
don't mind the screen burn in the background, the TV was from a bookies:D
There is service menus on most TVs which you can enter to fix the h/v position, size, etc




Heres a video of a 21" mitsubishi black diamond which I installed as the screen burn was too annoying
View My Video

Myrddin

CathalDublin wrote: »

I'd imagine its converted to 15khz, I remember selling those voodoo cards in Peats and couldnt see the attraction of them as the quality was shocking

Are you kidding?? It had a whole 16MB of Video Memory thats what the appeal was But yeah, I remember the video out to tv was pretty terrible. Dead handy to know tv's accept 15Khz....debating whether or not replacing the chassis on my Polo now or just use a 25" tv. Do they look exactly the same? I always thought arcade screens had a much lower resolution than a tv

CathalDublin

I've a 21" polo and you wouldn't tell the difference in that and the Mitsubishi I had in the machine before it.
The only thing with the TV is they can be difficult to de-case, some have metal brackets on the corners of the tubes and others don't.
You'll also want to make sure the service menu is accessible on the TV your using to adjust the h.size, v.size, etc.
Which its actually great being able to do this with the remote control rather than using the controls on the rear of Polo I have

smliv

cathal would you be able to tell me if it would be possible to use the old pc lightguns with this setup as it is using a crt

CathalDublin

If imagine so, I know the aimtrac's are the best light guns for mame out there

djidane535

I encountered the following problem with an intel onboard graphic card:

Intel drivers don't allow more than 5 resolution definitions

Since I didn't find any solution on the internet, I post it here in order to help others that will encounter it in the future.

I'm running on Windows 7-64bits and it works. The problem is that soft15khz tries to register more than 5 resolutions to be deliver in 15khz instead of 31khz. The trick is to told the program not to register some of them.

I just had to create a 'custom15khz.txt' file. Copy paste the following text within the file:

remove 240,240
remove 256,240
remove 256,256
remove 256,264
remove 304,240
remove 320,240
remove 320,256
remove 336,240
remove 352,256
remove 352,264
remove 352,288
remove 368,240
remove 384,288
remove 392,240
remove 400,256
remove 448,240
remove 512,240
remove 512,288
remove 632,264
remove 640,240
remove 640,288
remove 640,240
remove 512,448
remove 512,512
remove 640,480
remove 720,480
remove 800,600
remove 1024,768

When using the 'Install 15khz' button. The program will not modify the specified resolution definitions. So if you want to use a resolution of 640x480, just remove the line 'remove 640,480' so that the program will only use this resolution for the 15khz output. Don't erase more than 5 lines and it will still work.

About W7, the trick is that whenever you start the computer, it has to try to send the image on the VGA port. Most of the time, plugging the display on the VGA port is enough. But if the operating system does not detect the display (that was the case for me), than before shutting down the computer:
- Right click on the Desktop.
- Select "Display resolution" (or similar, my OS is not in english).
- Than, click on the "Detect" button.
- Here, you will probably see 2 new "screens", corresponding to the 2 graphic cards (Intel and Nvidia in my case).
- Select the Intel one, and select the option consisting to force the connection with the VGA port.
- After that, you have to select the option duplicating the screen on both displays.

When this is done, the OS will always send the image of the screen on the VGA port, even if nothing is plugged.

Hope it will help anyone .

Myrddin

I thought Soft15 didn't work at all with Win7?

djidane535

That's what I also read on the web, but I saw a video showing a computer running Win7 working perfectly with the UMSA. After seeing that, I tried to do so with mine and it worked. I encountered the same thing about intel onboard graphic cards (such mine) and with the trick I described in my previous post, it also worked perfectly (even if you're still limited to 5 resolution definitions).

djidane535

I made a mistake, it does not work. I assumed that my HD TV Scart port will react the same way. In fact, the HD TV has accepted the signal, but not the CRT TV. I suspect that the SCART port of my HD TV is just a mapping to some stuff within the television, which supports 31khz signals, even though a 31khz signal is not expected. I performed several tests, but it appears that this graphic card does not react to any modification of neither soft15khz nor powerstrip.

After making some researches, I found this component:

http://www.arcadespareparts.com/arcade_parts/video_converter/vga_rgb_cga_video_converter/12215.html

As I can understand, this component converts a 31khz signal into a 15khz signal (VGA Input and Output), so it is the "hardware version" of the soft15khz software.

Myrddin

djidane535 wrote: »

I made a mistake, it does not work. I assumed that my HD TV Scart port will react the same way. In fact, the HD TV has accepted the signal, but not the CRT TV. I suspect that the SCART port of my HD TV is just a mapping to some stuff within the television, which supports 31khz signals, even though a 31khz signal is not expected. I performed several tests, but it appears that this graphic card does not react to any modification of neither soft15khz nor powerstrip.

After making some researches, I found this component:

http://www.arcadespareparts.com/arcade_parts/video_converter/vga_rgb_cga_video_converter/12215.html

As I can understand, this component converts a 31khz signal into a 15khz signal (VGA Input and Output), so it is the "hardware version" of the soft15khz software.

Why not just buy an ArcadeVGA...a video card that outputs 15Khz natively.

djidane535

EnterNow wrote: »

Why not just buy an ArcadeVGA...a video card that outputs 15Khz natively.

Because I use a laptop. I will receive a new laptop for my job and I want to use the old one for emulation purpose. So I cannot change the graphic card.

Optimus Prime

You could just buy one of those scanline emulator things and use an lcd screen if it came to it. Not the same, but close...