Netgear Wireless G Router WGR614v10 from UPC

BenEadir

Hi all,

I've 20mb broadband from UPC coming through a Scientific Atlanta EPC2203 cable modem connected to a Netgear Wireless G WGR614v10 Router. I'm getting a new desktop which is coming with this wireless N adapter http://www.argos.ie/static/Product/partNumber/9255155/Trail/searchtext%3ENETGEAR.htm#tabrev I understand the N standard is way faster/better than the G standard.

I assume the Netgear N Adapter will be backwards compatible and connet to my G router (Please confirm??) but if I change router to an N router will I have to re-connect everything that currently connected to the G router? I'm guessing it'll be like having a new network so the answer is 'yes' but would like to kow for sure as there are 2 laptops, a tablet, 4 phones and a couple of game consoles (x-box and wii) on top of the new desktop which will all need to be re-connected.

What N router should I go for? Total wireless connections throughout the house will be at least 10 and will probably grow as new devices arrive over time.

The router is serving the house from a central location in the ceiling of the fist floor, it's a 2 story timber frame house. The furthest device will be 20 metres from the router through 3 walls.

Last bit of info I'd appreciate input on is what is the likely reaction if I ask UPC to relace the G router with an N router? I've been with them over 2 years so can easily switch provider if a new provider will supply an N router.

Hope all the ablve makes sense.

Ben

FSL

Wireless g is 54mbs your internet is at best 20mbs so as far as internet speed is concerned 'N' won't make any difference.

As far as I am aware all devices connected to a 'N' router have to be 'N' rated or it will revert to 'g'.

The only difference will be if you are streaming between devices on your LAN.

BenEadir

FSL wrote: »

As far as I am aware all devices connected to a 'N' router have to be 'N' rated or it will revert to 'g'.

Thanks for the explanation. I guess I don't need an N router so until my broadband speed increases past 50mb??

Does that mean the N adapter I'm getting will or won't work with the G router I have? I'm assuming an N adapter is backwards compatible but I know that's a dangerous thing to do.

Ben

FSL

Yes the adapter will be backward compatible.

The other thing to remember is that wireless is very convenient but susceptible to RF interference. E.g. wireless baby alarms, neighbours wireless router, TV senders etc.

BenEadir

FSL wrote: »

Yes the adapter will be backward compatible.

The other thing to remember is that wireless is very convenient but susceptible to RF interference. E.g. wireless baby alarms, neighbours wireless router, TV senders etc.

Thanks FSL, appreciate it.

Ben

FSL

Thanks no problem glad to have helped.

PogMoThoin

FSL wrote: »

Wireless g is 54mbs your internet is at best 20mbs so as far as internet speed is concerned 'N' won't make any difference.

As far as I am aware all devices connected to a 'N' router have to be 'N' rated or it will revert to 'g'.

The only difference will be if you are streaming between devices on your LAN.

In real life situations a 54Mbit "g" router will max out at 20-28Mbits, that is with it being the only device, in the same room, with line of sight, without any other device causing interference on the channel. It's barely enough to stream a 1080p bluray h264 encoded file.

BenEadir

PogMoThoin wrote: »

In real life situations a 54Mbit "g" router will max out at 20-28Mbits, that is with it being the only device, in the same room, with line of sight, without any other device causing interference on the channel. It's barely enough to stream a 1080p bluray h264 encoded file.

Hi PMT,

I have a total of 10 devices (2 laptops, 1 desktop PC, 4 smart phones, 1 xBox, 1 Wii & one tablet PC) wirelessly connected to the router. I'm being fed 20mb fibre optic broadband from UPC.

How would an N router improve things????

Ben

PogMoThoin

With "n" you could have breathing space, there would be ample bandwidth for your pc to stream HD content across the network while you're downloading to another device.

If it were me, I'd get a dual band wifi router like the Linksys WRT610N to be futureproof, buy once buy right. Avoid Belkin at all costs.

dub45

The performance of "N" equipment is often wildly exaggerated. Google for some reviews and get familiar with what the real world speeds are.

Also remember that to maintain an "n" network performance all devices connect at any one time have to be "n' standard.

http://compnetworking.about.com/od/wireless/f/80211n-300-mbps.htm

stephen97

BenThere wrote: »

Hi all,

I've 20mb broadband from UPC coming through a Scientific Atlanta EPC2203 cable modem connected to a Netgear Wireless G WGR614v10 Router. I'm getting a new desktop which is coming with this wireless N adapter http://www.argos.ie/static/Product/partNumber/9255155/Trail/searchtext%3ENETGEAR.htm#tabrev I understand the N standard is way faster/better than the G standard.

I assume the Netgear N Adapter will be backwards compatible and connet to my G router (Please confirm??) but if I change router to an N router will I have to re-connect everything that currently connected to the G router? I'm guessing it'll be like having a new network so the answer is 'yes' but would like to kow for sure as there are 2 laptops, a tablet, 4 phones and a couple of game consoles (x-box and wii) on top of the new desktop which will all need to be re-connected.

What N router should I go for? Total wireless connections throughout the house will be at least 10 and will probably grow as new devices arrive over time.

The router is serving the house from a central location in the ceiling of the fist floor, it's a 2 story timber frame house. The furthest device will be 20 metres from the router through 3 walls.

Last bit of info I'd appreciate input on is what is the likely reaction if I ask UPC to relace the G router with an N router? I've been with them over 2 years so can easily switch provider if a new provider will supply an N router.

Hope all the ablve makes sense.

Ben

my advice is keep the modem as it is needed if you get the phone from upc as we do and just get a wireless n router, this is the one i upgraded to from the netgear 614 to a Netgear Rangemax NEXT Dual Band Wireless Router. i found it works very well and does not drop the signal as we watch premier league on p2p4u.net.
specs and link for amazon with great price: http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0018OIN4C/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&m=A3K5HHD3KZXXBZ

infowars.com

talking about football is that p2p site still running? firstrowfootball is not

dub45

infowars.com wrote: »

talking about football is that p2p site still running? firstrowfootball is not

We are not talking about football or p2p sites here.

infowars.com

fk u ya p!!!k

stephen97

infowars.com wrote: »

talking about football is that p2p site still running? firstrowfootball is not

it works for me http://www.firstrow.tv/

BenEadir

stephen97 wrote: »

my advice is keep the modem as it is needed if you get the phone from upc as we do and just get a wireless n router, this is the one i upgraded to from the netgear 614 to a Netgear Rangemax NEXT Dual Band Wireless Router. i found it works very well and does not drop the signal as we watch premier league on p2p4u.net.
specs and link for amazon with great price: http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0018OIN4C/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&m=A3K5HHD3KZXXBZ

Stephen,

Where do you live??? I'm coming over to shove this Netgear "Rangemax" (someone has a sense of humour) router up your arse!!! :rolleyes:

Got the router as you suggested, got it up and running in no time, tested it with Speedtest via cable and was getting the full 20Mbps download. Tried the same test using "N" wireless from right beside the router (which is situated in the attic of my bungalow) and got similar results so thanked God for sending Stephen97 my way with his sound advice and headed to the other end of the house (maybe 15 metres away from the router as the crow flies through 3 plasterboard walls/partitions) to test it where I mostly use my laptop and the kids use their xBox and depression set in. THE SIGNAL IS CRAP :mad:

As I'm sure you know the Netgear Rangemax NEXT Dual Band Wireless Router throws out both a G and N signal. Where I was previously getting a fair signal from my old Wireless G router I'm now not getting any "N" signal whatsoever and the "G" signal is mostly one and wavers with a maximum of two bars and Speedtest is only scoring 3Mbps.

WTF????

I'm only joking obviously about it being your fault but I sure would appreciate some help from anyone on here who can help me get decent performance out of this "Rangemax" router!!

Here's hoping someone comes to my rescue.

Ben

dub45

Unfortunately as you are discovering the performance of wireless equipment in any given location is very difficult to predict in advance

Have you tried changing channels? Are there wifi connections around you?

Have a look with this:

http://www.metageek.net/products/inssider/

BenEadir

Hey Dub45, thanks for the feedback.

Can't believe the free "crappy" old "G" wireless router UPC gave me performas better than this new "RangeMax" router!!!

Downloaded that software and here's a screenshot of what's happening.

The Eircom network is a neighbours!!! You'll see that the "N" signal in blue popped up for a few seconds at the start but then disappeared.

I've no idea what the info means however. Can you or someone else tell me what's going on??



Ben

stephen97

BenThere wrote: »

Stephen,

Where do you live??? I'm coming over to shove this Netgear "Rangemax" (someone has a sense of humour) router up your arse!!! :rolleyes:

Got the router as you suggested, got it up and running in no time, tested it with Speedtest via cable and was getting the full 20Mbps download. Tried the same test using "N" wireless from right beside the router (which is situated in the attic of my bungalow) and got similar results so thanked God for sending Stephen97 my way with his sound advice and headed to the other end of the house (maybe 15 metres away from the router as the crow flies through 3 plasterboard walls/partitions) to test it where I mostly use my laptop and the kids use their xBox and depression set in. THE SIGNAL IS CRAP :mad:

As I'm sure you know the Netgear Rangemax NEXT Dual Band Wireless Router throws out both a G and N signal. Where I was previously getting a fair signal from my old Wireless G router I'm now not getting any "N" signal whatsoever and the "G" signal is mostly one and wavers with a maximum of two bars and Speedtest is only scoring 3Mbps.

WTF????

I'm only joking obviously about it being your fault but I sure would appreciate some help from anyone on here who can help me get decent performance out of this "Rangemax" router!!

Here's hoping someone comes to my rescue.

Ben

The router i suggested is fine for my needs as i stated, i gave you an example of what i have and therefore the onus is on you to check these things out before you buy. its free advice on the subject matter, if you bought router from amazon you have 30 days to return to sender for your cashback, below are 4 ways to fix the distance issue
(1) is an entender usb dongle to improve the range the your network just plug into the usb of a desktop or laptop and your problem is sorted link: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Netgear-RangeMax-Dual-Wireless-N-Adaptor/dp/B0018782HW/ref=lh_ni_t
(2) use a 15 metre ethernet cable from the modem to the router link:http://www.amazon.co.uk/1001Cables-metre-Network-Ethernet-Cable/dp/B000HWY2ZK
(3) netgear have a powerline networking which will plug into your esb supply and hence turn all esb points in your home into a massive range and signal will be strong whereever you plug anything into a power socket link: http://www.amazon.co.uk/NetGear-XAVB2001-100UKS-Netgear-Powerline-Ethernet/dp/B0034CBMPI/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1326841744&sr=8-6
(4)the router is fine its just the signal distance, the new router has four ethernet out slots plug the old router into 1 of these and setup as a repeater, this will then extend the range of your network a lot more, link http://support.netgear.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/965 . this page will fully explain how to turn the old router ie wgr614 into a slave extender. remember to keep the new rangemax router as the master and this will solve your range problems

PogMoThoin

BenThere wrote: »

Hey Dub45, thanks for the feedback.

Can't believe the free "crappy" old "G" wireless router UPC gave me performas better than this new "RangeMax" router!!!

Downloaded that software and here's a screenshot of what's happening.

The Eircom network is a neighbours!!! You'll see that the "N" signal in blue popped up for a few seconds at the start but then disappeared.

I've no idea what the info means however. Can you or someone else tell me what's going on??



Ben

I'm afraid you owe Stephen an apology, there is nothing wrong Ben.

The reason you're not seeing "n" is that your laptop/PC does not have a 5.8Ghz card as "n" is on 5.8Ghz on that dual band router, as the laptop/PC only has a 2.4Ghz card it only sees the 2.4Ghz "g" signal.

The Netgear "g" signal is on channel 1, it's the same as your neighbours Eircom modem and needs changing as they are overlapping, change it to 11 and the signal will most likely improve.

stephen97

BenThere wrote: »

Stephen,

Where do you live??? I'm coming over to shove this Netgear "Rangemax" (someone has a sense of humour) router up your arse!!! :rolleyes:

Got the router as you suggested, got it up and running in no time, tested it with Speedtest via cable and was getting the full 20Mbps download. Tried the same test using "N" wireless from right beside the router (which is situated in the attic of my bungalow) and got similar results so thanked God for sending Stephen97 my way with his sound advice and headed to the other end of the house (maybe 15 metres away from the router as the crow flies through 3 plasterboard walls/partitions) to test it where I mostly use my laptop and the kids use their xBox and depression set in. THE SIGNAL IS CRAP :mad:

As I'm sure you know the Netgear Rangemax NEXT Dual Band Wireless Router throws out both a G and N signal. Where I was previously getting a fair signal from my old Wireless G router I'm now not getting any "N" signal whatsoever and the "G" signal is mostly one and wavers with a maximum of two bars and Speedtest is only scoring 3Mbps.

WTF????

I'm only joking obviously about it being your fault but I sure would appreciate some help from anyone on here who can help me get decent performance out of this "Rangemax" router!!

Here's hoping someone comes to my rescue.

Ben

my email is [removed]send me your address details and ill set up your new router for you, and any additional tech related problems you have.
There are internal settings which will improve your reception
Type the following into the address bar of your internet browser http://www.routerlogin.com/ and then go to, This will then invite you to enter the following user and password, admin and password are the defaults,
Once in click on wireless setup in the left column under setup,
Then click mode as up to 270 at 2.4ghz click region as europe as america may be default here, Then click 11n and 11g channels as Auto,
Then set your security, wpa2-psk is best 1 to pick as older devices will not work with the top choice, Then click apply.
This should sort out your range issues,
If not then best option is the usb wifi dongle, But make sure it is wireless n compatable here is a reasonable price link: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Netgear-RangeMax-Dual-Wireless-N-Adaptor/dp/B0018782HW/ref=lh_ni_t
and hey presto, problem sorted

PogMoThoin

Stephen, it's very foolish to leave your email visible on a public forum, you're inviting spambots to harvest and ruin your email with spam.

Also, leaving the router on auto has resulted on an overlap of channel 1 with the neighbour, it's best to take it off auto and set it to channel 11

BenEadir

Cheers lads, serious advice there from people who know what they're talking about.

I was only jocking you Stephen97, apologies if you thought I was serious, I mean it. I appreciate you taking the time to offer help. I'd never slag off someone who has volunteered info. I do it all the time myself on here on subjects I do have some knowledge/expertise in and wouldn't take kindly to my generosity being thrown back in my face either. I didn't frame my 'joke' very well. Apologies again.

PMT, thanks for getting Stephen to remove his email address. His intentions were indeed good but your advice to him is spot on.

It'll be tonight before I get a chance to read all the info so I'll revert later with success/more questions etc.

BTW, I feel a bit of a tit ref the N signal on my laptop. I knew that already but the N signal being received by the NetGear N600 wi-fi adapter I'm using on my PC (http://www.netgear.com/home/products/wireless-adapters/high-performance/WNDA3100.aspx which is located a little closer to the router than my laptop was) was only getting an 8% signal and the G signal was hovering between 38% and 50%. With my old G router I was getting a 70% G signal and thought the inSSIDER info produced somehow reflected the N signal problem I have on my PC also

Anyway, thanks for the support. I'll knuckle down and see if I can figure out the suggestions myself without hassling you all too much more.

Ben

BenEadir

stephen97 wrote: »

Once in click on wireless setup in the left column under setup,
Then click mode as up to 270 at 2.4ghz click region as europe as america may be default here, Then click 11n and 11g channels as Auto,
Then set your security, wpa2-psk is best 1 to pick as older devices will not work with the top choice, Then click apply.
This should sort out your range issues,

Hi Stephen,

Apologies again if my 'joke' wasn't received as intended

I got the kids to bed and set about trying to crack this router problem. (Problem is me rather than the router I know but you know what I mean)

I followed your instructions to the 'T' with the exception of setting the channel to Auto. I set it to channel 11 as PMT suggested.

The signal strength being received at the PC (using the Netgear N600 USB adapter) is much much improved and the download speeds are hitting 17Mbps although they drop to just 3Mbps from time to time which I guess is UPC congestion??

Anyway, given I know feck all about this stuff I thought I'd share a few screen shots with yourself and PMT in the hope ye might review the new setup and comment if I've either fu**ked anything up or there is anything else you'd recommend I do to max the performance I'm getting.

Hope these make some sense to you.













One thing I'm curious about is why there is nothing being broadcast on the 5.0GHz channel?? Also, why are the 11G SSID and 11G channels greyed out in Wireless Settings of the Router Manager software?

Probably stupid questions but it's all a mystery to me so I'd like to learn a bit whilst you guys are helping me fix this!!

Cheers again,

Ben

BenEadir

Having used the above setup for a few hours I have the following observations:-

1. Initially the N signal strength being received at the PC improved from 8% (before making the settings changes) to 70% but this seems to waver quite a bit. The # of signal bars can be anything from 4 down to 2 and the signal from 70% down to 30% with Download speeds dropping from 15Mbps down to 3Mbps. Given the PC is at a fixed location and so is the router how can the signal strength vary so much???

2. The signal is not reaching as far as the old G signal was with the old Router. There's a couple of spots in the house where I routinely browse news websites etc on my phone via wi-fi. One is the kitchen table which is at the furthest point in the house from the router and the other is the bog which is a similar distance from the router. With the old G router I always had a good enough wi-fi connection (one or two bars) in both locations to browse on my phone with ease but with the new router I have absolutely nothing.

I guess there is still some tinkering to be done to get the settings of the new router right so anything anyone can recommend based on the screenshots in the post above would be most welcome.

Ben

BenEadir

Went to use my PC a while ago and it was incredibly slow loading websites. It threw up latency errors when trying a Speedtest.net test and the Chrome browser threw up "106" time out errors.

Really confused now. Anyone got any suggestions?

Ben

stephen97

BenThere wrote: »

Having used the above setup for a few hours I have the following observations:-

1. Initially the N signal strength being received at the PC improved from 8% (before making the settings changes) to 70% but this seems to waver quite a bit. The # of signal bars can be anything from 4 down to 2 and the signal from 70% down to 30% with Download speeds dropping from 15Mbps down to 3Mbps. Given the PC is at a fixed location and so is the router how can the signal strength vary so much???

2. The signal is not reaching as far as the old G signal was with the old Router. There's a couple of spots in the house where I routinely browse news websites etc on my phone via wi-fi. One is the kitchen table which is at the furthest point in the house from the router and the other is the bog which is a similar distance from the router. With the old G router I always had a good enough wi-fi connection (one or two bars) in both locations to browse on my phone with ease but with the new router I have absolutely nothing.

I guess there is still some tinkering to be done to get the settings of the new router right so anything anyone can recommend based on the screenshots in the post above would be most welcome.

Ben

hi point 1 upc congestion is the likely culprit. you know you can use both networks by plugging in your old router into your new one via ethernet cable and then choose whichever signal you want by wifi, id still recommend setting your 11n channel to auto, because your neighbours channel wont intefere with it because hes using g and these new routers automatically choose a channel if others would clash with yours, so yes id turn on auto. 1 last thing i love spam, i couldnt get enough of it in america, yum ham in a can mixed with other gooh yuuuuuummmm lol BTW no offence the other day, but just send a line by the forum if you have probs in future

stephen97

BenThere wrote: »

Hi Stephen,

Apologies again if my 'joke' wasn't received as intended

I got the kids to bed and set about trying to crack this router problem. (Problem is me rather than the router I know but you know what I mean)

I followed your instructions to the 'T' with the exception of setting the channel to Auto. I set it to channel 11 as PMT suggested.

The signal strength being received at the PC (using the Netgear N600 USB adapter) is much much improved and the download speeds are hitting 17Mbps although they drop to just 3Mbps from time to time which I guess is UPC congestion??

Anyway, given I know feck all about this stuff I thought I'd share a few screen shots with yourself and PMT in the hope ye might review the new setup and comment if I've either fu**ked anything up or there is anything else you'd recommend I do to max the performance I'm getting.

Hope these make some sense to you.













One thing I'm curious about is why there is nothing being broadcast on the 5.0GHz channel?? Also, why are the 11G SSID and 11G channels greyed out in Wireless Settings of the Router Manager software?

Probably stupid questions but it's all a mystery to me so I'd like to learn a bit whilst you guys are helping me fix this!!

Cheers again,

Ben

the 5ghz channel is only for the future, so new laptops and devices will use this signal, id say maybe 2 to 3 years away yet, its a bit like the microsoft 32 bit and 64 bit debate. the 11g channel is greyed cos your not using it, so plug old router in and it should pop up

BenEadir

stephen97 wrote: »

hi point 1 upc congestion is the likely culprit. you know you can use both networks by plugging in your old router into your new one via ethernet cable and then choose whichever signal you want by wifi, id still recommend setting your 11n channel to auto, because your neighbours channel wont intefere with it because hes using g and these new routers automatically choose a channel if others would clash with yours, so yes id turn on auto. 1 last thing i love spam, i couldnt get enough of it in america, yum ham in a can mixed with other gooh yuuuuuummmm lol BTW no offence the other day, but just send a line by the forum if you have probs in future

Cheers Stephen I'll try that.

BTW what is the spam reference about? It's gone right over my head

stephen97

BenThere wrote: »

Cheers Stephen I'll try that.

BTW what is the spam reference about? It's gone right over my head

pmt said it was foolish to post my email on site cos id get loads of spam and junk

BenEadir

This is totally wrecking my head!! I now have two routers and I'm getting half the download speeds and half the signal coverage that I was getting before I added the "Rangemaster".

How can two wireless routers be performing worse than one??

Ben