Alarm providers for new build

TKD SC

Hi,

We've just finished a new build and have now moved in! Need to get an alarm soon, have contacted Eircom Phonewatch and Securigard for initial quotes - all very pricey - are there any other co's you guys would recommend for Dublin area re getting an alarm from? We've no phone line, so would go the wireless route.

Any suggestions would be great.

Thanks

Simon

KoolKid

This thread here will give you links to the PSA register of all licensed installers.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056242435
Also take a look at the sticky here
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055956748

Always get at least 3 quotes and compare like with like.
Insist on a site visit and get everything in writing. Especially what's covered and what's not. If looking at eircom ask what happens if you change your phone provider.
Also check what's covered in maintenance contracts.Some installers only allow you one or2 callouts etc. Best not to have any surprises down the road.

altor

+ 1 to the above.
If you are with Eircom when you get the system installed and are receiving text alerts from the alarm, ask what happens with a change over to UPC, as a lot of people are moving away from the standard phone line to UPC. Best to cover everything on the site survey.

Jnealon

Just get a few quotes from some compaines in the area.
With phone watch you are paying a hefty premium for the name, local companies will offer better value in the long run

TKD SC

Thanks guys. Looked at the link and there are a lot of co's etc.
Any personal recommendations of decent local co's - Dublin 14 area? Have rang a few and still all crazy money - Eircom phonewatch actually coming out better value!

Tks
Simon

KoolKid

Don't forget to ask the Eircom rep all the right questions. It won't work out cheaper when you see what's not included. The basic stuff like a working bell will be extra.:eek:
Also don't accept just inertias on the windows.

TKD SC

Hi Guys,

The two main systems I'm coming across seem to be visonics and hkc. I seem to have a preference for hkc with what people are saying. Main difference I can gather is that visonics detectors only detect when window actually broken through, whereas hkc detects a bang on the windows. Is this the main difference or what other differences are there??

If I can at least make this decisision it will be a step forward!!

Thanks again
Simon

KoolKid

Hi Simon,
Also take a look at the Siemens 4000 range.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6034073/uploads/attachments/78653/179480.pdf
Its in the same price range as HKC but with some nice added features for your money.
All inertia contacts should detect opening or forced entry.
Who told you different?

TKD SC

Hi,

Couple more q's! Think I've nearly decided! Was thinking of the HKC Quantum (wireless), going gsm option (as no landline) and keeping it basic enough. One of the other co's just rang me back and has thrown me a bit now though!! He is not a fan of gsm as primary communication method! He said a blocker can be bought online for €80 and render it useless. Also, if the gsm is built into the panel (which I thought sounded good re neatness etc) that if there was a power cut, the back-up battery is used up extremely fast. He also mentioned there is monthly cost (besides the initial cost of gsm) re the sim card etc (which I didn't hear about before).

So few things he said have now thrown me!! I would think that phone lines could be cut too, so what's the difference between cutting ph lines / gsm blocker?!

Power cut seems a bit ott - that would be unlucky!

Monthly sim card cost to gsm would be an issue and make me think about comparing to monthly cost of phone line (especially if I can get upc who are only €6 vs eircom €25ish)...

Any advise appreciated! Never knew alarms were so complicated!!

Thanks
Simon

Jnealon

If you are using the gsm unit for sms and home automation then it will be fine.
I dont know what capacity the battery is in the hkc or what current their gsm unit consumes but other brands use very little. Think of the gsm unit as a bare mobile phone and we all know that your basic phone will last well over a week on a battery

KoolKid

TKD SC wrote: »

Hi,
So few things he said have now thrown me!! I would think that phone lines could be cut too, so what's the difference between cutting ph lines / gsm blocker?!

To cut a phone line requires physical tampering. You have to actually find, access & cut it. Depending on the configuration the line can be protected by the alam and/or concealed. The alarm will also give a notification of a line fault. When GSM is blocked no line fault will show untill the digi attempts a call.

TKD SC wrote: »

Power cut seems a bit ott - that would be unlucky!

If this guy is certifying the alarm to EN50131 the battery should be of sufficiant size to hold up the system & all signaling devices for the required time under all circumstances. That would include up to 4 activations & all the warnings & signalling that goes with that.
He really should know this stuff..
From EQAs site.

Requirement: [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]The power supply shall be capable of supporting the Intruder Alarm System in all conditions including when recharging storage devices for 12 Hours for Grades 1 and 2.
In general, the manufacturers will supply batteries that can sustain the system for 12 hours, however, if a system has a large number of Zones, the installer should be able to verify that the battery is capable of sustaining the system for 12 hours (by looking at the current requirements for each piece of equipment, adding these up to get the load for the full system and confirming that the battery Amp Hours is sufficient to maintain this load for 12 hours).
[/FONT][/FONT]

TKD SC wrote: »

Monthly sim card cost to gsm would be an issue and make me think about comparing to monthly cost of phone line (especially if I can get upc who are only €6 vs eircom €25ish)...

UPC is good value , but would present you waith another issue in the event of power cuts. GSM on pre pay is cheap enough. You are only spending monent when the alarm contacts you with an activation etc.
Unless your using text for remote control. If your planning lots of that then a panel with a web server works out cheaper in the long run.

altor

TKD SC wrote: »

Hi Guys,

The two main systems I'm coming across seem to be visonics and hkc. I seem to have a preference for hkc with what people are saying. Main difference I can gather is that visonics detectors only detect when window actually broken through, whereas hkc detects a bang on the windows. Is this the main difference or what other differences are there??

If I can at least make this decisision it will be a step forward!!

Thanks again
Simon

The Visonic would be the cheaper system. The HKC Quantum would be a much better system. Both systems will detect an open/close plus an intruder trying to gain entry, with Visonic sensors it depends how you set them up re the open/close. The HKC system devices use two way communication to the panel, Visonic use the older one way.

altor

TKD SC wrote: »

Hi,

Couple more q's! Think I've nearly decided! Was thinking of the HKC Quantum (wireless), going gsm option (as no landline) and keeping it basic enough. One of the other co's just rang me back and has thrown me a bit now though!! He is not a fan of gsm as primary communication method! He said a blocker can be bought online for €80 and render it useless. Also, if the gsm is built into the panel (which I thought sounded good re neatness etc) that if there was a power cut, the back-up battery is used up extremely fast. He also mentioned there is monthly cost (besides the initial cost of gsm) re the sim card etc (which I didn't hear about before).

So few things he said have now thrown me!! I would think that phone lines could be cut too, so what's the difference between cutting ph lines / gsm blocker?!

Power cut seems a bit ott - that would be unlucky!

Monthly sim card cost to gsm would be an issue and make me think about comparing to monthly cost of phone line (especially if I can get upc who are only €6 vs eircom €25ish)...

Any advise appreciated! Never knew alarms were so complicated!!

Thanks
Simon

The newer GSM that can be installed in the panel wont be out till early next year. A ready to go sim registered on line so you can check the credit plus top it up would be the cheaper option. Bill pay sims is going to cost more as you have to pay the bill but with the ready to go you can top it up as needs be, just make sure you activate the alarm sim every couple of months to keep it active.

KoolKid

I think I know where this picking up opening is coming from.
Using Visonic inertias as duel ( sensor and contact on the one zone) the system will not show an open contact when setting the system. However, when the system is armed it will detect opening.

altor

That is correct. The only way is to install them as duel and use 2 zones.
If you set up 1 zone as duel with the combination of inertia/contact you can walk out of the home with the window open with the alarm set. Not a good way but setting it up as 2 zones will fix this for you.