Who gives a f****** about the children?

aidan24326

Freddie59 wrote: »

Africa is a tragedy. Yet, Ireland is to BORROW €850m (even though we're up to our tits) to donate next year to overseas relief.

Africa has been torn apart by war, tyrants, etc and much of its misery is of its own making. And yet you expect the West to continually bail it out, when, allegedly, only 25% of all aid donated gets through, with much of it being hijacked to fund wars? Get real man.

It's believed even some of the Live Aid money ended up in the hands of tyrants, to buy weapons etc

So clearly throwing money at the place doesn't do much good unless you can fully control where it goes and what it gets spent on.

Johro

aidan24326 wrote: »

It's believed even some of the Live Aid money ended up in the hands of tyrants, to buy weapons etc

So clearly throwing money at the place doesn't do much good unless you can fully control where it goes and what it gets spent on.

We have to stop giving our overseas aid to corrupt governments and hand it to the aid agencies that are already there instead. It's simple really.

Johro

Wibbs wrote: »

Re "colonise" places like the Congo with the UN with a large chunk of other African forces and civil servants making up the numbers. Tap into the natural resources and get those resources ot to the wider world of trade and business. Use the money to pay for infrastructure and pay for education for the Congalese. Foster it up to a point where they're running the place themselves in a democratic way. Leave.

That would be the kind of thing I had in mind as well, so at least we agree on that. I'm only saying we should help if and when we can by giving money to the genuine aid agencies that are out there now. Overthrow of their government is well overdue.

Slydice

What a pathetic bunch of selfish half arsed responses. Apart from the small few replies showing some understanding, nothing in this thread has been surprising.

ScumLord

Johro wrote: »

You should do stand-up.

I already stood up today.

Slydice

Slydice wrote: »

What a pathetic bunch of selfish half arsed responses. Apart from the small few replies showing some understanding, nothing in this thread has been surprising.

You say that yet you have displayed no logic or understanding of the situation. You haven't put an argument forward, just berated people for doing nothing. You haven't responded to any of the replies which have an educated response yet you complain about the responses being half arsed.

Wake up will ya?

old_aussie

Blame the sex mad parents.

Dudess

Slydice wrote: »

What a pathetic bunch of selfish half arsed responses. Apart from the small few replies showing some understanding, nothing in this thread has been surprising.

So you throw out insults and assumptions in your opening post, then it doesn't go your way so you throw your toys out of the pram? Repeat: what have you done to help those people and what qualifies you to take the moral high ground? What makes you any different?

Logical Fallacy

Slydice wrote: »

What a pathetic bunch of selfish half arsed responses. Apart from the small few replies showing some understanding, nothing in this thread has been surprising.

Yawn.

You asked a question and you got answers...if you don't like them i suggest sitting in front of a mirror and conversing with the specter who lives within the silvered glass.

Still no details on why everyone else should know and care before you did, or even what you yourself are doing to help.

Keyboard warriors crack me up.

Jimoslimos

AngeGal wrote: »

Charity begins at home, how many nurses/teachers/people on the poverty line would that help in Ireland?

I absolutely hate this statement 'Charity begins at home'. It doesn't. In my mind for something to be charitable it also needs to be altruistic, no benefit falling back on the benefactor.

Donating to causes at home is all very well meaning but there is usually always a kickback. One example I'm always loath to give (and which probably belongs in the Unpopular Opinions thread) is that of persons raising money for charities responsible for caring/researching treatments for ill or deceased relatives, especially cancer ones. Given the genetic predisposition we have to many diseases could this not be simply seen as an extended insurance policy?

ItsAWindUp

These countries are massively overpopulated. I'm sorry, but there's nothing else to it. Until they sort that out all the aid in the world won't make a blind bit of difference.

Dudess

"Charity begins at home" is just an opinion, not a fact. I'd consider flood survivors in India more worthy than a local GAA club.

ScumLord

Jimoslimos wrote: »

I absolutely hate this statement 'Charity begins at home'. It doesn't. In my mind for something to be charitable it also needs to be altruistic, no benefit falling back on the benefactor.

Humans are becoming more species oriented than any other animal so looking out for any human is beneficial too us all. Unlike other animals other humans aren't necessarily competition. It pays to be altruistic in a modern world in other words, helping your fellow human could very well be seen as selfish in the end when you remove borders and cultures. Steven Hawking would be seen as a burden on people in some respects but just look at his contributions to the human species.

ScissorPaperRock

weldoninhio wrote: »

Maybe its the generation i'm from. But i can honestly say that i couldn't care less about poor people in Africa dying. They have had lots of chances and hundreds of millions in aid, but they keep screwing it up. Let them die. It doesn't affect me.

Despite your obvious cluelessness on the matter, the lack of value you attribute to human life makes me sick.

Let's hope you (and anyone like you) don't affect anyone. Perceptions like yours are toxic to humanity.

Simon Adebisi

Slydice sounds like a 16 year old who has just looked up live aid on youtube and discovered something shocking.

Joshua whatever sounds like a 1st year psychology student mad to show off.

Both of them sound like plums.

Africa needs to sort itself out first before any of our money will help. Get out from under the yolk of religion, learn the value of human life and for **** sake learn to use a johnny.

ScissorPaperRock

Simon Adebisi wrote: »

Africa needs to sort itself out first before any of our money will help. Get out from under the yolk of religion, learn the value of human life and for **** sake learn to use a johnny.

Not just that, its just as important that wealthier countries stop squeezing it for everything it's worth.

Slydice

Slydice wrote: »

We certainly don't look like we do...


It struck me when I saw that video last month that 30,000 children died in 3 months because of the Famine in Africa.

But since then, what the **** did we care? Nah **** it, we give a **** about our taxes... we care about our dole... we want our rent paid... and then the price of getting locked on booze?

I hadn't even noticed it before that video and haven't seen anything else happen about it on the news since.

The only thing on the wikipedia article is that Kenya invaded Somalia to save some western tourists. wow

Round of applause for us all and lets take a bow (Especialy you smart ass reply number 1).

Africa has been given something like 14 trillion in aid in the last 40 years from the west and have done nothing to benefit themselves with it.
Instead even with free condom distribution continue to have 4 plus kids that will all of course die of starvation or some other horrific way and allow cultural corruption to spread rife ensuring no money gets anywhere near the people unless westerners give out the aid themselves. Is it any wonder sympathy towards them is dwindling.

Im more concerned about the homeless guy in town tonight freezing then the Africans tbh. In fact considering the state of our country at the moment we should be giving Africa nothing. Why should we as a country be borrowing money we dont have to send to Africa while we have our own elderly people freezing to death in the winter because they cant afford heating.

Its obviously sad but they have proven again and again they will not help themselves despite the vast amounts of money they have been given as a region.

ScissorPaperRock

Estrella Proud Giant wrote: »

Africa has been given something like 14 trillion in aid in the last 40 years from the west and have done nothing to benefit themselves with it. Please show some evidence of this: I can show you evidence that suggests otherwise

Instead even with free condom distribution continue to have 4 plus kids. People don't have larger families because of a lack of contraception.

that will all of course die of starvation or some other horrific way, This is one reason why people have larger families

and allow cultural corruption to spread rife ensuring no money gets anywhere near the people unless westerners give out the aid themselves. We westerners are continuously implicit in not giving African countries the revenue they should get for their resources - that could be described as some sort of corruption - also it's not cultural, don't be foolish

People like you should educate yourself on the facts before spouting this kind of BS rhetoric..

PrincessLola

To quote my seventeen year old cousin: "why don't we just print lots of money to give to Africa?"




:pac:

Logical Fallacy

Simon Adebisi wrote: »

Slydice sounds like a 16 year old who has just looked up live aid on youtube and discovered something shocking.

It's the current trend to try and make everyone feel bad for being born in the first world.

I've spent two decades raising money for my chosen charity...I'm not going to feel bad because i can't help everyone. If i did i would never get out of bed.

ScissorPaperRoc

ScissorPaperRoc wrote: »

People like you should educate yourself on the facts before spouting this kind of BS rhetoric..

Maybe you should educate yourself and read one of the many books available on the subject. I recommend starting with the Dambisa Moyo book, dead aid.

As for the resources gag, go and tell that to the Chinese who are absolutely destrying the region. Tell the chinese to give the africans money and see what they say?
Or the rich arab nations etc etc, the west cannot borrow money to supply Africa with a continuous ****ing stream of aid, which is clearly doing nothing.

ScissorPaperRock

Estrella Proud Giant wrote: »

Maybe you should educate yourself and read one of the many books available on the subject. I recommend starting with the Dambisa Moyo book, dead aid.

As for the resources gag, go and tell that to the Chinese who are absolutely destrying the region. Tell the chinese to give the africans money and see what they say?
Or the rich arab nations etc etc, the west cannot borrow money to supply Africa with a continuous ****ing stream of aid, which is clearly doing nothing.

I've read Dead Aid. It makes some good points, but it's by no means a bible in terms of development literature.

I know that much of the extraction of resources in Africa is carried out as a result of demand from China. But where do you think the demand for Chinese products comes from? Remember, China's growth has been export-led. We, as consumers of the final products, are just as implicated in this injustice.

I'd imagine that the value of aid doesn't come near the value of revenue generated from African resources, very little of which remains in Africa.

Dudess

Simon Adebisi wrote: »

Slydice sounds like a 16 year old who has just looked up live aid on youtube and discovered something shocking.

Joshua whatever sounds like a 1st year psychology student mad to show off.

And have no doubt done far far less for charity than some people on this thread whom they berate.

couldntthink

OP get real. If you care that much about it, why don't you sacrifice the luxury items in your life, like internet, cell phone, laptop, etc and give the money saved to charity. I would say not even one per cent of people in the first world give much of a sh1t about the third world. If we did we would be making a lot more sacrifices. I also think that less than one per cent of third world leaders give a sh1t about their own people. And do you think that anyone in Africa would give two shiney sh1tes if we were hungry????? Wake up, and welcome to the real world.

yuppies

http://bigthink.com/ideas/24920

Poverty will be history by 2100.. Those sh.ithole african countries need to learn that if they want the living standards enjoyed by the west they need to make it happen themselves

We had a population disaster with the great famine but we changed our ways after that

yuppies

Also, I often wonder; do Germans, French, Americans, Spanish etc.. feel as guilty or concerned about the third world as we do in Ireland and the UK? I always imagine that they just don't care..

Vudgie

Slydice wrote: »

We certainly don't look like we do...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYZWZ6N-6tc

It struck me when I saw that video last month that 30,000 children died in 3 months because of the Famine in Africa.

But since then, what the **** did we care? Nah **** it, we give a **** about our taxes... we care about our dole... we want our rent paid... and then the price of getting locked on booze?

I hadn't even noticed it before that video and haven't seen anything else happen about it on the news since.

The only thing on the wikipedia article is that Kenya invaded Somalia to save some western tourists. wow

Round of applause for us all and lets take a bow (Especialy you smart ass reply number 1).

what rubbish, Irish people have historically given plenty of money and volunteers to these causes. You have also omitted all the work that you have done except for getting carried away watchin YouTube videos.

ScissorPaperRock

yuppies wrote: »

http://bigthink.com/ideas/24920

Those sh.ithole african countries need to learn that if they want the living standards enjoyed by the west they need to make it happen themselves

Why call them '****hole' countries? Have you ever visited any? From my experience of African countries, they are full of beautiful people and beautiful scenery.

As much as eradicating poverty will require enterprise within Africa, and for stable, transparent governance, it will also require us westerners to recognise our continuing roles in depriving African countries of the revenue they deserve for their resources.

Dudess

Yeah true. It's all very well to say they need to help themselves but how can they do that without guidance?

ScissorPaperRock

Dudess wrote: »

Yeah true. It's all very well to say they need to help themselves but how can they do that without guidance?

To be honest, I don't think guidance is really the issue. A "we know best attitude" from western organisations (e.g. IMF, World Bank, western Govs.) has been undermining domestic strategies within developing countries for centuries. Many people in this thread say that African countries need to help themselves, but in reality western institutions have been dictating how developing countries should achieve development for a long time, only to realise that their "suggestions" were generally not suitable, and often counter-productive.

What I meant is that we need to stop unfair trading practices that prevent African countries from capitalising on the revenue that can be generated from their resources.

Also, we, as consumers, should expect higher standards of companies that manufacture products using resources extracted in Africa.