Man bursts into flames - another shc?

maccored

http://www.businessinsider.com/gothenburg-man-station-fire-sweden-2011-11#ixzz1evi4CuuW

Apparently just started screaming and went on fire. could this be either a mad person who set himself on fire (though theres no mention of that) of a case of shc starting?

the man was standing outside a record store near the station at about 10:30pm. He began to scream and burst into flames.

Riamfada

I would assume that if someone was to burn themselves alive in a public place he would have given a reason before hand. Really strange case.

maccored

we'll just have to wait and see what he has to say for himself when he recovers. I would assume that if he had doused himself with fuel, someone would have noticed .... still - you'd never know

Riamfada

From what I have read dosnt SHC usually do massive damage to the internal organs rather than the exterior?

maccored

there have been cases of people going alight in the past - burning from the outside first rather than from the inside out. Its hard to say what happens in apparent shc cases as its so rare and disputed - plus of course, just because people go on fire for no reason doesnt necessarily means its shc (though technically they are human, and they do spontaneously combust, so I suppose theres not much else to call it).

maccored

he might have just ate a really really really hot curry and farted internally

Dave!

On the topic of SHC, saw this in the Irish Times the other day

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2011/1124/1224308051446.html

Spontaneous human combustion a 'myth'

STATE PATHOLOGIST Prof Marie Cassidy has described the idea of spontaneous human combustion as a “myth” enjoyed by fiction writers.

She was speaking at Dublin Coroner’s Court yesterday during the inquest into the death of Declan Dowling (59), Bulfin Gardens, Inchicore, who was found dead at his home on March 7th.

He died as a result of extensive burns and had a toxic level of alcohol in his bloodstream. His death had the appearance of spontaneous combustion.

Mr Dowling’s cousin Albert Reeves raised the alarm after becoming concerned that Mr Dowling had not called around to his house that morning to return money borrowed the previous Friday.

Garda Robert Fitzharris accompanied Mr Reeves to his cousin’s house and broke down the door.

He discovered Mr Dowling’s body in the back room of the house lying crouched on the floor. His fingertips and clothing were burnt, as was his stomach.

The area around him was undisturbed and there was no significant source of air to fuel a fire.

Prof Cassidy carried out the postmortem. She found burns on his head, stomach and thighs and found his abdomen had been breached.

Mr Dowling had inhaled no smoke, suggesting he was dead before the fire started. He had a high level of alcohol in his blood. Mr Dowling was a heavy smoker and Prof Cassidy said it was likely he had been unconscious when his clothing caught fire.

Prof Cassidy said his skin was then breached and liquefied fat had emerged, catching fire but burning very slowly at a low temperature, hence the localised fire and soot in the room. This is called atypical or sustained human combustion.

She described spontaneous combustion as a myth and a theory that has not been valid for 500 years.

Coroner Dr Brian Farrell returned a verdict of death by misadventure.

The issue of spontaneous human combustion hit the headlines earlier this year when west Galway coroner Dr Ciarán McLoughlin declared a 76-year-old pensioner had died as a result of the phenomenon.

Prof Cassidy said outside the court that spontaneous human combustion was a “misnomer”.

“It captures everybody’s imagination, this idea that somebody suddenly erupts into flame.

“The pattern is unusual in that the fire is localised to the body and the immediate surrounds because most fires that we deal with cause extensive damage to the fabric of the building, the body and everything else that is associated with it,” she continued.

“Because of that, this name tripped off the tongue. It goes back to Charles Dickens in Bleak House, where he describes a man dying with spontaneous combustion,” Prof Cassidy added.

Experiments using pig fat and skin had replicated the circumstances of so-called spontaneous combustion and confirmed a wick effect – where body fat burns very slowly at very low temperatures over a long period.

maccored

glad she has an opinion. the last sentence is bollocks though ...... the wick theory doesnt explain a lot of so called SHC deaths (no matter how many people think it does). And dickens only used it as a device to kill off a character - he didnt invent the idea

maccored

Mr Dowling had inhaled no smoke, suggesting he was dead before the fire started. He had a high level of alcohol in his blood. Mr Dowling was a heavy smoker and Prof Cassidy said it was likely he had been unconscious when his clothing caught fire.

thats a classic right there. he was dead before the fire started, but yet he was a smoker so Im assuming thats what she's claiming started the fire? Im amazed the fire service didnt cop that one. nevermind, it must have been a startling coincidence he dropped dead halfway through a cigarette.

Im not saying he didnt die completely naturally, but you have to agree she didnt actually come up with anything substantial other than an assumption. Its basically just her best guess - without anything to back it up.

We'll see what yer man has to say, since it happened outside. Im thinking he tried to commit suicide with petrol.

kylith

maccored wrote: »

but yet he was a smoker so Im assuming thats what she's claiming started the fire? Im amazed the fire service didnt cop that one.

Because the fire brigade are all qualified SoCOs? Because they receive training in conducting post mortems alongside their 'point hose here' training?

The fire brigade a wonderful, brave bunch of lads, but trained to detect cause of death they are not.

nevermind, it must have been a startling coincidence he dropped dead halfway through a cigarette.

It's a damn sight less unusual for a smoker with toxic levels of alcohol in his bloodstream to drop dead of a heart attack and drop a lit fag on his shirt than it is for a person to spontaneously burst into flames for no reason.

Im not saying he didnt die completely naturally, but you have to agree she didnt actually come up with anything substantial other than an assumption. Its basically just her best guess - without anything to back it up.

Her 'best guess' is a damn sight more reliable than internet codswalllop about SHC, in fairness. She 'came up with' a plausible scenario based on observation and experiment. What she didn't do was make the flawed statement that people don't just drop dead while smoking a cigarette, and reach the highly unlikely conclusion that he must have been engulfed by an exceptionally flammable fart.

We'll see what yer man has to say, since it happened outside. Im thinking he tried to commit suicide with petrol.

Self immolation is a plausible scenario here. Usually those who commit suicide in this way have a significant point to make, so I'm sure that more will be revealed as the investigation progresses.

maccored

unfortunately you havent added one iota to the whole thing. Fire staff arent trained to find sources of ignition eh? Yeah, of course not. because someone smokes then they burned themselves to death - wonderful work Sherlock. And one persons best guess is a damn sight better than internet 'codswallop' .... thats so insightful. though it isnt any better than internet codswallop in reality though.

Your last point was the only one that made any sense - but then again, you were just repeating what I'd already said.

kylith wrote: »

Because the fire brigade are all qualified SoCOs? Because they receive training in conducting post mortems alongside their 'point hose here' training?

The fire brigade a wonderful, brave bunch of lads, but trained to detect cause of death they are not.


It's a damn sight less unusual for a smoker with toxic levels of alcohol in his bloodstream to drop dead of a heart attack and drop a lit fag on his shirt than it is for a person to spontaneously burst into flames for no reason.



Her 'best guess' is a damn sight more reliable than internet codswalllop about SHC, in fairness. She 'came up with' a plausible scenario based on observation and experiment. What she didn't do was make the flawed statement that people don't just drop dead while smoking a cigarette, and reach the highly unlikely conclusion that he must have been engulfed by an exceptionally flammable fart.


Self immolation is a plausible scenario here. Usually those who commit suicide in this way have a significant point to make, so I'm sure that more will be revealed as the investigation progresses.