The Ultimate Survival Knife [Read Mod post #175]

Hibrion

Following on from the recent knife thread, I'm starting this one to see how many people are interested in helping design the 'ultimate survival knife'.

With enough support, we know this works. It was done on the hunting forum with the 'ultimate Irish hunting knife thread':
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055487267

This one was a real hit and I ended up buying one off Davy myself; so I can certainly say any knife emerging from our thread will be well built.

The first order of business is to see who is interested in this project. The plan is that at the end of the build the knife will be passed around to those interested to 'test out' and review.

It stands to reason that you must be over 18 to participate in the pass around. I think a minimum of 200 posts would be a good idea. We can have a max of 12 to keep it feasible. However, the more that participate in the build the better the knife will be.

Post your support in this thread if you are up for the project. For now, hold back on your suggestions for the knife as these will be done one by one and through a series of polls.

Mods: I hope this is ok with you guys?

davymoore

Interested in this thread, NOT partaking in the passaround

krissovo

Chalk me down

Doc Ruby

I'll be poncing around Paris with a big camera and a beret for the next while so I'm not sure how much of a contribution I can make, the pic and text in the last thread should do it.

I will say this though; a hunting knife, a camp knife, and a bush/survival knife are three different things. Even if some might not like larger knives for whatever reason, I wouldn't go near a small knife without a companion larger knife for bushcraft purposes.

Hibrion

Doc Ruby wrote: »

I'll be poncing around Paris with a big camera and a beret for the next while so I'm not sure how much of a contribution I can make, the pic and text in the last thread should do it.

I will say this though; a hunting knife, a camp knife, and a bush/survival knife are three different things. Even if some might not like larger knives for whatever reason, I wouldn't go near a small knife without a companion larger knife for bushcraft purposes.

Have a look at the thread whenever you can and vote on everything you can. This is not the type of thing that will happen quickly, so you will have plenty of time to contribute

krissovo

Doc Ruby wrote: »

I wouldn't go near a small knife without a companion larger knife for bushcraft purposes.

This is why I think we need a two in one for it to be called a "Ultimate", a main "big" knife and an additional smaller one incorporated into the sheath similar in principle to a kukri and Karda.

If I look at the basics of what I want in a survival knife:

Primary = Reliable - Must be strong and take punishment
Hold an edge - Must be able to hold an edge for example to complete butchering a animal or chop branches without continuous sharpening
Multi purpose - Without losing any of the primary goals
Drop point style blade

Basic Knife Tasks:

Shelter
Large knife - chopping 2" - 4" branches, stripping branches, hammer nails/pins (secondary task)
Small knife - cutting cord/rope/vines

Fire
Large Knife - chopping logs up to ~20", splitting, kindling
Small Knife - kindling

Food
Large knife - Skinning, Butchery, chopping veg, trap preparation/carving
Small knife - Skinning, filleting, preparing veg, intricate carving

Additional tasks:
Wire cutting
Breaking glass - Toughened
Digging
Carving

Its in no way a comprehensive list but they would be my activities.

Hibrion

Don't worry about specifics yet, lads. At the moment we are only gauging interest.

Questions on what we want to use it for will come next then more specifics on forma and function.
By working together, we might even learn how to use a knife more to our advantage in the field.

Grizzly 45

I'm there on this one.I like what Krisovo said too,that maybe this should be a big knife/little knife set??

PS both design and pass round.

waterfordham

Interested in the thread NOT in the pass-around.

ShadowFox

Very interested in a custom knife once cost and style has been sorted out

Odysseus

I would be interested in the pass around and will help in anyway I can.

Tigger

Very interested in this tbh

Hibrion

Ok guys, we are starting to get some interest int his project now. Before we decide any of the design factors (that includes size of knife, whether it will be one or two, or anything else like that), what are the MAIN jobs you expect out of a survival knife?

Lets not make this a debate yet. My ideas on what I would like will be very different to each of yours. For now, if we could just list OUR OWN preferences that would be great.

For me, my main concern is cutting ability. I want something that will be able to feather a stick, cut through natural and man made cordage and be able to carry out the basic carving duties one needs to make key elements of kit while in the wilderness: pot hangers, basic camp cutlery, stakes, etc. and the option for it to be used to split branches and very small logs for fire wood if needed.

The ability to strike a fire steel is something I see as essential as strikers can be easily lost.

Hammering duties do not concern me too much as there are alternatives in nature that can be used easily.

ShadowFox

Hibrion wrote: »

Ok guys, we are starting to get some interest int his project now. Before we decide any of the design factors (that includes size of knife, whether it will be one or two, or anything else like that), what are the MAIN jobs you expect out of a survival knife?

Lets not make this a debate yet. My ideas on what I would like will be very different to each of yours. For now, if we could just list OUR OWN preferences that would be great.

For me, my main concern is cutting ability. I want something that will be able to feather a stick, cut through natural and man made cordage and be able to carry out the basic carving duties one needs to make key elements of kit while in the wilderness: pot hangers, basic camp cutlery, stakes, etc. and the option for it to be used to split branches and very small logs for fire wood if needed.

The ability to strike a fire steel is something I see as essential as strikers can be easily lost.

Hammering duties do not concern me too much as there are alternatives in nature that can be used easily.

Really id be the same as yourself once it holds a good edge around 4 to 5" blade

Grizzly 45

For me it is going have to be an all round tool designed for extreme conditions.That means being able to do some chopping,[even to the point of having to be possibly able to punch thru a car door or roof ]
Also it will have to be somthing that is easily maintained ,easily sharpned steel,and also tough enough to be used if need be as a prying impliment.As well as being able to be able to gut and butcher game from a moose downwards.
So I am looking at a single piece construction.Grip material,could also be for me paracord or micrata.Est a 8to 9in blade MAX .Over that they become impractical IMO.
Its quite an order in a single blade.:eek:

Tigger

Strength is the number one for me once it's really strong and can hold a blade it's half way there.

If brute force isn't working you're not using enough

Hibrion

So far we all want something sharp enough to cut anything you will come across, easy to keep sharp and re-sharpen and strong enough to be used to pry stuff, ale to strike a firesteel and comfortable enough for basic carving.

Great, keep it coming.

Anyone else have anything to add?

ShadowFox

Hibrion wrote: »

So far we all want something sharp enough to cut anything you will come across, easy to keep sharp and re-sharpen and strong enough to be used to pry stuff, ale to strike a firesteel and comfortable enough for basic carving.

Great, keep it coming.

Anyone else have anything to add?

I agree with Grizzly on the handle paracord is nice or a handle that can be removed so it can be changed to paracord if you wish

Tigger

Hibrion wrote: »

So far we all want something sharp enough to cut anything you will come across, easy to keep sharp and re-sharpen and strong enough to be used to pry stuff, ale to strike a firesteel and comfortable enough for basic carving.

Great, keep it coming.

Anyone else have anything to add?

I disagree with the other methods of hammering I want a squared off pommel than I can hammer with if I want.
Basically I want a " if I could Only have one thing" answer

Hibrion

Don't worry about specific design elements yet, guys. We will get to those eventually. For now, all we need to know is what tasks you would want to use such a knife for.

If you want to see how all the features of the knife will be decided have a look at the "ultimate irish hunting knife" thread. I will be following the same steps as Davy, more or less.

Hibrion

Ok. To keep everyone happy I've put up the first of the polls that will shape the knife.

This is also a good way to see who is genuinely interested in the thread. If we don't have enough people voting on the poll, I'll call it a day and we can put the project to rest. there's no sense in wasting Davy's time.

Tigger

Well fixed blade is a no brainer it's a survival tool not an edc
I

Hibrion

Tigger wrote: »

Well fixed blade is a no brainer it's a survival tool not an edc
I

I'd like to think so too, but we will keep everything democratic and vote on all aspects of the build that we can. That way no one can complain

ShadowFox

Hibrion wrote: »

I'd like to think so too, but we will keep everything democratic and vote on all aspects of the build that we can. That way no one can complain

Well so far I agree with you Hibrion even if this doesnt go ahead I think ill be contacting you to ask Davy to make one for me either way

krissovo

Hibrion wrote: »

So far we all want something sharp enough to cut anything you will come across, easy to keep sharp and re-sharpen and strong enough to be used to pry stuff, ale to strike a firesteel and comfortable enough for basic carving.

Great, keep it coming.

Anyone else have anything to add?

Hammer & Chop

Hibrion

So far, as I expected, fullt tang is winning. But we had to ask the first question democratically :cool:

Now, I have been thinking. Based on our other threads and what has been said here, it seems that most of us like to use a small to medium knife and either a large camp knife, machete, parang or axe of some sort.

So my suggestion is this: why don't we focus on designing the knife, or the smaller of the two knives for those of you in the two knife category? I think we can only design one knife at a time effectively, and if it's a case that some people do want a small/ big combo, our design could be scaled up and modified accordingly.

This is just a thought I had. But what do YOU guys think?

Odysseus

What about the sheath for the knife, leather or cordura [sp]? For me I would be interested in one that can be hung upside down on a backpack strap or similar. This would mean the blade it would need to be secured within the sheath, so would a strap across the handle do or would it be secured another way.

I seen some of the more tactical knifes with a reversible clip which allow it to be attached upright or the opposite way. Some of these have something within the sheath which tightens or loosens the blade, so that it can take different levels of strength to release the knife. I hope that makes sense, I’m finding it difficult to describe.

Anyway I post some thoughts on the blade itself later; I just thought I would mention the sheath for now or is it too soon for that?

Hibrion

It's never to soon to think about any aspect of the build, but it's best to keep the thread on topic with the current step.

For now, all I need people to think about is:

What tasks they will use the knife for and,

If they want a fixed or folding knife

Tigger

Odysseus wrote: »

What about the sheath for the knife, leather or cordura [sp]? For me I would be interested in one that can be hung upside down on a backpack strap or similar. This would mean the blade it would need to be secured within the sheath, so would a strap across the handle do or would it be secured another way.

I seen some of the more tactical knifes with a reversible clip which allow it to be attached upright or the opposite way. Some of these have something within the sheath which tightens or loosens the blade, so that it can take different levels of strength to release the knife. I hope that makes sense, I’m finding it difficult to describe.

Anyway I post some thoughts on the blade itself later; I just thought I would mention the sheath for now or is it too soon for that?

not leather for me but the knife itself should have 2 or 3 lanyard holes to make sure its never lost and so it can be fixed to a pole as a spear axe or hammer as needed

Hibrion

So what about food processing? I'd like something that can easily process small to large game and chop veggies etc. I think this is a simple requirement and any small knife with a straight edge and a good point is enough to process up to and including deer in Ireland.

I worked for nearly ten years as a butcher, so I find these tasks very easy. What do you guys think?

krissovo

Personally my requirements for a small knife are quite limited and its for basic cutting, skinning, carving/whittling. I would like a simple knife that gives me close control. A straightback or a slight clip point 3" blade, nice thumb ramp with no guard on the bolster.

It does not need much engineering IMO.