Mods need to step up in Politics Forum

Nodin

gandalf wrote: »

Apologies if I offended but I thought you were mature enough to handle a few barbs. I will sugercoat my comments for your ears in future
.

This isn't the time or place for it. Elsewhere, feel free.

gandalf wrote: »

Asking for a separate private forum not as you asserted earlier asking to replace Politics with a "private members club"..

That or wanting a standard set by two-three vocal members rather amounts to the same thing as far as I'm concerned.

gandalf wrote: »

Never asked for 100% but the moderators attempting to work in a co-ordinated fashion would be a nice start.

As far as I'm aware they do. They dodn't do as you would, however, or as others would, which seems to be a good deal of the complaint.

Permabear

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nesf

Permabear wrote: »

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Such threads have always been problematic. It just used to be communist threads not libertarians, you guys only appeared a few years back.

I think we have to distinguish between attack threads set up to attack an ideology, those are going to be dirty whatever we do and threads set up to debate an aspect of an ideology, these I'd be far more willing to intervene in and warn in. The Objectivism thread is a good example of the latter.

Permabear

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nesf

Permabear wrote: »

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Attack threads are awkward precisely because they involve ideologies and most people aren't particularly reasonable or rational when it comes to an opposing ideology. It's rare enough to find a poster that can be respectful when debating against something they think is, well, idiocy. I think you expect too much if you think we can turn them into reasoned debates but what we definitely can do is get rid of the muppets that get personal in them.

Permabear

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nesf

Permabear wrote: »

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Sure but I don't expect such a warning to work and don't expect anything else than a future thread lock for trench warfare and the thread going around in circles. The exact same as Republican threads.

Permabear

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nesf

Permabear wrote: »

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We've tried that in the past with Republican threads and it didn't work. We were sure it would etc.

Permabear

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coffee_cake

people are sometimes ok on republican/any threads once i post and tell them to stop acting up
after that, it's warnings and infractions for not heeding mod warning on thread
works ok

nesf

Permabear wrote: »

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It worked fine with the regulars. We just kept getting new people joining in who didn't know the groundrules and the cycle of learning began again. It was annoying.

Nodin

Permabear wrote: »

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No, I think not.

Permabear wrote:

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http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=75834235&postcount=39

Permabear

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Sully

Perfect solution. Ban all talk from the Sinn Fein/ULA type of folk.

I kid, I kid!

P. Breathnach

Sully wrote: »

Perfect solution. Ban all talk from the Sinn Fein/ULA type of folk. ...

No. Move them to their own sub-forum. And create sub-forums for libertarians, for pro-Palestinians, for pro-Israelis, for anti-FF people, for unrelenting economic pessimists, for those who think David McWilliams is the fount of all wisdom, and for various other categories. Keep those forums pure - anybody who dissents from the forum's orthodoxy should be banned.

Dr Galen

nesf wrote: »

It worked fine with the regulars. We just kept getting new people joining in who didn't know the groundrules and the cycle of learning began again. It was annoying.

I think this is a very real issue, and one without an easy solution. It's certainly not the whole issue that people are giving feedback about here, but it does count for quite a lot.

It's also an issue that wouldn't have existed as much anyway back in the day, as there wasn't anywhere near the amount of site-wide posters or people interested in Politics.

nesf

Dr Galen wrote: »

It's also an issue that wouldn't have existed as much anyway back in the day, as there wasn't anywhere near the amount of site-wide posters or people interested in Politics.

Exactly.

RichieC

Permabear wrote: »

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The prince of rationality speaks. He who Posts Ayn Rand topics in a political theory forum. One who thinks people who don't agree with your objectivist and down right extremist ideology must surely just not understand it.

If you're going to debate bringing down western civilisation in favour of your corporate led tyranny you're going to inevitably face harsh critics. if it's not me or someone else in the forums it will be someone new who comes along.

Adiós. Enjoy the purity.

nesf

RichieC wrote: »

The prince of rationality speaks. He who Posts Ayn Rand topics in a political theory forum. One who thinks people who don't agree with your objectivist and down right extremist ideology must surely just not understand it.

If you're going to debate bringing down western civilisation in favour of your corporate led tyranny you're going to inevitably face harsh critics. if it's not me or someone else in the forums it will be someone new who comes along.

Adiós. Enjoy the purity.

And this kind of ad hominem crap that fails to attack the argument is exactly what I'd like to eradicate from the forum.

Bannasidhe

nesf wrote: »

And this kind of ad hominem crap that fails to attack the argument is exactly what I'd like to eradicate from the forum.

Personally I'd like to see crap like this dealt with -posted today in Irish Economy:

crumbs from table is for lazy, sometimes it make sense to suck up to the powerful in order to learn how to become powerful yourself
Left wing ideology now become religion for losers, who want to have an excuse for own laziness

How is that contributing to a debate? To my way of thinking is nothing but a lazy tirade against a particular political ideology. Yet - the post is still there.

I have noticed that some of those who have advocated tighter enforcement of the forum charter are also those who have, in the past, resorted to simply dismissing counter-arguments because they perceive the poster as 'left-wing' -to those people I say a bit of practising what you preach would not go amiss.

RichieC

look at these infractions, both handed out by libertarian moderators:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=75964519&postcount=75

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=75966245&postcount=78

unbelievable.

coffee_cake

RichieC wrote: »

look at these infractions, both handed out by libertarian moderators:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=75964519&postcount=75

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=75966245&postcount=78

unbelievable.

They were handed out by me because you were personally warned (by a non-libertarian mod) to stop derailing the thread and to cut out the nonsense.
Twice.
If you have a problem then we can PM or take it to DRP.

nesf

RichieC wrote: »

look at these infractions, both handed out by libertarian moderators:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=75964519&postcount=75

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=75966245&postcount=78

unbelievable.

Take it to DRP and the warning came from me that's why you were infracted and if you pay attention on the forum you'll notice I don't agree with libertarians at all on most issues.

nesf

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Personally I'd like to see crap like this dealt with -posted today in Irish Economy:



How is that contributing to a debate? To my way of thinking is nothing but a lazy tirade against a particular political ideology. Yet - the post is still there.

I have noticed that some of those who have advocated tighter enforcement of the forum charter are also those who have, in the past, resorted to simply dismissing counter-arguments because they perceive the poster as 'left-wing' -to those people I say a bit of practising what you preach would not go amiss.

Report it and it'll be dealt with, I've little patience for it from either side on the debate. I've not had much of a chance to mod today.

nesf

Actually, let me make a point: If you're not reporting the posts you lose all right in my eyes to bitch about the moderation not being strict enough. The forums are busy enough that things will be missed unless they are reported, we rely on users to report problems that they see.

MungBean

nesf wrote: »

Actually, let me make a point: If you're not reporting the posts you lose all right in my eyes to bitch about the moderation not being strict enough. The forums are busy enough that things will be missed unless they are reported, we rely on users to report problems that they see.

This brings us back to not knowing whats acceptable though. I often see things that I think should be dealt with but on past experience those posts are not actionable. So I dont know if I'm reporting something that breaches the charter/how the mods see the charter or unnecessarily bothering the mods by reporting something I have a personal issue with. So rather than keep reporting stuff the mods see no issue with I tend to just walk away.

What Bannasidhe quoted is a common occurrence from both sides of the left/right debate and I have reported similar things before with no action taken so I really dont think a "if you dont report it you have no right to bitch" style response to that is appropriate. Its all part of the one issue I think and just as people become more and more likely to post these things so too do people become less likely to report them.

nesf

MungBean wrote: »

This brings us back to not knowing whats acceptable though. I often see things that I think should be dealt with but on past experience those posts are not actionable. So I dont know if I'm reporting something that breaches the charter/how the mods see the charter or unnecessarily bothering the mods by reporting something I have a personal issue with. So rather than keep reporting stuff the mods see no issue with I tend to just walk away.

What Bannasidhe quoted is a common occurrence from both sides od the left/right debate and I have reported similar things before with no action taken so I really dont think a "if you dont report it you have no right to bitch" style response to that is appropriate. Its all part of the one issue I think and just as people become more and more likely to post these things so too do people become less likely report them.

Report them, if you're continuously reporting stuff that isn't actionable you'll be told so.

coffee_cake

You're not bothering us, really. If in doubt, report it. The worst that'll happen is that we don't action it. Ok don't spam the place, but do report

Bannasidhe

nesf wrote: »

Actually, let me make a point: If you're not reporting the posts you lose all right in my eyes to bitch about the moderation not being strict enough. The forums are busy enough that things will be missed unless they are reported, we rely on users to report problems that they see.

I did no bitching I just pointed out the type of posts that add nothing to debates plus commented that I, personally, have been on the receiving end of 'oh, that's just left-wing crap' by some here who are bitching about how the charter is not enforced.

Perhaps those who are actually bitching should ensure they, themselves, stick to the rules before complaining about the MODS.

TBH I gave up reporting as it seemed a pointless king Cnut against the tide activity.

- Just saw what Mungbean posted - my views exactly.