oil man trespassing

Biggins

Birdie086 wrote: »

lodge a complaint and subtract the amount of the damage done to the fence from the bill

Yep, and if they mention they are going sure for the full amount, you state your case that under "Trespass ad Initio" and subsequently the Criminal Damage Act 1991 (that it is a crime to damage, destroy, deface, dismantle, render unrepairable or subsequently unfit for use, prevent or impair any property) you can seriously counter-sue their asses off for a much bigger amount, not just for the repair of the item itself but in also punitive damages.

You can be sure the bosses will sit up and listen if their asses is in trouble!

all i can say is thanks for all your help and advice alot of people seem to understand what im saying i just wanted oil not a broken fence and possilbe lawsuit

Biggins

tnynll wrote: »

all i can say is thanks for all your help and advice alot of people seem to understand what im saying i just wanted oil not a broken fence and possilbe lawsuit

It is a shame.
If we brought a car into a garage for a service and it came out with a few dents, I'm sure many would be equally upset.
We expect to get what we ask and pay for, a decent service.
There are others out there that are willing to provide that "legal duty of care" towards their customers - this oil company legal agents (their truck workers) don't seem to be living up to an acceptable standard of even normal care.

JMSE

slates? on a fence? get outta here :D:D

Ok you have to get into the mind of a GOOD truck driver here, hes not your average office worker or bus driver. He/she doesnt have defined hours and is uber-flexible in the hours of the day that he will spend at work that day. He won't ring the boss every time he has a problem, like a puncture, a flat battery, a barking dog, a locked gate, a boiler that needs bleeding. He wont ring the customer every time he finds he has time to get the goods to them earlier than they expected (what driver does, you'd expect them to be happy about it). Hes the most flexible and adaptable worker you will ever meet, he is used to people ordering late and probably presumed you did too and that you were empty.

Trespassing? get outta that garden!!!!! I'll have a tenner that the oil company's t&c's state that an order can be executed anytime and without notice.

JMSE

Biggins wrote: »

It is a shame. We expect to get what we ask and pay for, a decent service.

What a load! Customer got great service, lawsuits not required, just a few slates will knock the oilman back about 5euro

Wheres the pics of this slatted fence?

Biggins

JMSE wrote: »

slates? on a fence? get outta here :D:D

Ok you have to get into the mind of a GOOD truck driver here, hes not your average office worker or bus driver. He/she doesnt have defined hours and is uber-flexible in the hours of the day that he will spend at work that day. He won't ring the boss every time he has a problem, like a puncture, a flat battery, a barking dog, a locked gate, a boiler that needs bleeding. He wont ring the customer every time he finds he has time to get the goods to them earlier than they expected (what driver does, you'd expect them to be happy about it). Hes the most flexible and adaptable worker you will ever meet, he is used to people ordering late and probably presumed you did too and that you were empty.

Trespassing? get outta that garden!!!!! I'll have a tenner that the oil company's t&c's state that an order can be executed anytime and without notice.

The customer is not responsible about how the workers conditions are. If the worker has a problem with them, its their job to raise them.
Not every single customer.

Also again, unless the purchaser has legally by express permission PREVIOUSLY that their property could be entered, later T&C supplied as they sign something, does not invalidate and/or allow for any damage done.
Show one T&C contract that says you must accept any damage done in the course of supplying oil.

Biggins

JMSE wrote: »

What a load! Customer got great service, lawsuits not required, just a few slates will knock the oilman back about 5euro

Wheres the pics of this slatted fence?

Great service? Damage to property! Kop-on!

rainbowtrout

The OP still hasn't proved it was the oil man..

I'd be more concerned about the compensation culture being bandied about here, that lawsuits and criminal acts are being quoted, when if it was indeed the oil man that broke the fence, that he did it most likely by accident, and not intentionally, and this is something that the OP could probably sort out by phoning the company instead of ranting about it online.

I also suspect that to get the majority of their orders completed on a day to day basis that a lot of oil men have to climb fences and jump walls because home owners aren't home etc. If they spent their day ringing every customer that wasn't home, and sat outside their house waiting because they said 'I'll be there in 5 minutes' and arrive an hour later, that very few deliveries would actually get to their destination, and there would be a whole other rant on here about 'oil men who never deliver, despite the oil being ordered days ago'.

staker

JMSE wrote: »

I'll have a tenner that the oil company's t&c's state that an order can be executed anytime and without notice.

I wouldn't imagine there's anything signedby the customer,just a telephone order.
OP you need to contact the oil company regarding the fence Any reputable business should cover the costs of repair if indeed they caused the damage.
Did they ask you for a daytime contact number ?

Biggins

rainbowtrout wrote: »

The OP still hasn't proved it was the oil man..

I'd be more concerned about the compensation culture being bandied about here, that lawsuits and criminal acts are being quoted, when if it was indeed the oil man that broke the fence, that he did it most likely by accident, and not intentionally, and this is something that the OP could probably sort out by phoning the company instead of ranting about it online.

I also suspect that to get the majority of their orders completed on a day to day basis that a lot of oil men have to climb fences and jump walls because home owners aren't home etc. If they spent their day ringing every customer that wasn't home, and sat outside their house waiting because they said 'I'll be there in 5 minutes' and arrive an hour later, that very few deliveries would actually get to their destination, and there would be a whole other rant on here about 'oil men who never deliver, despite the oil being ordered days ago'.

I already stated the OP would have a major problem proving it was the oil man.
However if neighbours can state no one else was in the area at the time it happened, their case is strengthened.

The OP is concerned about the damage done. Lets be real, so would the rest of us if something we own was damaged by people.

Its the job of the worker to do their job right (Its what they are earning a wage for?), not the job of every customer to hope that they do so!
...But sadly they must because of fools causing damage in the course of their daily work.

Biggins

staker wrote: »

I wouldn't imagine there's anything signedby the customer,just a telephone order.
OP you need to contact the oil company regarding the fence Any reputable business should cover the costs of repair if indeed they caused the damage.
Did they ask you for a daytime contact number ?

Thats the route I would advocate.

gigino

rainbowtrout wrote: »

I'd be more concerned about the compensation culture being bandied about here, that lawsuits and criminal acts are being quoted, when if it was indeed the oil man that broke the fence, that he did it most likely by accident, and not intentionally, .

+1. The fence must have been dodgy to begin with if it got broken that easily. It could have been kids kicking a football, or rotten wood eventually breaking due to gravity / the wind. Be thankful you got the oil. In 5 or ten years you may give an arm + a leg to get oil from the far side of the world.

Tayla

rainbowtrout wrote: »

The OP still hasn't proved it was the oil man..

He doesn't have to prove it to us, why do boardsies always insist on proof for everything? Can we not all just for us take the word of the person who is telling the story?

rainbowtrout wrote: »

I'd be more concerned about the compensation culture being bandied about here, that lawsuits and criminal acts are being quoted, when if it was indeed the oil man that broke the fence, that he did it most likely by accident, and not intentionally, and this is something that the OP could probably sort out by phoning the company instead of ranting about it online.

He's not ranting and it's always helpful to learn your rights before you ring customer service.

Biggins

gigino wrote: »

+1. The fence must have been dodgy to begin with if it got broken that easily. It could have been kids kicking a football, or rotten wood eventually breaking due to gravity / the wind. Be thankful you got the oil. In 5 or ten years you may give an arm + a leg to get oil from the far side of the world.

Have you ANY idea how heavy those oil hoses are?
They are extremely heavy and thats when not even filled with passing thru oil.
Imagine the weight of a full keg and more, pressing down upon a maybe wooden fence!
At its main fulcrum point of force upon a fence, damage can be done very easily.

cruiser178

Tread reminded me of this haha http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBHI2IxMh-I

Fix the fence yourself op and stop your whingin

JMSE

cruiser178 wrote: »

Fix the fence yourself op and stop your whingin

Yeah stop your whingin and get the hammer out and fix the slates or whatever they were. Maybe Biggins could add the hammering to your expenses and settle on the steps, or go bigtime and get a barrister, or just turn the boiler on and bring the dog in and tell one-another about your day being hard done by

gigino

some poor feckers lost 2 or 3 limbs in the middle east so you can have ( relatively) cheap oil.
next time the op should be asked to stay at home and hold the hose if there is no easy way for the oil man to fill the tank.

if ye had a letterbox at the very bottom of your door and a dodgy flap on it, would you sue the postman if you returned home one day + it was broken ?

Dionysus

tnynll wrote: »

hello lads and lady's i want to ask a question to all the fellow boards members its a long one so bare with me i ordered oil yesterday from a company <who shall remain nameless> and they advised that they will deliver it on Monday anyway today i come home from work with an invoice in my door and my oil tank full.now my back gate was locked and my dog was in my garden so its clear they jumped my fence to put oil in and now a couple of things i want to know

are they legally allowed to come onto my property when im not there?

would i have been liable if said oil man got bitten by my dog ??

and finally what will i do since the f@@ker who put my oil in broke my bloody fence??? i haven't paid yet and i feel like i shouldn't until i get some answers and a new fence

off-topic: OK, to take this on a totally different angle: how did you get oil delivered to you before the budget? We rang eight different firms last week and they said they could not deliver until late next week as there was a slew of people ordering oil before budget day.

on-topic: Talk to them about the fence. It shouldn't be a problem. I wouldn't worry about the "trespassing" stuff other than that damage. It seems petty when the person was there to provide a requested service to you. Are you going to act similarly to anybody who "trespasses" on your land - do door-to-door sellers, newspaper delivery people, take away people and so on have to call you from outside your gate?

Biggins

gigino wrote: »

...if ye had a letterbox at the very bottom of your door and a dodgy flap on it, would you sue the postman if you returned home one day + it was broken ?

Where did the OP say/allude to that their fence was previously damaged/faulty, even partially?

Biggins

Dionysus wrote: »

Talk to them about the fence. It shouldn't be a problem. I wouldn't worry about the "trespassing" stuff other than that damage. It seems petty when the person was there to provide a requested service to you. Are you going to act similarly to anybody who "trespasses" on your land - do door-to-door sellers, newspaper delivery people, take away people and so on have to call you from outside your gate?

Very right in what you say.
We can only hope though that those also calling might have a bit of respect also for us using their business and in return leave our property the way they found it.
Is it too much to ask for these days?

caesar

I have to say I’m sitting on the fence with this one :pac:

Anyway, I can understand that they need to get deliveries done and all that but they probably should have a better system in place. The weight of the hose probably did damage the fence but what kind of condition was it in to begin with? OP you have to be honest with yourself on this one.

I also think the truck driver should have called, to my mind it would be in his own interest. It would be an expensive mistake if he had filled the wrong tank.

As for fence, I don’t think you should get cash compensation. I think they should cover the cost of the repair if they did in fact damage it. That way you will in actually fix it and not just take the money as compensation for compensations sake. I don't mean to suggest that's what you would, just making a point.

Also, if oil delivery companies do this often, why don't they ask if they can deliver even if no one is at home, it could save them hassle in the long run. This kind of thing could easily be avoided.

Einhard

salonfire wrote: »

It's people like the OP that make working in customer service the most degrading, demoralising job known to man.

Hold on a moment, that's a bit unfair. The OP arranged a time for the oil to be delivered. The oil company unilaterally decided that some other time would suit them better (ie serving themselves, not the customer), decided to hop over the OP's fence to deliver the oil, and broke the fence in the process. I don't think it's unreasonable that the OP be somewhat annoyed at the turn of events. And customer service? As far as I can see, the only motive the oil people had for what they did was making things easier on themselves.

eqwjewoiujqorj

if I have this right, if someone is delivering something to you, they can enter your property?

does this only apply to outside your property or can they enter your house as well?


if I'm relaxing in my garden and an oilman comes onto my property by mistake, that's ok?

ps
was this the oilman?
http://i.imgur.com/RV8Mf.jpg

stoneill

What was the dog doing when all this oil filling/fence breaking shenanigans was going on?

stoeger

JMSE wrote: »

slates? on a fence? get outta here :D:D

Ok you have to get into the mind of a GOOD truck driver here, hes not your average office worker or bus driver. He/she doesnt have defined hours and is uber-flexible in the hours of the day that he will spend at work that day. He won't ring the boss every time he has a problem, like a puncture, a flat battery, a barking dog, a locked gate, a boiler that needs bleeding. He wont ring the customer every time he finds he has time to get the goods to them earlier than they expected (what driver does, you'd expect them to be happy about it). Hes the most flexible and adaptable worker you will ever meet, he is used to people ordering late and probably presumed you did too and that you were empty.

Trespassing? get outta that garden!!!!! I'll have a tenner that the oil company's t&c's state that an order can be executed anytime and without notice.

+1

michael999999

stoneill wrote: »

What was the dog doing when all this oil filling/fence breaking shenanigans was going on?

He was waiting for Tesco to deliver!

foodie66

salonfire wrote: »

It's people like the OP that make working in customer service the most degrading, demoralising job known to man.

That's not fair, she has a right to be pissed if her fence is damaged FFS

Biggins

stoeger wrote: »

+1

-1

Tayla

gigino wrote: »

some poor feckers lost 2 or 3 limbs in the middle east so you can have ( relatively) cheap oil.

Ffs, that has nothing at all to do with it! Someone ordered a service, they got the service and he got a broken fence along with it but of course that's fine

kippy

I think the best thing to do here is to:
1. Wait and see what happens when the OP calls the oil company and advises them of the situation. Give them a chance to respond. Steps from that point will depend on their response.

2. Advise the OP how to negate the potential issues with his dog if this were to happen in future. I believe signage isn't necessarily a defence.

Kimia

I am absolutely shocked to find so many people sticking up for the truck driver and oil company. And people are actually making impassioned pleas to 'think of the poor guy who drilled for oil and how they lost their legs' (WTF :rolleyes:) and I loved the insightful look into the truck drivers mind and how he's saint like in his devotion to his job (every single truck driver in the world acts like this apparently).

FFS. The truck driver broke in at a time that he decided (not the customer) would be convenient to him, and broke the guy's property! Not to mention if he got attacked by the dog. Can you imagine if the dog had to be put down because the truck driver was trespassing? I mean, all they had to do is call the OP and tell them they were going to be in the area earlier than planned.

So you would all be cool with a UPC guy breaking into your house to install your TV while you're at work because he happened to be in the area? Come on out of it.

Kimia

kippy wrote: »

I think the best thing to do here is to:
1. Wait and see what happens when the OP calls the oil company and advises them of the situation. Give them a chance to respond. Steps from that point will depend on their response.

2. Advise the OP how to negate the potential issues with his dog if this were to happen in future. I believe signage isn't necessarily a defence.

A defence against people breaking into your back garden and trespassing on your property? Ridiculous.

hondasam

tnynll wrote: »

hello lads and lady's i want to ask a question to all the fellow boards members its a long one so bare with me i ordered oil yesterday from a company <who shall remain nameless> and they advised that they will deliver it on Monday anyway today i come home from work with an invoice in my door and my oil tank full.now my back gate was locked and my dog was in my garden so its clear they jumped my fence to put oil in and now a couple of things i want to know

are they legally allowed to come onto my property when im not there?

would i have been liable if said oil man got bitten by my dog ??

and finally what will i do since the f@@ker who put my oil in broke my bloody fence??? i haven't paid yet and i feel like i shouldn't until i get some answers and a new fence

It was good of them to deliver the oil early. You have no proof it was the oilman who broke the fence.
I cannot see the oil company accepting any liability tbh.
Do you always leave your dog out when you are not at home?

I order form the same company all the time, it's an understood thing if we are not here he still delivers the oil.

Tayla

Kimia wrote: »

So you would all be cool with a UPC guy breaking into your house to install your TV while you're at work because he happened to be in the area? Come on out of it.

Apparently they would, even if they broke the tv while they were at it!

hondasam wrote: »

Do you always leave your dog out when you are not at home?

Loads of people leave their dogs outside secured by walls or fences.

Biggins

kippy wrote: »

...I believe signage isn't necessarily a defence.

Its not.
The legal defences in Irish law to trespass is:
1. Consent.
2. Action of a third party (example: someone pushing you in)
3. Justification by law.
4. Re-entry.
5. Necessity (for pure emergency reasons)

ejmaztec

Ask Makikomi, he'll sort out defence.

ballsymchugh

ejmaztec wrote: »

Ask Makikomi, he'll sort out defence.

/
thread.

Biggins

Kimia wrote: »

I am absolutely shocked to find so many people sticking up for the truck driver and oil company. And people are actually making impassioned pleas to 'think of the poor guy who drilled for oil and how they lost their legs' (WTF :rolleyes:) and I loved the insightful look into the truck drivers mind and how he's saint like in his devotion to his job (every single truck driver in the world acts like this apparently).

FFS. The truck driver broke in at a time that he decided (not the customer) would be convenient to him, and broke the guy's property! Not to mention if he got attacked by the dog. Can you imagine if the dog had to be put down because the truck driver was trespassing? I mean, all they had to do is call the OP and tell them they were going to be in the area earlier than planned.

So you would all be cool with a UPC guy breaking into your house to install your TV while you're at work because he happened to be in the area? Come on out of it.

Exactly.

...Or while you drop you car off to be worked on, dents are put in it?

...Maybe bring your child to the dentist to get them cleaned and they get a punctured jaw from one of their pick tools while doing the work requested?

...Or a window cleaner while doing his work, actually fractures a large pane of expensive glass?

...Aaa but thats all different of course! As long as the job is done!

No - its not.
Your pay good money to someone to do a job.
Your paying for a good service, as in this case they turn up at the time pre-arranged by the OP and they come and go without doing damage to property and possible other subsequent problems.

You know if we started earlier to stand up for ourselves more with the smaller things like this, the bigger things like what some bankers have seemingly got away with so far, might have occurred less - for they might have been called out on it also!

hondasam

Tayla wrote: »

Loads of people leave their dogs outside secured by walls or fences.

I'm sure they do but I don't. They could be stolen and I would always be afraid they might get out.

bmcc10

Ohhh ffs a broken fence talking about lawsuits..get over it a bloody FENCE if thats all you have got to worry about you are 1 lucky person..Can,t stand people like this heard similar last week with a tiny oil spill complining for it to be cleaned..Sickens me!!

Kimia

Biggins wrote: »

You know if we started earlier to stand up for ourselves more with the smaller things like this, the bigger things like what some bankers have seemingly got away with so far, might have occurred less - for they might have been called out on it also!

I was going to say something similar myself. Irish people for the most part never stand up for themselves and have a 'Sure it's grand' mentality - I think that comes out of a sense of extreme social phobia and not wanting to ruffle feathers. It's a national aversion to cage-rattling because it shines the light on the cage rattler and we can't have that now can we!

It reminds me of that National Lampoon movie where the english guy gets knocks down and they break his leg and he's all 'No problem here - I'm fine'. HE HAS A BROKEN LEG PEOPLE.

Kimia

bmcc10 wrote: »

Ohhh ffs a broken fence talking about lawsuits..get over it a bloody FENCE if thats all you have got to worry about you are 1 lucky person..Can,t stand people like this heard similar last week with a tiny oil spill complining for it to be cleaned..Sickens me!!

OH and here we go again! You also like to say 'You're lucky to have a job' don't you?

In fact, I think people like you who are get so riled up whenever anyone complains about anything (legitimately) actually feel repressed about stuff that you can't complain about because of your own fears and insecurities. So when you see someone else with the balls to complain you feel irrational rage and jealousy.

Biggins

bmcc10 wrote: »

Ohhh ffs a broken fence talking about lawsuits..get over it a bloody FENCE if thats all you have got to worry about you are 1 lucky person..Can,t stand people like this heard similar last week with a tiny oil spill complining for it to be cleaned..Sickens me!!

The OP won't be suing anyone. Its still nice to know how they stand instead of as some fools would have, just accepting crappy service for their money.

O' and I'm sure if you slipped on an oil spill and broke something, when you get out of hospital, you might be coaxed to see a solicitor for damages!
You mightn't need any coaxing at all!

bmcc10

Kimia wrote: »

OH and here we go again! You also like to say 'You're lucky to have a job' don't you?

No couldn,t care less about jobs or what not it,s a fence ffs..sicken ya

ballsymchugh

ejmaztec wrote: »

Ask Makikomi, he'll sort out defence.

it's a damn shame that posts like this aren't noticed!

Kimia

bmcc10 wrote: »

No couldn,t care less about jobs or what not it,s a fence ffs..sicken ya

See above. What an overreaction to someone having a legitimate complaint. :rolleyes:

Biggins

bmcc10 wrote: »

No couldn,t care less about jobs or what not it,s a fence ffs..sicken ya

The point about doing a job right and leaving a place the way you have found it, has gone right over your head hasn't it?
...Or are you intentionally deaf/blind to that part?

Again, is it too much to expect that when one returns home, your property is left in the same condition as it was when you left?

ballsymchugh

Biggins wrote: »

The point about doing a job right and leaving a place the way you have found it, has gone right over your head hasn't it?
...Or are you intentionally deaf/blind to that part?

Again, is it too much to expect that when one returns home, your property is left in the same condition as it was when you left?

nobody can prove who broke the fence. it's all circumstantial.

Tayla

hondasam wrote: »

I'm sure they do but I don't. They could be stolen and I would always be afraid they might get out.

The OP could have a huge dog that's chained up or something for all we know, doesn't really matter, his original post suggested he would have moved it when the oilman came and yet he didn't know the oilman would come today so he couldn't move it for safety reasons.

bmcc10 wrote: »

Ohhh ffs a broken fence talking about lawsuits..get over it a bloody FENCE if thats all you have got to worry about you are 1 lucky person..Can,t stand people like this heard similar last week with a tiny oil spill complining for it to be cleaned..Sickens me!!

Hold on a minute, a lot of the time when people are trying to have their rights adhered to, they have no choice but to threaten legal action, it doesn't mean that they ever will do that!

I could have had 2 claims in the last 5 years, one left me with scarring and the other involved a mortifying incident where I was chased across the road by someone who accused me of robbing clothes by sticking them up my jumper and the lady screaming at me in the road to lift up my top when I was in fact 7 months pregnant! I didn't bother to claim for either of them.

Have I threatened legal action to get companies to act in accordance with my rights as a consumer, of course I have! Sometimes it's the only way to get them to stick to them!

Biggins

ballsymchugh wrote: »

nobody can prove who broke the fence. it's all circumstantial.

It is at this stage.
Now if it was something more serious like an actual break-in, questions I'm sure would be asked as to who only was in the area at the time? Witnesses, process of elimination, etc...

As its a fence, if the OP is lucky, the best they can hope for is a reduction in their oil bill as part compo.

...And OP, I would suggest you take pics of the damage done.