Non payment of motor tax fine

oh_nos

I recently got a summons for not paying a fine for not having current tax back in april. I genuinely couldn't afford to pay it at the time. Can someone who was in a similar situation tell me what to expect as I have never been in court before and I'm brickin' it. Also is it required/recommended that I get a solicitor? Thanks for the help

Ms Minnie Mouse

I've been there. You'll be fine. Main thing is just make sure you turn up (if you don't, things can get much messier and you could end up having to enlist the help of a professional)! Explain to the judge the reason for non-payment, apologise humbly and they will reissue the fine (sadly at the higher amount) and make sure you pay this time.

There is no substitute for expert advice, however, if you're confident enough to go along, treat the court with the respect it commands and be courteous to the judge whilst apologising, you can't go far wrong.

I would add, I'm not a lawyer so this isn't professional/legal advice, merely my experience - if in doubt, do check with a professional.

oh_nos

Ms Minnie Mouse wrote: »

I've been there. You'll be fine. Main thing is just make sure you turn up (if you don't, things can get much messier and you could end up having to enlist the help of a professional)! Explain to the judge the reason for non-payment, apologise humbly and they will reissue the fine (sadly at the higher amount) and make sure you pay this time.

There is no substitute for expert advice, however, if you're confident enough to go along, treat the court with the respect it commands and be courteous to the judge whilst apologising, you can't go far wrong.

I would add, I'm not a lawyer so this isn't professional/legal advice, merely my experience - if in doubt, do check with a professional.

Thanks for the fast reply Minnie. Thats taken a load of my shoulders

Ms Minnie Mouse

You're welcome. Any more questions, feel free to PM me...

Zambia

Could I ask a wider question?What happens if one just ignores all traffic fines and does not pay them?

seamus

Zambia wrote: »

Could I ask a wider question?What happens if one just ignores all traffic fines and does not pay them?

You will eventually face a court-ordered fine, which if you refuse to pay it, will result in a prison sentence.

patwicklow

Zambia wrote: »

Could I ask a wider question?What happens if one just ignores all traffic fines and does not pay them?

Jail

Ms Minnie Mouse

Zambia wrote: »

Could I ask a wider question?What happens if one just ignores all traffic fines and does not pay them?

You'll end up with a knock on the door from people with metal wrist restraints and a warrant for your arrest, from what I understand. From experience (court error processing an appeal result but still, same result).

Hasten to add, didn't get as far as arrest as knew the local AGS from domestic issues but yes, had I not paid my fine, this would have been the result.

Guy:Incognito

Did you since back tax it at least as far as and including the month you were stopped? They tend to take a dim view if you dont.

gustafo

seamus wrote: »

You will eventually face a court-ordered fine, which if you refuse to pay it, will result in a prison sentence.

ya a prison sentence for a few hours, then given money for a train/bus ticket home.

Our man in Havana

gustafo wrote: »

ya a prison sentence for a few hours, then given money for a train/bus ticket home.

So true.

Ms Minnie Mouse

But even then, you still have to pay the fine!

Our man in Havana

Ms Minnie Mouse wrote: »

But even then, you still have to pay the fine!

No you don't!

gustafo

Ms Minnie Mouse wrote: »

But even then, you still have to pay the fine!

i don't know about that, my mate had a 400 euro fine that he didn't pay he got a phone call from the cops to say that they will be calling for him in the morning to take him to cork prison, 2 cops called brought him up, he was in a holding cell for 5 hours they gave him a dinner then they gave him 20 euro for a train/bus ticket and he was left go,

He never had to pay the fine after.

Zambia

I meant who comes for you? What sort of warrant are you arrested on?

Our man in Havana

Zambia wrote: »

I meant who comes for you? What sort of warrant are you arrested on?

A fines warrant.

Ms Minnie Mouse

@ Our man in Havana - Bloomin' heck, I missed a trick there, didn't I!

Bloody 'do the right thing' gene gets me every time!

Our man in Havana

Ms Minnie Mouse wrote: »

@ Our man in Havana - Bloomin' heck, I missed a trick there, didn't I!

Bloody 'do the right thing' gene gets me every time!

It's a fine or jail in default not both.

coylemj

The judge issues a fine with a set time to pay or in default a term of imprisonment. A local Garda who deals with warrants will knock on your door to collect the fine - or you can arrange to meet him to pay at a location convenient to you both. At the expiration of the time, the Garda can come to your house and take you to the local prison (named on the warrant).

FWIW you can actually pay at any stage before you go through the gates of the prison, even after the time expires but you can't be hauled off to prison until the time expires.

Zambia

So the process is

Garda/body issues ticket post/personal on (A)
(A) Ignores ticket
(A) Receives Summons
(A) Ignores summons
(A) Convicted in absence sentenced to a term of imprisonment and warrant to imprison (with time limit )issued?
(A) Local Garda gets warrant and tries to collect payment, executes warrant to imprison if payment not collected and time elapsed.
(A) Transported straight to prison or a Garda station to be transported?

source

Zambia wrote: »

So the process is

Garda/body issues ticket post/personal on (A)
(A) Ignores ticket
(A) Receives Summons
(A) Ignores summons
(A) Convicted in absence sentenced to a term of imprisonment and warrant to imprison (with time limit )issued?
(A) Local Garda gets warrant and tries to collect payment, executes warrant to imprison if payment not collected and time elapsed.
(A) Transported straight to prison or a Garda station to be transported?

Not quite, when A fails to turn up for court and is convicted in his absence, the sentence is a fine or x days in lieu. (Say €350 with 3 months to pay or 2 days in lieu)

If the person fails to pay the fine a penal warrant is issued and the person is brought to prison to serve their 2 days. Depending on when they are arrested they may be brought straight to the prison, but usually brought to Garda station first to do paperwork before being brought to the prison.

Usually due to overcrowding they spend a few hours in jail and are released.

If however the person is picked up on a Saturday night, they'll more than likely spend Saturday and Sunday night in the Garda station waiting for the jail to take them.

ontheditch2

Its simply a case of when you arrive at the prison, the prison is usually packed. There are dangerous criminals/paedophiles/general menaces to society waiting for a place. They are going to bump them to the front of the que and you get to go home that evening.
Still, i personally would pay the fine, its just the way i am. But i can understand why people would take the jail time. €2k or "a week" in jail, then i would probably chance "the week" in jail

Zambia

So

Garda/body issues ticket post/personal on (A)
(A) Ignores ticket
(A) Receives Summons
(A) Ignores summons
(A) Convicted in absence sentenced to a fine in lieu term of imprisonment.
(A) Local Garda gets notice and tries to collect payment,
(A) Does not pay the fine in time allowed.
(A) Warrant becomes active.
(A) Local Garda executes warrant to imprison as payment not collected and time elapsed.
(A) Transported straight to a Garda station to be transported to a jail.

source

Zambia wrote: »

So

Garda/body issues ticket post/personal on (A)
(A) Ignores ticket
(A) Receives Summons
(A) Ignores summons
(A) Convicted in absence sentenced to a fine in lieu term of imprisonment.
(A) Local Garda gets notice and tries to collect payment,
(A) Does not pay the fine in time allowed.
(A) Warrant becomes active.
(A) Local Garda executes warrant to imprison as payment not collected and time elapsed.
(A) Transported straight to a Garda station to be transported to a jail.

Spot on.

Edit: just to clarify that (A) will be given ample time to pay original fine, (A) will get the fine and has 28 days to make payment, if the fine isn't paid after the 28 days (A) gets another fine notice informing him the fine has increased and he has another 28 days to make that payment. Then the summons for court is issued.

Corruptable

Just to note, this has no impact on civil commital orders for debt or liquidated money demands. You can be committed, and the debt is still owed when you come out.

So, the above only applies to criminal fines I believe.

Our man in Havana

Correct.

Corruptable

Our man in Havana wrote: »

Correct.

Indeed, didn't want anyone reading the thread to get the idea that their debts disappear once they've served a committal order.

I'd say it would "suck" to have done the maximum three months committal thinking that was it and then only find the roller coaster starting all over again

Zambia

So the process is used for civil debt as well?

Corruptable

Zambia wrote: »

So the process is used for civil debt as well?

Sometimes, in a rare number of cases where the debtor is completely unwilling to cooperate.

If the person fails to live up to an installment order (i.e.: to pay €X per week/month to service the debt), the plaintiff can seek a committal order , on foot of a committal summons to the District Court, and if the Judge is willing to grant committal, it's lodged with a warrant in the District Court office and it will then be passed to AGS who have six months to arrest the debtor or explain why it was not possible to do so (e.g.: person skipped country, gone into hiding, etc.)

Maximum is three months, as mentioned. It's usually just thrown around as a scare tactic nowadays, as it's unlikely that it would ever go that far, but it happens. The logic is that it's not about the debt, it's the defendant disobeying a court order hence why the debt still remains after release.

dilly069

how much is the fine after uv been summons to court?how much does it increase by?

source

dilly069 wrote: »

how much is the fine after uv been summons to court?how much does it increase by?

Down to the judge.

dilly069

how much can it go upta?