General Star Trek thread

odyssey06

Rawr wrote: »

There is this particular knack of US television in the 80's and 90's to depict Ireland and the Irish as backward superstitious drunkards who exist mostly in this bizarre 19th Century mode. Mrs. Rawr once showed me an episode of Murder She Wrote just to see how i'd react. I'm sure she enjoyed my animated disbelief while Jessica arrived in at rural castle (by steam train, naturally) to declare that a murder victim had met an unlucky fate...or as she put it "The Luck of the Irish"...because you know...that's what you say in those situations.

Even more bizarre is that Angela Lansbury lived in Cork and has Irish citizenship but that episode "Murder in Cork" was filmed on a studio lot in the US...

There is a definite late 19th century view of rural Ireland.
Scotland gets some of the same treatment.

It's not a Trek thing, but TNG as a scifi show should really have tried to rise above it. But I think over long seasons of 26 episodes sometimes they resorted to the tropes like the Oirish episode, the Italian comedian cameo episode, the noir homage\parody episode, the twin episode, the clip show episode etc

Kate Mulgrew worked in Ireland in Ryan's Hope, in 1970s Blarney, yet Fairhaven still went ahead
(Hell the woman basically lived here during the OITNB off time)

Evade

Was Fair Haven supposed to be an accurate representation or was it Tom's fantasy Ireland?

odyssey06

Deleted User wrote: »

Kate Mulgrew worked in Ireland in Ryan's Hope, in 1970s Blarney, yet Fairhaven still went ahead
(Hell the woman basically lived here during the OITNB off time)

*cough danced Oirish jig on Conan O'Brien cough*

She was also here filming medieval romance Lovespell in 1981:

Evade

Evade wrote: »

Was Fair Haven supposed to be an accurate representation or was it Tom's fantasy Ireland?

Either it was meant to be a real representation, in which csae the writers were at fault


Or it was meant to be Tom's view of Ireland which was, again, the writers fault...

Evade

Deleted User wrote: »

Either it was meant to be a real representation, in which csae the writers were at fault


Or it was meant to be Tom's view of Ireland which was, again, the writers fault...

That's not what I meant. It's either supposed to be accurate, or it's intentionally made to be a fantastical version for the crew to have fun in. I always assumed the latter because a 19th century village anywhere is probably pretty boring most of the time.

pixelburp

I get why they do it, and from the audience's point of view it makes sense, but Trek's characters' obsession with 19th/20th century culture kinda strikes as weird when taken from a certain angle. Like, not just as a general enthusiasm for the period - there are plenty of dramas on TV ATM set 400+ years ago - but more the veneration Trek has for 20th century cultural figures.

Makes the Federation look like it's cultural, artistically inert - where nothing new is being produced, kinda feeding into this idea of the Utopia as a bit moribund. Where are the new artists, actors, writers etc? The odd reference to Klingon opera but that always struck more as an in-joke

pixelburp

pixelburp wrote: »

I get why they do it, and from the audience's point of view it makes sense, but Trek's characters' obsession with 19th/20th century culture kinda strikes as weird when taken from a certain angle. Like, not just as a general enthusiasm for the period - there are plenty of dramas on TV ATM set 400+ years ago - but more the veneration Trek has for 20th century cultural figures.

Makes the Federation look like it's cultural, artistically inert - where nothing new is being produced, kinda feeding into this idea of the Utopia as a bit moribund. Where are the new artists, actors, writers etc? The odd reference to Klingon opera but that always struck more as an in-joke

Well the 1990s on to 2063 are **** shows. Eugenic wars and WWIII sandwich a period of resource scarcity, and I imagine that records are not great, from that period.

Nothing from then on is a massive hole, alright

Justin Credible Darts

odyssey06 wrote: »

*cough danced Oirish jig on Conan O'Brien cough*

She was also here filming medieval romance Lovespell in 1981:

Oddly enough only yesterday an article appeared online about Kate Mulgrew saying if Trump won the next election she would move to Ireland

odyssey06

To continue the Trek Oirishness angle... I remembered that the original draft for DS9 If Wishes were Horses had a leprechaun opposite OBrien.
Took pushback from Colm Meaney to change the fairytale character to Rumpelstiltskin.

AMKC

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

Oddly enough only yesterday an article appeared online about Kate Mulgrew saying if Trump won the next election she would move to Ireland

She is welcome here too unlike the orange Buffoon who hopefully will not be where he currently is now in 9 months time.

Spon Farmer

pixelburp wrote: »

I get why they do it, and from the audience's point of view it makes sense, but Trek's characters' obsession with 19th/20th century culture kinda strikes as weird when taken from a certain angle. Like, not just as a general enthusiasm for the period - there are plenty of dramas on TV ATM set 400+ years ago - but more the veneration Trek has for 20th century cultural figures.

Makes the Federation look like it's cultural, artistically inert - where nothing new is being produced, kinda feeding into this idea of the Utopia as a bit moribund. Where are the new artists, actors, writers etc? The odd reference to Klingon opera but that always struck more as an in-joke

All the potential new artists, writers, etc. joined Starfleet instead hoping to achieve greatness that way but ended up cleaning the Jefferies tubes while Kirk, Picard and friends became legends. :P

Jake Sisko becomes an author.

Spon Farmer

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

Oddly enough only yesterday an article appeared online about Kate Mulgrew saying if Trump won the next election she would move to Ireland

I see. So she'd only move here if things were bad at home? But wouldn't be arse moving here just because it would be a nice place to live?

Spon Farmer

AMKC wrote: »

She is welcome here too unlike the orange Buffoon who hopefully will not be where he currently is now in 9 months time.

What does it matter to you who the President of America is?

Spon Farmer

Spon Farmer wrote: »

What does it matter to you who the President of America is?

It matters to us all. Destroying a huge chunk of industry in this country is very high up his agenda.

Justin Credible Darts

Spon Farmer wrote: »

What does it matter to you who the President of America is?

Seriously ?


There are countless reasons why it could matter

Spon Farmer

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

It matters to us all. Destroying a huge chunk of industry in this country is very high up his agenda.

Doesn’t matter to “us all”. Makes no difference in my life and don’t know of any impact (negative or positive) any American President has had on anyone I know.

I was only asking if Trump’s policies actually affect or have the potential to actually affect your life or whether you were just moaning.

Spon Farmer

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

Seriously ?


There are countless reasons why it could matter

Yes I am being serious and what is wrong with asking?

The reasons are NOT “countless”. Don’t be melodramatic.

pixelburp

As much as I despise Trump, and believe his actions have ripple effects outside the US, let's move away from it? Backseat moderation perhaps, but this is the General Trek thread not politics.

Spon Farmer

pixelburp wrote: »

As much as I despise Trump, and believe his actions have ripple effects outside the US, let's move away from it? Backseat moderation perhaps, but this is the General Trek thread not politics.

Quite right. (Although “despise”? Oaf he may be but he hasn’t done anything to you personally. )

I shouldn’t have posted on it. The important thing in all that is Anson Mount is getting a Pike series.

Who it!!! :

nyarlothothep

pixelburp wrote: »

As much as I despise Trump, and believe his actions have ripple effects outside the US, let's move away from it? Backseat moderation perhaps, but this is the General Trek thread not politics.

Yes, but can you imagine how weirdly accurate DS9 was about 2020 regarding the riots/poverty in the US?

AMKC

nyarlothothep wrote: »

Yes, but can you imagine how weirdly accurate DS9 was about 2020 regarding the riots/poverty in the US?

Now we just need the prediction about a United Ireland to come true soon but can't see it in the next five years. Maybe after that. I think Data meant to say 2031 not 2021.

AMKC

AMKC wrote: »

Now we just need the prediction about a United Ireland to come true soon but can't see it in the next five years. Maybe after that. I think Data meant to say 2031 not 2021.

Records are scrappy, from that time period, obviously

Justin Credible Darts

anyone think we will ever see a trek show go 7 seasons again, like TNG, DS9 and Voyager did ?
Those shows not only went 7 seasons but went somrthing like 26 episodes a season as well.

Enterprise was cut as soon as it started to get really good after 4 seasons.
Discovery is a mere 15 episode season
There certainly is not 7 series in Picard, the one was poor enough.

pixelburp

Depends. 7 seasons is rare enough these days in general, outside of a few standouts. That speaks to how flooded with content TV is more than anything. Picard is unlikely to run 7 years because, well, poor Stewart is getting on and he'd be in his late 80s by the time season 7 ended.

The 22 episode season is kinda redundant nowadays, so in other sense you can keep a story going for 7 seasons if there's fewer episodes to fill. Discovery could hit 7 seasons.

Justin Credible Darts

Law and Order, SVU run 20 odd episode seasons.
Blacklist usually has over 22 episodes a season and that is in its 7th season

There are some shows that still do it, and I accept its less common these days, but sadly it seems the main reason is stupid tv reps axing shows if they dont get the viewers they want.

For example if a show usually got a million viewers, and then it dropped to 800k, the pressure is on and in some cases the show is axed, because of the loss of 200k viewers.
As if the 200k that left were more important than the 800k that remained.
Personally I think more shows should be given the chance to grow.
Go back and look at the reviews the original star trek got of so called "professional critics"

Variety for example predicted that it "won't work", calling it "an incredible and dreary mess of confusion and complexities".

it has 8 tv shows, a ninth on the way for sure, and 13 movies, etc....shows what the critics know

pixelburp

Looping back to Voyager and the tried &, true subject of "<Rick Berman sucks", in a recent podcast Bryan Fuller said that the original intention for "Year of Hell" in Voyager was it to be a full season arc. Berman however was intent on making Voyager TNG II, clashing over the idea of serialised stories, with DS9 being a particular sore point for Berman.

https://trekmovie.com/2020/05/29/bryan-fuller-describes-star-trek-voyager-serialized-year-of-hell-season-rejected-by-rick-berman/

TheValeyard

pixelburp wrote: »

Looping back to Voyager and the tried &, true subject of "<Rick Berman sucks", in a recent podcast Bryan Fuller said that the original intention for "Year of Hell" in Voyager was it to be a full season arc. Berman however was intent on making Voyager TNG II, clashing over the idea of serialised stories, with DS9 being a particular sore point for Berman.

https://trekmovie.com/2020/05/29/bryan-fuller-describes-star-trek-voyager-serialized-year-of-hell-season-rejected-by-rick-berman/

Year of hell as a season would have been brilliant once they didn't time wipe the end.

Evade

TheValeyard wrote: »

Year of hell as a season would have been brilliant once they didn't time wipe the end.

And it could have given them the chance to make a certain ensign less bland if for some reason the Year of Hell version got sent to the reset timeline.

Been going through series 4 of Enterprise for the first time in years over the past couple of days. Has to be up there with the best Star Trek I’ve seen.