General Star Trek thread

Indricotherium

Indricotherium wrote: »

Indeed.

It's one of ST's quirks that characters always have olde timey hobbies isn't it.

O'Brien and Bashir's Alamo model, Picard's ancient books, LaForge's ships in bottles, Riker's Womanising and jazz, even Sisko's baseball.

How come none of them have any niche interest in things that were invented between 1990 and the 24th century?

You mean like the holodeck, phaser range, ambu jistu (spelling)

degrassinoel

and space tennis, don't forget space tennis! Domjot, Dabbo, Move along home!

Sorry, resistance was futile

Cookie_Monster

battle chess, parise squares, space ship racing (Paris), tong

degrassinoel

Tongo, yeah i forgot about that one, Quark used to have his own tongo wheel until Dax won it in a bet too

Did he get it back?

Beefy78

I thought most of those 'old-time' passions were fair enough. They really stretched it with Tom Paris and his love of 50s American Sci-Fi though.

helimachoptor

watched a few more VOY eps over the last few days

first couple of encounters with the Maalon, I'd forgotten how awesome the floating planet of water episode was.

couple of **** ones in there though, the smart missing and the thing stuck to Torres are poor for me

crazyderk

Since its that time of year :D:D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oiSn2JuDQSc

Indricotherium

Just watching season 1 of stargate atlantis for the first time this week.

One of my first impressions from episode 1-4 is that they've handled the whole "families and children " thing way better than than st ever had.

They go for all the same lazy characters like the stubborn local and the n'er do well brat with a heart of gold that syfi shows usually have but it seems to just work.

_Kaiser_

Indricotherium wrote: »

Just watching season 1 of stargate atlantis for the first time this week.

One of my first impressions from episode 1-4 is that they've handled the whole "families and children " thing way better than than st ever had.

They go for all the same lazy characters like the stubborn local and the n'er do well brat with a heart of gold that syfi shows usually have but it seems to just work.

Atlantis seems to be the ENT/VOY of the Stargate world but I have to say I really enjoyed it. The crossovers with SG1 (something Trek rarely did) help ground it in its own universe (no pun intended!) I think and McKay is just brilliant.

Spoilers ahead.. lots of stuff from later seasons!

In later seasons, it may have been a bit too much like VOY with new kick-ass warships, being able to jump from the Milky Way to Pegasus in a few weeks (bit like how VOY had regular contact with the Alpha Quadrant by the end), and an enemy that almost becomes domesticated (Wraith/Borg) but it retained the humour from SG1 which was key I think.

Some great episodes as well - like when McKay becomes even more of a genius, the "Civilization" one where they discover the game they've been playing is reality on a real world, the one where McKay finally gets the girl/doctor (lucky fecker ).. yep, Rodney was the real star alright

degrassinoel

I seen an episode of that with "Trip" in it from enterprise too

SarahBM

I have to jump to Voyager's defence, it wasnt THAT bad!
I loved atlantis but it all ended too quickly which is a real shame!
Were there many trek crossovers? I remember in the Caretaker Voyager was setting out from Deep Space 9, but other than that, I dont really remember any. A few guest stars and cameos but never a full blown crossover.
I am of course open to correction

Goodshape

SarahBM wrote: »

Were there many trek crossovers? I remember in the Caretaker Voyager was setting out from Deep Space 9

There were a handful of them. First episode of TNG, DS9 and Voyager each had cameos from the preceding show (McCoy, Picard, and Quark, respectively).

Spock had a TNG two parter. Scotty was in an episode too.

TNG's Birthright part one coincided with DS9's pilot, with Enterprise docked at the station and Bashier featuring heavily enough. I guess these two episodes are the best example of 'crossover', as opposed to just cameos.

Barkley was in a few Voyager episodes.

Probably forgetting a couple. Not sure.

_Kaiser_

degrassinoel wrote: »

I seen an episode of that with "Trip" in it from enterprise too

Yea, he plays a recurring/one of the main villains in the later seasons

SarahBM

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Yea, he plays a recurring/one of the main villains in the later seasons

Great story arch! Rodney McKay has to be one of my favourite characters in syfy. I thought Carter was great in it too. I was so disappointed with the way they ended. Left the door wide open for another season that never came

helimachoptor

SarahBM wrote: »

I have to jump to Voyager's defence, it wasnt THAT bad!
I loved atlantis but it all ended too quickly which is a real shame!
Were there many trek crossovers? I remember in the Caretaker Voyager was setting out from Deep Space 9, but other than that, I dont really remember any. A few guest stars and cameos but never a full blown crossover.
I am of course open to correction

DS9's first Ep had Picard in it,
Riker (Thomas) was in it
Obviously the Chief and Worf

Voyager had Geordi, Barclay

Q was in 3 series

Obviously a few chaps from TOS appeared in various series

Indricotherium

Will Riker appeared in an episode of Voyager, summoned by Q as a witness at Q's trial.

Counsellor Troi also appeared in a number of episodes. As did Dr. Lewis Zimmerman, who had previously appeared on DS9

Riker and Troi appeared in ENT as well, in the finale

Kirby

We need more Trek. We haven't had anything but the reboot movies in years. Don't get me wrong, I like the new movies. They are good movies but they aren't classic trek.

We need a new tv show. I'm hoping that Axanar does mega numbers and is successful. It might prove to the studio that the audience is ready for more. I mean, this is star trek. There will be a new show eventually. The franchise is too big for there not to be.

But sooner rather than later would be good. We are nearly a decade since Enterprise.

nyarlothothep

We need a few more years though, otherwise it will be 'dark' and 'cynical', I could do without another show like that. Rewatching TNG, it feel so quaint, almost 19th century compared to what's on nowadays but it's very subtly good also, it's evident in the dialogue. Also does Riker appear to be an ass to his subordinates? Kahless also appeared to be much shorter than everyone and not very inspiring with his endless stories, Gowron on the other hand appeared to be much more of a leader.

Myrddin

nyarlothothep wrote: »

We need a few more years though

I agree. While the new movies were good in that bland Hollywood way, I personally feel they missed a trick by using the reboot premise. It could only ever have gone so far before outstaying its welcome, & was never going to lead to a direct tv show with those actors.

I don't know what form a new tv show could take to be successful. The Roddenberry universe was fleshed out to the point that recycling plots was common place. The reboot universe? I don't know, it has no real substance & in the space of two movies we're already beaming people across whole quadrants, I don't think it makes for a good long term setting which a tv show can sustain.

'Continues' has shown a significant raising of the bar with regard fan fiction, & Axanar looks set to follow. But Continues is a continuation, it could never be a full on network driven show really could it? Axanar too won't set the basis for a new show, because of prequelitus (we know the ending before knowing the beginning).

Whats left? A future show? I don't think that could really work for very long either given we already know about Starfleet getting temporal abilities & the temporal timeline etc. Whatever follows, it needs to be something new, something different, & something that raises the bar. All things that Trek has lacked for a long, long time. I don't think we're anywhere near having a successful return of Trek to tv.

Kiith

I'd say we'll be waiting 10 or so years before another Trek series is made. We'll get the 3rd reboot film, and that'll be the last i'd say. And i've no idea what style it will take to be honest, though i'd expect another reboot or reimagining.

nyarlothothep wrote: »

Kahless also appeared to be much shorter than everyone and not very inspiring with his endless stories, Gowron on the other hand appeared to be much more of a leader.

Gowron was brilliant in TNG and DS9. Pretty menacing in a crazy kind of way at first, and actually seemed to be a pretty good leader (up until the end of DS9). Loved his freaky eyes when he talked.

"We do not forgive :eek: or forget!!"

Indricotherium

Myrddin wrote: »

Whats left? A future show? I don't think that could really work for very long either given we already know about Starfleet getting temporal abilities & the temporal timeline etc.

Personally, I feel that all that temporal cold war should be retconned out.

It is what done for Enterprise. That and that god awful delphic expanse.

Enterprise should have been wall to wall Klingon and romulan wars.

We already knew they got into bed with each other by the TOS time, so having an emerging Federation drive the two empires to that was the storyline that was there for the writing.

Enterprise was such a missed opportunity. Once all that expanse crap starts, I honestly can't even watch it.

Indricotherium

Indricotherium wrote: »

Personally, I feel that all that temporal cold war should be retconned out.

It is what done for Enterprise. That and that god awful delphic expanse.

Enterprise should have been wall to wall Klingon and romulan wars.

We already knew they got into bed with each other by the TOS time, so having an emerging Federation drive the two empires to that was the storyline that was there for the writing.

Enterprise was such a missed opportunity. Once all that expanse crap starts, I honestly can't even watch it.

I'd sooner watch "a fistfull of Tuvix's"

Indricotherium

Indricotherium wrote: »

Personally, I feel that all that temporal cold war should be retconned out.

It is what done for Enterprise. That and that god awful delphic expanse.

Enterprise should have been wall to wall Klingon and romulan wars.

We already knew they got into bed with each other by the TOS time, so having an emerging Federation drive the two empires to that was the storyline that was there for the writing.

Enterprise was such a missed opportunity. Once all that expanse crap starts, I honestly can't even watch it.

Remember it was an Earth/Romulan war, not Fed/Romulan


The Expanse is actually good when watched in one run and it was really just to show how Earth recognised it's weakness alone and needed an alliance formed.

AFAIK the following seasons were going to be the breaking of that Alliance leaving Earth facing the Romulan's pretty much alone, with a final rejoining of the conflict by the others (forming the Federation)

Goodshape

I've been reading bits and pieces that Paramount want Nu Trek 3 to be more like Guardians of the Galaxy.

Not sure about the rest of you, and I know Guardians was popular, but to me that just shows the level of contempt that they have for this franchise and the characters, stories and worlds within it. They have no interest in fostering that universe (as if that weren't clear already). They're looking at Disney/Marvel and Warner/DC and the comic book cash-cows and they want the same. Big wham-bam IMAX "event" movies, with good looking heros and lots of toys.

Guardians of the Galaxy was an awful, dumb, lowest common denominator, "sci-fi" movie. If that's where they want to push Star Trek then I'm just about ready to say **** 'em at this stage. I'm excited about Axanar and always looking forward to new Star Trek Continues episodes but it looks like this franchise is all washed up otherwise. It's just a wannabe meal ticket for some Paramount execs.

Guardians was a Fantasy movie based in a Super Hero universe. It has nothing to apologise for in that regard (or much esle)

degrassinoel

I like GotG, it's not star trek and it never will be, nor should it imo.

Goodshape

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Guardians was a Fantasy movie based in a Super Hero universe. It has nothing to apologise for in that regard (or much esle)

That's grand if that's what you're after. I didn't enjoy it but each to their own. It's certainly not science fiction in the same vain as Star Trek was, and the thought that they're looking at it as inspiration for the next Trek film is... Disappointing.

But that's just it; it's not Sci-fiction, hell it's not even Science Fantasy like Star Wars. It's pure fantasy comic book fun, it's unfair to compare it to hard SciFi.

If you went to Guardians expecting serious SciFi no wonder you were disappointed.

Goodshape

I didn't really mean to start a discussion on the merits of GotG as a film in it's own right, but I think we're in agreement that it isn't the right tone for Star Trek?

My issue is that the people behind the Trek franchise are looking to GotG as a template for future films and if that's the way they're going, I'm just not interested.

nyarlothothep

ST has the ultimate sandbox universe for space opera in terms of tv, you could literally do anything with it except go into sci-fantasy or fantasy. But that's not really a problem imo. In fact it can run parallel to sci-fantasy if you take the Greco-Roman influence on TOS into account. The TNG-verse was in existence for so long that it naturally ended up recycling ideas, if you include ENT in that universe in terms of style and set up then it ran for 18 years.

I think a new universe would have to be set in the future to avoid the boredom of the prequel format, and it should have an entirely different set of conditions but should still stay faithful to the spirit of trek. So maybe the Federation has fallen, you could draw upon an Isaac Asimov Foundation kind of environment where there still exists an organisation trying to bring peace and civilisation to the galaxy, except the galaxy is seriously fcked up in this time period and it's a lot more dangerous. And there could be a major mystery/quest element, like our heroes need to discover/find out something that will restore the galaxy or save it from itself and it could be like Interstellar in this sense, which I thought did a really good job of establishing an atmosphere of exploring the unknown. They could be venturing into some anomaly or landing on a planet except it wouldn't be a generic anomaly of the week, it would actually matter, it would be grandiose, immense and a bit scary. This kind of idea was also at work in TMP with the Voyager probe and this is what Trek needs to get back, a sense of the unknown. Not only that but interesting characters that aren't generic or safe who change over time. And a new universe with links to the past but essentially different to explore new ideas. I think that mystery, amazing characerisation and performances and a quest element make for really good stories with a definate emphasis on mystery. And yeah, all that time travel malarkey as mentioned could definitely be jettisoned. It was so bs and reflected everything arseways about trek by that time.