General Star Trek thread

Myrddin

crazyderk wrote: »

Finished Season 2 of DS9 today and met the Jem Hadar. That was a great episode.

Season 3 here I come.

It ramps up in quality from here on. Great show

Kiith

The Next Generation gets good when they get the new uniforms, and DS9 gets good when Sisko gets a beard

crazyderk

Kiith wrote: »

The Next Generation gets good when they get the new uniforms, and DS9 gets good when Sisko gets a beard

and when Worf joins. Here's a question, was it ever explained why Sisko started out as a commander, should they not have had a captain for the station?

Myrddin

crazyderk wrote: »

Here's a question, was it ever explained why Sisko started out as a commander, should they not have had a captain for the station?

I don't think it originally warranted needing a Captain to run the station. Don't forget, it was an old, decrepit, hole of a station in the then middle of nowhere, having no strategic importance or defensive importance whatsoever. The wormhole changed all that, & it changed Sisko too then. It gave him purpose, & he excelled. The station went from being a nothing outpost, to being the single most important strategic and defensive position in the quadrant. Sisko's work earned him the promotion later on.

Indricotherium

Myrddin wrote: »

I don't think it originally warranted needing a Captain to run the station. Don't forget, it was an old, decrepit, hole of a station in the then middle of nowhere, having no strategic importance or defensive importance whatsoever. The wormhole changed all that, & it changed Sisko too then. It gave him purpose, & he excelled. The station went from being a nothing outpost, to being the single most important strategic and defensive position in the quadrant. Sisko's work earned him the promotion later on.

+ Siskos position as emmisary, meant that he couldn't be replaced as commander of the Federation mission when the wormhole was discovered and it suddenly became the most important posting in the galaxy.

Although, I'd have thought that a system on the cardassian border like that would be hugely important to the federation on its own merit , such that they'd send a top negotiator / assimilation expert to command it. Not a burnt out commander unsure of his future in Starfleet. Someone who'd be straight in winning hearts and minds of the locals.

helimachoptor

Generally rank of a CO is determined by the size & importance of the installation.

Pre wormhole you'd be expecting a commander as it was a civilian station and bajor was a poor planet.

Post wormhole you'd have expected them to sign up an admiral

Myrddin

Indricotherium wrote: »

+ Siskos position as emmisary, meant that he couldn't be replaced as commander of the Federation mission when the wormhole was discovered and it suddenly became the most important posting in the galaxy.

There was an element of that yeah (Starfleet not wanting to offend the Bajorans by taking away the Emissary), but Starfleet were never comfortable with Sisko's role as Emissary either. I think by the time Sisko and Starfleet accepted his role as Emissary, Sisko had grown to really love Bajor and his work on DS9.

Although, I'd have thought that a system on the cardassian border like that would be hugely important to the federation on its own merit , such that they'd send a top negotiator / assimilation expert to command it. Not a burnt out commander unsure of his future in Starfleet. Someone who'd be straight in winning hearts and minds of the locals.

I think initially it was the perfect place for a burnt out officer, a place of no real importance in the back waters of the Federation. True, you'd expect they'd have put someone there who had their heart in it, in order to win the Bajorans over...maybe Starfleet thought the Bajorans had a long long way to go & were low priority really? I dunno, good point though

SarahBM

All this talk is making me want to start watching DS9

Myrddin

SarahBM wrote: »

All this talk is making me want to start watching DS9

You need to do that as a priority There are so many truly great characters in it. So jealous that you'll be doing a 1st proper run through of it at some stage!

crazyderk

SarahBM wrote: »

All this talk is making me want to start watching DS9

I watched it when it was first out 22 years ago and enjoyed it. I didn't think the first few series would hold up well but I'm thoroughly enjoying it. I'd definitely recommend it especially now since most tv shows are on the summer break!

SarahBM

I'd love to start but I won't have the time in the next couple of months as I'm doing my project and thesis.
I promise I'll set up a thread when I am doing a run through. :-)

Indricotherium

SarahBM wrote: »

I'd love to start but I won't have the time in the next couple of months as I'm doing my project and thesis.
I promise I'll set up a thread when I am doing a run through. :-)

Part of the thesis experience is learning to type while watching tv.

Agent Coulson

If I had the money I would as well

It is a rather common occurrence in the world of fandom to see someone go to extreme lengths to prove just how big a fan they are of a certain movie, television show, or whatever it might be. The Verge recently reported that Liu Dejian, the founder of Chinese game developer NetDragon Websoft, has found a way to go above and beyond in his fandom: he has reportedly spent 600 million yuan, which converts over to just under $100 million, to build an office for his company to resemble the U.S.S. Enterprise from Star Trek.

http://nerdist.com/star-trek-office-building-cost-nearly-100-million-to-build/

_Kaiser_

^^^ Not a bad place to work all the same! It's even beach and tennis court/football pitch/pool adjacent

The Chinese.. a great bunch of lads!

Indricotherium

TNG: Sub Rosa on scfy now.

... . Worst episode ever .... ...

Indricotherium

Indricotherium wrote: »

TNG: Sub Rosa on scfy now.

... . Worst episode ever .... ...

Defo won't be missing corrie for it.

Kirby

Indricotherium wrote: »

TNG: Sub Rosa on scfy now.

... . Worst episode ever .... ...

Indricotherium wrote: »

Defo won't be missing corrie for it.

I'm....so confused. You stuck in a time loop? :P

crazyderk

I'm more than half way through season 3 of DS9 now. The msot recent episode was were grand nagus Zek went into the wormhole and was changed to become more charitable and rewrite the rules of acquisition.

Pretty poor episode. some of them have been poor and some have been good. bar me knowing things start heating up in season 4 I'd almost be thinking of not watching the series, maybe I've just been watching to much of it lately. Maybe I'm right and this lull caused the writers to turn things the way they did?

knucklehead6

Nichelle Nichols has had a minor stroke according to news reports.

With Nimoy and Grace Lee Whitney recently I fear we will see them all getting ill health soon. They're in late 70s to mid 80s now.
Sad times ahead

Jamaican Me Crazy

crazyderk wrote: »

I'm more than half way through season 3 of DS9 now. The msot recent episode was were grand nagus Zek went into the wormhole and was changed to become more charitable and rewrite the rules of acquisition.

Pretty poor episode. some of them have been poor and some have been good. bar me knowing things start heating up in season 4 I'd almost be thinking of not watching the series, maybe I've just been watching to much of it lately. Maybe I'm right and this lull caused the writers to turn things the way they did?

Seasons 1-3 are tough going (with some exceptions) but the quality definitely ramps up from season 4 onwards. Stick with it though. I have always found Ferengi episodes fairly ropey and that season 3 episode 'Explorers' is just so dull but there is some good stuff in there.

All this talk is making me want to re-watch too

crazyderk

Good couple of episodes recently with through the looking glass and im currently watching the Romulan and Cardassian ships getting their ass's handed to them by the Jem Hadar

Indricotherium

It's interesting that the Dominion-alpha quadrant war ends with all the major players doing the opposite of what they generally portray themselves doing.

Cardassians: heroically rising up against authority

Kilingons: forging strong multi race alliances

Romulans: opening up and becoming allies with everyone

Dominion : seeking peaceful relations

Federation : bringing a civilisation to its knees with the attempted genocide of the founders via bioengineered wmd

crazyderk

Indricotherium wrote: »

It's interesting that the Dominion-alpha quadrant war ends with all the major players doing the opposite of what they generally portray themselves doing.

Cardassians: heroically rising up against authority

Kilingons: forging strong multi race alliances

Romulans: opening up and becoming allies with everyone

Dominion : seeking peaceful relations

Federation : bringing a civilisation to its knees with the attempted genocide of the founders via bioengineered wmd

Never looked at it like that!

Mind = blown!

Myrddin

Indricotherium wrote: »

Cardassians: heroically rising up against authority - after realising they were a conquered race themselves, & were not the ones doing the conquering anymore.

Kilingons: forging strong multi race alliances - despite breaking off a long standing peace treaty with the Federation who wouldn't join in the Klingon quest to invade Cardassia.

Romulans: opening up and becoming allies with everyone - including forming a non aggression pack with a race who were likely to defeat all the Romulan's enemies. Why go to war with the Federation/Klingons when the Dominion can do your dirty work for you? They 'opened up' because they eventually had to.

Dominion : seeking peaceful relations -

Federation : bringing a civilisation to its knees with the attempted genocide of the founders via bioengineered wmd - Strange how things come full circle, remember the race in the Delta Quadrant that Bashir tried to help, after the Dominion had introduced a bio-engineered wmd into their population? Not very interested in seeking peaceful relations at that stage were they? While I'm not condoning Starfleet's actions, I don't think they were left with much choice - it really was us vs them & the Dominion were hardly interested in diplomacy

A few alterations

Indricotherium

Myrddin wrote: »

A few alterations

They hadn't much choice????

It's one of the Federations go to tactics. Advanced species specific engineered weapons.

They tried it on the Borg, twice, once in TNG and once (Successfully??) in Voyager, they also tried on Species 8472.

crazyderk

Myrddin wrote: »

A few alterations

I prefer the other one :D:D

Myrddin

Indricotherium wrote: »

They hadn't much choice????

It's one of the Federations go to tactics. Advanced species specific engineered weapons.

You're right, despite the New Bajor colonists being massacred without warning maybe the Federation should have sought diplomatic relations with the Dominion first...oh no wait, they tried that & the Odyssey (with several hundred people on board) was destroyed by a suicide run. But no, maybe the Federation should have tried once more to establish peaceful relations...actually hang on, they did. But this peace seeking expedition was captured, subjected to a hallucinogenic role play test, & there learned that the leaders behind the Dominion were the Changelings. Not only were the changelings xenophobic & prejudiced, they seen it as their duty to 'impose order on a chaotic universe'. Not long after, the founders began to infiltrate the Federation, & replace key figures in an attempt to destabilise things.

An invasion of the Alpha Quadrant followed suit, with millions of lives lost, many Federation worlds conquered. DS9 itself was taken by the Dominion, and several large scale battles took place. During a down time in the war, Betazed was captured next. Starfleet HQ was attacked on Earth, & then the Foudners tried to destroy the Bajoras Sun which would have wiped out millions/billions of people.

Section 31 created the bio-engineered weapon to use against the Founders, and a Starfleet officer, one Julian Bashir, was able to cure it & give the cure to Odo. That ended the war, & the founders themselves were cured by Odo. So yeah, it became a case of us or them, & a rogue group not representative of the Federation took action.

They tried it on the Borg, twice, once in TNG and once (Successfully??) in Voyager, they also tried on Species 8472.

Borg - "Resistance is futile, you will be assimilated, your culture will adapt to service us."

8472 - A race determined to exterminate the life forms of the galaxy, to "purge" it. Diplomatic relations were established by Voyager, & hostilities ended as a result.

Dominion - "We must impose order on the galaxy". Despite a bloody war, peaceful relations were established.

crazyderk wrote: »

I prefer the other one :D:D

Prefer away It certainly sounds better, but it doesn't stand up, at all. The only arguing point in the Dominion war, is that the Dominion stated the Federation were to stay on their side of the wormhole. At that time, several colonies had been set up, & the Federation was only interested in peace. Plus, it was a big quadrant, hardly reasonable to order races not to explore the non-Dominion parts of it.

Indricotherium

Myrddin wrote: »

several colonies had been set up

Doesn't sound like only interested in peace to me?

Sounds more like pouring from one side of the galaxy to another, an unstoppable wave of colonial / imperial expansion, hungry for new lands and new resources.

Myrddin

Indricotherium wrote: »

Doesn't sound like only interested in peace to me?

Sounds more like pouring from one side of the galaxy to another, an unstoppable wave of colonial / imperial expansion, hungry for new lands and new resources.

That'd be an incorrect assumption on your part dude, given New Bajor was a Bajoran colony The Vulcans were responsible for a lot of the early Gamma Quadrant exploration too, and a more peace loving race you couldn't get. Your favourite peace lovers too, the Klingons, had their own scout ships exploring & looking for colony sites.

While the Dominion may have perceived all of this as hostile, in reality, it wasn't, & had Dominion diplomacy been any way decent, I'd be certain there wouldn't have been any further 'incursions' into Dominion held space.