Petrol or Diesel

Red Rua

Hi,

Thinking of upgrading my car to a 2008 medium hatchback, something along the lines of Auris/Focus/Astra/Ceed.

Was wondering should I be looking at diesel or petrol, given I don't do big mileage in a year (approx 7,000 miles p/y). Typically weekdays 10 miles journey to work (6 miles on 80km zone, 4 miles urban), and weekends slightly longer journeys (generally though 20-40 miles).

The Bishop Basher

Everyone here will till you to get a petrol at that mileage. I would go Diesel. I do about 10k a year and it's cheaper with diesel. Your car will also be worth more come trade in time. Only benefit with petrol is you can pick them up very cheap but there's a reason for that.

Elessar

I'd say petrol OP but I'm kind of wondering the same myself.

Getting a Golf in new year, either a new petrol tsi or a used diesel (1 year old) for 1k less. Same mileage as you, urban driving. Is the DPF really that big an issue?

MugMugs

Swanner wrote: »

Everyone here will till you to get a petrol at that mileage. I would go Diesel. I do about 10k a year and it's cheaper with diesel. Your car will also be worth more come trade in time. Only benefit with petrol is you can pick them up very cheap but there's a reason for that.

You pick it up cheap and sell it cheap. What's the problem?

Op I don't think you'd see the benefit of a diesel.

EPM

Petrol Ceed is surprisingly economical. There's no point in buying a diesel at that mileage. You will pay a premium that won't be easily recouped.

bazz26

Swanner wrote: »

Everyone here will till you to get a petrol at that mileage. I would go Diesel. I do about 10k a year and it's cheaper with diesel. Your car will also be worth more come trade in time. Only benefit with petrol is you can pick them up very cheap but there's a reason for that.

This is the current train of thought with the average Irish motorist who doesn't look at the bigger picture.

Diesels might be more econonical and have cheaper motor tax at the moment but they cost more to buy in the first place. With doing such low mileage how would you make back that premium? If you buy the unfashionable petrol cheaper then you can afford to sell it on cheaper too. There are great deals on petrol cars at the moment because all the sheep want diesels despite most of the them not justifying their use.

Then you have to also factor in that modern diesel cars do not like short journeys, a few years down the road and people who bought them to save a few cent on motor tax and at the pump but use them in around town will have lots of DMF and DPF problems which are not cheap to fix. Diesel cars are designed to be driven after all.

Leonard Hofstadter

Don't forget that the changes in the budget mean that the tax differential between say a band C petrol and a band B diesel are not as much as before. Basically a band C car used to cost nearly twice as much to tax as a band B car, but now the gap is much smaller.

This should at least in theory make petrols a little bit more desirable, and redress some of the balance between the cost of a pre-08 petrol and a post-08 diesel.

veetwin

Golf?

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Volkswagen/Golf/GOLF-1.4/201140204860641/advert?channel=CARS

Cheap tax, low mileage and full service history. Way nicer that a Ceed or Astra. That car probably cost very close to €30k just over 3 years ago. IMHO you would be nuts to even consider diesel with your kind of mileage.

Leonard Hofstadter

veetwin wrote: »

Golf?

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Volkswagen/Golf/GOLF-1.4/201140204860641/advert?channel=CARS

Cheap tax, low mileage and full service history. Way nicer that a Ceed or Astra. That car probably cost very close to €30k just over 3 years ago. IMHO you would be nuts to even consider diesel with your kind of mileage.

The only thing "nicer" about a Golf is you can tell your neighbours that you've got a car with a 'better badge' than they do if they've a Ford or Opel or Toyota.

In fairness as Golfs go that's a nice one (apart from the mph clocks - it's clearly an import), but Golfs are so overrated to be honest.

I could be wrong but I am quite sure that no Mk5 petrol Golf got into VRT band B either.

veetwin

captainspeed wrote: »

The only thing "nicer" about a Golf is you can tell your neighbours that you've got a car with a 'better badge' than they do if they've a Ford or Opel or Toyota.

Why? Is the Auris, Astra or Focus superior to the Golf?

Maybe the Focus is comparable but I personally much prefer the Golf inside and outside. As for the other two..well..

L1011

If you buy a diesel with a DPF you are going to have CHRONIC problems at that yearly mileage and average journey lengths.

Petrol all the way for that.

heate

Resale - a three year old car is being purchased here and in all likely hood the car will be kept for 3 more years - a six year old hatchback is going to have a limited value anyway!
And sure if your gonna buy a petrol one for less in the first place save some money buying it and buy another one next time.
7k miles a year is nothing an petrol is perfectly suited.
A petrol will hopefully throw up few issues outside normal servicing whilst a diesel may be costly if anything goes wrong.
As for fuel economy a diesel would have just about come to optimum operating temperature as you arrive at work!

mathepac

Petrol, but I bet a tenner the salesman (woman) won't tell you that if they have a dayzil in the yard.

heate

mathepac wrote: »

Petrol, but I bet a tenner the salesman (woman) won't tell you that if they have a dayzil in the yard.

Ha because they are making a bigger profit on the more expensive must have item!
Haggle out a petrol bargain OP

heate

http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2056479242?page=1#post_75934175
Another turbo failure really worth the risk €1300 in repairs!

The Bishop Basher

Told ya !! Of course the other side of the price argument is that you pay a bit more but you have a much more desirable car when you go to sell it. You'll hear all about these Diesel issues on boards but go ask a few diesel drivers and I doubt you'll find many who've had dpf or turbo failures. I'm just voicing my opinion all be it an unpopular one with all the "experts" on here. I do low mileage and bought a diesel, I've never looked back and its far cheaper to run in all respects.

Elessar

Swanner wrote: »

Told ya !! Of course the other side of the price argument is that you pay a bit more but you have a much more desirable car when you go to sell it. You'll hear all about these Diesel issues on boards but go ask a few diesel drivers and I doubt you'll find many who've had dpf or turbo failures. I'm just voicing my opinion all be it an unpopular one with all the "experts" on here. I do low mileage and bought a diesel, I've never looked back and its far cheaper to run in all respects.

What mileage do you do? Urban/city etc?

The Bishop Basher

Elessar wrote: »

What mileage do you do? Urban/city etc?

About 12k. Mixed urban and motorway......about half and half.

bazz26

Swanner wrote: »

Told ya !! Of course the other side of the price argument is that you pay a bit more but you have a much more desirable car when you go to sell it.

How does that work out better than buying a petrol car cheaper and then selling it on again cheaper? Just to keep it simple, buy a petrol car for €10k and sell it two years later for €5k. Buy a similar model diesel for €12k and sell it two years later for €7k. Both cars still lost €5k.

Swanner wrote: »

You'll hear all about these Diesel issues on boards but go ask a few diesel drivers and I doubt you'll find many who've had dpf or turbo failures. I'm just voicing my opinion all be it an unpopular one with all the "experts" on here. I do low mileage and bought a diesel, I've never looked back and its far cheaper to run in all respects.

The DPF on my previous Volvo S40 1.6d failed and had to be replaced at a cost of €1k. That's a fact not opinion. Also given all these places with "great" deals in €99 servicing, etc these days where they use generic grade oil instead of the manufacturer's recommended grade I expect to see more DPF and turbo failures in the near future.

And despite what you think there are quite a good few knowledgeable people on here who actually know what they are talking about.

heate

bazz26 wrote: »

How does that work out better than buying a petrol car cheaper and then selling it on again cheaper? Just to keep it simple, buy a petrol car for €10k and sell it two years later for €5k. Buy a similar model diesel for €12k and sell it two years later for €7k. Both cars still lost €5k.



The DPF on my previous Volvo S40 1.6d failed and had to be replaced at a cost of €1k. That's a fact not opinion. Also given all these places with "great" deals in €99 servicing, etc these days where they use generic grade oil instead of the manufacturer's recommended grade I expect to see more DPF and turbo failures in the near future.

And despite what you think there are quite a good few knowledgeable people on here who actually know what they are talking about.

Bingo add in slightly higher maintenance costs equalizing fuel prices and the cost of financing the extra acquisition cost (regardless of whether the buyer has cash or not there is always an opportunity cost)

_Kaiser_

bazz26 wrote: »

Then you have to also factor in that modern diesel cars do not like short journeys, a few years down the road and people who bought them to save a few cent on motor tax and at the pump but use them in around town will have lots of DMF and DPF problems which are not cheap to fix. Diesel cars are designed to be driven after all.

If only.. more likely is they will have traded it for the new 13/14-reg or at the first sign of trouble so it'll be the next buyer who inherits all these issues.

It's not something I'm looking forward to when I go to change as I actually NEED a diesel (50000km upwards a year) and I'd imagine the market will be flooded with problematic cars in a year or two from all these people who went diesel to save a few quid on motor tax :rolleyes:

166man

veetwin wrote: »

Golf?

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Volkswagen/Golf/GOLF-1.4/201140204860641/advert?channel=CARS

Cheap tax, low mileage and full service history. Way nicer that a Ceed or Astra. That car probably cost very close to €30k just over 3 years ago. IMHO you would be nuts to even consider diesel with your kind of mileage.

In fairness it is probably 52k miles which is nearer 100k km in 3 years so mileage isn't really that low..

keithclancy

Red Rua wrote: »

Hi,

Thinking of upgrading my car to a 2008 medium hatchback, something along the lines of Auris/Focus/Astra/Ceed.

Was wondering should I be looking at diesel or petrol, given I don't do big mileage in a year (approx 7,000 miles p/y). Typically weekdays 10 miles journey to work (6 miles on 80km zone, 4 miles urban), and weekends slightly longer journeys (generally though 20-40 miles).

20,000km/minimum minimum for a Diesel, all the on/off, start/stop, any savings you make on tax/fuel will be wiped out by a new turbo/dpf/dmf and increased tyre wear from that big heavy lump up the front.

Nissan doctor

Swanner wrote: »

Everyone here will till you to get a petrol at that mileage. I would go Diesel. I do about 10k a year and it's cheaper with diesel. Your car will also be worth more come trade in time. Only benefit with petrol is you can pick them up very cheap but there's a reason for that.

That is far from the only benefit when doing low mileage.

As has been said, think of the big picture..... take your 10k a year. Thats 192 miles a week, so depending on car comparisons(lets assume 1.4 petrol V 1.6 diesel) savings on fuel could be maybe €20 a week or €1040 a year.

So 1 DMF failure duel to low mileage/city driving cancels a years fuel savings, 1 DPF failure cancels another full years fuel savings and so on.

And for the OP, only doing 7k a years, this would be even more pronounced.

You buy a petrol car cheaper, its has almost nothing(bar perhaps an egr valve, €200 ish) that is badly effected by doing low mileage. Most post 08 smaller petrols are only maybe 1 tax band higher then the diesel and are still very economical and are generally smoother and nicer to drive.

IMO the current obsession with smaller engine diesels is based solely around cheaper tax and a perceived lower running cost.

Wait 5 years and see what most people think of diesels then!

veetwin

166man wrote: »

In fairness it is probably 52k miles which is nearer 100k km in 3 years so mileage isn't really that low..

No its 52K Kms. If you enlarge the picture of the speedo in the ad it clearly shows the odometer is measuring in kms. BTW no connection to the car. Just thought it looked like good value.

166man

veetwin wrote: »

No its 52K Kms. If you enlarge the picture of the speedo in the ad it clearly shows the odometer is measuring in kms. BTW no connection to the car. Just thought it looked like good value.

Apologies you are correct, I assumed it was in miles due to the speedo being in miles. In that case pretty low mileage alright.

Realistically will there be a huge difference in the cost of buying a petrol or a diesel of the vintage the OP is considering?

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Ford/Focus/ZETEC-1./131659476501580/advert?channel=CARS

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Ford/Focus/1.8tdci-/201148205837240/advert?channel=CARS

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Ford/Focus/1.6-TDCI/201149205944380/advert?channel=CARS

Obviously I haven't gone to either extreme

Of course, realistically doing 7000 miles/annum will the diesel prove to be much cheaper to run? A friend ran a 1.6 petrol Focus a couple of miles to and from work daily in Lucan and then up and down to Cork at the weekend, he knocked 40mpg out of it, a diesel would no doubt have managed 50+mpg but still hardly a huge difference.

Do 08 Focus, Astra, Ceed diesels have DPFs?

I'd test drive a few petrols and diesels and buy what you like tbh

chinwag

veetwin wrote: »

No its 52K Kms. If you enlarge the picture of the speedo in the ad it clearly shows the odometer is measuring in kms. BTW no connection to the car. Just thought it looked like good value.

Is it not peculiar to have speedo in miles and odometer in kms?

pajo1981

chinwag wrote: »

Is it not peculiar to have speedo in miles and odometer in kms?

Import with ODO set to kms.

Leonard Hofstadter

pajo1981 wrote: »

Import with ODO set to kms.

A bit OT, but in a lot of German cars with the clocks in kms you can change the mileometer, mpg etc back to miles as well, so nothing unusual about a German car with the clocks in miles showing mileage etc in kms.

bazz26

My car is a UK import. The speedometer is in mph with kph on the inside. I can switch the odometer and mpg computer from miles to kilometers easily.